Current Events > I think you needed to **SPOILERS** **SPOILERS** in Last of Us 2...

(+) Yeah! (+)

I think you needed to hate Abby and she had to do those terrible things in order for her redemption to have any merits.

If she just walked up and shot Joel in the head, I don't think I would have hated her enough to be surprised that at the end I actually sympathized with her more than Ellie.

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That comic presupposes the idea that there aren't times in your life when you gotta do shit you don't want to.

But I realize a lot of people have that issue with the game and that's fine.

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Ppl be like "Why the writers making me like Abby when I don't want to?"

Nah. The writers are presenting you with a story and you can feel how you want.

If she just shot him in the head and walked off Ellie wouldn't have been that traumatized so who knows if her warpath would have even been the same. I don't remember when Tommy figured out they were WLF either.

So it's possible there wouldn't have been a game if she did that. But yes they wanted you to absolutely hate Abby for the first half.

I don't think the game made much of an effort to make you feel bad for killing dogs. The whole thing is about tribalism and seeing things from a different perspective.

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Joel's Brother WILL GET DLC

he was gone for a while, a year seeking her out


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Joeydollaz posted...

Joel's Brother WILL GET DLC

he was gone for a while, a year seeking her out

They've said no DLC plans for the game. Then again that wouldn't rule out a Lost Legacy style mini sequel.

Tommy will die at the beginning of the third game to continue the trend of each game starting off with the brutal death of a Miller.

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Darmik posted...

They've said no DLC plans for the game. Then again that wouldn't rule out a Lost Legacy style mini sequel.

Tommy will die at the beginning of the third game to continue the trend of each game starting off with the brutal death of a Miller.

Some consider Ellie part of the Miller family

sLaCkEr408___RJ posted...

Ppl be like "Why the writers making me like Abby when I don't want to?"

Nah. The writers are presenting you with a story and you can feel how you want.

And if that feeling is "social justice bullshit ruined TLoU"? Because it did.

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Im probably in the minority here but I started out liking abbys character (when you first play as her), however I became less interested as it went along. I thought she ended up getting too cheesy and the writing was really heavy handed, they tried too hard to make you like her imo

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The games ending was fucking stupid and nonsensical. None of it after the midgame shift is any good. The game fails on a fundamental level to attempt to get you to empathize with these pieces of shit.

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Romulox28 posted...

Im probably in the minority here but I started out liking abbys character (when you first play as her), however I became less interested as it went along. I thought she ended up getting too cheesy and the writing was really heavy handed, they tried too hard to make you like her imo

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I agree with the OP, that's why I disagree whenever people say that the game should have had alternating Ellie and Abby chapters.

the story wouldn't have been as effecting in that way, IMO.

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Game: *attempts to make me feel bad about killing abby's piece of shit friends*

Me: https://youtu.be/sMGMZsKXz94

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I never felt bad killing her friends, lol

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brokenfingers posted...

And if that feeling is "social justice bullshit ruined TLoU"? Because it did.

You're welcome to expand on how any of the "social justice bullshit" ruined TLoU outside of you probably just hating seeing women and sexual minorities in prominent game roles.

Motherfuckers acting like the game was 30 hours of Ellie killing straight white men because they disagree on socialism.

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Jeff AKA Snoopy posted...

I never felt bad killing her friends, lol

Yeah I never really felt for her friends. I felt for Abby herself somewhat. Even that is hard for people though because they just aren't able to see from a perspective outside of the character that was established first. Both Ellie and Abby are a lot more nuanced than Team Joel fans want them to be.

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I didn't necessarily feel bad about Ellie killing Abby's friends, but I felt bad about how it affected both Ellie and Abby, especially when it came to Owen and Mel.

like, Ellie wasn't planning on killing them, but shit went south. and it was sad playing Abby knowing what was coming up, and her reaction to it.

the way Ellie killed Nora was pretty messed up, though. she tortured a dying woman for info, and probably even beat her to death.

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And it traumatizes the **** out of her

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true

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They made a good job at making you hate abby through the whole game, and they made a terrible job at actually making you feel bad for her, she's a shitstain, acts like a complete bitch towards everyone, and doesn't give a shit about anything other than what she wants to do, she only starts caring once lev enters the picture but at that point its too late

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Total_Lost2 posted...

