Current Events > The bigger issue with cannabis legalization, honestly, is lack of education

(+) Yeah! (+)

I, for one, think cannabis should be legal.

But there's an issue with this - the (false) belief that somehow cannabis has no major health risks.

This is simply not true. When smoked, cannabis may have a risk of lung cancer and COPD, though there simply isn't enough available studies. The truth is that any kind of charred carbon compound carries carcinogenic risk.

Smoked meats dramatically increase your risk of gastric cancer, for instance.

TLDR - It's not a reason to make it illegal, but we probably should promote some public awareness that marijuana isn't some magical risk-free natural cure-all. More studies are needed to assess its risk for lung cancer and COPD, as generally-speaking smoked plants typically increase the risk of both, regardless of the plant.
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That's what edibles are for.

I don't have an issue with legalization but I find the culture of celebrating marijuana to be weird af
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Edibles

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DuranOfForcena posted...

there's certainly no evidence whatsoever that it can contribute at all to lung cancer.

Once it gets commercial enough, it'll probably be fertilized with ground apatite just like tobacco.
That's where most of the cancer comes from.

konokonohamaru posted...

I don't have an issue with legalization but I find the culture of celebrating marijuana to be weird af

The only reason that even exists is because it was prohibited forever
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DuranOfForcena posted...

konokonohamaru posted...

I don't have an issue with legalization but I find the culture of celebrating marijuana to be weird af

no weirder than the culture of celebrating alcohol

no argument from me
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DuranOfForcena posted...

while it is true that cannabis may carry some health risks, i don't think any can be classified as major. there's certainly no evidence whatsoever that it can contribute at all to lung cancer.

https://erj.ersjournals.com/content/31/2/280

There's not a lot of studies in general but this one's conclusion:

The highest tertile of cannabis use was associated with an increased risk of lung cancer (relative risk 5.7 (95% CI 1.521.6)), after adjustment for confounding variables including cigarette smoking.

In conclusion, the results of the present study indicate that long-term cannabis use increases the risk of lung cancer in young adults.



that's a pretty wide confidence interval, but also a relatively impressive relative risk.

It's also not terribly irrational to think that there is an increased risk, considering it is widely known that burning complex carbon compounds yields carcinogenic components.
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This summer was the first time I had been back in Seattle after having been outside of America for almost seven years. Pretty much every street reeked of marijuana. Although I do feel bad for people who are thrown in jail for years just because of drugs, I personally remain against legalization.

DarkRoast posted...

It's also not terribly irrational to think that there is an increased risk, considering it is widely known that burning complex carbon compounds yields carcinogenic components.

The most obvious one I can think of is plain old benzene.

DarkRoast posted...

I, for one, think cannabis should be legal.

But there's an issue with this - the (false) belief that somehow cannabis has no major health risks.

This is simply not true. When smoked, cannabis may have a risk of lung cancer and COPD, though there simply isn't enough available studies. The truth is that any kind of charred carbon compound carries carcinogenic risk.

Smoked meats dramatically increase your risk of gastric cancer, for instance.

TLDR - It's not a reason to make it illegal, but we probably should promote some public awareness that marijuana isn't some magical risk-free natural cure-all. More studies are needed to assess its risk for lung cancer and COPD, as generally-speaking smoked plants typically increase the risk of both, regardless of the plant.

The reason there havent been more studies is because of the governments dumbass classification of cannabis.
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Questionmarktarius posted...

DarkRoast posted...

It's also not terribly irrational to think that there is an increased risk, considering it is widely known that burning complex carbon compounds yields carcinogenic components.

The most obvious one I can think of is plain old benzene.

But it's aromatic!
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DuranOfForcena posted...

while it is true that cannabis may carry some health risks, i don't think any can be classified as major. there's certainly no evidence whatsoever that it can contribute at all to lung cancer.

There's no evidence that smoke causes lung cancer?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L6GDoXCCaUc" data-time="
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So is there any info on the lung cancer risks?

