Current Events > "Why gay white men are hindering our progress"

(+) Yeah! (+)

https://www.them.us/story/white-gay-men-are-hindering-our-progress

People literally say that gay white men have done nothing for the movement for the last 50 years, he said. Theyre not trying to make the movement intersectional; theyre trying to erase other participants who came before them.

Lol the left is eating itself again.
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I'm sure one article by a total nobody will destroy the left
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Honestly I wouldn't take a site domain them.us seriously.
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Where do you guys find these random articles? Do you have a feed from all the sites that trigger you?
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HylianFox posted...

I'm sure one article by a total nobody will destroy the left

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SomeonesAlt posted...

Where do you guys find these random articles? Do you have a feed from all the sites that trigger you?

Nice deflection.
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Pretty sure a similar article was made a year or two ago. So perhaps its gaining steam.
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Howl posted...

https://www.them.us/story/white-gay-men-are-hindering-our-progress

People literally say that gay white men have done nothing for the movement for the last 50 years, he said. Theyre not trying to make the movement intersectional; theyre trying to erase other participants who came before them.

Lol the left is eating itself again.

Well that's pretty ironic when you consider that "erasing" certain participants is the point of the article.

"Intersectionality" is an insidious and daresay, evil social construct. It's another word for a caste system. A leftist caste system.
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SomeonesAlt posted...

Where do you guys find these random articles? Do you have a feed from all the sites that trigger you?

yeah it's called /pol/ and r/The_Donald
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Funbazooka posted...

Howl posted...

https://www.them.us/story/white-gay-men-are-hindering-our-progress

People literally say that gay white men have done nothing for the movement for the last 50 years, he said. Theyre not trying to make the movement intersectional; theyre trying to erase other participants who came before them.

Lol the left is eating itself again.

Well that's pretty ironic when you consider that "erasing" certain participants is the point of the article.

"Intersectionality" is an insidious and daresay, evil social construct. It's another word for a caste system. A leftist caste system.

Agree or disagree with Jordan Peterson on whatever you want, but he's 100% on point about intersectionality:
"The logical conclusion of intersectionality is individuality. There's so many different ways of categorizing people's advantages and disadvantages that if you take that all the way out to the end you say well the individual is the ultimate minority and that's exactly right and that's exactly what the West discovered. The intersectionalists will get there if they don't kill everyone first."
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HylianFox posted...

I'm sure one article by a total nobody will destroy the left

Femenists also think that white femenists are getting all the attention.

All it takes is one article and a few tweets for easily manipulated progressives to roar inequality and oppression.
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NINExATExSEVEN posted...

HylianFox posted...

I'm sure one article by a total nobody will destroy the left

Femenists also think that white femenists are getting all the attention.

All it takes is one article and a few tweets for easily manipulated progressives to roar inequality and oppression.

If you take a trend and just respond to every single instance as "just an article" then you can basically dissemble ANY reality into a series of unrelated instances. It's the basis of deconstructionist theory, also known as "losing the forest for the trees."
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HylianFox posted...

I'm sure one article by a total nobody will destroy the left

To be fair, shitting on whites within activist movement for not doing enough for colored people within those movements isn't an uncommon complaint. "White feminism" is a common bludgeon to hit white feminists with for not being intersectional enough. Not enough to just advocate for women's rights, you have to add PoC rights, transgender rights, gay rights, Muslim rights, etc.
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Many of the cultural contributions of PoC to the queer community are largely erased by larger popular narratives. Ask a random gay man who Marsha P. Johnson or Sylvia Riviera is and they can't answer, because they aren't taught to remember those people or their sacrifices by mainstream queer media. Still. We're still whitewashing movies about stonewall and voguing. People are snatching quotes from Paris is Burning and don't know anything about the people who said it, the communities it's coming out of, and the struggles they were dealing with. So much of the color in the LGBT movement was offered to, or appropriated by the mainstream without acknowledgement. This cycle has been repeated again and again for decades.

But TC, doesn't know anything about that, nor does he care to. Frankly, I'd be shocked to learn he even read the article or did any follow up research. TC just wants to start fights on the internet about shit that, I'm guessing, has nothing to do with him.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I think I can speak for all queer PoC participants in this community when I kindly ask TC to fuck off with this noise.

