Current Events > Woman with chronic fatigue has herself Euthanized is going viral

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Atralis posted...

One worry I have with this sort of thing is that doctors will happily sign off on it for things like chronic diseases that don't have an effective medical treatment, even diseases that have a psychological component.

Many doctors see these people as a problem they can't fix and some doctors think that medically assisted suicide is a solution to the problem. Its a mistake to think that the profession itself confers people with some special sense of ethics.

Do you think the doctor makes the first decision about if someone wants to go through assisted suicide?

Tough topic. If people are just going to commit suicide anyway then I guess it's best for it to be in the most peaceful and least painful way possible.

DrizztLink posted...

Do you think the doctor makes the first decision about if someone wants to go through assisted suicide?

I think they play a part as does the rest of the society a person lives in and cultural expectations. There are massive cultural differences in suicide rates and I'd expect there to be massive cultural differences in euthanasia rates between cultures.

I don't want to live in a culture where there is an expectation that people who are depressed should just go to a doctor to sign off on getting euthanized.

https://apnews.com/article/covid-science-health-toronto-7c631558a457188d2bd2b5cfd360a867
Disturbing': Experts troubled by Canadas euthanasia laws

Alan Nichols had a history of depression and other medical issues, but none were life-threatening. When the 61-year-old Canadian was hospitalized in June 2019 over fears he might be suicidal, he asked his brother to bust him out as soon as possible.
Within a month, Nichols submitted a request to be euthanized and he was killed, despite concerns raised by his family and a nurse practitioner.
His application for euthanasia listed only one health condition as the reason for his request to die: hearing loss.

Here is another disturbing incident-

In one recording obtained by the AP, the hospitals director of ethics told Foley that for him to remain in the hospital, it would cost north of $1,500 a day. Foley replied that mentioning fees felt like coercion and asked what plan there was for his long-term care.
Roger, this is not my show, the ethicist responded. My piece of this was to talk to you, (to see) if you had an interest in assisted dying.
Foley said he had never previously mentioned euthanasia. The hospital says there is no prohibition on staff raising the issue.

So they basically brought up euthanasia for someone as a way to avoid the expense of a long hospital stay. The hospital isn't even denying that is what they did they are saying it was perfectly legal.

Atralis posted...

One worry I have with this sort of thing is that doctors will happily sign off on it for things like chronic diseases that don't have an effective medical treatment, even diseases that have a psychological component.

Many doctors see these people as a problem they can't fix and some doctors think that medically assisted suicide is a solution to the problem. Its a mistake to think that the profession itself confers people with some special sense of ethics.

Uh this is exactly when assisted suicide should be available. If your problem can't be fixed and will only get worse, then why shouldn't you be allowed to die? It's cruel and unethical to not allow someone that option.

If you can't be saved, why should you be be forced to live?

Deutschenlied posted...

Uh this is exactly when assisted suicide should be available. If your problem can't be fixed and will only get worse, then why shouldn't you be allowed to die? It's cruel and unethical to not allow someone that option.

Your name is really "Deutschenlied" and you need someone to explain to the potential dangers of euthanasia going too far?

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/newfoundland-labrador/doctor-suggested-assisted-suicide-daughter-mother-elson-1.4218669

Sheila Elson's 25-year-old daughter, Candice Lewis, has several medical conditions, including spina bifida, cerebral palsy and chronic seizure disorder.
During a hospital stay in St. Anthony last November, when Lewis was very sick, Elson said a doctor told her that her daughter was dying and that she had the option to end her life.

"His words were 'assisted suicide death was legal in Canada,'" she told CBC. "I was shocked, and said, 'Well, I'm not really interested,' and he told me I was being selfish."
According to Elson, Lewis was within earshot when the doctor made the comment which she said was quite traumatic for her daughter to hear.

Canada went from not allowing the practice at all to having doctors recommending it for people that are a "burden of the state" as soon as the practice was made legal.

That is not a regular occurrence and is actually against the law. Doctors are not allowed to mention MAID to patients at all, only to respond should a patient bring it up to them.

You can't stop all bad actors nor can you say a law is bad because bad actors will take advantage of it.

Jeff_AKA_Snoopy posted...

That is not a regular occurrence and is actually against the law. Doctors are not allowed to mention MAID to patients at all, only to respond should a patient bring it up to them.

You can't stop all bad actors nor can you say a law is bad because bad actors will take advantage of it.

https://apnews.com/article/covid-science-health-toronto-7c631558a457188d2bd2b5cfd360a867

The countries that allow euthanasia and assisted suicide vary in how they administer and regulate the practices, but Canada has several policies that set it apart from others. For example:
Belgian doctors are advised to avoid mentioning euthanasia to patients since it could be misinterpreted as medical advice. The Australian state of Victoria forbids doctors from raising euthanasia with patients. There are no such restrictions in Canada. The association of Canadian health professionals who provide euthanasia tells physicians and nurses to inform patients if they might qualify to be killed, as one of their possible clinical care options.

Atralis posted...

https://apnews.com/article/covid-science-health-toronto-7c631558a457188d2bd2b5cfd360a867

The countries that allow euthanasia and assisted suicide vary in how they administer and regulate the practices, but Canada has several policies that set it apart from others. For example:
Belgian doctors are advised to avoid mentioning euthanasia to patients since it could be misinterpreted as medical advice. The Australian state of Victoria forbids doctors from raising euthanasia with patients. There are no such restrictions in Canada. The association of Canadian health professionals who provide euthanasia tells physicians and nurses to inform patients if they might qualify to be killed, as one of their possible clinical care options.

But each province has their own rules about MAID, as health care is a provincial matter. What the Canadian association says has no bearing on the legality per province.

So I suppose it is possible that it was legal for the Newfoundland doctor to mention MAID, I can't speak to the legality of THAT province, but I know here in Saskatchewan doctors are told not to discuss the issue unless it is brought up by their patients.

I do think someone should be able to choose to end their life for any reason. On the other hand, there are people who used to be suicidal and were glad they didnt go through with it, and it would be terrible to ease the process of dying for people who might later have enjoyed life if they persevered. I dont have a good answer for this problem

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]


This. Unless death is imminent (such as cancer patient who is choosing not to continue treatment) MAID takes 90 days from starting the process to being allowed to end your life.

Dark_Arbron posted...

There are very legitimate reasons for a person to end their life that don't involve mental or terminal illness.

What would those be, IYO?

Kradek posted...

I suppose it would be on a case-by-case basis as evaluated from a mental health professional.

I agree. I just worry about people in not sound mind being given euthanasia at their request is, like you say, a very grey area. But that's where the case-by-case evaluations come in.

What does the board think about people who have attorney of people over someone who is ill having the right to ask for them to be euthanized?