Current Events > Bill banning trans athletes from school, college sports passes Florida House

(+) Yeah! (+)

https://www.clickorlando.com/news/local/2021/04/14/legislation-banning-transgender-athletes-from-school-college-sports-passes-florida-house-vote/
---

Hmm
---

Physically they have more testosterone. Don't deny that. And they can win against their female counterparts

---

LastTomorrow posted...

Physically they have more testosterone. Don't deny that. And they can win against their female counterparts

Who gives a shit

---

pretty much the only time people seem to care about female sports
---

Uh oh. Guess it's time to pretend to care about women's sports again.

---

philsov posted...

pretty much the only time people seem to care about female sports

Bigots start out with stuff like this then as it gets approved, they move on to banning our medical care entirely. It's all part of their plan to make it so we can't be trans and if we do, that we'll suffer for it.

---

Sports shouldn't be divided by gender, everyone should get lumped into the same group.

Let the cream rise up to the top and losers get case to the wayside.

---

Sports are meant to be competitive. We have weight classes and leagues. If X-Men were real, there would be a human league and a superhero league.

Trans women have the strength of men. No amount of estrogen is going to take that away from them. It's unfair to cis women that they be placed in competition with women of greater strength.

If trans athletes are allowed to compete against cis athletes, we're going to reach a point at which every champion is one who was born with a penis.

I'm all in favor of trans rights, but there's a limit to how progressive I'm willing to be. You can't cater to a small minority at the expense of everyone else. That's not how it works.

MaxEffingBemis posted...

Who gives a shit

I would think the people losing to them would give a shit.

You either have womens sports separate from mens because you recognize the difference that biology has in sports or you dont and you have everything opened to who ever wants to compete. If you separate them then you have to define what allows someone to compete in womens sports in a way that makes sense for fair competition. If you dont separate the sports then women dont have a place in sport in any similar way as they currently do.

Its a bad situation that no matter what you do, you are going to be making someone unhappy.

---

pogo_rabid posted...

Sports shouldn't be divided by gender, everyone should get lumped into the same group.

Let the cream rise up to the top and losers get case to the wayside.

In that case there would be zero women in professional sports. Daily reminder that women aren't barred from pro leages, they simply can't compete with men thus have their own women leagues.
---

FortuneCookie posted...

Sports are meant to be competitive. We have weight classes. If X-Men were real, there would be a human league and a superhero league.

Trans women have the strength of men. No amount of estrogen is going to take that away from them. It's unfair to cis women that they be placed in competition with women of greater strength.

If trans athletes are allowed to compete against cis athletes, we're going to reach a point at which every champion is one who was born with a penis.

I'm all in favor of trans rights, but there's a limit to how progressive I'm willing to be. You can't cater to a small minority at the expense of everyone else. That's not how it works.

@FortuneCookie
What are your thoughts on how the fastest sprinters in the world are predominantly black, and how the best basketball players in the world are black?

---

gunplagirl posted...

@FortuneCookie
What are your thoughts on how the fastest sprinters in the world are predominantly black, and how the best basketball players in the world are black?

Coincidence. You might as well be asking, "Why are most (insert field here) white people?" One race is not inherently more gifted than another.

voldothegr8 posted...

In that case there would be zero women in professional sports. Daily reminder that women aren't barred from pro leages, they simply can't compete with men thus have their own women leagues.

If they're not competitive, then that's on them.

---

This is screwed up.

And as others have pointed out, this is the start of anti-trans legislation. It won't stop here.

---

i thought republicans didn't want to turn sports political?

---

Musourenka posted...

This is screwed up.

And as others have pointed out, this is the start of anti-trans legislation. It won't stop here.

It is not anti trans legislation, it's pro female athlete legislation
---

Francis Ngannou vs Amanda Nunes, NAO.

---

gunplagirl posted...

Bigots start out with stuff like this then as it gets approved, they move on to banning our medical care entirely. It's all part of their plan to make it so we can't be trans and if we do, that we'll suffer for it.

No we don't want to cut your medical care we just don't think it's fair if cisgendered women lose to trans females and thus lose out on scholarships and grants.


---

Perascamin posted...

we just don't think it's fair if cisgendered women lose to trans females and thus lose out on scholarships and grants.

so the trans female gets the scholarship money and grants instead. It's net zero.
---

Perascamin posted...

No we don't want to cut your medical care we just don't think it's fair if cisgendered women lose to trans females and thus lose out on scholarships and grants.

