Current Events > They need to abolish health insurance

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solosnake 07/19/17 10:05:11 PM #1:	just make a health tax and have universal health care, treat everyone for free with any condition. Get rid of this idea of health insurance. stop monetizing medicines. but who am I kidding, we live in a capitalist society --- "We would have no NBA possibly if they got rid of all the flopping." ~ Dwyane Wade http://i.imgur.com/MYYEIx5.gif http://i.imgur.com/WGE12ef.jpg <cite>solosnake posted [p:883239211] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote>just make a health tax and have universal health care, treat everyone for free with any condition. Get rid of this idea of health insurance. stop monetizing medicines. but who am I kidding, we live in a capitalist society</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Annihilated 07/19/17 10:10:46 PM #2:	Millions of jobs would be lost without the health insurance industry. Of course some might be created by the expanding health care sector, but they wouldn't come close to making up for it. <cite>Annihilated posted [p:883239521] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote>Millions of jobs would be lost without the health insurance industry. Of course some might be created by the expanding health care sector, but they wouldn't come close to making up for it.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
RebelElite791 07/19/17 10:11:33 PM #3:	solosnake posted... but who am I kidding, we live in a capitalist society So do countries with universal healthcare yet they make it work. --- http://i.imgur.com/MS5SvzN.gif https://i.imgur.com/ahQpG57.jpg <cite>RebelElite791 posted [p:883239564] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>solosnake posted...</cite> <quote>but who am I kidding, we live in a capitalist society</quote> So do countries with universal healthcare yet they make it work.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
solosnake 07/19/17 10:14:17 PM #4:	Annihilated posted... Millions of jobs would be lost without the health insurance industry. Of course some might be created by the expanding health care sector, but they wouldn't come close to making up for it. honestly, those jobs arent helping society, they are actively harming it. --- "We would have no NBA possibly if they got rid of all the flopping." ~ Dwyane Wade http://i.imgur.com/MYYEIx5.gif http://i.imgur.com/WGE12ef.jpg <cite>solosnake posted [p:883239706] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>Annihilated posted...</cite> <quote>Millions of jobs would be lost without the health insurance industry. Of course some might be created by the expanding health care sector, but they wouldn't come close to making up for it.</quote> honestly, those jobs arent helping society, they are actively harming it.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
MorbidFaithless 07/19/17 10:19:40 PM #5:	solosnake posted... honestly, those jobs arent helping society, they are actively harming it. This --- walk like thunder <cite>MorbidFaithless posted [p:883239974] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>solosnake posted...</cite> <quote>honestly, those jobs arent helping society, they are actively harming it.</quote> This</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ZeldaMutant 07/19/17 10:20:03 PM #6:	Annihilated posted... Millions of jobs would be lost without the health insurance industry. Of course some might be created by the expanding health care sector, but they wouldn't come close to making up for it. Broken window fallacy. Jobs that are a waste of resources should disappear. --- 96065 <cite>ZeldaMutant posted [p:883239990] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>Annihilated posted...</cite> <quote>Millions of jobs would be lost without the health insurance industry. Of course some might be created by the expanding health care sector, but they wouldn't come close to making up for it.</quote>Broken window fallacy. Jobs that are a waste of resources should disappear.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Transcendentia 07/19/17 10:21:20 PM #7:	solosnake posted... Annihilated posted... Millions of jobs would be lost without the health insurance industry. Of course some might be created by the expanding health care sector, but they wouldn't come close to making up for it. honestly, those jobs arent helping society, they are actively harming it. This is horseshit. ZeldaMutant posted... Annihilated posted... Millions of jobs would be lost without the health insurance industry. Of course some might be created by the expanding health care sector, but they wouldn't come close to making up for it. Broken window fallacy. Jobs that are a waste of resources should disappear. Who decides which jobs are a good use of resources? <cite>Transcendentia posted [p:883240062] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>solosnake posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Annihilated posted...</cite> <quote>Millions of jobs would be lost without the health insurance industry. Of course some might be created by the expanding health care sector, but they wouldn't come close to making up for it.</quote> honestly, those jobs arent helping society, they are actively harming it.</quote> This is horseshit. <cite>ZeldaMutant posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Annihilated posted...</cite> <quote>Millions of jobs would be lost without the health insurance industry. Of course some might be created by the expanding health care sector, but they wouldn't come close to making up for it.</quote>Broken window fallacy. Jobs that are a waste of resources should disappear.</quote> Who decides which jobs are a good use of resources?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Soviet_Poland 07/19/17 10:23:47 PM #8:	Annihilated posted... Millions of jobs would be lost without the health insurance industry. Paper pushing. Eliminate the middle man bureaucracy and maybe we'll get more funding for graduate medical education and healthcare staff actually involved in patient care instead of bookkeeping for companies that just shave off money from the healthcare industry pie that just maximizes profit for people who don't do anything with patients. --- "He has two neurons held together by a spirochete." <cite>Soviet_Poland posted [p:883240188] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>Annihilated posted...