Current Events > Transgender Canadian woman sets off debate after winning cycling world champions

(+) Yeah! (+)

Literally cheating

https://ca.sports.yahoo.com/news/transgender-canadian-woman-sets-off-204200340.html
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because she is forced to suppress her testosterone levels to what she deems "unhealthily low" levels as a pre-requisite for competing.

Literally not cheating.
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Well he is a guy so
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Really gets the noggin joggin.
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Complete nonsense. Transgender people should not be able to enter any physical gender segregated competition. Regardless of where you fall on the idea of the relationship of gender and sex, the absolute fact is that they still have the body of their biological sex. It will always have an effect in a competition. It is cheating people out of a win.

rofl
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Thicc
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Its never a F2M transgendered person to ever win these

Strange
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Lordgold666 posted...

Its never a F2M transgendered person to ever win these

Strange

I'm sure it's just coincidence.
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"We cannot have a woman legally recognized as a trans woman in society, and not be recognized that way in sports," McKinnon was quoted as saying. "Focusing on performance advantage is largely irrelevant because this is a rights issue. We shouldn't be worried about trans people taking over the Olympics. We should be worried about their fairness and human rights instead."

and ignore the fairness for every other athlete, apparently.
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How can people not feel hollow inside winning like that?
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refmon posted...

Literally cheating

I don't see how that's chea..

ThePrinceFish posted...

rofl

*record scratch
*spits out drink
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Just another way the patriarchy is trying to oppress women. sarcasm
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The end of women's sports is nigh
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Lordgold666 posted...

Its never a F2M transgendered person to ever win these

Strange

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Like when that trans age guy dominated that children's crossfit competition
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7t8xwpW8gJQ" data-time="
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So... misgendering is a good thing now?

Lordgold666 posted...

Its never a F2M transgendered person to ever win these

Strange

https://www.cnn.com/2017/02/27/us/texas-transgender-wrestler-trnd-hold/index.html
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I get why people get iffy on athletics, but the alternatives are p fucked up for transgenders. Either no sports, don't take hormones & compete with your biological sex, or form a new segregated sports industry.
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Blue_Dream87 posted...

I get why people get iffy on athletics, but the alternatives are p fucked up for transgenders. Either no sports, don't take hormones & compete with your biological sex, or form a new segregated sports industry.

We segregate sports already, for the exact same reasons.
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Look at her Twitter page. The woman who got third place is complaining even though she beat the trans athlete in 11/13 of their races together. And the trans athlete only came in first place this one time.

https://twitter.com/rachelvmckinnon/status/1052161418680823808?s=09

Oh, and the woman in second place raised a good point, the third place woman agreed to the rules of competition and if she disagrees then she can simply opt not to compete.

https://twitter.com/CforCycling/status/1051874220014104576?s=09
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Blue_Dream87 posted...

I get why people get iffy on athletics, but the alternatives are p fucked up for transgenders. Either no sports, don't take hormones & compete with your biological sex, or form a new segregated sports industry.

The major problem is we're reaching a point where there has to be a cut off. There has to be a point where society says "no, unfortunately that cannot happen." With sports, it needs to be you either don't transition and continue to play under your biological sex, or don't play at all. There is no middle ground where things can remain fair unless we want to go by weight classes instead of gender. Casual sports or a league where everyone is signing up knowing that gender identity is the determining factor is no problem.

Also, depending on how far down the rabbit hole we're going to go with "people are the gender they say they are", what is the cutoff for someone being considered transgender? If there is a large money prize, can someone just say "I'm a woman for the next hour" and crush the competition? Who would judge how seriously someone is transitioning? I assume there are probably some regulations in place currently, but you have all the gender fluid nonsense going around that could infect these institutions in the future.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IzXbmQ-JLmE" data-time="
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nemu posted...

Blue_Dream87 posted...

I get why people get iffy on athletics, but the alternatives are p fucked up for transgenders. Either no sports, don't take hormones & compete with your biological sex, or form a new segregated sports industry.

