Current Events > NBA is unwatchable

(+) Yeah! (+)

Fuck outta here with these all-star game scores of 130-125 on a nightly basis. Defense is dead.

Haven't really watched much in like 20 years but the fuck? I remember when 100 points was considered a strong offensive performance. What happened?

The core problem is that its a boring sport.

But Ill concede as an Australian that its still not as boring as cricket.

Edit: Feck me, I just confused basketball with baseball? Nah, basketball is alright. Not deleting this post because I shouldnt be able to hide the fact I mixed up my sports acronyms. NBA != NBL.

chaos_knight posted...

Haven't really watched much in like 20 years but the fuck? I remember when 100 points was considered a strong offensive performance. What happened?

There's just a lot more perimeter shooting, and more players have the ability to make those more frequently than ever before.

chaos_knight posted...

What happened?

Impossible to guard three point shots due to the flopping of the shooter on nearly every shot.

Is "defense dead" or have teams realized which shots are most efficient? It's easy to keep the score down against a team playing iso-ball to get midrange jumpers.

Intro2Logic posted...

Is "defense dead" or have teams realized which shots are most efficient? It's easy to keep the score down against a team playing iso-ball to get midrange jumpers.

This is it. Defense still exists; teams just shoot a lot more threes.

Also the shot clock has been shortened when you get an offensive rebound, so that also speeds the game up.

NBA is better than ever. some users have trouble hiding their biases.

chaos_knight posted...

Haven't really watched much in like 20 years but the fuck? I remember when 100 points was considered a strong offensive performance. What happened?

Unlimited chucking

No, really. Around 15 years ago, Stephen Curry entered the league and basically changed how the 3pt shot was viewed. Instead of a situational tool that wasn't the priority, his Warriors teams were defined by their 3pt shooting, specifically because he hit such an extraordinarily high percentage of them. Other teams followed suit and despite very few players making shots at a rate comparable to Curry's, teams figure that if they keep chucking them up, enough will fall that it justifies the other misses.

Flash forward to today and now you have guys who "really" shouldn't be shooting high volumes of threes doing so because it's the expectation of the modern game.

The inability to do just about anything defensively without getting whistled for a foul has also significantly changed the game.

El_Marsh posted...

Unlimited chucking

No, really. Around 15 years ago, Stephen Curry entered the league and basically changed how the 3pt shot was viewed. Instead of a situational tool that wasn't the priority, his Warriors teams were defined by their 3pt shooting, specifically because he hit such an extraordinarily high percentage of them. Other teams followed suit and despite very few players making shots at a rate comparable to Curry's, teams figure that if they keep chucking them up, enough will fall that it justifies the other misses.

Flash forward to today and now you have guys who "really" shouldn't be shooting high volumes of threes doing so because it's the expectation of the modern game.

The inability to do just about anything defensively without getting whistled for a foul has also significantly changed the game.

Wow, that sounds unwatchable. But Steph Curry entered the league around the time my franchise left so...yeah, stopped following really. But thanks for that explanation.

I dunno if TC watched any games last night but I watched the Cavs vs GSW game and defense was definitely there.

rynobot posted...

NBA is better than ever. some users have trouble hiding their biases.

So they've finally eliminated flopping and "superstar treatment"? Cool, I might give it a watch for the first time in decades.

I watched classic games and all they did was post ups all day. How people found that to be entertaining and yet shit bricks about too many 3 point attempts baffles me.

darkace77450 posted...

So they've finally eliminated flopping and "superstar treatment"? Cool, I might give it a watch for the first time in decades.

You're implying this kinda shit started recently which is not true. MJ got the line whenever he wanted.

chaos_knight posted...

Wow, that sounds unwatchable. But Steph Curry entered the league around the time my franchise left so...yeah, stopped following really. But thanks for that explanation.

Don't worry, Seattle will get the Supersonics back soon via expansion and you'll be reeled back in to this shitty chuck fest league.

VeggetaX posted...

You're implying this kinda shit started recently which is not true. MJ got the line whenever he wanted.

MJ is the exact person I have in mind whenever I refer to the "superstar treatment".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vyUTYY2SNLU

darkace77450 posted...

So they've finally eliminated flopping and "superstar treatment"? Cool, I might give it a watch for the first time in decades.

If you think these are problems or even exist?

DoctorPiranha3 posted...

Don't worry, Seattle will get the Supersonics back soon via expansion and you'll be reeled back in to this shitty chuck fest league.