</cite> <quote>Millions of jobs would be lost without the health insurance industry.</quote> Paper pushing. Eliminate the middle man bureaucracy and maybe we'll get more funding for graduate medical education and healthcare staff actually involved in patient care instead of bookkeeping for companies that just shave off money from the healthcare industry pie that just maximizes profit for people who don't do anything with patients.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Annihilated 07/19/17 10:25:00 PM #9:	solosnake posted... Annihilated posted... Millions of jobs would be lost without the health insurance industry. Of course some might be created by the expanding health care sector, but they wouldn't come close to making up for it. honestly, those jobs arent helping society, they are actively harming it. LMAO. Middle class jobs who fuel spending for businesses and companies of all sizes are "harming society" because reasons. Transcendentia posted... Who decides which jobs are a good use of resources? Why, the people who think their own job is worth $15 an hour of course. <cite>Annihilated posted [p:883240258] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>solosnake posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Annihilated posted...</cite> <quote>Millions of jobs would be lost without the health insurance industry. Of course some might be created by the expanding health care sector, but they wouldn't come close to making up for it.</quote> honestly, those jobs arent helping society, they are actively harming it.</quote> LMAO. Middle class jobs who fuel spending for businesses and companies of all sizes are "harming society" because reasons. <cite>Transcendentia posted...</cite> <quote>Who decides which jobs are a good use of resources? </quote> Why, the people who think their own job is worth $15 an hour of course.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Transcendentia 07/19/17 10:27:07 PM #10:	Annihilated posted... Why, the people who think their own job is worth $15 an hour of course. It'd be pretty embarrassing and inconsistent if TC and ZeldaMutant work in some useless and poisonous industry like fast food, tbqh. <cite>Transcendentia posted [p:883240358] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>Annihilated posted...</cite> <quote>Why, the people who think their own job is worth $15 an hour of course. </quote> It'd be pretty embarrassing and inconsistent if TC and ZeldaMutant work in some useless and poisonous industry like fast food, tbqh.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
NurseRedHeart 07/19/17 10:28:16 PM #11:	It used to make perfect sense but now everyone is getting sick for any type of reason. --- http://tinyurl.com/z8cf8o6 / http://tinyurl.com/jpq5l8j / http://tinyurl.com/z9y449e \ ( ' w ') / - Ah yiss! <cite>NurseRedHeart posted [p:883240421] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote>It used to make perfect sense but now everyone is getting sick for any type of reason.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Soviet_Poland 07/19/17 10:29:46 PM #12:	Annihilated posted... LMAO. Middle class jobs who fuel spending for businesses and companies of all sizes are "harming society" because reasons. And a compensatory increase in income in people actually involved in patient care or hospital affairs wouldn't fuel proportionate spending? I'll get on my soap box here and say that nurses, doctors, technicians, pharmacists, physical therapists, etc are a bit more important than some paper pusher in a company literally doing nothing else but leeching as much money from the healthcare industry and away from patients and healthcare professionals as possible. They're drains. Let some of them take over the administrative ends in hospitals and clinics, but the rest, I'm not going to justify keeping jobs for the marginal economic benefit (when there are also economic downsides on the other side of that coin, and realistically you aren't any better at predicting the net effect of this either). --- "He has two neurons held together by a spirochete." <cite>Soviet_Poland posted [p:883240496] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>Annihilated posted...</cite> <quote>LMAO. Middle class jobs who fuel spending for businesses and companies of all sizes are "harming society" because reasons.</quote> And a compensatory increase in income in people actually involved in patient care or hospital affairs wouldn't fuel proportionate spending? I'll get on my soap box here and say that nurses, doctors, technicians, pharmacists, physical therapists, etc are a bit more important than some paper pusher in a company literally doing nothing else but leeching as much money from the healthcare industry and away from patients and healthcare professionals as possible. They're drains. Let some of them take over the administrative ends in hospitals and clinics, but the rest, I'm not going to justify keeping jobs for the marginal economic benefit (when there are also economic downsides on the other side of that coin, and realistically you aren't any better at predicting the net effect of this either).</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Questionmarktarius 07/19/17 10:31:47 PM #13:	Ban all 3rd-party payers, except for catastrophic coverage and charity hospitals. Costs will collapse immediately. <cite>Questionmarktarius posted [p:883240600] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote>Ban all 3rd-party payers, except for catastrophic coverage and charity hospitals. Costs will collapse immediately.