The major problem is we're reaching a point where there has to be a cut off. There has to be a point where society says "no, unfortunately that cannot happen." With sports, it needs to be you either don't transition and continue to play under your biological sex, or don't play at all. There is no middle ground where things can remain fair unless we want to go by weight classes instead of gender. Casual sports or a league where everyone is signing up knowing that gender identity is the determining factor is no problem.

Also, depending on how far down the rabbit hole we're going to go with "people are the gender they say they are", what is the cutoff for someone being considered transgender? If there is a large money prize, can someone just say "I'm a woman for the next hour" and crush the competition? Who would judge how seriously someone is transitioning? I assume there are probably some regulations in place currently, but you have all the gender fluid nonsense going around that could infect these institutions in the future.

There's literally internationally accepted rules regarding what constraints trans women need to meet to qualify for competition, stop with this slippery slope bull crap when to qualify for races with large amounts of prize money you'd have to qualify and sign up months in advance.
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It's really sad when we've gotten to the point where we actually have to discuss why a biological male getting awards in female sports is bad.

nemu posted...

Also, depending on how far down the rabbit hole we're going to go with "people are the gender they say they are", what is the cutoff for someone being considered transgender? If there is a large money prize, can someone just say "I'm a woman for the next hour" and crush the competition? Who would judge how seriously someone is transitioning? I assume there are probably some regulations in place currently, but you have all the gender fluid nonsense going around that could infect these institutions in the future.

Half of the swim club that I was part of in highschool would easily get bronze or better in every female swimming olympic event since 2000.

That's with highschoolers and none of us were anything special. I imagine it'd be even worse of a divide with serious athletes

Hopefully it doesn't get to the "let's listen to feelings even tho they just brought it up after hearing of the sports event"
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gunplagirl posted...

nemu posted...

Blue_Dream87 posted...

I get why people get iffy on athletics, but the alternatives are p fucked up for transgenders. Either no sports, don't take hormones & compete with your biological sex, or form a new segregated sports industry.

The major problem is we're reaching a point where there has to be a cut off. There has to be a point where society says "no, unfortunately that cannot happen." With sports, it needs to be you either don't transition and continue to play under your biological sex, or don't play at all. There is no middle ground where things can remain fair unless we want to go by weight classes instead of gender. Casual sports or a league where everyone is signing up knowing that gender identity is the determining factor is no problem.

Also, depending on how far down the rabbit hole we're going to go with "people are the gender they say they are", what is the cutoff for someone being considered transgender? If there is a large money prize, can someone just say "I'm a woman for the next hour" and crush the competition? Who would judge how seriously someone is transitioning? I assume there are probably some regulations in place currently, but you have all the gender fluid nonsense going around that could infect these institutions in the future.

There's literally internationally accepted rules regarding what constraints trans women need to meet to qualify for competition, stop with this slippery slope bull crap when to qualify for races with large amounts of prize money you'd have to qualify and sign up months in advance.

But will those rules be the same in five years? Will people argue that they aren't inclusive enough to the point where they're changed again? That's what made transgender people able to compete. The rules were changed to be more progressive. How progressive will they get? We're already going down the slippery slope with them being able to compete in the first place despite the unfairness. People want to ignore that because of progressiveness.

nemu posted...

gunplagirl posted...

nemu posted...

Blue_Dream87 posted...

I get why people get iffy on athletics, but the alternatives are p fucked up for transgenders. Either no sports, don't take hormones & compete with your biological sex, or form a new segregated sports industry.

The major problem is we're reaching a point where there has to be a cut off. There has to be a point where society says "no, unfortunately that cannot happen." With sports, it needs to be you either don't transition and continue to play under your biological sex, or don't play at all. There is no middle ground where things can remain fair unless we want to go by weight classes instead of gender. Casual sports or a league where everyone is signing up knowing that gender identity is the determining factor is no problem.

Also, depending on how far down the rabbit hole we're going to go with "people are the gender they say they are", what is the cutoff for someone being considered transgender? If there is a large money prize, can someone just say "I'm a woman for the next hour" and crush the competition? Who would judge how seriously someone is transitioning? I assume there are probably some regulations in place currently, but you have all the gender fluid nonsense going around that could infect these institutions in the future.

