Poll of the Day > Why do most European countries require a license to own and operate a TV?

(+) Yeah! (+)

That is not a sign of freedom.

Can't speak for other countries but in the UK, the TV licence isn't to use a TV but to recieve live broadcasts from the BBC only.
Every other station technically* doesn't require a licence.

*problem is that it is impossible to receive these signals without the BBC piggybacking on them so you still have to pay, whether you watch the content or not, as long as your property has the capability of receiving live broadcast signals AND has a means of displaying them.
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Darth_CiD posted...

Can't speak for other countries but in the UK, the TV licence isn't to use a TV but to recieve live broadcasts from the BBC only.

In France, it's a tax, not a license, and it's just for watching TV. If you buy a TV and don't subscribe to any service (just use it for you PS4 and whatnot) and can prove it, you don't pay the tax.
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Get a job, troll.
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Sethera posted...

In France, it's a tax, not a license, and it's just for watching TV. If you buy a TV and don't subscribe to any service (just use it for you PS4 and whatnot) and can prove it, you don't pay the tax.

Apparently, they arrest you in the UK for owning a TV without a license, or an expired license.

I have heard stories of people getting raided by the cops to check their tv's. if you own a tv, they assume your pirating the BBC. even if you dont even watch tv and just use it for gaming. also sometimes they shame people before even knowing if they have a tv. I remember some case where they were able to detect that someone in the neighborhood didn't pay for a license, and they put up a sign shaming them. but it turned out later the person didn't even own a tv. The BBC sounds very aggressive and they just assume every british citizen owes them money.

TheWorstPoster posted...

Apparently, they arrest you in the UK for owning a TV without a license, or an expired license.

Zikten posted...

I have heard stories of people getting raided by the cops to check their tv's. if you own a tv, they assume your pirating the BBC. even if you dont even watch tv and just use it for gaming. also sometimes they shame people before even knowing if they have a tv. I remember some case where they were able to detect that someone in the neighborhood didn't pay for a license, and they put up a sign shaming them. but it turned out later the person didn't even own a tv. The BBC sounds very aggressive and they just assume every british citizen owes them money.

It's not my place to judge, especially since I live in a hellhole of a country, but that doesn't sound very normal...
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TheWorstPoster posted...

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Wouldn't be easier to make it so you have to have a license to buy a TV instead of letting you buy it without a license and then pursuing you? Also, is it a license per household or per TV?

And one other thing, Islamophobic hate speech on social media is a crime, okay, but why isn't Christian and Jewish hate speech also a crime? Or any hate speech? Or just none of it?
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Sethera posted...

Also, is it a license per household or per TV?

Per household.

And one other thing, Islamophobic hate speech on social media is a crime, okay, but why isn't Christian and Jewish hate speech also a crime? Or any hate speech? Or just none of it?

It is and it is.

The reason they've singled out Islamophobic hate speech in that screenshot of a tweet is because of the greater prevalence of such over hate speech against Christians and Jews.

The reason why they've considered hate speech a crime is because they believe the intangible societal harm caused by hate speech outweighs the free speech rights of individuals.
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dainkinkaide posted...

Sethera posted...

Also, is it a license per household or per TV?

Per household.

And one other thing, Islamophobic hate speech on social media is a crime, okay, but why isn't Christian and Jewish hate speech also a crime? Or any hate speech? Or just none of it?

It is and it is.

The reason they've singled out Islamophobic hate speech in that screenshot of a tweet is because of the greater prevalence of such over hate speech against Christians and Jews.

The reason why they've considered hate speech a crime is because they believe the intangible societal harm caused by hate speech outweighs the free speech rights of individuals.

Thanks for the clarification. It makes sense. I don't think hate speech being a crime is bad, but there should be a limit. Also, I'd argue the amount of hate against Christian and Jews has been on the rise lately (although you're right, it's still far from the amount of hate Muslims get).
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TheWorstPoster posted...

Apparently, they arrest you in the UK for owning a TV without a license, or an expired license.

No they don't. It's a civil matter, any arrests would have been because of other factors, such as disturbing the peace (basically kicking off) or assault as they attempt to prevent carrying out lawful warrants of entry.

Now the fact that judges are willing to sign off on warrants because someone might be receiving live broadcasts is not a good thing...

Zikten posted...

I have heard stories of people getting raided by the cops to check their tv's.

Not really, police will be there to prevent breach of the peace but really it is a private organisation carrying out a lawful warrant of entry.

Zikten posted...

if you own a tv, they assume your pirating the BBC.

Unfortunately, this is true. They try to make you think the burden of proof is on you but as we all know, innocent until proven guilty.

Zikten posted...

I remember some case where they were able to detect that someone in the neighborhood didn't pay for a license, and they put up a sign shaming them. but it turned out later the person didn't even own a tv.

That doesn't sound true at all, data protection laws and all that, unless you are referring to what tc posted in them images which isn't remotely the same as what you described.

Zikten posted...

The BBC sounds very aggressive and they just assume every british citizen owes them money.

Still true though, but i think the main problem is that they don't actually do this stuff themselves. They hire collection agencies (bailiffs) to handle it and they don't really have a great track record of respecting peoples rights or just being friendly with the public.
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Sethera posted...

Wouldn't be easier to make it so you have to have a license to buy a TV instead of letting you buy it without a license and then pursuing you?

Well no, because you don't need a licence to own a TV, just to watch live broadcasts. Owning a TV doesn't necessarily mean you are using it to watch TV.
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Darth_CiD posted...

Sethera posted...

Wouldn't be easier to make it so you have to have a license to buy a TV instead of letting you buy it without a license and then pursuing you?

Well no, because you don't need a licence to own a TV, just to watch live broadcasts. Owning a TV doesn't necessarily mean you are using it to watch TV.

So it's actually closer to what I described in France's case than what TC makes it look like?
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Sethera posted...

Darth_CiD posted...

Sethera posted...

Wouldn't be easier to make it so you have to have a license to buy a TV instead of letting you buy it without a license and then pursuing you?

Well no, because you don't need a licence to own a TV, just to watch live broadcasts. Owning a TV doesn't necessarily mean you are using it to watch TV.

So it's actually closer to what I described in France's case than what TC makes it look like?

Yup, the problems with it stem from infringement of rights. Yeah, you don't have to pay if you own a TV and can prove you don't watch TV. But why should we prove we don't watch TV? It's not our job to do that, it's their job to prove we do if they want us to pay.

That raises other problems of what is considered proof. To them, if you have a reciever of any kind (aerial or dish) and a TV, you are capable of watching TV and therefore have to pay, regardless of whether they are actually connected or not. Even if they were connected, you still might not ever watch TV.
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Darth_CiD posted...

Even if they were connected, you still might not ever watch TV.

I think they're right to assume you watch TV in that case (and only in that case).
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Sethera posted...

Darth_CiD posted...

Even if they were connected, you still might not ever watch TV.

I think they're right to assume you watch TV in that case (and only in that case).

True, but that isn't how law works. You may find a person standing over a dead body with a bloody knife in their hand but you still have to investigate if they actually killed the other and go to trial.
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Free speech is over rated. Islamophobia is a serious threat to a religion of peace and tolerance.
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Damn Europe is North Korea and some of our posters look up to them as ideal progressives... kind of scary what can happen to a populous without the right to defend itself.