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Annihilated 07/19/17 10:31:54 PM #14:	Soviet_Poland posted... Annihilated posted... LMAO. Middle class jobs who fuel spending for businesses and companies of all sizes are "harming society" because reasons. And a compensatory increase in income in people actually involved in patient care or hospital affairs wouldn't fuel proportionate spending? I'll get on my soap box here and say that nurses, doctors, technicians, pharmacists, physical therapists, etc are a bit more important than some paper pusher in a company literally doing nothing else but leeching as much money from the healthcare industry and away from patients and healthcare professionals. They're drains. Let some of them take over the administrative ends in hospitals and clinics, but the rest, I'm not going to justify keeping jobs for the marginal economic benefit (when there are also economic downsides on the other side of that coin, and realistically you aren't any better at predicting the net effect of this either). The damage to the overall economy would be so great, healthcare in general would almost be pointless anyway. <cite>Annihilated posted [p:883240606] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>Soviet_Poland posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Annihilated posted...</cite> <quote>LMAO. Middle class jobs who fuel spending for businesses and companies of all sizes are "harming society" because reasons.</quote> And a compensatory increase in income in people actually involved in patient care or hospital affairs wouldn't fuel proportionate spending? I'll get on my soap box here and say that nurses, doctors, technicians, pharmacists, physical therapists, etc are a bit more important than some paper pusher in a company literally doing nothing else but leeching as much money from the healthcare industry and away from patients and healthcare professionals. They're drains. Let some of them take over the administrative ends in hospitals and clinics, but the rest, I'm not going to justify keeping jobs for the marginal economic benefit (when there are also economic downsides on the other side of that coin, and realistically you aren't any better at predicting the net effect of this either).</quote> The damage to the overall economy would be so great, healthcare in general would almost be pointless anyway.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Transcendentia 07/19/17 10:32:00 PM #15:	Soviet_Poland posted... Annihilated posted... LMAO. Middle class jobs who fuel spending for businesses and companies of all sizes are "harming society" because reasons. And a compensatory increase in income in people actually involved in patient care or hospital affairs wouldn't fuel proportionate spending? I'll get on my soap box here and say that nurses, doctors, technicians, pharmacists, physical therapists, etc are a bit more important than some paper pusher in a company literally doing nothing else but leeching as much money from the healthcare industry and away from patients and healthcare professionals. They're drains. Let some of them take over the administrative ends in hospitals and clinics, but the rest, I'm not going to justify keeping jobs for the marginal economic benefit (when there are also economic downsides on the other side of that coin, and realistically you aren't any better at predicting the net effect of this either). Don't underestimate how much doctors overbill. <cite>Transcendentia posted [p:883240616] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>Soviet_Poland posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Annihilated posted...</cite> <quote>LMAO. Middle class jobs who fuel spending for businesses and companies of all sizes are "harming society" because reasons.</quote> And a compensatory increase in income in people actually involved in patient care or hospital affairs wouldn't fuel proportionate spending? I'll get on my soap box here and say that nurses, doctors, technicians, pharmacists, physical therapists, etc are a bit more important than some paper pusher in a company literally doing nothing else but leeching as much money from the healthcare industry and away from patients and healthcare professionals. They're drains. Let some of them take over the administrative ends in hospitals and clinics, but the rest, I'm not going to justify keeping jobs for the marginal economic benefit (when there are also economic downsides on the other side of that coin, and realistically you aren't any better at predicting the net effect of this either).</quote> Don't underestimate how much doctors overbill.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Transcendentia 07/19/17 10:32:52 PM #16:	Questionmarktarius posted... Ban all 3rd-party payers, except for catastrophic coverage and charity hospitals. Costs will collapse immediately. And so will the economy. Some of the biggest companies are in the health insurance space. And they do a shit ton of work in that space. Despite the bad reputation health insurance companies get, they're actually doing solid work. <cite>Transcendentia posted [p:883240666] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>Questionmarktarius posted...</cite> <quote>Ban all 3rd-party payers, except for catastrophic coverage and charity hospitals. Costs will collapse immediately.</quote> And so will the economy. Some of the biggest companies are in the health insurance space. And they do a shit ton of work in that space. Despite the bad reputation health insurance companies get, they're actually doing solid work.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Soviet_Poland 07/19/17 10:36:34 PM #17:	Annihilated posted... The damage to the overall economy would be so great, healthcare in general would almost be pointless anyway. And are you on the budgetary committee privy to determining an economic forecasting on this issue? Did you get your Masters in Business Administration and have experience in the health insurance industry, perhaps as a CFO? --- "He has two neurons held together by a spirochete." <cite>Soviet_Poland posted [p:883240860] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>Annihilated posted...</cite> <quote>The damage to the overall economy would be so great, healthcare in general would almost be pointless anyway.</quote> And are you on the budgetary committee privy to determining an economic forecasting on this issue? Did you get your Masters in Business Administration and have experience in the health insurance industry, perhaps as a CFO?