Okay, how many transfemale athletes have won over cisfemale athletes, percentage wise, and how much of that is due to them being trans?

Sure you can point to a few, but is it a trend? The data is inconclusive.

Also, other states ARE cutting transgender access to medical care. See Arkansas.

---

Its not a fair playing field for cisgender women to compete against trans women no matter how you ever try to cut it. Pretending otherwise is living in fairytale land.

---

FortuneCookie posted...

Sports are meant to be competitive. We have weight classes and leagues. If X-Men were real, there would be a human league and a superhero league.

Trans women have the strength of men. No amount of estrogen is going to take that away from them. It's unfair to cis women that they be placed in competition with women of greater strength.

If trans athletes are allowed to compete against cis athletes, we're going to reach a point at which every champion is one who was born with a penis.

I'm all in favor of trans rights, but there's a limit to how progressive I'm willing to be. You can't cater to a small minority at the expense of everyone else. That's not how it works.

As much as i am an advocate for Trans rights, this is elegantly put and true. Whether people like it or not Men and Women are biologically different which means different strength and weaknesses in physical activities.

---

why don't we just like... make trans sport teams? >_> That way cisgender women won't feel they're being cheated by competing with people with physiological advantages.

It really is a tricky situation. Since I know trans people don't want to be treated separately. But there has to be a line somewhere for the sake of fairness. There are differences between XX and XY that hormones will never bridge the gap for.

---

FortuneCookie posted...

Coincidence. You might as well be asking, "Why are most (insert field here) white people?" One race is not inherently more gifted than another.

Ah, so the oversaturation of races is fine but if it's transgender people, well fuck them, I read you loud and clear.

Perascamin posted...

No we don't want to cut your medical care we just don't think it's fair if cisgendered women lose to trans females and thus lose out on scholarships and grants.

Name one example of this happening. And for that matter, what you're quite explicitly saying is that trans girls don't deserve scholarships or grants.

Also, Arkansas banned any trans related care for anyone under 18. So yeah, this is just the beginning. Fuck off with this "that's not happening" bullshit when it is, while you're making up scenarios that haven't happened to justify discrimination.

---

Teneritas posted...

why don't we just like... make trans sport teams? >_> That way cisgender women won't feel they're being cheated by competing with people with physiological advantages.

It really is a tricky situation. Since I know trans people don't want to be treated separately. But there has to be a line somewhere for the sake of fairness. There are differences between XX and XY that hormones will never bridge the gap for.

"Why don't we just have the black people play in their own league if they aren't allowed in the MLB?"
Great going, that's still segregation and you're not even using real science to justify your bullshit.

---

This is a mere fig leaf for anti-trans legislation. They found a little soft spot where it's safe to voice anti-trans views and they're exploiting it for all its worth. This is not all these people want to do though.

---

ITT people want to end women's sports which frankly im okay with

---

gunplagirl posted...

"Why don't we just have the black people play in their own league if they aren't allowed in the MLB?"
Great going, that's still segregation and you're not even using real science to justify your bullshit.

Yea, I know it sounds awful. I just don't know what the answer is. Either way someone isn't going to be happy.

I'd be for banning competitive sports entirely. :v We can just go back to playing for funsies.

---

legendary_zell posted...

This is a mere fig leaf for anti-trans legislation. They found a little soft spot where it's safe to voice anti-trans views and they're exploiting it for all its worth. This is not all these people want to do though.

No but see it's about the women. And banning trans care for anyone under 18 is about the children. And rounding up and indefinitely hailing all transgender people, that's about protecting some other group, I'm sure they'll say.

---

Teneritas posted...

Yea, I know it sounds awful. I just don't know what the answer is. Either way someone isn't going to be happy.

I'd be for banning competitive sports entirely. :v We can just go back to playing for funsies.

Here's an idea: tell the bigots to fuck off. Bam, now everyone whose opinions matter can resume living their lives instead of getting more and more people to agree to subjugate an entire minority.

---

Teneritas posted...

why don't we just like... make trans sport teams? >_>

You'd need enough trans people who are around the same age, physical location, and into getting together for sports practice on the regular. Absolutely will not happen at the high school or even college level, but might happen in like, the top 5 US cities period. This affects mtf's more than ftm's, so just also finding mtf's into sports in the first place is so many levels of barrel scraping that it's just not feasible.
---

Gunpla I understand your passion for this topic and I wish nothing but the best for transpeople, but my specific belief is that people like yourself should be able to get the medial care you deserve...unfortunately, that is not the case for pretty much all of US citizens (that is, getting deserved medical care) we can't change the system drastically overnight. We're all frustrated.