There's literally internationally accepted rules regarding what constraints trans women need to meet to qualify for competition, stop with this slippery slope bull crap when to qualify for races with large amounts of prize money you'd have to qualify and sign up months in advance.

But will those rules be the same in five years? Will people argue that they aren't inclusive enough to the point where they're changed again? That's what made transgender people able to compete. The rules were changed to be more progressive. How progressive will they get? We're already going down the slippery slope with them being able to compete in the first place despite the unfairness. People want to ignore that because of progressiveness.

You are talking to gunplagirl. Trans rights are always right to her even if it means the end of women's sports
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nemu posted...

gunplagirl posted...

nemu posted...

Blue_Dream87 posted...

I get why people get iffy on athletics, but the alternatives are p fucked up for transgenders. Either no sports, don't take hormones & compete with your biological sex, or form a new segregated sports industry.

The major problem is we're reaching a point where there has to be a cut off. There has to be a point where society says "no, unfortunately that cannot happen." With sports, it needs to be you either don't transition and continue to play under your biological sex, or don't play at all. There is no middle ground where things can remain fair unless we want to go by weight classes instead of gender. Casual sports or a league where everyone is signing up knowing that gender identity is the determining factor is no problem.

Also, depending on how far down the rabbit hole we're going to go with "people are the gender they say they are", what is the cutoff for someone being considered transgender? If there is a large money prize, can someone just say "I'm a woman for the next hour" and crush the competition? Who would judge how seriously someone is transitioning? I assume there are probably some regulations in place currently, but you have all the gender fluid nonsense going around that could infect these institutions in the future.

There's literally internationally accepted rules regarding what constraints trans women need to meet to qualify for competition, stop with this slippery slope bull crap when to qualify for races with large amounts of prize money you'd have to qualify and sign up months in advance.

But will those rules be the same in five years? Will people argue that they aren't inclusive enough to the point where they're changed again? That's what made transgender people able to compete. The rules were changed to be more progressive. How progressive will they get? We're already going down the slippery slope with them being able to compete in the first place despite the unfairness. People want to ignore that because of progressiveness.

An, rather than actually sticking to facts you're fear mongering and not interested in the science behind the determinations or requirements for trans athletes to compete.

Gosh, what possible reason could a cis person have to ignore science if it's means they get to call a trans athlete who loses most of the time some sort of cheater /sarcasm
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Yeah, this is bullshit. Even with their testosterone being suppressed, people who were born as men have enormous athletic advantages based on their build and body structure. I feel bad for the real women who work so hard only to get unfairly beaten like this.
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Dathrowed1 posted...

nemu posted...

gunplagirl posted...

nemu posted...

Blue_Dream87 posted...

I get why people get iffy on athletics, but the alternatives are p fucked up for transgenders. Either no sports, don't take hormones & compete with your biological sex, or form a new segregated sports industry.

The major problem is we're reaching a point where there has to be a cut off. There has to be a point where society says "no, unfortunately that cannot happen." With sports, it needs to be you either don't transition and continue to play under your biological sex, or don't play at all. There is no middle ground where things can remain fair unless we want to go by weight classes instead of gender. Casual sports or a league where everyone is signing up knowing that gender identity is the determining factor is no problem.

Also, depending on how far down the rabbit hole we're going to go with "people are the gender they say they are", what is the cutoff for someone being considered transgender? If there is a large money prize, can someone just say "I'm a woman for the next hour" and crush the competition? Who would judge how seriously someone is transitioning? I assume there are probably some regulations in place currently, but you have all the gender fluid nonsense going around that could infect these institutions in the future.

There's literally internationally accepted rules regarding what constraints trans women need to meet to qualify for competition, stop with this slippery slope bull crap when to qualify for races with large amounts of prize money you'd have to qualify and sign up months in advance.

But will those rules be the same in five years? Will people argue that they aren't inclusive enough to the point where they're changed again? That's what made transgender people able to compete. The rules were changed to be more progressive. How progressive will they get? We're already going down the slippery slope with them being able to compete in the first place despite the unfairness. People want to ignore that because of progressiveness.