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Questionmarktarius 07/19/17 10:37:12 PM #18:	Transcendentia posted... Despite the bad reputation health insurance companies get, they're actually doing solid work. I haven't made an attempt at a bad analogy for awhile, so here's a new one. Let's say you went into a burger place for a cheeseburger that someone said would be the perfect cheeseburger for you, and were told it costs $185. You'd be sensible to walk out and look for a cheaper cheeseburger. Now, let's say you were in some sort of free cheeseburger club,and went into the same place. You'd be pretty damn pissed if the club refused to pay for that cheeseburger, maybe even to the point of accusing the club of starving you. <cite>Questionmarktarius posted [p:883240890] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>Transcendentia posted...</cite> <quote>Despite the bad reputation health insurance companies get, they're actually doing solid work.</quote> I haven't made an attempt at a bad analogy for awhile, so here's a new one. Let's say you went into a burger place for a cheeseburger that someone said would be the perfect cheeseburger for you, and were told it costs $185. You'd be sensible to walk out and look for a cheaper cheeseburger. Now, let's say you were in some sort of free cheeseburger club,and went into the same place. You'd be pretty damn pissed if the club refused to pay for that cheeseburger, maybe even to the point of accusing the club of starving you.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Jeff AKA Snoopy 07/19/17 10:41:03 PM #19:	Just wondering what percentage of taxes you guys pay in the States. I pay 5% GST and 6% PST, so all my new purchases are taxed 11% overall. That pays for Universal Health Care in my neck of Canada . --- It's art! YOU DON'T NEED PANTS! - Chris Jericho http://imgur.com/a/1zdpk <cite>Jeff AKA Snoopy posted [p:883241083] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote>Just wondering what percentage of taxes you guys pay in the States. I pay 5% GST and 6% PST, so all my new purchases are taxed 11% overall. That pays for Universal Health Care in my neck of Canada .</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
booboy 07/19/17 10:41:49 PM #20:	I've seen a line item large size hospital bill. When they charge $30 for one Tylenol pill that you can buy at any pharmacy for a sane cost and $150 for a teddy bear I have seen on the shelf at Wal Mart, down to matching UPC numbers, insurance companies aren't the cause of the cancer that's health care, they're just a symptomatic tumor. --- There is no problem that can't be solved by applying more yuri to it. In Torque We Trust <cite>booboy posted [p:883241111] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote>I've seen a line item large size hospital bill. When they charge $30 for one Tylenol pill that you can buy at any pharmacy for a sane cost and $150 for a teddy bear I have seen on the shelf at Wal Mart, down to matching UPC numbers, insurance companies aren't the cause of the cancer that's health care, they're just a symptomatic tumor.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
EnragedSlith 07/19/17 10:42:49 PM #21:	Health insurance should be catastrophic only. The fact that we need it for basic care is really backward --- http://i.imgur.com/gIoselB.gif https://i.imgur.com/p8iCfHF.jpg <cite>EnragedSlith posted [p:883241162] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote>Health insurance should be catastrophic only. The fact that we need it for basic care is really backward</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Questionmarktarius 07/19/17 10:43:06 PM #22:	booboy posted... When they charge $30 for one Tylenol Because, they have to cover the costs of all deadbeats in the emergency room. ...insurance pays for teddy bears? <cite>Questionmarktarius posted [p:883241175] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>booboy posted...</cite> <quote>When they charge $30 for one Tylenol</quote> Because, they have to cover the costs of all deadbeats in the emergency room. ...insurance pays for teddy bears?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Questionmarktarius 07/19/17 10:44:31 PM #23:	Sales tax is about 10% here, and all we got is a stupid train to nowhere. <cite>Questionmarktarius posted [p:883241247] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote>Sales tax is about 10% here, and all we got is a stupid train to nowhere.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Soviet_Poland 07/19/17 10:44:52 PM #24:	Transcendentia posted... Don't underestimate how much doctors overbill. First off, doctors don't really set prices. Secondly, medical billing is artificially increased as a function of insurance companies denying claims and delaying reimbursement as much as possible for their own profits. So if they reimburse 70% of what the services are actually worth (sake of argument), you bill accordingly higher in order to meet at the amount that the services are actually worth. It's a round-about way of doing it, but a reality of healthcare with insurance companies. Also it varies between private practice offices, which is a more 1:1 interaction between a doctor's office and billing staff and the insurance company. "Overbilling" as you put it is considered fraud and is a criminal offense. Doctors do go to prison for this and lose their medical license. Insurance companies have enough influence as well such that doctors can't side step the insurance company and negotiate the prices with the patient themselves. If you accept insurance, it's contractual that you won't do cash pay visits with insured patients. You're either all cash pay (a previously non-viable model, although some primary care offices are trying it, and it has been historically possible in psychiatry) or you take insurance and your salary is virtually all paid to you by the insurance company. Hospitals are a different beast in that they often get put on the hook to pay for services the patient was either denied, or did not have insurance and can't pay, and these services are often much more expensive. When 10-20% of your "customers" don't pay, the hospital can't stay open. It shifts all those costs onto the insured pool, so other people's insurance is more expensive when other people don't pay. This is what Obamacare tried to alleviate, but it's a bit too convoluted of a system to have a layperson follow, let alone truly appreciate the minutiae. --- "He has two neurons held together by a spirochete." <cite>Soviet_Poland posted [p:883241267] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>Transcendentia posted...