Current Events > Isn't it convenient that you're always born into the right religion?

(+) Yeah! (+)

You live in America, you're going to be a Christian. Everyone else is wrong. YOu live in Pakistan, you're going to be a Muslim. Everyone else is wrong. You in India, good chance you'll practice Hinduism. Everyone else is wrong.

God works in mysterious ways.
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While i agree, this is solely meant to piss off religious people....
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god chose me specifically because I'm special and he loves me. so it makes sense
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Dustin1280 posted...

While i agree, this is solely meant to piss off religious people....

Yes, logic does upset willful ignorance. Fuck 'em.
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Don't forget that people who haven't travelled extensively or expanded their perspective beyond the city/town in which they live also live in the best country.
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this ignores the fact that people do give up their native religion to convert to other religions

and of course you wouldnt expect a religion to teach that it is false

i always thought this argument was a bad one tbqh
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it's not an argument. it's an observation.
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yea well like he said, you ignore the fact of people converting. not everyone sticks with the religion they are born into.

So nobody converts anymore?
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Also, some religions don't discredit all others in their tenets.
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JACKBUTTMOMMY posted...

plenty of people convert

thank you for an original post, unlike those other folk who copied you.

I'm generalizing, obviously. most people don't convert tho
https://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Society/2009/0428/p02s01-ussc.html
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Megaman50100 posted...

Also, some religions don't discredit all others in their tenets.

like Hinduism for example. TC mentions Hinduism in a list of religions that think they are the only right one. and that's false. Hindus actually accept all religions as true. they see different religions as different ways to look at the divine and all equally valid. in fact, some hindus even pray to other gods, even Jesus. I saw a documentary on India and they showed a statue of Jesus in a Hindu shrine once alongside Hindu gods

lilORANG posted...

You in India, good chance you'll practice Hinduism. Everyone else is wrong.

not really true. i was born and raised hindu. my dad always respected all religions. there were the main gods he'd directly pray to but he would never call anyone else wrong. hell he has a little cabinet of religious pictures and statues in his house and there is a picture of jesus in there one of his coworkers gave him at christmas years ago...its in there because to him it is a god that should be respected even if its not one he prays to. Most hindus i've known have been that way. then again it could just be a personal bias and it might just be my own family that thinks that way...
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TheVipaGTS posted...

lilORANG posted...

You in India, good chance you'll practice Hinduism. Everyone else is wrong.

not really true. i was born and raised hindu. my dad always respected all religions. there were the main gods he'd directly pray to but he would never call anyone else wrong. hell he has a little cabinet of religious pictures and statues in his house and there is a picture of jesus in there one of his coworkers gave him at christmas years ago...its in there because to him it is a god that should be respected even if its not one he prays to. Most hindus i've known have been that way. then again it could just be a personal bias and it might just be my own family that thinks that way...

nah, I think that's generally what Hindu is. But it's still it's own distinct thing. They may not judge others as much but they obviously think their own beliefs are more valid, otherwise they'd be whatever they thought was better.
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lilORANG posted...

nah, I think that's generally what Hindu is. But it's still it's own distinct thing. They may not judge others as much but they obviously think their own beliefs are more valid, otherwise they'd be whatever they thought was better.

this seems like nitpicking. they are their own thing cause that's what they were raised as and are comfortable with, but they accept all other views and respect them too. your trying to pin negative thoughts on them that don't exist.

The teachings of Eastern religions are very interesting and worth adopting - although Eastern religions are more like ways of life than traditional religions
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that's the logical result of believing one thing but not another
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FLUFFYGERM posted...

this ignores the fact that people do give up their native religion to convert to other religions

Yeah, 0.004% of the time.
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DarkChozoGhost posted...

FLUFFYGERM posted...

this ignores the fact that people do give up their native religion to convert to other religions

Yeah, 0.004% of the time.

http://www.pewforum.org/2009/04/27/faith-in-flux/
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lilORANG posted...

that's the logical result of believing one thing but not another

and I keep saying that hindus believe in other religions. your not getting it. to a hindu, all gods are real. because there is only one god that has many names and faces. the multiple gods in hinduism are actually really just a single being. and foreign gods fall under that category. hindus believe in Jesus. and Zeus. and Horus, and the Great Spirit and so on.