You are talking to gunplagirl. Trans rights are always right to her even if it means the end of women's sports

Trans women are women and the international committees have determined them eligible. She isn't even setting any records in her races, stop with the concern bull shit when there's cis women doing better than her consistently yet you have no qualms with them. I guess her trans cheating only kicked in this one time?
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why dont trans people compete in a trans division? anything else is unfair

CornBarn posted...

why dont trans people compete in a trans division? anything else is unfair

Literally had committees determine that's total bull shit

0AbsoluteZero0 posted...

Yeah, this is bullshit. Even with their testosterone being suppressed, people who were born as a men have enormous athletic advantages based on their build and body structure. I feel bad for the real women who work so hard only to get unfairly beaten like this.

See above, experts who actually specialize in this stuff say it's fair
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https://work.chron.com/physiological-differences-between-male-female-athletes-20627.html

Cardiovascular Fitness

Athletes' cardiovascular fitness is measured by their maximum oxygen consumption, also known as VO2max, which measures their capacity to transport and use oxygen during exercise. This is measured by calculating the point at which an athlete's oxygen consumption remains steady despite an increase in an exercise intensity. Elite male athletes have a higher oxygen carrying capacity than women, which allows them to reach their maximum training peak earlier. This is probably due to women's lower hemoglobin levels and men's larger body size. Maximum oxygen consumption is directly related to body size.

Bones and Ligaments

Male athletes have longer and larger bones, which provide a clear mechanical advantage over female athletes. The increased articular surface and larger structure of male bones provide them with a greater leverage and a wider frame on which to support muscle. Similarly, the ligaments of female athletes are generally more lax and fragile than those of their male counterparts. This gives male athletes an advantage in sports that involve throwing, kicking and hitting, and explains the higher incidence of musculoskeletal injuries among female athletes. On the other hand, female athletes have a wider pelvis and a lower center of gravity, which provides excellent balance.

Strength

Male athletes have a higher ratio of muscle mass to body weight, which allows for greater speed and acceleration. This explains why female speed records in running and swimming are consistently 10 percent slower than men's, and why, on average, they have two thirds of the strength of men. However, when you factor out the larger muscle mass in men and compare muscular strength relative to cross-section area of muscle, the strength of male and female athletes is nearly equal.

Endurance

Endurance is largely determined by a body's efficiency when converting calories into energy. Female athletes are more efficient than male athletes at converting glycogen to energy. Glycogen is a secondary source of fuel you use when glucose levels drop. This is why female athletes excel in ultra-long-distance sports and rarely hit the wall during long races. It also explains why ultra-running, which includes races longer than a marathon, is one of the few sports where elite female and male athletes regularly compete together, and in which female athletes sometimes win.

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gunplagirl posted...

An, rather than actually sticking to facts you're fear mongering and not interested in the science behind the determinations or requirements for trans athletes to compete.

Gosh, what possible reason could a cis person have to ignore science if it's means they get to call a trans athlete who loses most of the time some sort of cheater /sarcasm

What science? They're going from the starting point of "transpeople are eligible to compete" and then deciding random hormone nonsense as if that negates the natural advantage.

voldothegr8 posted...

https://work.chron.com/physiological-differences-between-male-female-athletes-20627.html

Cardiovascular Fitness

Athletes' cardiovascular fitness is measured by their maximum oxygen consumption, also known as VO2max, which measures their capacity to transport and use oxygen during exercise. This is measured by calculating the point at which an athlete's oxygen consumption remains steady despite an increase in an exercise intensity. Elite male athletes have a higher oxygen carrying capacity than women, which allows them to reach their maximum training peak earlier. This is probably due to women's lower hemoglobin levels and men's larger body size. Maximum oxygen consumption is directly related to body size.

Bones and Ligaments

Male athletes have longer and larger bones, which provide a clear mechanical advantage over female athletes. The increased articular surface and larger structure of male bones provide them with a greater leverage and a wider frame on which to support muscle. Similarly, the ligaments of female athletes are generally more lax and fragile than those of their male counterparts. This gives male athletes an advantage in sports that involve throwing, kicking and hitting, and explains the higher incidence of musculoskeletal injuries among female athletes. On the other hand, female athletes have a wider pelvis and a lower center of gravity, which provides excellent balance.

