Current Events > In stories where someone kills God, how is that possible?

(+) Yeah! (+)

Like where the protagonist fights God (the One God from Christianity) and kills him with some special weapon or whatever.

How the hell is that even possible in these stories when God can simply just kill someone with a mere thought?

For example, in the Preacher comics and TV show, the Saint of Killers kills God with a special gun.

There's also a short story comic book called "Godzilla in Hell" where Godzilla dies, goes to hell, and wrecks havoc in hell. He then kills the devil AND he kills God too.

Inb4 "my fictional character can kill your fictional characters"

Theyre usually a god instead of a God, highly powerful but not omnipotent. In the case of your example, I think it was that God was only God on the throne or something but it has been a while since I read the comic.

If there is a mythical godlike entity, why should there be no mythical godlike weapon able to kill them?

Because God knew it was coming and already had a plan. He just pulls the omipresent card and is everywhere, and jumps to a copy elsewhere.

They just think they killed em, because he luvs u and wants to test your will and bank account.

I don't know.

Karovorak posted...

If there is a mythical godlike entity, why should there be no mythical godlike weapon able to kill them?

Cause if it's the God that is the creator of all creation and is omnipotent, wouldn't he know what everyone in the universe is doing at all times and can just kill them simply by willing it?

NhojAnec posted...

Cause if it's the God that is the creator of all creation and is omnipotent, wouldn't he know what everyone in the universe is doing at all times and can just kill them simply by willing it?

Can a mother knows her children doing at all times and kill them simply by willing it?

NhojAnec posted...

Cause if it's the God that is the creator of all creation and is omnipotent, wouldn't he know what everyone in the universe is doing at all times and can just kill them simply by willing it?

Sure. But only if you take it face value that God is, in fact, fully omnipotent and prescient and can do whatever he wants.

But even if he was those things, it could be Gods will that he be defeated. Maybe he knows how hes going to be beaten, is sick of being God, and is just waiting around for the man with the God gun to come along and pop him.

A decent writer could contrive any number of possible scenarios as to how a super being that knows everything is still beaten.

A lot of anime and video games where that happens take heavy influence from Gnosticism (where the being commonly worshiped as "God" is actually a fake and a major control freak who thinks he's the real thing, and as such isn't really all-knowing or all-powerful), rather than from the three mainstream Abrahamic religions and their various sects and schisms (where the being worshiped as "God" legitimately is God, with everything that entails).

The mainline Shin Megami Tensei series as well as spinoff Persona 5 are major examples here, with the latter's main villain even being named "Yaldabaoth", the name of the Gnostic fake-God.

In the Japanese language, they originally didn't want to translate the Christian term "God" as Kami, as they felt the terms were so different from each other, that it gave people the wrong idea.

Kami are numerous, and while they are "gods" they can, and do, die. Whereas the Abrahamic God is eternal, and deathless.

So, in Japanese media, it's literally because of a decision a translator made back in the 16th century when translating The Gospel of Matthew.

This reminds me of the Spawn comics, where God and Satan were more like petty siblings and the solution was to let them fight each other over a dying Earth while everyone else gets resurrected on a new one.

If theyre omniscient maybe theyre self aware theyre in a story told to a broader audience and that their death makes for a good story.

SpawnShadow posted...

A lot of anime and video games where that happens take heavy influence from Gnosticism (where the being commonly worshiped as "God" is actually a fake and a major control freak who thinks he's the real thing, and as such isn't really all-knowing or all-powerful), rather than from the three mainstream Abrahamic religions and their various sects and schisms (where the being worshiped as "God" legitimately is God, with everything that entails).

The mainline Shin Megami Tensei series as well as spinoff Persona 5 are major examples here, with the latter's main villain even being named "Yaldabaoth", the name of the Gnostic fake-God.

It kills me when people say most final fantasy games the villain becomes a God. I only know of a few instances. 2 in the gba remake where they added dawn of souls. I think 6 Kefka absorbs the power of some gods. 9 technically but it wasn't the main villain. 12 vayne does merge with a God so he does become one. And that's about it as far as I recall. Maybe 13 counts but it was already a God like being it didn't turn into one.

Like sephiroth didn't become a God he just became super powerful from absorbing a lot of mako from the life stream

SpawnShadow posted...

A lot of anime and video games where that happens take heavy influence from Gnosticism (where the being commonly worshiped as "God" is actually a fake and a major control freak who thinks he's the real thing, and as such isn't really all-knowing or all-powerful), rather than from the three mainstream Abrahamic religions and their various sects and schisms (where the being worshiped as "God" legitimately is God, with everything that entails).

The mainline Shin Megami Tensei series as well as spinoff Persona 5 are major examples here, with the latter's main villain even being named "Yaldabaoth", the name of the Gnostic fake-God.

Isnt the final boss of 4 Apocalypse Actual YHVH and not a Gnostic demiurge?

NhojAnec posted...

Cause if it's the God that is the creator of all creation and is omnipotent, wouldn't he know what everyone in the universe is doing at all times and can just kill them simply by willing it?

Oppenheimer created a nuclear bomb, however, if you were to make the two of them fight, I would bet money on the nuclear bomb every time.