EDIT: And this isn't new. This conversation is older than me. It's played out on everything from film, to the stage, perhaps most infamously in Tony Kushner's Angels in America in the conversations Belize and Lewis have where Lewis whitesplains American liberalism.

TLDR: If you don't know, it's because you've never asked.
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If anybody actually believes that theyre looking into it too much.

At least in terms of right here right now.
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Some people just hate whites, its incredibly racist.

hollow_shrine posted...

Many of the cultural contributions of PoC to the queer community are largely erased by larger popular narratives. Ask a random gay man who Marsha P. Johnson or Sylvia Riviera is and they can't answer, because they aren't taught to remember those people or their sacrifices by mainstream queer media. Still. We're still whitewashing movies about stonewall and voguing. People are snatching quotes from Paris is Burning and don't know anything about the people who said it, the communities it's coming out of, and the struggles they were dealing with. So much of the color in the LGBT movement was offered to, or appropriated by the mainstream without acknowledgement. This cycle has been repeated again and again for decades.

But TC, doesn't know anything about that, nor does he care to. Frankly, I'd be shocked to learn he even read the article or did any follow up research. TC just wants to start fights on the internet about shit that, I'm guessing, has nothing to do with him.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I think I can speak for all queer PoC participants in this community when I kindly ask TC to fuck off with this noise.

Listen to the arrogance. "but I think I can speak for all queer PoC participants in this community when I kindly ask TC to fuck off with this noise."

Yes, you speak for the entirety of queer and POC participants in defending a racist article about how "white gay men are hindering progress."
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hollow_shrine posted...

Many of the cultural contributions of PoC to the queer community are largely erased by larger popular narratives. Ask a random gay man who Marsha P. Johnson or Sylvia Riviera is and they can't answer, because they aren't taught to remember those people or their sacrifices by mainstream queer media. Still. We're still whitewashing movies about stonewall and voguing. People are snatching quotes from Paris is Burning and don't know anything about the people who said it, the communities it's coming out of, and the struggles they were dealing with. So much of the color in the LGBT movement was offered to, or appropriated by the mainstream without acknowledgement. This cycle has been repeated again and again for decades.

But TC, doesn't know anything about that, nor does he care to. Frankly, I'd be shocked to learn he even read the article or did any follow up research. TC just wants to start fights on the internet about shit that, I'm guessing, has nothing to do with him.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I think I can speak for all queer PoC participants in this community when I kindly ask TC to fuck off with this noise.

Maybe your movement should stop with the racist infighting.
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Funbazooka posted...

A leftist caste system.

Where have you been for the past decade or so?

This happened at some college. White gay men were booted from some LGBT group because they were considered "too privileged."
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Howl posted...

Listen to the arrogance. "but I think I can speak for all queer PoC participants in this community when I kindly ask TC to fuck off with this noise."

Arrogance. I allow for the possibility that I'm wrong. I'm willing to share that mic. I just suspect I don't need to.

Funbazooka posted...

Maybe your movement should stop with the racist infighting.

What infighting? Some people are acting stank and they need to know.

Do any of you remember the reaction to the LGBT flag getting updated with the brown and black stripes in memory of the Pulse shooting. How people felt it was racially charged and inappropriate, despite the fact that many of these same people were the ones on facebook talking about how "we were all Pulse" one year prior, and how the overwhelming majority of Pulse's victims were latinx people of color? We should absolutely call that kind of hypocrisy out.
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hollow_shrine posted...

Howl posted...

Listen to the arrogance. "but I think I can speak for all queer PoC participants in this community when I kindly ask TC to fuck off with this noise."

Arrogance. I allow for the possibility that I'm wrong. I'm willing to share that mic. I just suspect I don't need to.

Funbazooka posted...

Maybe your movement should stop with the racist infighting.

What infighting? Some people are acting stank and they need to know.

Do any of you remember the reaction to the LGBT flag getting updated with the brown and black stripes in memory of the Pulse shooting. How people felt it was racially charged and inappropriate, despite the fact that many of these same people were the ones on facebook talking about how "we were all Pulse" one year prior, and how the overwhelming majority of Pulse's victims were latinx people of color? We should absolutely call that kind of hypocrisy out.