</cite> <quote>Don't underestimate how much doctors overbill.</quote> First off, doctors don't really set prices. Secondly, medical billing is artificially increased as a function of insurance companies denying claims and delaying reimbursement as much as possible for their own profits. So if they reimburse 70% of what the services are actually worth (sake of argument), you bill accordingly higher in order to meet at the amount that the services are actually worth. It's a round-about way of doing it, but a reality of healthcare with insurance companies. Also it varies between private practice offices, which is a more 1:1 interaction between a doctor's office and billing staff and the insurance company. "Overbilling" as you put it is considered fraud and is a criminal offense. Doctors do go to prison for this and lose their medical license. Insurance companies have enough influence as well such that doctors can't side step the insurance company and negotiate the prices with the patient themselves. If you accept insurance, it's contractual that you won't do cash pay visits with insured patients. You're either all cash pay (a previously non-viable model, although some primary care offices are trying it, and it has been historically possible in psychiatry) or you take insurance and your salary is virtually all paid to you by the insurance company. Hospitals are a different beast in that they often get put on the hook to pay for services the patient was either denied, or did not have insurance and can't pay, and these services are often much more expensive. When 10-20% of your "customers" don't pay, the hospital can't stay open. It shifts all those costs onto the insured pool, so other people's insurance is more expensive when other people don't pay. This is what Obamacare tried to alleviate, but it's a bit too convoluted of a system to have a layperson follow, let alone truly appreciate the minutiae.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Questionmarktarius 07/19/17 10:45:56 PM #25:	Soviet_Poland posted... First off, doctors don't really set prices. If insurance is going to pay up to $1350 for a MRI, you better damn well believe that a hospital is going to charge exactly $1350. <cite>Questionmarktarius posted [p:883241320] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>Soviet_Poland posted...</cite> <quote>First off, doctors don't really set prices.</quote> If insurance is going to pay up to $1350 for a MRI, you better damn well believe that a hospital is going to charge exactly $1350.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Paper_Okami 07/19/17 10:47:25 PM #26:	solosnake posted... but who am I kidding, we live in a capitalist society James Cromwell talking real shit https://www.democracynow.org/2017/7/14/extended_interview_with_actor_james_cromwell Capitalism is a cancer. --- "Conceit, arrogance and egotism are the essentials of patriotism"- Emma Goldman "Wimmy Wham Wham Wozzle!" -Slurms MacKenzie <cite>Paper_Okami posted [p:883241380] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>solosnake posted...</cite> <quote>but who am I kidding, we live in a capitalist society</quote> James Cromwell talking real shit https://www.democracynow.org/2017/7/14/extended_interview_with_actor_james_cromwell Capitalism is a cancer. </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
RebelElite791 07/19/17 10:48:19 PM #27:	Paper_Okami posted... solosnake posted... but who am I kidding, we live in a capitalist society James Cromwell talking real shit https://www.democracynow.org/2017/7/14/extended_interview_with_actor_james_cromwell Capitalism is a cancer. RebelElite791 posted... solosnake posted... but who am I kidding, we live in a capitalist society So do countries with universal healthcare yet they make it work. thinking emoji --- http://i.imgur.com/MS5SvzN.gif https://i.imgur.com/ahQpG57.jpg <cite>RebelElite791 posted [p:883241423] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>Paper_Okami posted...</cite> <quote><cite>solosnake posted...</cite> <quote>but who am I kidding, we live in a capitalist society</quote> James Cromwell talking real shit https://www.democracynow.org/2017/7/14/extended_interview_with_actor_james_cromwell Capitalism is a cancer. </quote> <cite>RebelElite791 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>solosnake posted...</cite> <quote>but who am I kidding, we live in a capitalist society</quote> So do countries with universal healthcare yet they make it work.</quote> thinking emoji</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Questionmarktarius 07/19/17 10:50:03 PM #28:	Paper_Okami posted... solosnake posted... but who am I kidding, we live in a capitalist society James Cromwell talking real shit https://www.democracynow.org/2017/7/14/extended_interview_with_actor_james_cromwell Capitalism is a cancer. Meanwhile, thanks to capitalism: http://www.therichest.com/celebnetworth/celeb/actors/james-cromwell-net-worth/ <cite>Questionmarktarius posted [p:883241518] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>Paper_Okami posted...</cite> <quote><cite>solosnake posted...</cite> <quote>but who am I kidding, we live in a capitalist society</quote> James Cromwell talking real shit https://www.democracynow.org/2017/7/14/extended_interview_with_actor_james_cromwell Capitalism is a cancer. </quote> Meanwhile, thanks to capitalism: http://www.therichest.com/celebnetworth/celeb/actors/james-cromwell-net-worth/</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