FLUFFYGERM posted...

DarkChozoGhost posted...

FLUFFYGERM posted...

this ignores the fact that people do give up their native religion to convert to other religions

Yeah, 0.004% of the time.

http://www.pewforum.org/2009/04/27/faith-in-flux/

They're still converting to local religions. People in the US don't convert to Islam or Hinduism.
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The fact that many people move around the Christian religion shows that the Christian religion itself is good, but the individual sects have a lot of problems

As Jesus said, you don't pour new wine into old wineskins. And the word of Jesus is an eternally new wineskin
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FLUFFYGERM posted...

i always thought this argument was a bad one tbqh

That in itself is a strong indicator that the argument is pretty good tbqh
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DarkChozoGhost posted...

They're still converting

exactly
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Asherlee10 posted...

Damn_Underscore posted...

The fact that many people move around the Christian religion shows that the Christian religion itself is good, but the individual sects have a lot of problems

How do you conclude that? That seems like a leap.

Because all Christian sects are based on the Bible (and more specifically, the four gospels), which you can read at any time. But the different sects interpret the Bible very differently.
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Because the word of Jesus stands strong.

Even if you don't believe in God, you can't deny that the values Jesus teachers are good.
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there are literally more people changing the sex of the bodies they were born with than people changing the religion they were born with to an unrelated religion.

people going from religious to atheist, otoh, is rising rapidly.
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Location is the main factor of what your first religion is.

But when you get older you can decide for yourself what religion you believe in and what values are best.
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Another angle this topic didn't consider is that...maybe every religion is similar in the areas that matter. So people don't find a need to declare war on other religions. Maybe it's a minority that feel the need to preserve their faith as the absolute truth above all other truths.

Maybe people are largely content with the shared characteristics. Similar to how most advanced cultures have had similar views against murder, rape, etc.

Another angle is that maybe most people adopt their household religion as a label but don't actively practice or pursue it in a sophisticated manner. In which case you wouldn't expect much change, since people who aren't actively investigating or studying the material won't see any reason to consider other religions.

Maybe over the years apologists for each religion have built frameworks in which their religion can make sense in the modern age, making each one equally defensible to people who have spent enough time learning those frameworks.

Atheism and secularism are on the rise, so a lot of people are abandoning their household religion.
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Zikten posted...

lilORANG posted...

that's the logical result of believing one thing but not another

and I keep saying that hindus believe in other religions. your not getting it. to a hindu, all gods are real. because there is only one god that has many names and faces. the multiple gods in hinduism are actually really just a single being. and foreign gods fall under that category. hindus believe in Jesus. and Zeus. and Horus, and the Great Spirit and so on.

this is a vast oversimplification. They don't believe in all gods, in the sense that I couldn't make up a god right now and worship it, and all Hindus wouldn't suddenly believe in it. The validity of other gods won't be questioned, but the religion still has its own mythology and traditions, which are followed over those of other religions. So yes, they think their views are right. If they thought other views were right, they'd follow those teachings.

FLUFFYGERM posted...

Another angle this topic didn't consider is that...maybe every religion is similar in the areas that matter.

because that's irrelevant. Every religion can be boiled down to "be a good person" but some religions don't let you be happy in the afterlife unless you follow that religion. Being similar enough means we can get along, because we have shared cultural values, but it does nothing to address the underlying feeling of "i'm right, you're wrong"
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lilORANG posted...

because that's irrelevant. Every religion can be boiled down to "be a good person" but some religions don't let you be happy in the afterlife unless you follow that religion. Being similar enough means we can get along, because we have shared cultural values, but it does nothing to address the underlying feeling of "i'm right, you're wrong"

And I'm thinking that it's just a minority of people who insist on that underlying feeling. Just like how it's a minority (large subset but still a minority) of Muslims who think you need to blow shit up in order to please Allah.

How many Christians / Jews / Hindus / Muslims actually accept that you need to be part of their religion in order to be a good person or go to heaven?
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Asherlee10 posted...

Damn_Underscore posted...

Location is the main factor of what your first religion is.