There's not just the possibility that you're wrong, it's a 100 percent certainty.

Trying to deny the millions of gay white men the credit for their years and lifetimes of the sacrifices they made to the civil rights movement is outright racist. It's fucking disgusting that you would defend the notion that gay white men are hindering progress after the fact that they suffered for generations fighting to acheive more basic human dignity.

You are a disgusting person tbh. I don't even care if this gets modded.
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Obscure article by one person on some no name website that no one would even know about if TC didnt post it. lol they eating themselves!
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hollow_shrine posted...

Howl posted...

Listen to the arrogance. "but I think I can speak for all queer PoC participants in this community when I kindly ask TC to fuck off with this noise."

Arrogance. I allow for the possibility that I'm wrong. I'm willing to share that mic. I just suspect I don't need to.

Funbazooka posted...

Maybe your movement should stop with the racist infighting.

What infighting? Some people are acting stank and they need to know.

Do any of you remember the reaction to the LGBT flag getting updated with the brown and black stripes in memory of the Pulse shooting. How people felt it was racially charged and inappropriate, despite the fact that many of these same people were the ones on facebook talking about how "we were all Pulse" one year prior, and how the overwhelming majority of Pulse's victims were latinx people of color? We should absolutely call that kind of hypocrisy out.

To be fair, I definitely don't see a "white" stripe in the LGBT flag either.
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skin color isn't a sexual orientation which is why people didn't like the change to the flag. It doesn't fucking matter what color the Pulse victims were. That's not hypocrisy... it's people not buying into intersectionality and turning a movement about sexual expression into a soapbox for unrelated issues. All you intersectionalists are doing is stealing the hard work of already established, actual movements and corrupting them to be about your pet issues because you're unable on your own to create traction.
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hollow_shrine posted...

Do any of you remember the reaction to the LGBT flag getting updated with the brown and black stripes in memory of the Pulse shooting. How people felt it was racially charged and inappropriate, despite the fact that many of these same people were the ones on facebook talking about how "we were all Pulse" one year prior, and how the overwhelming majority of Pulse's victims were latinx people of color? We should absolutely call that kind of hypocrisy out.

Huh. Was there that big an uproar when the purple- and green-skinned people got stripes added?

This is why Trump won
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As a bi guy myself this is why I wouldn't touch the LGBQT movement with a 20 ft pole. If I'm going to be attacked because I'm white by these people, I don't want any part of it. Who in their right mind would?
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Funbazooka posted...

As a bi guy myself this is why I wouldn't touch the LGBQT movement with a 20 ft pole. If I'm going to be attacked because I'm white by these people, I don't want any part of it. Who in their right mind would?

People like @hollow_shrine just want you to be scapegoat for their cause. It doesn't matter who you are as an individual because your individual sacrifices do not matter to them. They're only concerned with the appearance that POC aren't getting enough credit for their sacrifices as well so that concern completely negates any amount of effort you or any white person has ever made in history apparently.
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masticatingman posted...

hollow_shrine posted...

Howl posted...

Listen to the arrogance. "but I think I can speak for all queer PoC participants in this community when I kindly ask TC to fuck off with this noise."

Arrogance. I allow for the possibility that I'm wrong. I'm willing to share that mic. I just suspect I don't need to.

Funbazooka posted...

Maybe your movement should stop with the racist infighting.

What infighting? Some people are acting stank and they need to know.

Do any of you remember the reaction to the LGBT flag getting updated with the brown and black stripes in memory of the Pulse shooting. How people felt it was racially charged and inappropriate, despite the fact that many of these same people were the ones on facebook talking about how "we were all Pulse" one year prior, and how the overwhelming majority of Pulse's victims were latinx people of color? We should absolutely call that kind of hypocrisy out.

To be fair, I definitely don't see a "white" stripe in the LGBT flag either.

They added a black stripe to literally advacate for black people, LOL

https://www.phillymag.com/g-philly/2017/06/08/philly-pride-flag-black-brown/

So stupid

TheVipaGTS posted...

Obscure article by one person on some no name website that no one would even know about if TC didnt post it. lol they eating themselves!