RebelElite791 07/19/17 10:51:08 PM #29:	Questionmarktarius posted... Paper_Okami posted... solosnake posted... but who am I kidding, we live in a capitalist society James Cromwell talking real shit https://www.democracynow.org/2017/7/14/extended_interview_with_actor_james_cromwell Capitalism is a cancer. Meanwhile, thanks to capitalism: http://www.therichest.com/celebnetworth/celeb/actors/james-cromwell-net-worth/ lol --- http://i.imgur.com/MS5SvzN.gif https://i.imgur.com/ahQpG57.jpg <cite>RebelElite791 posted [p:883241581] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>Questionmarktarius posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Paper_Okami posted...</cite> <quote><cite>solosnake posted...</cite> <quote>but who am I kidding, we live in a capitalist society</quote> James Cromwell talking real shit https://www.democracynow.org/2017/7/14/extended_interview_with_actor_james_cromwell Capitalism is a cancer. </quote> Meanwhile, thanks to capitalism: http://www.therichest.com/celebnetworth/celeb/actors/james-cromwell-net-worth/</quote> lol</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Soviet_Poland 07/19/17 10:51:50 PM #30:	Questionmarktarius posted... If insurance is going to pay you up to $1350 for a MRI, you better damn well believe that a hospital is going to charge exactly $1350. That's not really how it works though. For one reason or another, the actual cost of a service, like an MRI, is not really standardized. Since these prices aren't advertised, insurance companies basically play a game of trying to maximize how much they get paid by patients (their customers) and minimizing how much they pay out of benefits. Since hospitals don't know how much to charge, an insurance company might offer $200 reimbursement to the hospital on that MRI. Down the street a few miles at the next hospital, the bill is higher, and the insurance company is willing to shell out $650. The continued squirming from insurance leads to them getting patients on technicalities. You didn't meet this criteria, the hospital was out of network, etc, etc. They deny reimbusement. Patient gets slapped with the bill. The hospital never intended the patient to pay the $650 and virtually always works with a patient who then says they need to pay out of pocket and can't afford it. The hospital is better off getting something rather than nothing, but its much lower than the insurance company's reimbursement. Now the hospital is running out of money, so they bill higher in subsequent services to make up the difference to stay afloat. Again, since no one knows the true cost of an MRI, it's okay, and this other insurance company ends up covering it. But they also deny a different patient's claim somewhere else--again, to maximize their own profits. The end result after a lot of this cat and mouse is the insurance company continues to squeeze more and more money away from both patients and healthcare professionals. Patients have no money to pay for bills they expected to be covered because they're paying premiums. Hospitals can't stay open without continually raising the cost. And insurance continues to siphon the gasoline from the car until it runs empty and it all crashes. --- "He has two neurons held together by a spirochete." <cite>Soviet_Poland posted [p:883241627] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>Questionmarktarius posted...</cite> <quote>If insurance is going to pay you up to $1350 for a MRI, you better damn well believe that a hospital is going to charge exactly $1350.</quote> That's not really how it works though. For one reason or another, the actual cost of a service, like an MRI, is not really standardized. Since these prices aren't advertised, insurance companies basically play a game of trying to maximize how much they get paid by patients (their customers) and minimizing how much they pay out of benefits. Since hospitals don't know how much to charge, an insurance company might offer $200 reimbursement to the hospital on that MRI. Down the street a few miles at the next hospital, the bill is higher, and the insurance company is willing to shell out $650. The continued squirming from insurance leads to them getting patients on technicalities. You didn't meet this criteria, the hospital was out of network, etc, etc. They deny reimbusement. Patient gets slapped with the bill. The hospital never intended the patient to pay the $650 and virtually always works with a patient who then says they need to pay out of pocket and can't afford it. The hospital is better off getting something rather than nothing, but its much lower than the insurance company's reimbursement. Now the hospital is running out of money, so they bill higher in subsequent services to make up the difference to stay afloat. Again, since no one knows the true cost of an MRI, it's okay, and this other insurance company ends up covering it. But they also deny a different patient's claim somewhere else--again, to maximize their own profits. The end result after a lot of this cat and mouse is the insurance company continues to squeeze more and more money away from both patients and healthcare professionals. Patients have no money to pay for bills they expected to be covered because they're paying premiums. Hospitals can't stay open without continually raising the cost. And insurance continues to siphon the gasoline from the car until it runs empty and it all crashes.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Paper_Okami 07/19/17 10:57:47 PM #32:	Questionmarktarius posted... Paper_Okami posted... solosnake posted... but who am I kidding, we live in a capitalist society James Cromwell talking real shit https://www.democracynow.org/2017/7/14/extended_interview_with_actor_james_cromwell Capitalism is a cancer. Meanwhile, thanks to capitalism: http://www.therichest.com/celebnetworth/celeb/actors/james-cromwell-net-worth/ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem --- "Conceit, arrogance and egotism are the essentials of patriotism"- Emma Goldman "Wimmy Wham Wham Wozzle!" -Slurms MacKenzie <cite>Paper_Okami posted [p:883241916] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>Questionmarktarius posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Paper_Okami posted...</cite> <quote><cite>solosnake posted...</cite> <quote>but who am I kidding, we live in a capitalist society</quote> James Cromwell talking real shit https://www.democracynow.org/2017/7/14/extended_interview_with_actor_james_cromwell Capitalism is a cancer. </quote> Meanwhile, thanks to capitalism: http://www.therichest.com/celebnetworth/celeb/actors/james-cromwell-net-worth/</quote> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Questionmarktarius 07/19/17 10:58:52 PM #33:	Soviet_Poland posted... [stuff] Thus, we need to get over the idea that healthcare gets to be pretty much the only product or service that doesn't state the price upfront. Paper_Okami posted... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem You're damn straight it is. <cite>Questionmarktarius posted [p:883241971] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>Soviet_Poland posted...</cite> <quote>[stuff]</quote> Thus, we need to get over the idea that healthcare gets to be pretty much the only product or service that doesn't state the price upfront. <cite>Paper_Okami posted...</cite> <quote>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem</quote> You're damn straight it is.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
