Current Events > Why do progressives not go after college fraternities?

(+) Yeah! (+)

"(Americas college fraternities) [...]. Fraternities own $3 billion in real estate and house a quarter of a million students who tap into an unrivaled alumni network of presidents, members of Congress, corporate executives and Wall Street investors."

Hmm...? Oh, because CoLLeGe, amirite?

Waffles v Pancakes

Go!

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Ving_Rhames posted...

Waffles v Pancakes

Go!

Waffles in almost every situation

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I've seen a ton of people go after fraternities over the years

they do

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I mean didn't they? I certainly heard a lot of noise about them a few years back.

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This is an incredibly stupid topic. You clearly only read enough to find something to be mad about, without figuring out if what you're mad about is actually true.

Change your username to SpeedReader, then shut the fuck up and go to bed.

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Because cancel culture doesnt actually target white men

"Parents [...] are fighting to pierce the veil of secrecy that has protected fraternities for two centuries on American college campuses. Grieving families are pushing to investigate deaths once dismissed as roughhousing gone wrong. They are forcing universities and legislatures to publicize fraternity infractions, rein in their behavior and toughen the penalties after injuries and deaths. [...] 25 families that lost sons at fraternities in recent years. Members of Parents United to Stop Hazing hope to borrow pages from the successful playbook of Mothers Against Drunk Driving in the 1980s.
For now, few fraternity casualties ever result in punishment or any kind of serious reckoning, [...]

In sworn statements [...] chapter pledges said they were told to drink whiskey until they vomited into a kiddie pool lined with garbage bags. One member recounted how brothers put a hood over his head and beat him, leaving him with residual pain in his right shin. At the end of Hell Week, where hazing reaches its crescendo, older students would blindfold each pledge and ask him to lie in a coffin packed with ice, according to a deposition.
These rituals contradicted the universitys description of fraternity life. On its website, the school calls Greek students outstanding models in the classroom, on the playing field and amongst other clubs and organizations on campus.

Perhaps we should reevaluate colleges, as they're all in on the hazing and other deprived acts.

In fascist politics, universities, which present a more complex and accurate version of history and current reality, are attacked for being places where dominant traditions or practices are critiqued. Fascist ideology centers loyalty to power rather than truth.

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Ving_Rhames posted...

Waffles v Pancakes

Go!

Belgian Waffles are the best, and throw some fried chicken on it for awesomeness.

Pancakes are literally cake you bake in a pan. Meh. Unless I'm in a log cabin, give me the waffle

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You can thank Rolling Stone for giving frats a free ride from the media

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ASithLord7 posted...

In fascist politics, universities, which present a more complex and accurate version of history and current reality, are attacked for being places where dominant traditions or practices are critiqued. Fascist ideology centers loyalty to power rather than truth.

Are you saying we shouldn't bring up anything related to hazing on college campuses? Or that hazing deaths don't exist? Or that Universities would like nothing more that to sweep incidents of hazing under the rug to preserve their image?

A vague passage unrelated to reality doesn't make you look as smart as you think it does.

Pancakes. All day. Don't talk to me about Nooks and crannies and surface area bull shit....PANCAKES.

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I'm saying you trying to disguise your hatred for colleges with virtue signaling about frats is not as clever as you think it is.

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yeah hazing is fucked. fraternities in general are fucked up, even not including wealth/connections to wall street

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I was behind the scenes for a lot of fraternities and sororities back in college and the shit that happened was straight up disturbing as fuck.

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ASithLord7 posted...

I'm saying you trying to disguise your hatred for colleges with virtue signaling about frats is not as clever as you think it is.

Funny. By your logic, nothing will ever get solved; the left doesn't bother taking any actions, and any attempts by others to bring up the fact will be met with "concerned trolling" or "virtue signaling"

I mean, hazing is nothing new, but has the left taken any action against colleges to stop it? Nope, fraternities still exist, and are even "college-approved" so to speak.

https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2014/03/how-colleges-could-get-rid-of-fraternities/284176/

Pretending there hasn't been tons of reporting on frats and attempted action to curb them (or that the impetus lies solely on "the left") is so mindblowingly intellectually dishonest.

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ASithLord7 posted...

Waffles in almost every situation

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Waffles are like pancakes except they were scientifically designed to be superior with their syrup grooves.

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ASithLord7 posted...

Pretending there hasn't been tons of reporting on frats and attempted action to curb them (or that the impetus lies solely on "the left") is so mindblowingly intellectually dishonest.