Yeah. -_-

At least your team won the World Series recently. Congrats on that. Texas rebuilt the real way, unlike my shitty team. *grumbles*

So the stats on this are interesting to look at, imo:

https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_stats_per_game.html

Scoring hit rock bottom in 98-99 (coincidentally? a season shorted by lockout) and shooting percentage was down across the board from even other years in this era. But points per game lingered in the mid 90s from 96-97 through 05-06. And there are years in that stretch where the percentage of 3-pointers made is pretty similar to what you're seeing nowadays:
2001-02: .354 (95.5 points per game)
2021-22: .354 (110.2 points per game)

What changes isn't so much that players have become better three point shooters (though they certainly have). Instead these are the big differences between those two seasons:
3-pointers attempted per game:
01-02: 5.2
21-22: 12.4

So we've more than doubled the volume of 3-pointers being attempted. Given this, and the fact that 3-pointers are the least likely shots to be made, you'd expect overall field goal percentage to go down. And we see the exact opposite:
01-02: .443
21-22: .461

What this suggests is that, either because the rise in threes has opened the floor, or because teams are prioritizing more efficient shots, the league has gotten better at shooting 2-pointers.

Lastly (and maybe most importantly) there's a big difference in the pace of play:
01-02: 91.3 possessions per game
21-22: 98.2 possessions per game

Offenses are going to work quicker, and as a result there are more opportunities within each game to score. The change to the shot clock after offensive rebounds contributes to this, but offensive rebounds are at all-time lows.

A side-note here: the highest scoring years in league history are all in the 1960s, before the three pointer. Shooting percentage was lower than it is now, but there were significantly more free throws in each game.

chaos_knight posted...

Yeah. -_-

At least your team won the World Series recently. Congrats on that. Texas rebuilt the real way, unlike my shitty team. *grumbles*

Thanks, it was much needed after being cursed for so long and being really close before. If my team's not in it and the Mariners are, I'll definitely be rooting for them to end their curse now.

chaos_knight posted...

Haven't really watched much in like 20 years but the fuck? I remember when 100 points was considered a strong offensive performance. What happened?

Emphasis on 3pt shooting combined with refs calling fouls for basically everything so you can't really play tough defense

DoctorPiranha3 posted...

Thanks, it was much needed after being cursed for so long and being really close before. If my team's not in it and the Mariners are, I'll definitely be rooting for them to end their curse now.

I was rooting for your team as well. Partially because I never hated the Rangers, but also to send a message to ownership that spending money is the part they refuse to do as part of the rebuild. So like twisting a knife in Dipoto so he can't make excuses, haha.

chaos_knight posted...

I was rooting for your team as well. Partially because I never hated the Rangers, but also to send a message to ownership that spending money is the part they refuse to do as part of the rebuild. So like twisting a knife in Dipoto so he can't make excuses, haha.

It's sad to feel like last year should have been the Mariners' year, until Alvarez happened. They get through Houston and I think they had a real chance. Penny pinching owners really annoy me, they could have built on that foundation.

1980s-1990s was my NBA. Started watching it in 1980, following the Lakers and Celtics. Then followed the Bulls too some time after Jordan debuted. Stopped watching after Jordan's second retirement.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/9/96135604.jpg

DoctorPiranha3 posted...

It's sad to feel like last year should have been the Mariners' year, until Alvarez happened. They get through Houston and I think they had a real chance. Penny pinching owners really annoy me, they could have built on that foundation.

Yeah. You guys are where Mariner fans wanted their team to be in, but ownership did penny pinch. Counting this season, they'll have made at least a quarter of a billion in just profit in the past 3 years. Won't know exact numbers until March, but they are the most profitable team in baseball most recently. Just won't use it.

Scoring was averaging in the 100's back in the 1980s, dipped down in the 1990s, and has slowly rebounded (ha!) since.

chaos_knight posted...

Yeah. You guys are where Mariner fans wanted their team to be in, but ownership did penny pinch. Counting this season, they'll have made at least a quarter of a billion in just profit in the past 3 years. Won't know exact numbers until March, but they are the most profitable team in baseball most recently. Just won't use it.

Winning yields more profit, so I never understand these cheap owners. Gotta spend money to make money. Golden State Warriors became one of the most valuable sports franchises in the world after winning those championships.

The over-emphasis on 3 point shooting just kills it. They need to do what baseball did and implement rules to de-emphasize analytic strategies.

Sure, they "add up"/make mathematical sense, but they're boring as hell to watch.

steph is my favorite player ever but i hate the effect the warriors and d'antoni/rockets with analytics had on the nba.

i like stephs 3 pt shooting obviously, but i think i like his handles and finishing at the rim even more. making circus layups on the regular. it's more fun to see over 3 pt contests.