MonkeyBones23 07/19/17 11:04:21 PM #34:	The mindset needs to change because universal healthcare would dramatically improve the quality of life for the future. Things will get messed up before they get better (like jobs lost), but in the end it needs to be done. --- We're a forest of lives, but we grow tall and wide. We'll never be cut down. <cite>MonkeyBones23 posted [p:883242247] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote>The mindset needs to change because universal healthcare would dramatically improve the quality of life for the future. Things will get messed up before they get better (like jobs lost), but in the end it needs to be done.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Questionmarktarius 07/19/17 11:08:13 PM #35:	MonkeyBones23 posted... The mindset needs to change because universal healthcare would dramatically improve the quality of life for the future. Things will get messed up before they get better (like jobs lost), but in the end it needs to be done. Why not a "VA for everyone" instead of a "medicare for everyone", along with a parallel private system? Seems like that would avoid a Charlie Gard situation <cite>Questionmarktarius posted [p:883242428] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>MonkeyBones23 posted...</cite> <quote>The mindset needs to change because universal healthcare would dramatically improve the quality of life for the future. Things will get messed up before they get better (like jobs lost), but in the end it needs to be done.</quote> Why not a "VA for everyone" instead of a "medicare for everyone", along with a parallel private system? Seems like that would avoid a Charlie Gard situation</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
MorbidFaithless 07/19/17 11:10:41 PM #36:	MonkeyBones23 posted... The mindset needs to change because universal healthcare would dramatically improve the quality of life for the future. Things will get messed up before they get better (like jobs lost), but in the end it needs to be done. How people don't fucking see this is beyond me --- walk like thunder <cite>MorbidFaithless posted [p:883242538] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>MonkeyBones23 posted...</cite> <quote>The mindset needs to change because universal healthcare would dramatically improve the quality of life for the future. Things will get messed up before they get better (like jobs lost), but in the end it needs to be done.</quote> How people don't fucking see this is beyond me</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
JohnLennon6 07/19/17 11:14:08 PM #37:	America has like ten times the people of other countries with UHC. --- He has good daygame - MasterOfMissions <cite>JohnLennon6 posted [p:883242719] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote>America has like ten times the people of other countries with UHC.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Questionmarktarius 07/19/17 11:15:35 PM #38:	JohnLennon6 posted... America has like ten times the people of other countries with UHC. That's pretty much irrelevant, though. <cite>Questionmarktarius posted [p:883242789] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>JohnLennon6 posted...</cite> <quote>America has like ten times the people of other countries with UHC.</quote> That's pretty much irrelevant, though.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
RebelElite791 07/19/17 11:15:54 PM #39:	JohnLennon6 posted... America has like ten times the people of other countries with UHC. Hilariously incorrect. --- http://i.imgur.com/MS5SvzN.gif https://i.imgur.com/ahQpG57.jpg <cite>RebelElite791 posted [p:883242808] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>JohnLennon6 posted...</cite> <quote>America has like ten times the people of other countries with UHC.</quote> Hilariously incorrect.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Jeff AKA Snoopy 07/19/17 11:17:41 PM #40:	JohnLennon6 posted... America has like ten times the people of other countries with UHC. And still has a GDP in the Top 20, so don't feed anyone that shit like "we can't afford it" You also spend a fuck ton more on the army than any other country per capita. --- It's art! YOU DON'T NEED PANTS! - Chris Jericho http://imgur.com/a/1zdpk <cite>Jeff AKA Snoopy posted [p:883242920] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>JohnLennon6 posted...</cite> <quote>America has like ten times the people of other countries with UHC.</quote> And still has a GDP in the Top 20, so don't feed anyone that shit like "we can't afford it" You also spend a fuck ton more on the army than any other country per capita.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
JohnLennon6 07/19/17 11:17:57 PM #41:	Questionmarktarius posted... JohnLennon6 posted... America has like ten times the people of other countries with UHC. That's pretty much irrelevant, though. How so? It would never work here. --- He has good daygame - MasterOfMissions <cite>JohnLennon6 posted [p:883242937] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>Questionmarktarius posted...</cite> <quote><cite>JohnLennon6 posted...</cite> <quote>America has like ten times the people of other countries with UHC.</quote> That's pretty much irrelevant, though.</quote> How so? It would never work here.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Questionmarktarius 07/19/17 11:20:37 PM #42:	JohnLennon6 posted... Questionmarktarius posted... JohnLennon6 posted... America has like ten times the people of other countries with UHC. That's pretty much irrelevant, though. How so? It would never work here. We're already spending vastly more than anyone else on healthcare, total and per-capita. The only reason it wouldn't work is because we're an nation of greedy assholes who would either fight it to the end, or defraud the shit out of it when it happens. Possibly both. <cite>Questionmarktarius posted [p:883243082] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>JohnLennon6 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Questionmarktarius posted...</cite> <quote><cite>JohnLennon6 posted...</cite> <quote>America has like ten times the people of other countries with UHC.</quote> That's pretty much irrelevant, though.</quote> How so? It would never work here.</quote> We're already spending vastly more than anyone else on healthcare, total and per-capita. The only reason it wouldn't work is because we're an nation of greedy assholes who would either fight it to the end, or defraud the shit out of it when it happens. Possibly both.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