Because it is a part of Gods plan.

I always liked the idea gods could be killed and dethroned so to speak with the killer taking the throne. I feel if there was a God that would explain why some eras of history are so much worse than others

Sufferedphoenix posted...

I always liked the idea gods could be killed and dethroned so to speak with the killer taking the throne. I feel if there was a God that would explain why some eras of history are so much worse than others

SMTV spoilers: SMTV actually does exactly this. Its an interesting concept

Evil_Nice_Guy posted...

Like where the protagonist fights God (the One God from Christianity) and kills him with some special weapon or whatever.

How the hell is that even possible in these stories when God can simply just kill someone with a mere thought?

For example, in the Preacher comics and TV show, the Saint of Killers kills God with a special gun.

There's also a short story comic book called "Godzilla in Hell" where Godzilla dies, goes to hell, and wrecks havoc in hell. He then kills the devil AND he kills God too.

We can give you the answer TC, but you aren't going to like the answer.

We are talking about sky daddy that you assume exists, and is all powerful as you think, being killed by someone who's more powerful or with a weapon capable of killing your sky daddy. In essence, you already have the answer, you just don't like there being characters more powerful than the sky daddy.

SpawnShadow posted...

The mainline Shin Megami Tensei series as well as spinoff Persona 5 are major examples here, with the latter's main villain even being named "Yaldabaoth", the name of the Gnostic fake-God.

I wouldn't say those series always play on "fake" gods.

Especially SMT and spin off Devil Survivor series which often has you dethrone the abrahamic hierarchy in a couple games with Satan, Lucifer, Metatron and the Arc Angels often being at the top. With the abrahamic God checking out for one reason or another in a couple games.

In the His Dark Materials series, God was just an angel had just grown incredibly weak with time. In the book, God had been sealed/secured and once exposed was simply blown away by a breeze. In the show, I think someone killed God.

So, you wan the story to be "there was this all powerful God and he ruled forever."
Pretty boring.

ssb_yunglink2 posted...

Isnt the final boss of 4 Apocalypse Actual YHVH and not a Gnostic demiurge?

Yes. If it was the Demiurge, they would have said so, since the Demiurge or Yaldabaoth is also a recurring demon in the series.

In both SMT2 and SMT4A, they outright say that it's God, or YHVH, and treat him as such.

Solar_Crimson posted...

Yes. If it was the Demiurge, they would have said so, since the Demiurge or Yaldabaoth is also a recurring demon in the series.

In both SMT2 and SMT4A, they outright say that it's God, or YHVH, and treat him as such.

Yeah SMTV also directly deals with God and his absence. So yeah i wouldnt say that SMT always focuses on the demiurge, or even usually does.

In most works of fiction God isn't as powerful as the Abrahamic version.

Irony posted...

In most works of fiction God isn't as powerful as the Abrahamic version.

Its also important to note, all religions andor those who believe in Gods..... don't even all agree the Abrahamic version of God is as powerful as Abrahamic followers believe.

I think that's where much of the disconnect comes from of those who closely believe in their Abrahamic God not understanding how their God can be weak erto other people and their God. Especially fiction.

Evil_Nice_Guy posted...

Like where the protagonist fights God (the One God from Christianity)

Simple, it is not the God from Christianity but a pale replica.

it's a little more involved than that in Preacher (comic in OP)

the saint of killer's six shooters are made from the melted down grim reaper's scythe iirc. and god is explicitly not all powerful unless he is on his heavenly throne

buddhamonster posted...

But even if he was those things, it could be Gods will that he be defeated.

Then he killed himself and they didn't kill him, that is suicide.

RchHomieQuanChi posted...

This reminds me of the Spawn comics, where God and Satan were more like petty siblings and the solution was to let them fight each other over a dying Earth while everyone else gets resurrected on a new one.

I read that comic and it is just throwing the term God to another being. As in they were lesser entities and had a more powerful mother. Could she be killed? Probably not.

https://spawn.fandom.com/wiki/Mother_of_Existence

The Mother of Existence (also known as the Creator and Man of Miracles) is the enigmatic and nameless super-being that created the universe. This ageless, omnipotent being is featured in the Spawn comic book series.

So God as it were was actually her but they labeled another being God for the shock value of Spawn fighting him lol.

The being known as the Mother is the creator of the universe. They are an ageless being of practically inconceivable and limitless power who has been the architect behind most of the events in the Spawn universe. Their true form is as the Mother of Existence, though they are neither female nor male, they are able to cast an illusion to make themselves look male if the situation requires.

Omnipotence
Omniscience
Omnipresence
Absolute Immortality

They let their god down.

In Star Trek, it was because it was an alien cosplaying as God.

mercurydude posted...

In Star Trek, it was because it was an alien cosplaying as God.

Isn't Q basically gods with a halfway capital G? (like they can die but they can also rewrite reality and basically only be killed by another Q)

WingsOfGood posted...

Isn't Q basically gods with a halfway capital G? (like they can die but they can also rewrite reality and basically only be killed by another Q)

In one of the episodes it's insinuated that Q (or someone else from the Continuum) was behind all the various God myths on Earth because they were trying to amuse themselves.