And yet, deaths and hazings still happen.

Attempts to curb them? Seems like it's more lucrative to have them.

While college administrators, for the most part, have acted quickly after the most recent deaths, it is still highly unlikely that any would move to permanently ban fraternities outright, experts say.
Despite the surge in examining its flaws, Greek life is an institution designed to last in America's collegiate landscape.
"Fraternities are a huge draw for universities, and theyre more popular than they've ever been," Hechinger said, adding that there has been a 50 percent increase in membership over last decade.
Fraternities can also be a source of income for schools.
In Hechinger's research for "True Gentlemen," he examined the Indiana University Foundation, which raises money for the university. He found that although only 19 percent of alumni in its database had been members of Greek life, they accounted for 60 percent of donations.
The leadership opportunities that fraternities offer and the career networks that graduates have access to make Greek life even more appealing to colleges, students and alumni, Hechinger said.
"The bottom line is, most college fraternities are so central that theyre here to stay," he said, adding that the question is whether they will be properly regulated not whether they will be banned.


ASithLord7 posted...

(or that the impetus lies solely on "the left")

Not sure why it's the Right's responsibility, when they're already skeptical of, and insinuate that colleges are indoctrination centers for the left.

Or how you would just cry that the right is "attacking higher education", if they were to make any attempts to regulate colleges and fraternities.

Gross topic. I mentioned this in a previous post some time ago, but I'm surprised you didn't find some way to bitch about California. I'm sure you'll find a way.
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Cornmuffins posted...

Gross topic.

If only you support fraternities, and thus the hazing.

Cornmuffins posted...

I'm sure you'll find a way.

This issue isn't isolate to just California.
But I have no doubt the UC system has no plans to abolish the fraternities that exist there.

fraternities are garbage imo, and dens for terrible behavior. I did know some good frat boys through my ex who was more into the college scene than I, though.

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Is TC pretending that the people that speak out against fraternities are conservative, even though it's mostly liberals that criticize and push them to reform?

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DarkChozoGhost posted...

Is TC pretending that the people that speak out against fraternities are conservative, even though it's mostly liberals that criticize and push them to reform?

No, I speak for no one but myself.
But see, if liberals were the driving force for reforms, then it ought to be noted that they aren't pushing hard enough.

Ving_Rhames posted...

Waffles v Pancakes

Go!

well pancakes are usurped by the superior crepe, and waffles have "Chicken and" so I think the choice is obvious

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TC, literally everyone saw through this dumb shit

This is embarrassing

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HiddenRoar posted...

Attempts to curb them? Seems like it's more lucrative to have them.

While college administrators, for the most part, have acted quickly after the most recent deaths, it is still highly unlikely that any would move to permanently ban fraternities outright, experts say.
Despite the surge in examining its flaws, Greek life is an institution designed to last in America's collegiate landscape.
"Fraternities are a huge draw for universities, and theyre more popular than they've ever been," Hechinger said, adding that there has been a 50 percent increase in membership over last decade.
Fraternities can also be a source of income for schools.
In Hechinger's research for "True Gentlemen," he examined the Indiana University Foundation, which raises money for the university. He found that although only 19 percent of alumni in its database had been members of Greek life, they accounted for 60 percent of donations.
The leadership opportunities that fraternities offer and the career networks that graduates have access to make Greek life even more appealing to colleges, students and alumni, Hechinger said.
"The bottom line is, most college fraternities are so central that theyre here to stay," he said, adding that the question is whether they will be properly regulated not whether they will be banned.

seems like part of the solution is to make all schools public so they won't need the donations

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College should absolutely be public. K-12 already is and we know now that our brains dont stop developing until were at least 25 years old.

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why do you see shitty things happening and use them as "gotchas" for progressives? conservatives should have a problem with this too

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HiddenRoar posted...

No, I speak for no one but myself.
But see, if liberals were the driving force for reforms, then it ought to be noted that they aren't pushing hard enough.

They're pushing harder than conservatives, so conservatives would be more appropriate to criticize

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Waffles are generally better, but the best pancake >> the best waffle
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MC_BatCommander posted...

why do you see s***ty things happening and use them as "gotchas" for progressives? conservatives should have a problem with this too

Fraternities wouldn't be as influential, if not collapse completely, if colleges were abolished.
How are you supposed to attract new members if the pipeline from high school supplying girls and freshmen from all over the country were to no longer exist?