That being said, its still not even remotely fair for transwomen to compete against cisgender women in athletic events. Is that saying that transwomen don't deserve scholarships or grants meant for cisgendered women? Yes. You don't deserve nor are you entitled to something like that.

---

gunplagirl posted...

Ah, so the oversaturation of races is fine but if it's transgender people, well fuck them, I read you loud and clear.

Do not play Oppression Olympics.

If transpeople are barred from competing with others of their gender, then who do they compete with?


---

Yea, the right has realized that this is the soft spot that is a lot easier to argue for than anything else involving the trans community. The bathroom stuff is just too openly dehumanizing to stick, but the sports angle with the female athletes getting robbed of scholarships is an easier sell.

And I mean, there are cases where you see women competing against someone that is clearly out of their league. You show someone those cases and it's easy to think something is wrong there. :v

---

Perascamin posted...

Is that saying that transwomen don't deserve scholarships or grants meant for cisgendered women? Yes. You don't deserve nor are you entitled to something like that.

Thanks for your support. Youre doing great at this whole ally thing.

---

Seems weird to outright ban them. I'd understand if you were just concerned about competition but to say "trans people cant play competitive sports" is strange.

I'm no expert and I don't know how much testosterone is lost and how much muscle mass is lost during transition. At worst I would say just have them play in whatever league they'd play in before transitioning and give them protections.

Sports during school are supposed to be fun and give you a sense of teamwork etc. Telling a kid they cant play is awful. Especially if you just want to be who you are.

---

Perascamin posted...

Is that saying that transwomen don't deserve scholarships or grants meant for cisgendered women? Yes.

Are there school or federally sponsored scholarships or grants specifically for trans athletes in the first place? Otherwise this is a pretty classic NIMBY; transmen have little to no chance against cismen in sports, and transwomen are then going to lack access to sports for ciswomen.

What's your solution?
---

Perascamin posted...

"I support you but not really, I don't think trans women should get scholarships"

Holy fuck. And this won't get modded either.

FortuneCookie posted...

Do not play Oppression Olympics.

So you admit you're oppressing transgender people?

Musourenka posted...

If transpeople are barred from competing with others of their gender, then who do they compete with?

The idea is that we will be so miserable we either detransition or kill ourselves. If we do both, they'll be even happier because then we'll be a statistic to misuse and twist to show anyone who thinks they're trans is at risk.

---

CalosiaTana posted...

Uh oh. Guess it's time to pretend to care about women's sports again.

---

FlameTurtle posted...

Thanks for your support. Youre doing great at this whole ally thing.

Right? Nowhere in any woman's scholarship I've seen has it said it's only for cisgender women. Just women, period.

---

Why would it get modded? Its not hateful.

You have to think about this without your feelings. Transpeople are built differently. Transmen wouldn't be able to compete with cisgender men, and transwomen demolish cisgender women. There's not a soft spot that's fair for everyone. That's life.

---

https://youtu.be/wxDaiyREBPw

---

Oh thank God someone posted South Park as their opinion.

This topic certainly had too much class already.

---

Perascamin posted...

transwomen demolish cisgender women

Explain the trans women who lose.

---

Tall people will almost always have the advantage over short people in most sports, natural disadvantage is built into physical competition. <_<;

The obvious solution (to me) to this is to make winning nigh irrelevant and personal improvement a better metric for success.

---

When you first start replacing hormones you're going to have a drop in overall strength and then once the body adjusts you will likely gain in strength.

There are a lot of variables in this kind of subject and it's hard to verify anything because people aren't hooked up to a machine 24/7 tracking their hormone levels.

But just look at Mary Gregory. She destroyed every women's weightlifting record in a day.

---

Perascamin posted...

Why would it get modded? Its not hateful.

You have to think about this without your feelings. Transpeople are built differently. Transmen wouldn't be able to compete with cisgender men, and transwomen demolish cisgender women. There's not a soft spot that's fair for everyone. That's life.

Its not like the NCAA has had regulations for Trans athletes for a decade, or The Olympics have had them for 2, no we need reactionary idiots who haven't done any research to do the real work because think of the children.

We're like 20 years farther along this conversation than people act like we are, I hate that every "controversial" conversation can't be moved forward because nobody is willing to meet where the actual science is.