Current Events > What constitutes sexual harassment?

(+) Yeah! (+)

https://www.npr.org/2017/11/28/565743374/sexual-harassment-cases-often-rejected-by-courts

Many actors, politicians and executives, including at NPR, are now facing sexual-harassment allegations in the court of public opinion.

But in actual courts, such cases filed by workers against their employers are very often dismissed by judges. The standard for harassment under the law is high, and only an estimated 3 percent to 6 percent of the cases ever make it to trial.

"You'll see case after case where a woman was groped at work and the court will dismiss the case as a matter of law, finding that's not sexual harassment," Sperino says.

In a 1986 decision, the Supreme Court said the behavior needs to be "severe or pervasive" in order to qualify as harassment, whether it's on the basis of sex or race.


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YoshitoKikuchi posted...

"You'll see case after case where a woman was groped at work and the court will dismiss the case as a matter of law, finding that's not sexual harassment," Sperino says.

I would assume that more often than not the issue is that there's no actual evidence of wrongdoing. "He said, she said" cases in general are basically a waste of the court's time.
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-Gavirulax- posted...

Indeed, it's getting a tad insane.

I had something like it get all to real recently, almost entirely because people wanted easy money from me when my sister (not me) fired them.

Fuck being famous though, I'll keep away from that.

What happened?
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What's nuts is how judges will wiggle around what "pervasive" means so they can toss the case. I think this is the same story I heard on NPR this morning. It's kind of gross.

Lots of harassment, but it only lasted 10 days? Too brief.

"Isolated" incidents that happened for months? Too sporadic.
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Asherlee10 posted...

Side note: Fuck Angela Lansbury. I just saw in the news that she said that women are sometimes to blame for sexual harassment and assault because we dress to be attractive.

Ohh, Angela.



We were rooting for you
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Asherlee10 posted...

We must sometimes take blame, women. I really do think that, she added. Although its awful to say we cant make ourselves look as attractive as possible without being knocked down and raped.

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Asherlee10 posted...

hollow_shrine posted...

Asherlee10 posted...

Side note: Fuck Angela Lansbury. I just saw in the news that she said that women are sometimes to blame for sexual harassment and assault because we dress to be attractive.

Ohh, Angela.



We were rooting for you

Did she also say something like that?

Also for reference: http://ew.com/news/2017/11/28/angela-lansbury-sexual-harassment/

We have to own up to the fact that women, since time immemorial, have gone out of their way to make themselves attractive, the 92-year-old said (via The Telegraph). And unfortunately it has backfired on us and this is where we are today.

We must sometimes take blame, women. I really do think that, she added. Although its awful to say we cant make ourselves look as attractive as possible without being knocked down and raped.

Wow
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-Gavirulax- posted...

Indeed, it's getting a tad insane.

I had something like it get all to real recently, almost entirely because people wanted easy money from me when my sister (not me) fired them.

Fuck being famous though, I'll keep away from that.

Nothing to do this topic, but i get so mixed feelings about you. I feel like you're ok, and i even like you as a fellow CEmen, but on other hand there's like alarming amount of people here who think you're complete sociopath, and then there was that apparently fake leaked document about your court case.

I'm just throwing this out here, i have been awake like 20 hours + i have some meds that makes me even more tired, so i don't even care, lol.
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Everything
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If you want to avoid a harassment charge, follow these simple steps:

1) Don't be male
2) Be attractive
3) Don't be unattractive

If you have to ask youve probably done it
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-Gavirulax- posted...

Indeed, it's getting a tad insane.

I had something like it get all to real recently, almost entirely because people wanted easy money from me when my sister (not me) fired them.

Fuck being famous though, I'll keep away from that.

Yes i'm sure that's the reason
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LittleRoyal posted...

If you have to ask youve probably done it

What is your response to the article?
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YoshitoKikuchi posted...

LittleRoyal posted...

If you have to ask youve probably done it

What is your response to the article?

Incredibly upset.

Ive been groped before, and backed into a corner by guys who put their hands on the wall so you feel like you cant really leave.
Its reallt scary and you dont really know what to do or what will happen.

I didnt report it because Im dumb and figured
My parents would be mad
Everyone at uni would hate me
Hed get expelled but not arrested and kill me or something.

But clearly I overdranatizes it.

So when its your employer thats really scary. Theyre in control of your job/income/livelihood to an unknown extent (they cant fire you for telling or stopping them, but lets fake it-they kinda can do that or st least make you think you can)

I felt worried when my employer accidentally called me hot (Im 20, hes like 30-some) (hes not a bad guy slip of the tongue but its when I just knew him so I didnt know he was a good guy)

So yeah. Girls are going to be pretty scared when someone with power over them gropes them. And they should be listened to and they deserve justice too.
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You don't need firsthand experience to just google his cousin's criminal case lol
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Asherlee10 posted...

On top of that, I've gotten some nasty PMs from people on CE telling me I'm a shitty person because I don't automatically think you are a shitty person.

Then someone (unprovoked) PM'd me some sort of legal documents or something about you and I reported it. Then I caught shit for reporting the PM.

the people who hate on Gavi are fucking creepy, like they are completely obsessed with him

a normal person would ignore his posts and move on, but these dudes are pretty much cyber stalking him
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LittleRoyal posted...

