Current Events > Arthas Menethil did nothing wrong SPOILERS for WC3 and WoW

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this may be a very unpopular take but I have always felt that Arthas was innocent. In WC 3 when he purged a village, it was the right thing do. Only he seemed to understand though. All his friends abandoned him because they didn't want to understand

I do think them all leaving was like 90% of the reason he stepped on the dark path. I don't think he would have become the Lich King if his friends had supported him and not left him alone

And when he picked up the sword, he wasn't Arthas anymore. His soul was down inside his body not in control. Almost every crime committed by Arthas was not actually by his doing. It was a demon in control of him and influencing him. Nothing he did as the Lich King is his fault

And in Shadowlands, his final fate was disgusting. The character who actually did do evil while in full control of her mind, Sylvanus, gets a redemption arc, while the victimized Arthas is reduced to nothing and deprived even of an afterlife

And they let his soul exist a few moments longer just so Sylvanus can lecture at him before he ceases to be. His girlfriend is in the fucking room, and should have been the one who last spoke to him but she just stands there and doesn't say anything

Its so fucked up and insulting and all because the Devs are in love with Sylvanus . I think most fans wanted a redemption arc for Arthas. Its classic fantasy. And Arthas was always heavily inspired by Darth Vader

Basically, I see Arthas as a person who got abused by everyone he ever met, and used and chewed up and then thrown away by even the gods

Zikten posted...

In WC 3 when he purged a village, it was the right thing do

True.

Zikten posted...

I do think them all leaving was like 90% of the reason he stepped on the dark path. I don't think he would have become the Lich King if his friends had supported him and not left him alone

True.

Zikten posted...

Almost every crime committed by Arthas was not actually by his doing.

He did hire a band of mercenaries to help burn down his ships, then turned on them and had his own men slaughter them when they were caught. So, y'know, not all sunshine.

Zikten posted...

Nothing he did as the Lich King is his fault

Not true. He overtook Ner'zhul very quickly and then chose to do everything that he did. When he had the opportunity to turn back, he ripped his own heart out of his chest to purge any kind of human emotion. Later on, when Tirion Fordring tried to appeal to his humanity by looking into that heart, he realized there was absolutely no possibility of his redemption.

Zikten posted...

I think most fans wanted a redemption arc for Arthas.

This is abso-fucking-lutely not true. I think the biggest fear the fanbase had going into Shadowlands was that they would fuck Arthas up. While I do think Uther and Jaina should have had at least a word in edgewise, I think Arthas' story actually ends fairly well.

well then why does Sylvanus deserve redemption? She should have been destroyed too

I reread my post and didn't see anything about Sylvanas deserving redemption, so I don't know why you asked me that.

That said, Sylvanas is a different situation because she's not exactly the same person that committed all her crimes. For all of Blizzard's faults, I think sending her to hell to save every soul she damned there is an excellent end for her.

because you are saying Arthas was to blame. Well then so was she. She was never in any doubt of being not in control. She has always been known have total free will. So if Arthas should be destroyed then she should have been too.

She is the same the same person that committed the crimes. She did it all.

I would have had Arthas rescue people from the Maw, and have Sylvanas get soul deleted

my entire point with this topic is that Sylvanas got special treatment that Arthas deserved instead of her

Zikten posted...

because you are saying Arthas was to blame.

He was.

Zikten posted...

Well then so was she

She was.

Zikten posted...

She is the same the same person that committed the crimes. She did it all.

Ehhh, kind of.

The main difference between the two is that Sylvanas regretted her actions after getting her time-locked soul half thrown back at her. She willingly submitted to the punishment of the woman that hated her more than anyone else in the entire universe. Arthas went to his grave not regretting a single thing.

Arthas should have been sent to Revendreth and tortured into redemption. Your issue is with Uther, not Sylvanas.

pegusus123456 posted...

She was.

Then kill her. I'll never forgive this story unless they somehow destroy her forever. It's the only way to have justice now

Fuck Sylvanas

And Arthas should have been given a chance. He didn't regret because he wasn't given a chance. The writers are the ones who decide what happens. They decided to make a situation that would open an opportunity for Sylvanas to regret. They didn't give any such situation to Arthas

And yes. I hate Uther too. I want his soul shredded. When he tossed Arthas into the maw, he committed a horrific unforgivable sin. He doesn't deserve to become a happy angel

Fuck him too

Zikten posted...