But when you get older you can decide for yourself what religion you believe in and what values are best.

Fair enough, I'm not sure I agree though. I think it's easier for people to convert to another religion entirely if they are exposed to it more. Your average American isn't going to know much about any Eastern religions or their philosophies.

That really isn't true anymore with the internet.

Also Eastern and Western religions are very different, but the values are basically the same. There's no reason you couldn't be a Christian and still follow the teachings of Buddhism or Taoism or Confucianism.
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FLUFFYGERM posted...

How many Christians / Jews / Hindus / Muslims actually accept that you need to be part of their religion in order to be a good person or go to heaven?

The former, very few. The latter, idk. Seems like it's a pretty prominent teaching in many Christian denominations.
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switching to a different denomination of christianity isn't really converting. that's really weak conversion tbh. when people talk about conversion they usually mean switching religions entirely, not making a lateral shift within your religion
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ThyCorndog posted...

switching to a different denomination of christianity isn't really converting. that's really weak conversion tbh. when people talk about conversion they usually mean switching religions entirely, not making a lateral shift within your religion

uh nah the differences between denominations can be very substantial, to the point of it being another religion entirely. in the same way that different sects of hinduism and islam consider themselves to be different from other sects of those religions.

if a pentecostal becomes a baptist or vice versa, for example, that's a huge paradigm shift in how they perceive both their religion and the rest of the world.
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ThyCorndog posted...

switching to a different denomination of christianity isn't really converting. that's really weak conversion tbh. when people talk about conversion they usually mean switching religions entirely, not making a lateral shift within your religion

yup. Still worshipping Jesus.
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FLUFFYGERM posted...

ThyCorndog posted...

switching to a different denomination of christianity isn't really converting. that's really weak conversion tbh. when people talk about conversion they usually mean switching religions entirely, not making a lateral shift within your religion

uh nah the differences between denominations can be very substantial, to the point of it being another religion entirely. in the same way that different sects of hinduism and islam consider themselves to be different from other sects of those religions.

if a pentecostal becomes a baptist or vice versa, for example, that's a huge paradigm shift in how they perceive both their religion and the rest of the world.

what's so different that you count it as an entirely different religion? FYI I don't even consider orthodox and catholic to be different religions, or sunni and shia. the worldview of their faiths aren't so drastically different. it's mostly political differences and method of prayer/ritual. the beliefs are almost identical
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>love thy neighbor
vs
>kill all non-believers

bb-b-but he's a good boy! he goes to the [church equivalent] and plays acidball with his friends!

ThyCorndog posted...

FLUFFYGERM posted...

ThyCorndog posted...

switching to a different denomination of christianity isn't really converting. that's really weak conversion tbh. when people talk about conversion they usually mean switching religions entirely, not making a lateral shift within your religion

uh nah the differences between denominations can be very substantial, to the point of it being another religion entirely. in the same way that different sects of hinduism and islam consider themselves to be different from other sects of those religions.

if a pentecostal becomes a baptist or vice versa, for example, that's a huge paradigm shift in how they perceive both their religion and the rest of the world.

what's so different that you count it as an entirely different religion? FYI I don't even consider orthodox and catholic to be different religions, or sunni and shia. the worldview of their faiths aren't so drastically different. it's mostly political differences and method of prayer/ritual. the beliefs are almost identical

there's a world of difference that can't be contained in just one post, to be honest. but the rituals, practices, even the beliefs, can differ drastically.
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FLUFFYGERM posted...

ThyCorndog posted...

FLUFFYGERM posted...

ThyCorndog posted...

switching to a different denomination of christianity isn't really converting. that's really weak conversion tbh. when people talk about conversion they usually mean switching religions entirely, not making a lateral shift within your religion

uh nah the differences between denominations can be very substantial, to the point of it being another religion entirely. in the same way that different sects of hinduism and islam consider themselves to be different from other sects of those religions.

if a pentecostal becomes a baptist or vice versa, for example, that's a huge paradigm shift in how they perceive both their religion and the rest of the world.

what's so different that you count it as an entirely different religion? FYI I don't even consider orthodox and catholic to be different religions, or sunni and shia. the worldview of their faiths aren't so drastically different. it's mostly political differences and method of prayer/ritual. the beliefs are almost identical

there's a world of difference that can't be contained in just one post, to be honest. but the rituals, practices, even the beliefs, can differ drastically.

sure. I get that. I just don't think it's as much of a leap to change from being a catholic to a baptist as it is like being jewish to switching to hinduism. and I know you know that
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ThyCorndog posted...