I'm not down with cops so I don't care about the other one.
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DarkRoast posted...

But it's aromatic!

If you even know what benzene smells like, you're probably already fucked.

DuranOfForcena posted...

like i said, there is no evidence whatsoever that it can contribute at all to lung cancer. no hard, verified, undeniable evidence.

You are catching a carbohydrate on fire, which inevitably leads to some bizarre compounds that do weird things to DNA and metabolic processes.

Benzene, yes.
Polonium, probably not. Not yet anyway.

Questionmarktarius posted...

DarkRoast posted...

But it's aromatic!

If you even know what benzene smells like, you're probably already fucked.

Organic chemistry joke
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go ahead, try and find me a patient diagnosis that says "lung cancer. cause: cannabis smoke".

Go ahead, violate HIPAA!

.... No thanks

And, the classic phrase applies - an absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, especially when there are very few studies.
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JACKBUTTMOMMY posted...

Its smoke yall. Come on. Vape or eat it or even drink or rub it. Just know inhaling smoke isnt great for you. At the same time I have heard cannabis has anti cancer properties, so it is important to factor that in as well.

People have attributed literally any health benefit that exists to cannabis.
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DarkRoast posted...

JACKBUTTMOMMY posted...

Its smoke yall. Come on. Vape or eat it or even drink or rub it. Just know inhaling smoke isnt great for you. At the same time I have heard cannabis has anti cancer properties, so it is important to factor that in as well.

People have attributed literally any health benefit that exists to cannabis.

Immortality is even plausible.
Just go look at Willie Nelson.

https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/does-marijuana-cause-lung-cancer-doctors-call-more-research-n993941



A direct link to lung cancer has not been found, but long-term use of the drug could have consequences for lung health, doctors warn.

Early in his career operating on lung cancer patients, Dr. Raja Flores knew most were cigarette smokers. But through the years, Flores, a thoracic surgeon at Mount Sinai Medical Center in New York, noticed a startling pattern: Some of his patients had never smoked a tobacco cigarette. They smoked a different drug: marijuana. And they had developed a much more aggressive form of lung cancer.

Initially, Flores didnt consider there could be a connection between marijuana and lung cancer. The research linking pot smoking with cancer was scant and largely inconclusive. But as the numbers grew, Flores wondered if he was seeing some kind of grim new trend.

I said to myself, wait a minute, heres another person in his 40s who never touched a cigarette and the cancer is all over the place, Flores told NBC News. Its so bad I cant even operate.

Flores first raised his concerns about harms from smoking marijuana in SurvivorNet, an online community for cancer patients and experts. He acknowledges there isnt scientific proof that smoking cannabis causes lung cancer. But he worries that the combination of widespread legalization and marketing of marijuanas potential health benefits are contributing to the belief that cannabis is an entirely benign drug. In fact, a nationally representative survey of U.S. adults published last summer found that nearly a third thought that smoking or vaping weed could protect a persons health.

Many Americans held a similar view of tobacco before evidence accumulated showing that cigarette smoking could cause lung cancer


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Let it be legal.
You wanna get high and get fired? Go ahead I say.
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DuranOfForcena posted...

JACKBUTTMOMMY posted...

Its smoke yall. Come on. Vape or eat it or even drink or rub it. Just know inhaling smoke isnt great for you. At the same time I have heard cannabis has anti cancer properties, so it is important to factor that in as well.

i'm not saying that inhaling smoke is great for you, and i'm not saying that cannabis can't or doesn't have any negative effects on your health. i'm just saying that lung cancer has not been demonstrated to be one of those effects.

It has, in relatively weak studies and in case reports like I posted above. I'm saying that we need to educate people on this fact, instead of letting unverified accounts of health benefits completely control the discussion about legalization.
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DarkRoast posted...

relatively weak studies and in case reports

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DarkRoast posted...

we need to educate people on this fact

wut

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The only major medical problems I've encountered with cannabis come from people you were never told about cannabis hyperemesis syndrome. I get at least two or three patients per month with intractable nausea and vomiting because they weren't aware that a large percentage of people get cannabis hyperemesis.
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care to share exactly what you mean by "large percentage" and what verified reputable source you are getting whatever figure that is from?