DarkChozoGhost posted...

They're pushing harder than conservatives, so conservatives would be more appropriate to criticize

It's as if you can't read, as:

HiddenRoar posted...

Not sure why it's the Right's responsibility, when they're already skeptical of, and insinuate that colleges are indoctrination centers for the left.

No colleges = end of fraternities. Since the left wishes to keep colleges the way they are, they are the party responsible for ensuring that the problems associated with their existence don't become problems in the first place, or at least left to fester into what they are today.

recently a Scottish chapter of an american fraternity got caught raping girls

https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/13/uk/st-andrews-sexual-assault-allegations-scli-gbr-intl/index.html

HiddenRoar posted...

Since the left wishes to keep colleges the way they are

[citation needed]

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averagejoel posted...

[citation needed]

Are you saying the left wishes to abolish colleges?

I think they do. Except a lot of progressives today probably were frat boys. Canada's prime minister has frat boy written all over him. Real progressives are more like this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IPBmWw_1fxo

HiddenRoar posted...

Are you saying the left wishes to abolish colleges?

I'm saying that we don't want to keep colleges the way they are

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are we ignoring the forced reforms or outright closing of frats in many schools over the last few years?

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monkmith posted...

are we ignoring the forced reforms or outright closing of frats in many schools over the last few years?

Small, no-name colleges, I'm sure.

But changing the system in a way that results in permanent and sustainable improvements may still be an uphill battle, particularly at some of the flagship universities and athletic powerhouses.
Kruger recently met with campus leaders from some of the schools that are members the Southeastern Conference, the Atlantic Coast Conference, the Big 10 and the Big 12 schools where approximately 30 percent to 40 percent of the student population is involved in a fraternity or a sorority.
"This is not a small part of the campus experience," he says. "Scale makes it very daunting. You literally have millions of dollars tied up in Greek life."

[...]
In spite of the increased awareness of the dangers associated with hazing and while college and university leadership looks for ways to curtail Greek life, students say they are increasingly interested in joining a fraternity or sorority.
The North-American Interfraternity Conference, which represents more than 70 of the country's biggest fraternities, estimates a 45 percent increase in the number of new pledges since the 2005-2006 school year. In the 2014-2015 academic year alone, more than 100,000 men were initiated into fraternities. And according to the National Panhellenic Conference, the umbrella organization for 26 national sororities, since 2013, more than 40 schools have signaled interest in hosting a chapter, and 70 new chapters have opened on campuses that already have thriving sorority systems.

And then we have California and Washington State corona outbreaks thanks to frat parties.

Also, suspension =/= ban/closing.
https://cbs12.com/news/local/ex-fsu-student-dead-allegedly-fell-from-roof-of-frat-house
A former Florida State University student was found dead outside a fraternity house Wednesday. Students said he fell off the roof.
[...]
A couple of boxes of seemingly empty beer cans could be seen on part of the roof. The Sigma Alpha Epsilon fraternity was suspended last fall for alleged alcohol violations. The fraternity was placed on disciplinary probation through the Spring 2020 semester, which ended in May.

https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/news/education/story/2020-07-02/sdsu-no-charges-in-death-of-freshman-fraternity-pledge-who-died-after-top-bunk-fall
SAN DIEGO No criminal charges will be filed in connection with the death last year of Dylan Hernandez, a 19-year-old freshman who suffered a fatal blow to the head when he fell out of a campus bunk bed after a night of drinking at a fraternity party, San Diego State University said late Thursday.
The university and the police department made a promise that they were going to investigate the drinking and the hazing that they knew happened that night, Julia Hernandez, one of Dylans two sisters, said earlier this year.
When my dad spoke to them recently they said they have not interviewed anyone [who was] at the party, they have not gone to the [fraternity] house, they have not retained any information from the fraternity or its members, so, in our eyes, the investigation isnt complete.
Last year, De la Torre appointed two task forces to examine the behavior in fraternities and the abuse of alcohol and drugs. The task forces have met almost exclusively in private.
On mid-December, the Union-Tribune filed a Public Records Act requesting extensive information about how the schools fraternities and sororities operate, and how disciplinary problems have been handled.SDSU later said that the university has continued to have problems with the fraternities. But it has not turned over the information requested by the U-T.

CONTINUED to have problems with fraternities. Where's your claims of reforms occurring? Why such secrecy?
Sounds much like "We've investigated ourselves and found no evidence of wrongdoing" to me.