Then kill her. I'll never forgive this story unless they somehow destroy her forever. It's the only way to have justice now

I think being sent to literal hell is more justice than just killing her.

Zikten posted...

He didn't regret because he wasn't given a chance

My brother, did you skip the part where he ripped out his own beating heart because he wanted to strip any remnant of his own humanity away? He wasn't going to regret shit without a hot vampire daddy beating the shit out of him for a few centuries.

This sounds less like a legitimate complaint with the story and more that you're overly obsessed with Arthas who is a way worse character than Garrosh "I REGRET NOTHING" Hellscream anyway.

going to Revendreth counts as a chance. But they could have done anything. The writers are gods. People always forget that. In any fictional story, there is no excuse for anything. The writer can literally make anything happen that they want. And nobody can stop them. They simply didn't want to save Arthas

Something could have been set up to make him remember his humanity. I don't care if he ripped out his heart

And Sylvanas isn't going to the Maw as a prisoner. She is down there getting people out. Its not really the same thing. Amd someday, in theory she will be done and get to come back to Azeroth and be happy

Uther throwing him straight into the Maw was the better choice for both Arthas and Uther. You really trust these writers not to ruin Arthas? I don't even know that I'd want Metzen to fuck with that. The tragedy of Arthas missing his chance at redemption, still slave to the creature that ultimately created the Lich King in the first place, is just a much more interesting ending to his story. Turning him into a flying ball of enchanting mats was the smartest thing they did that whole expansion.

There's a difference between a good story and fan service. Bringing Arthas back as some good guy would be fan service to the extreme. A story is not bad writing just because it is sad.

they could have made him that glowing ball but said he isn't fading to oblivion but is preparing to reincarnate as an innocent new person. We don't even have to do told what his new life or ever find out even. There. No fan service, and it avoids an evil unfair fate

That would be the only instance of reincarnation in the entire story and ruins the tragedy of his character. Arthas is and always has been a tragic character. Giving him a happy ending just so it's not "unfair" is dumb.

Then I still say destroy Sylvanas too, to make it equal. If she had also been destroyed, I would not be as upset

She has to live with herself and has to spent countless years recovering every soul in hell. As it stands, her fate was worse than Arthas'.

pegusus123456 posted...

She has to live with herself and has to spent countless years recovering every soul in hell. As it stands, her fate was worse than Arthas'.

How is a someday happy ending worse than being deleted from existence? She isn't being tortured. She is just in the maw digging out souls to send back to a nicer place

Having to do a job is a worse fate than being destroyed?

You just don't want to admit that Blizzard considers Sylvanas their pet

I think if the original blizzard writers were still around, Arthas would been treated better. The people who wrote Shadowlands had no attachment to him and didn't care about him

Zikten posted...

How is a someday happy ending worse than being deleted from existence? She isn't being tortured. She is just in the maw digging out souls to send back to a nicer place

As I said: "As it stands." The Maw is still full of nasty shit she has to fight and, as I said, she has to live with the terrible shit she's done. We don't know that she'll get an eventual happy ending.

Zikten posted...

You just don't want to admit that Blizzard considers Sylvanas their pet

No, they absolutely do.

Zikten posted...

I think if the original blizzard writers were still around, Arthas would been treated better

As I said:

pegusus123456 posted...

I don't even know that I'd want Metzen to fuck with that. The tragedy of Arthas missing his chance at redemption, still slave to the creature that ultimately created the Lich King in the first place, is just a much more interesting ending to his story. Turning him into a flying ball of enchanting mats was the smartest thing they did that whole expansion.

There's a difference between a good story and fan service. Bringing Arthas back as some good guy would be fan service to the extreme. A story is not bad writing just because it is sad.

Arthas did literally everything wrong, that's the whole point

Zeph posted...

Arthas did literally everything wrong, that's the whole point

So you would have left him when he purged that village? What would you have done at that village if you were in charge?