I can only share from personal experience, which is to say in a small town of a population of less than 10,000 people, I get three to four CHS cases per month.

I fully acknowledge that anecdotal evidence should not be considered significant.
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I pretty much agree.

I will say though, I pretty much only do edibles. I suck at smoking things and the amount of coughing and potential lung issues didn't seem worth it.

And I don't mean to say edibles might not have their own adverse health impacts
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I'm not saying the science shouldn't be done, but considering that we know that cigarettes increase the chances of developing COPD and lung cancer, I'd say it's an easy bet to just assume that smoking dope does as well. Especially when you consider that most people hold the pot smoke in their lungs much longer than tobacco smoke.
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mustachedmystic posted...

I'm not saying the science shouldn't be done, but considering that we know that cigarettes increase the chances of developing COPD and lung cancer, I'd say it's an easy bet to just assume that smoking dope does as well. Especially when you consider that most people hold the pot smoke in their lungs much longer than tobacco smoke.

If we've learned anything from vaping, it's that under playing the lack of information and evidence about the safety or riskiness of a treatment can be detrimental.
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Most people don't know what C.O.P.D. is but I think Willie Nelson has it. Not the end of the world but your heart and lungs are connected.
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Smoking, well, anything that isn't pure water, generates inflammatory compounds in the lungs. Chronic inflammation of lungs is one of the primary mediators of COPD progression. That doesn't directly prove that marijuana itself can cause COPD, but it does indicate the need for more studies.

Honestly, I doubt marijuana significantly worsens COPD risk at normal usage levels, but I do think we definitely need more studies, especially when it comes to carcinogenic risk.
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DuranOfForcena posted...

i will eat my words.

Someone's going to have to say "You're not even good enough to be my fake" first, though.

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Sonic Adventure 2: Battle reference.

I forget that not everyone played that game.

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DrizztLink posted...

Sonic Adventure 2: Battle reference.

I forget that not everyone played that game.

I played Sonic Adventure 2 non-Battle on Dreamcast. The OG.
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DarkRoast posted...

mustachedmystic posted...

I'm not saying the science shouldn't be done, but considering that we know that cigarettes increase the chances of developing COPD and lung cancer, I'd say it's an easy bet to just assume that smoking dope does as well. Especially when you consider that most people hold the pot smoke in their lungs much longer than tobacco smoke.

If we've learned anything from vaping, it's that under playing the lack of information and evidence about the safety or riskiness of a treatment can be detrimental.

I get what you saying, but what harm can come from not smoking, under the assumption that smoking anything can cause chronic disease? I say this as someone who smoked for 25 years, and wishes that I never had.
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DuranOfForcena posted...

Gamerguymass posted...

DuranOfForcena posted...

while it is true that cannabis may carry some health risks, i don't think any can be classified as major. there's certainly no evidence whatsoever that it can contribute at all to lung cancer.

There's no evidence that smoke causes lung cancer?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L6GDoXCCaUc" data-time="

there's no evidence that cannabis smoke causes lung cancer.

go ahead, try and find me a patient diagnosis that says "lung cancer. cause: cannabis smoke".

I don't need to prove pot smoke specifically gives you lung cancer because we already know it does. It is a long proven fact that smoke in your lungs can cause lung cancer. There is no such thing as good smoke when it comes to the human lungs, regardless of source. Rolling pot up in paper and lighting it on fire causes smoke. You then inhale that smoke, thus smoke goes into your lungs, thus smoking pot can give you lung cancer.

It's really not that hard of a concept to understand. The only people that want to play bullshit semantics games are potheads that want to pretend their drug is perfectly safe.
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How about banning the smoking of weed and have edibles and other cannabis items legalized.
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