YoshitoKikuchi posted...

LittleRoyal posted...

If you have to ask youve probably done it

What is your response to the article?

Incredibly upset.

Ive been groped before, and backed into a corner by guys who put their hands on the wall so you feel like you cant really leave.
Its reallt scary and you dont really know what to do or what will happen.

I didnt report it because Im dumb and figured
My parents would be mad
Everyone at uni would hate me
Hed get expelled but not arrested and kill me or something.

But clearly I overdranatizes it.

So when its your employer thats really scary. Theyre in control of your job/income/livelihood to an unknown extent (they cant fire you for telling or stopping them, but lets fake it-they kinda can do that or st least make you think you can)

I felt worried when my employer accidentally called me hot (Im 20, hes like 30-some) (hes not a bad guy slip of the tongue but its when I just knew him so I didnt know he was a good guy)

So yeah. Girls are going to be pretty scared when someone with power over them gropes them. And they should be listened to and they deserve justice too.

That's awful :(
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When you continue after the person has made it apparent they want nothing to do with you.

Seems to be a pretty good indication, but people still miss the mark.
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Deadpool_18 posted...

When you continue after the person has made it apparent they want nothing to do with you.

Seems to be a pretty good indication, but people still miss the mark.

How about in terms of "severity", as the article mentions?
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Asherlee10 posted...

Side note: Fuck Angela Lansbury. I just saw in the news that she said that women are sometimes to blame for sexual harassment and assault because we dress to be attractive.

she's right you know.
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Oh shoot Matt Lauer
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Reverend_Wilson posted...

Asherlee10 posted...

Side note: Fuck Angela Lansbury. I just saw in the news that she said that women are sometimes to blame for sexual harassment and assault because we dress to be attractive.

she's right you know.

Camille Paglia, a super famous second wave feminist and active civil rights advocate, also kind of agrees:
http://gos.sbc.edu/p/paglia.html

Like just this weekend--I'm getting so sick and tired, so nauseated by what's been happening--down in Philadelphia, where I work at the University of the Arts, there were two incidents at Temple University, and I think they're just a disgrace to women, these incidents--as reported--we don't know what really happened. The girl has met the guy once before, this is the second time she met him, they were at a party, she invites him back to her room, its three A.M., she falls asleep, and then suddenly something happens, and she charges him with rape. Now, pardon me, wake up to reality! This is a ridiculous situation. If a real rape occurs, I will help to lynch the guy from the nearest tree. I will be absolutely ferocious. I will get my switchblade knife--given to me by a reporter, by the way!--I will help track down the rapist and punish him. But this sort of thing is disastrous. We cannot have this, these white middle-class girls coming out of pampered homes, expecting to do whatever they want. They don't understand what's going on, that there's a sexual content to their behavior, that maybe there's a subliminal sexuality, a provocativeness in their behavior. "Don't say 'provocative'! Because then you're blaming the victim!" Well, women will never be taken seriously until they accept full responsibility for their sexuality.

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I find @-Gavirulax- 's legal issues interesting. I don't have any negative interactions with him either.

I am curious why people would PM @Asherlee10 crap though.
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Containing personal information? That sounds like a bad idea to send someone that kind of stuff. I wouldn't want anyone here having my personal information.
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On an unrelated note it amazes me how careless people are with their social media accounts. There is so much personal information that people are putting out and it probably isn't too hard to do something malicious with it. Not to mention people getting fired or arrested for shit posts tied to their real name.
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Asherlee10 posted...

YoshitoKikuchi posted...

Many actors, politicians and executives, including at NPR, are now facing sexual-harassment allegations in the court of public opinion.

But in actual courts, such cases filed by workers against their employers are very often dismissed by judges. The standard for harassment under the law is high, and only an estimated 3 percent to 6 percent of the cases ever make it to trial.

"You'll see case after case where a woman was groped at work and the court will dismiss the case as a matter of law, finding that's not sexual harassment," Sperino says.

In a 1986 decision, the Supreme Court said the behavior needs to be "severe or pervasive" in order to qualify as harassment, whether it's on the basis of sex or race.

I don't see how being groped is not "severe."

Furthermore, this looks more like an issue judicial judgment than it does with 'what constitutes sexual harassment.'

My assumption is groped is being used in a disingenuous way; similar to words are violence or male gaze is rape nonsense. Id have to see the actual specifics of the case before I fully hand wave it away, but thats my initial outlook when conclusory statements are thrown out like that.
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Yeah I think I was the one asking about your legal troubles. So they dropped the lawsuit eh. Must be a big relief.
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Oh so it is not over yet. The turd got passed to your sister. I hope she has good insurance.

I always liked hearing about legal issues at work. I don't work in legal, but some of the stuff that happens to clients gives a bit of variety and makes the day less boring.
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Obligatory:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IV-Fr3ppb3o
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Mildly uncomfortable comments made by people with money
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Sexual harassment usually is limited to words and doesn't go beyond a creepy suggestion. Unfortunately it also usually comes from people (men or women) with a lot of power in a given situation, and there's usually some incentive tied into giving in to the harassment. It's human nature to take advantage of how the best looking people are often very young adults who need a helping hand at the start of their adult lives. One thing leads to another.
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I agree that the people should be reprimanded, but should their entire careers be over and their awards revoked?
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