Strength

Male athletes have a higher ratio of muscle mass to body weight, which allows for greater speed and acceleration. This explains why female speed records in running and swimming are consistently 10 percent slower than men's, and why, on average, they have two thirds of the strength of men. However, when you factor out the larger muscle mass in men and compare muscular strength relative to cross-section area of muscle, the strength of male and female athletes is nearly equal.

Endurance

Endurance is largely determined by a body's efficiency when converting calories into energy. Female athletes are more efficient than male athletes at converting glycogen to energy. Glycogen is a secondary source of fuel you use when glucose levels drop. This is why female athletes excel in ultra-long-distance sports and rarely hit the wall during long races. It also explains why ultra-running, which includes races longer than a marathon, is one of the few sports where elite female and male athletes regularly compete together, and in which female athletes sometimes win.

And the part about testosterone suppression over the span of years and trans athletes? *Crickets*
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gunplagirl posted...

Literally had committees determine that's total bull s***

didnt realize your favorite committees are infallible and unbiased final authorities

nemu posted...

gunplagirl posted...

An, rather than actually sticking to facts you're fear mongering and not interested in the science behind the determinations or requirements for trans athletes to compete.

Gosh, what possible reason could a cis person have to ignore science if it's means they get to call a trans athlete who loses most of the time some sort of cheater /sarcasm

What science? They're going from the starting point of "transpeople are eligible to compete" and then deciding random hormone nonsense as if that negates the natural advantage.

No, they went from
Trans people can't compete
To
Trans people should be able to but how can we even the field
To
What sort of requirements, however strict, will allow for fair competition
To
Okay we took several years and after consulting with experts we decided on these requirements for trans athletes to compete
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gunplagirl posted...

voldothegr8 posted...

https://work.chron.com/physiological-differences-between-male-female-athletes-20627.html

Cardiovascular Fitness

Athletes' cardiovascular fitness is measured by their maximum oxygen consumption, also known as VO2max, which measures their capacity to transport and use oxygen during exercise. This is measured by calculating the point at which an athlete's oxygen consumption remains steady despite an increase in an exercise intensity. Elite male athletes have a higher oxygen carrying capacity than women, which allows them to reach their maximum training peak earlier. This is probably due to women's lower hemoglobin levels and men's larger body size. Maximum oxygen consumption is directly related to body size.

Bones and Ligaments

Male athletes have longer and larger bones, which provide a clear mechanical advantage over female athletes. The increased articular surface and larger structure of male bones provide them with a greater leverage and a wider frame on which to support muscle. Similarly, the ligaments of female athletes are generally more lax and fragile than those of their male counterparts. This gives male athletes an advantage in sports that involve throwing, kicking and hitting, and explains the higher incidence of musculoskeletal injuries among female athletes. On the other hand, female athletes have a wider pelvis and a lower center of gravity, which provides excellent balance.

Strength

Male athletes have a higher ratio of muscle mass to body weight, which allows for greater speed and acceleration. This explains why female speed records in running and swimming are consistently 10 percent slower than men's, and why, on average, they have two thirds of the strength of men. However, when you factor out the larger muscle mass in men and compare muscular strength relative to cross-section area of muscle, the strength of male and female athletes is nearly equal.

Endurance

Endurance is largely determined by a body's efficiency when converting calories into energy. Female athletes are more efficient than male athletes at converting glycogen to energy. Glycogen is a secondary source of fuel you use when glucose levels drop. This is why female athletes excel in ultra-long-distance sports and rarely hit the wall during long races. It also explains why ultra-running, which includes races longer than a marathon, is one of the few sports where elite female and male athletes regularly compete together, and in which female athletes sometimes win.

And the part about testosterone suppression over the span of years and trans athletes? *Crickets*

Not worth mentioning because it makes no difference
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CornBarn posted...

gunplagirl posted...

Literally had committees determine that's total bull s***

didnt realize your favorite committees are infallible and unbiased final authorities

I wasn't aware some random CE alt was more qualified on sports mechanics and biology
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gunplagirl posted...