Funny thing is the far right are the only ones I ever see link to these types of websites and articles. I've never seen someone on the left treat random sites like this so seriously

Axiom posted...

TheVipaGTS posted...

Obscure article by one person on some no name website that no one would even know about if TC didnt post it. lol they eating themselves!

Funny thing is the far right are the only ones I ever see link to these types of websites and articles. I've never seen someone on the left treat something like this seriously

There are lefties in here arguing in defense of the article.
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Howl posted...

Trying to deny the millions of gay white men the credit for their years and lifetimes of the sacrifices they made to the civil rights movement is outright racist. It's fucking disgusting that you would defend the notion that gay white men are hindering progress after the fact that they suffered for generations fighting to acheive more basic human dignity.

You are a disgusting person tbh. I don't even care if this gets modded.

No one is denying the Cleave Jones, Kushners, Kramers, Milks, etc of the Gay RIghts movements. They will always have an audience. They've got editorials, books, plays, and movies immortalizing them for posterity (whether the kids read them or not). But pretty much everyone who isn't white and male encounters resistance and the interruption which happened at Capital Pride in DC last year was an attempt to remind the partygoers of that parade, of which I was a member, that Pride is as much a protest as it is a party, and with that year's selection of sponsors were deserving of their own healthy helping of shade.

That extends beyond just the entities mentioned in the article. You may remember the HRC getting flack back in 2013 for comments made essentially dropping it's trans-advocacy to the triage (despite trans activists being one of the Gay rights movement's oldest and most loyal allies). Or later the reports about the lack of diversity within it's administrative ranks, and a seeming lack of interest in causes supporting the more diverse sections of it's membership for the usual suspects. (Marriage equality, the biggest focus of their advocacy through 2015 is a great example of a cause who's victory was largely symbolic for many gay Americans. This, while other discriminatory practices in the workplace or housing, or homeless youth were much higher on the list of priorities for most people, for obvious reasons.

When you bring any of this up in pretty much any context, people get defensive. They complain that it's 'harshing their buzz.' The complain that it's not the time or place for those kinds of intersectional discussions because it 'muddles the message' not understanding that your experiences as queer person in America are inextribably linked to your experiences as a person of color. They've forgotten the context in which all these alliances formed in the first place. They've forgotten what and why pride was. The article makes an interesting point when it defines the term 'white gays' and it's implied epithet. 'White gays' doesn't describe gay men who are white so much as it refers to the kinds of gay men who do this kind of de-politicization of these gatherings or who , and who are often white.

You know, I just realized I ain't even gotta do all this. It's not like the OP was sincere and attentive by any stretch of the word. You read that whole article and characterized it by posting one quote from some guy who felt erased by the intersectional movement, and just ignored the rest of the article. Even the quotes talking about how activism from older gay men has dropped after marriage equality, likely because those older (and whiter) people no longer feel they have a stake in LGBT activism, who don't understand the continued intensity in the movement, and who don't really understand why overtures are being made towards trans-activism and feminism. Those quotes lay out exactly why many queer PoC are throwing shade. And you summarized that as, "Lol the left is eating itself again." I came for you for starting this shit and you wanna get offended at me?


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What the actual fuck is "them.us" anyway?
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ImTheMacheteGuy posted...

What the actual fuck is "them.us" anyway?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.us

StarLightGlimmR posted...

masticatingman posted...

hollow_shrine posted...

Howl posted...

Listen to the arrogance. "but I think I can speak for all queer PoC participants in this community when I kindly ask TC to fuck off with this noise."

Arrogance. I allow for the possibility that I'm wrong. I'm willing to share that mic. I just suspect I don't need to.

Funbazooka posted...

Maybe your movement should stop with the racist infighting.

What infighting? Some people are acting stank and they need to know.

Do any of you remember the reaction to the LGBT flag getting updated with the brown and black stripes in memory of the Pulse shooting. How people felt it was racially charged and inappropriate, despite the fact that many of these same people were the ones on facebook talking about how "we were all Pulse" one year prior, and how the overwhelming majority of Pulse's victims were latinx people of color? We should absolutely call that kind of hypocrisy out.