JohnLennon6 07/19/17 11:22:13 PM #43:	Questionmarktarius posted... JohnLennon6 posted... Questionmarktarius posted... JohnLennon6 posted... America has like ten times the people of other countries with UHC. That's pretty much irrelevant, though. How so? It would never work here. The only reason it wouldn't work is because we're an nation of greedy assholes who would either fight it to the end, or defraud the shit out of it when it happens. Possibly both. Exactly. --- He has good daygame - MasterOfMissions <cite>JohnLennon6 posted [p:883243156] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>Questionmarktarius posted...</cite> <quote><cite>JohnLennon6 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Questionmarktarius posted...</cite> <quote><cite>JohnLennon6 posted...</cite> <quote>America has like ten times the people of other countries with UHC.</quote> That's pretty much irrelevant, though.</quote> How so? It would never work here.</quote> The only reason it wouldn't work is because we're an nation of greedy assholes who would either fight it to the end, or defraud the shit out of it when it happens. Possibly both.</quote> Exactly.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
do_ob_tpkillr 07/19/17 11:23:32 PM #44:	No. There's absolutely no reason why I have to pay for your medicine through tax. <cite>do_ob_tpkillr posted [p:883243215] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote>No. There's absolutely no reason why <cite>I</cite> have to pay for <cite>your</cite> medicine through tax.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
creativerealms 07/19/17 11:25:15 PM #45:	I don't believe health should be a commodity. Capitalism is a good thing but something's shouldn't be controlled by it. --- when you stub your toes it's the SJWs fualt. <cite>creativerealms posted [p:883243300] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote>I don't believe health should be a commodity. Capitalism is a good thing but something's shouldn't be controlled by it.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Jeff AKA Snoopy 07/19/17 11:25:21 PM #46:	do_ob_tpkillr posted... No. There's absolutely no reason why I have to pay for your medicine through tax. The Social Contract. --- It's art! YOU DON'T NEED PANTS! - Chris Jericho http://imgur.com/a/1zdpk <cite>Jeff AKA Snoopy posted [p:883243303] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>do_ob_tpkillr posted...</cite> <quote>No. There's absolutely no reason why <cite>I</cite> have to pay for <cite>your</cite> medicine through tax.</quote> The Social Contract.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
3rd_Best_Master 07/19/17 11:25:46 PM #47:	do_ob_tpkillr posted... No. There's absolutely no reason why I have to pay for your medicine through tax. You already do. --- You've fought the strongest, the second strongest, the fourth strongest, and the weakest master! Now you see the true advantage of being third strongest master! <cite>3rd_Best_Master posted [p:883243327] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>do_ob_tpkillr posted...</cite> <quote>No. There's absolutely no reason why <cite>I</cite> have to pay for <cite>your</cite> medicine through tax.</quote> You already do.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
JohnLennon6 07/19/17 11:26:16 PM #48:	3rd_Best_Master posted... do_ob_tpkillr posted... No. There's absolutely no reason why I have to pay for your medicine through tax. You already do. I don't see it on my paycheck. --- He has good daygame - MasterOfMissions <cite>JohnLennon6 posted [p:883243348] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>3rd_Best_Master posted...</cite> <quote><cite>do_ob_tpkillr posted...</cite> <quote>No. There's absolutely no reason why <cite>I</cite> have to pay for <cite>your</cite> medicine through tax.</quote> You already do.</quote> I don't see it on my paycheck.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Questionmarktarius 07/19/17 11:27:18 PM #49:	JohnLennon6 posted... 3rd_Best_Master posted... do_ob_tpkillr posted... No. There's absolutely no reason why I have to pay for your medicine through tax. You already do. I don't see it on my paycheck. FICA <cite>Questionmarktarius posted [p:883243394] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>JohnLennon6 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>3rd_Best_Master posted...</cite> <quote><cite>do_ob_tpkillr posted...</cite> <quote>No. There's absolutely no reason why <cite>I</cite> have to pay for <cite>your</cite> medicine through tax.</quote> You already do.</quote> I don't see it on my paycheck.</quote> FICA</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Transcendentia 07/19/17 11:27:28 PM #50:	MonkeyBones23 posted... The mindset needs to change because universal healthcare would dramatically improve the quality of life for the future. Things will get messed up before they get better (like jobs lost), but in the end it needs to be done. Funny how leftists stop caring about "muh goodpaying jerbs!!!111" when it suits them <cite>Transcendentia posted [p:883243400] in They need ... [t:75584069]...</cite> <quote><cite>MonkeyBones23 posted...</cite> <quote>The mindset needs to change because universal healthcare would dramatically improve the quality of life for the future. Things will get messed up before they get better (like jobs lost), but in the end it needs to be done.</quote> Funny how leftists stop caring about "muh goodpaying jerbs!!!111" when it suits them</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Current Events > They need to abolish health insurance (+) Yeah! (+)

Current Events > They need to abolish health insurance