Get rid of Corner 3's.
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/d/dfa72dc7.jpg
Fix the freaking 3-Point line on both sides and turn those Corner 3's into Corner 2's as they should be based on distance.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/b/b3a59be4.jpg
Fix that corner!
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/6/662da077.jpg
Allow 4 Point line to finally exist.
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/8/83fba964.jpg
30 ft radius for 4-point line.
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/0/0d547904.jpg
Also, allow Offensive Goal Tending to counter the long-range game.

Wembanyama is must watch tv every night.

Kamen_Rider_Blade posted...

Get rid of Corner 3's.
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/d/dfa72dc7.jpg
Fix the freaking 3-Point line on both sides and turn those Corner 3's into Corner 2's as they should be based on distance.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/b/b3a59be4.jpg
Fix that corner!
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/6/662da077.jpg
Allow 4 Point line to finally exist.
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/8/83fba964.jpg
30 ft radius for 4-point line.
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/0/0d547904.jpg
Also, allow Offensive Goal Tending to counter the long-range game.

Fuck all of this

Some of the rules have changed for faster play like reducing the shot clock reset on an offensive rebound from 24 to 14.

Also players are more efficient at shooting threes compared to 20-30 years ago.

i do think they need to reduce the number of fouls each game.

pauIie posted...

steph is my favorite player ever but i hate the effect the warriors and d'antoni/rockets with analytics had on the nba.

Those teams had scrotum-level thinking. Lots of "balls", but no brains. "Shoot, shoot shoot", no matter what the situation. I'd have hated being a fan of that team.

brestugo posted...

Those teams had scrotum-level thinking. Lots of "balls", but no brains. "Shoot, shoot shoot", no matter what the situation. I'd have hated being a fan of that team.

27 missed 3s in a row. they should have lost all their fans after that.

You look up highest scoring games in the NBA and it's all over the place from the 1960s to that 2023 Kings and Clippers game. I think people only watch Steph and the Warriors and think every game is a three-point chuck-fest now. If you actually watch games, there's still plenty of drives into the paint and posting-up and mid-range shots. And defense is still valuable. Minnesota is the best defensive team right now and gave the Nuggets their first and only loss so far, and held them to 89 points.

pauIie posted...

27 missed 3s in a row. they should have lost all their fans after that.

Yeah, I remember that. You'd think a dribble drive or two would have occurred to someone. I'm not even a Rockets fan, but it was still painful to watch.

MICHALECOLE posted...

Fuck all of this

=(

TripleDouble posted...

Impossible to guard three point shots due to the flopping of the shooter on nearly every shot.

lmao

There's like 1 perimeter shooting foul a game most nights, and that's usually because defender steps underneath the shooter when they're landing (Which is very dangerous).

Beyond that, FTAs have been at one of the lowest points they've ever been in league's history over the last 8 years or so. In fact, these last three seasons have basically had the highest FGA to FTA ratio in history. Shooting fouls are abnormally low right now but casuals who only watch flop compilations instead of actual games don't even recognize that shit.

alwayshasbeen.jpg

Then why is there a crowd of people watching? Checkmate atheists.

brestugo posted...

I'd have hated being a fan of that team.

I doubt it. If your teams was making all them 3s I bet people wouldn't be complaining nearly as much.

Pogo_Marimo posted...

lmao

There's like 1 perimeter shooting foul a game most nights, and that's usually because defender steps underneath the shooter when they're landing (Which is very dangerous).

Beyond that, FTAs have been at one of the lowest points they've ever been in league's history over the last 8 years or so. In fact, these last three seasons have basically had the highest FGA to FTA ratio in history. Shooting fouls are abnormally low right now but casuals who only watch flop compilations instead of actual games don't even recognize that shit.

my only problem with fouls is the players who act flabbergasted over committing one, or super whiney or not getting one called on them.

VeggetaX posted...

I doubt it. If your teams was making all them 3s I bet people wouldn't be complaining nearly as much.

I would. Prefer fast breaks, pick and rolls and the post up game. Only an inside out three is watchable, IMO.

I would like traveling and carrying to be called. That's a bigger problem than fouls.

Casuals are hilarious. They don't want calls on fouls but they want calls on traveling.

Three point shots basically just replaced long twos. That part of the game isn't terribly different from a viewing standpoint. What's changed is that offenses used to primarily run through post ups, now everyone just spams pick and roll actions all game.

Post ups are boring. Casuals today wants 80s/90s basketball where it's fucking violent. They watching the wrong sport.