To be fair, I definitely don't see a "white" stripe in the LGBT flag either.

They added a black stripe to literally advacate for black people, LOL

https://www.phillymag.com/g-philly/2017/06/08/philly-pride-flag-black-brown/

So stupid

Each other has a meaning and there was a black stripe present during the AIDS crisis to represent those lost to the disease. So not only has the flag changed in the past to acknowledge different movements or recent events, but we've even done it to commemorate specific tragedies like the Pulse shooting.

Where do you getting off acting all superior, when you clearly don't know what you're talking about?
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NINExATExSEVEN posted...

HylianFox posted...

I'm sure one article by a total nobody will destroy the left

Femenists also think that white femenists are getting all the attention.

All it takes is one article and a few tweets for easily manipulated progressives to roar inequality and oppression.

What does it take for non-progressives to think a pizza place is a front for a child sex trafficking ring?
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There are tons of liberals on this board and you would be lucky to find 5% of them agreeing with this article.
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For better or worse, I think that's generous.
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In respone to Post 35...

Not a single part of that rambling mess of cobbled together pseudo-intellectual drivel had any relevance to the notion that "white men are hindering progress" in any way.

It's like ypu just read academic articles from your schools library on intersectionality, try to make sense of them, fail, then completely ignore any and all context of a conversation you're having, and misapply entirely what you read in an effort to make a coherent thought.

Lol this is truly the most pathetic attempt at making a post I've ever seen tbh.
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Why didn't you read the article in the OP before you posted it?
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hollow_shrine posted...

Why didn't you read the article in the OP before you posted it?

I did read it. None of what you posted has any relevance to the article itself or even of life at all.
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Howl posted...

hollow_shrine posted...

Why didn't you read the article in the OP before you posted it?

I did read it.

But you felt a single quote from an interviewee feeling erased by the greater emphasis on intersectionality accurately characterized the article. Because that's the only thing in the OP.

Howl posted...

None of what you posted has any relevance to the article itself or even of life at all.

None? To be clear, I'm calling you out for misleading and disingenuous characterization of the editorial in the OP. And after these last two posts, I'm also calling you out for being too lazy to read.
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hollow_shrine posted...

StarLightGlimmR posted...

masticatingman posted...

hollow_shrine posted...

Howl posted...

Listen to the arrogance. "but I think I can speak for all queer PoC participants in this community when I kindly ask TC to fuck off with this noise."

Arrogance. I allow for the possibility that I'm wrong. I'm willing to share that mic. I just suspect I don't need to.

Funbazooka posted...

Maybe your movement should stop with the racist infighting.

What infighting? Some people are acting stank and they need to know.

Do any of you remember the reaction to the LGBT flag getting updated with the brown and black stripes in memory of the Pulse shooting. How people felt it was racially charged and inappropriate, despite the fact that many of these same people were the ones on facebook talking about how "we were all Pulse" one year prior, and how the overwhelming majority of Pulse's victims were latinx people of color? We should absolutely call that kind of hypocrisy out.

To be fair, I definitely don't see a "white" stripe in the LGBT flag either.

They added a black stripe to literally advacate for black people, LOL

https://www.phillymag.com/g-philly/2017/06/08/philly-pride-flag-black-brown/

So stupid

Each other has a meaning and there was a black stripe present during the AIDS crisis to represent those lost to the disease. So not only has the flag changed in the past to acknowledge different movements or recent events, but we've even done it to commemorate specific tragedies like the Pulse shooting.

Where do you getting off acting all superior, when you clearly don't know what you're talking about?

Lmao this is the stupidest thing I've ever heard XD

They included black and brown for dumbass racists

StarLightGlimmR posted...

Lmao this is the stupidest thing I've ever heard XD

They included black and brown for dumbass racists

You could have googled something like 'pride flag aids crisis' and saved us both some time. That's just true. The lgbt flag has changed many times these past forty years. It's well-documented. You're arguing over known cultural history that you don't seem to know anything about. I really don't understand why you're arguing with me here, because it doesn't look like you have any stakes here beyond winning an internet argument.
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Oh my god, some people with dumb opinions wrote dumb articles.

Time to erase an entire direction from existence.

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