FLUFFYGERM posted...

ThyCorndog posted...

FLUFFYGERM posted...

ThyCorndog posted...

switching to a different denomination of christianity isn't really converting. that's really weak conversion tbh. when people talk about conversion they usually mean switching religions entirely, not making a lateral shift within your religion

uh nah the differences between denominations can be very substantial, to the point of it being another religion entirely. in the same way that different sects of hinduism and islam consider themselves to be different from other sects of those religions.

if a pentecostal becomes a baptist or vice versa, for example, that's a huge paradigm shift in how they perceive both their religion and the rest of the world.

what's so different that you count it as an entirely different religion? FYI I don't even consider orthodox and catholic to be different religions, or sunni and shia. the worldview of their faiths aren't so drastically different. it's mostly political differences and method of prayer/ritual. the beliefs are almost identical

there's a world of difference that can't be contained in just one post, to be honest. but the rituals, practices, even the beliefs, can differ drastically.

sure. I get that. I just don't think it's as much of a leap to change from being a catholic to a baptist as it is like being jewish to switching to hinduism. and I know you know that

it absolutely is as big of a leap. you can even be disowned by friends and family for the switch because it is perceived as joining a different religion.

a pentecostal would react the same way if you became a mormon or a catholic or a baptist or a muslim. etc.
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lilORANG posted...

TheVipaGTS posted...

lilORANG posted...

You in India, good chance you'll practice Hinduism. Everyone else is wrong.

not really true. i was born and raised hindu. my dad always respected all religions. there were the main gods he'd directly pray to but he would never call anyone else wrong. hell he has a little cabinet of religious pictures and statues in his house and there is a picture of jesus in there one of his coworkers gave him at christmas years ago...its in there because to him it is a god that should be respected even if its not one he prays to. Most hindus i've known have been that way. then again it could just be a personal bias and it might just be my own family that thinks that way...

nah, I think that's generally what Hindu is. But it's still it's own distinct thing. They may not judge others as much but they obviously think their own beliefs are more valid, otherwise they'd be whatever they thought was better.

And?

"if people wanted to be different they would". Stunning observations itt
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FLUFFYGERM posted...

ThyCorndog posted...

FLUFFYGERM posted...

ThyCorndog posted...

FLUFFYGERM posted...

ThyCorndog posted...

switching to a different denomination of christianity isn't really converting. that's really weak conversion tbh. when people talk about conversion they usually mean switching religions entirely, not making a lateral shift within your religion

uh nah the differences between denominations can be very substantial, to the point of it being another religion entirely. in the same way that different sects of hinduism and islam consider themselves to be different from other sects of those religions.

if a pentecostal becomes a baptist or vice versa, for example, that's a huge paradigm shift in how they perceive both their religion and the rest of the world.

what's so different that you count it as an entirely different religion? FYI I don't even consider orthodox and catholic to be different religions, or sunni and shia. the worldview of their faiths aren't so drastically different. it's mostly political differences and method of prayer/ritual. the beliefs are almost identical

there's a world of difference that can't be contained in just one post, to be honest. but the rituals, practices, even the beliefs, can differ drastically.

sure. I get that. I just don't think it's as much of a leap to change from being a catholic to a baptist as it is like being jewish to switching to hinduism. and I know you know that

it absolutely is as big of a leap. you can even be disowned by friends and family for the switch because it is perceived as joining a different religion.

a pentecostal would react the same way if you became a mormon or a catholic or a baptist or a muslim. etc.

a pentecostal family would react the same way if you went home and said you're now a baptist as they would if you went home and said you were now muslim? like I know that's what you're saying, but I'm having a hard time believing that. I asked my friend whose family is baptist what's different about pentecostals just now and he said he doesn't know
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