And it traumatizes the **** out of her

This is the complete and utter difference between Ellie and Abby. Abby almost gleefully slices a pregnant woman's throat. Abby enjoys torture. Abby is a top member of WLF because she is so effective at brutality. Abby grows a little bit in the most generic of fashion (my enemy is actually my friend! Whoa!) and the writing is extraordinarily heavy handed. You BARELY hear her have any remorse for what she did to Joel, only alluding that she feels a weight on her shoulders and she wasn't sleeping right. Ellie, on the other hand, kills all of her friends (except Nora, who, fuck her) out of complete self defense. Ellie feels extremely bad about Nora. When she finds out Mel is pregnant she buckles over. The ending of her going back for revenge round 2 then abandoning it at the moment of truth is just....ugh what a stupid game.

Abby sucks. Period. She just turns into a microcosm of Joel and Ellie when her and Lev go on their adventure. That's the best thing I can say about that and even then it is just boring and not interesting. The game fails completely and utterly in trying to force empathy.

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hockeybub89 posted...

You're welcome to expand on how any of the "social justice bullshit" ruined TLoU outside of you probably just hating seeing women and sexual minorities in prominent game roles.

Motherfuckers acting like the game was 30 hours of Ellie killing straight white men because they disagree on socialism.

the whole thing with the seraphites & lev was kind of an eye roll tbh, i kind of feel like the developers went out of their way to put in a trans character and worried about it making sense later

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brokenfingers posted...

And if that feeling is "social justice bullshit ruined TLoU"? Because it did.

What social justice bullshit? The last of us 2 is an overly dark and depressing game where everyone is a horrible person who does horrible things. That isn't what I think of when I think social justice. That's straight up nihilist stuff there.

TLOU is the exact opposite of social justice.

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Romulox28 posted...

i kind of feel like the developers went out of their way to put in a trans character and worried about it making sense later

idk about that considering how much of the plot it affected, both directly and indirectly.

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I cant believe people are still making excuses for TLOU2, if the story and presentation was good you would not need to defend it.

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Cookie Bag posted...

They made a good job at making you hate abby through the whole game, and they made a terrible job at actually making you feel bad for her, she's a shitstain, acts like a complete bitch towards everyone, and doesn't give a shit about anything other than what she wants to do, she only starts caring once lev enters the picture but at that point its too late

I don't think it is really about feeling bad for her, just giving another perspective. Hell, as far as her story is concerned the Joel part is finished after beating him in the start up until she finds Owen and Mel (or arguable the last scene of Manny). It's just that (like Owen) she gets tired of her daily schtick and wants something more "light" after meeting Lev and Yara (as in going back to the norms of the Fireflies)

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Total_Lost2 posted...

I don't think it is really about feeling bad for her, just giving another perspective. Hell, as far as her story is concerned the Joel part is finished after beating him in the start up until she finds Owen and Mel (or arguable the last scene of Manny). It's just that (like Owen) she gets tired of her daily schtick and wants something more "light" after meeting Lev and Yara (as in going back to the norms of the Fireflies)

I don't think anyone expected or wanted that perspective, and even less fighting ellie as abby

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Romulox28 posted...

the whole thing with the seraphites & lev was kind of an eye roll tbh, i kind of feel like the developers went out of their way to put in a trans character and worried about it making sense later

i get it if you're saying that putting in yet another evil religious cult and a tragic transgender character is eyerolling. i don't claim to know how how any trans person feels about lev, but i would imagine a positive empowering trans character would be something nice to see.

but i don't think there's anything eyerolling in context. a transgender person having to flee for their life from their violent religious cult in a extremely violent world is pretty believable.

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pauIie posted...

i get it if you're saying that putting in yet another evil religious cult and a tragic transgender character is eyerolling. i don't claim to know how how any trans person feels about lev, but i would imagine a positive empowering trans character would be something nice to see.

but i don't think there's anything eyerolling in context. a transgender person having to flee for their life from their violent religious cult in a extremely violent world is pretty believable.

i thought it was kind of weird that lev's whole deal is that he is hunted by the cult for wanting to be a male soldier. meanwhile the seraphites are multi-racial, they have female soldiers (like lev's own sister), etc. i guess they could also just happen to not be cool with trans issues but that is a really weak justification imo.

the seraphites/lev plotline didnt really do it for me, although it did produce one hilarious moment, when you're trying to escape the island and they keep trying to kill you. the WLF people are there with their full forces burning the island down and executing every last person, yet when the seraphites see you they go "hey it's lily, let's get her!" and apply equal effort to trying to kill the 90lb trans teenager lol

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I don't even know if a third game is a good idea. Obviously most were not satisfied with the ending in this outside of flashbacks

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