CornBarn posted...

gunplagirl posted...

Literally had committees determine that's total bull s***

didnt realize your favorite committees are infallible and unbiased final authorities

I wasn't aware some random CE alt was more qualified on sports mechanics and biology

Says the person ignoring biology
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CornBarn posted...

why dont trans people compete in a trans division? anything else is unfair

Tbh I don't think they would have the numbers for it.

There's no good solution. Like nemu said, we've reached the "life's unfair, tough shit" moment.
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voldothegr8 posted...

gunplagirl posted...

voldothegr8 posted...

https://work.chron.com/physiological-differences-between-male-female-athletes-20627.html

Cardiovascular Fitness

Athletes' cardiovascular fitness is measured by their maximum oxygen consumption, also known as VO2max, which measures their capacity to transport and use oxygen during exercise. This is measured by calculating the point at which an athlete's oxygen consumption remains steady despite an increase in an exercise intensity. Elite male athletes have a higher oxygen carrying capacity than women, which allows them to reach their maximum training peak earlier. This is probably due to women's lower hemoglobin levels and men's larger body size. Maximum oxygen consumption is directly related to body size.

Bones and Ligaments

Male athletes have longer and larger bones, which provide a clear mechanical advantage over female athletes. The increased articular surface and larger structure of male bones provide them with a greater leverage and a wider frame on which to support muscle. Similarly, the ligaments of female athletes are generally more lax and fragile than those of their male counterparts. This gives male athletes an advantage in sports that involve throwing, kicking and hitting, and explains the higher incidence of musculoskeletal injuries among female athletes. On the other hand, female athletes have a wider pelvis and a lower center of gravity, which provides excellent balance.

Strength

Male athletes have a higher ratio of muscle mass to body weight, which allows for greater speed and acceleration. This explains why female speed records in running and swimming are consistently 10 percent slower than men's, and why, on average, they have two thirds of the strength of men. However, when you factor out the larger muscle mass in men and compare muscular strength relative to cross-section area of muscle, the strength of male and female athletes is nearly equal.

Endurance

Endurance is largely determined by a body's efficiency when converting calories into energy. Female athletes are more efficient than male athletes at converting glycogen to energy. Glycogen is a secondary source of fuel you use when glucose levels drop. This is why female athletes excel in ultra-long-distance sports and rarely hit the wall during long races. It also explains why ultra-running, which includes races longer than a marathon, is one of the few sports where elite female and male athletes regularly compete together, and in which female athletes sometimes win.

And the part about testosterone suppression over the span of years and trans athletes? *Crickets*

Not worth mentioning because it makes no difference

but his committee!

voldothegr8 posted...

gunplagirl posted...

voldothegr8 posted...

https://work.chron.com/physiological-differences-between-male-female-athletes-20627.html

Cardiovascular Fitness

Athletes' cardiovascular fitness is measured by their maximum oxygen consumption, also known as VO2max, which measures their capacity to transport and use oxygen during exercise. This is measured by calculating the point at which an athlete's oxygen consumption remains steady despite an increase in an exercise intensity. Elite male athletes have a higher oxygen carrying capacity than women, which allows them to reach their maximum training peak earlier. This is probably due to women's lower hemoglobin levels and men's larger body size. Maximum oxygen consumption is directly related to body size.

Bones and Ligaments

Male athletes have longer and larger bones, which provide a clear mechanical advantage over female athletes. The increased articular surface and larger structure of male bones provide them with a greater leverage and a wider frame on which to support muscle. Similarly, the ligaments of female athletes are generally more lax and fragile than those of their male counterparts. This gives male athletes an advantage in sports that involve throwing, kicking and hitting, and explains the higher incidence of musculoskeletal injuries among female athletes. On the other hand, female athletes have a wider pelvis and a lower center of gravity, which provides excellent balance.

Strength

Male athletes have a higher ratio of muscle mass to body weight, which allows for greater speed and acceleration. This explains why female speed records in running and swimming are consistently 10 percent slower than men's, and why, on average, they have two thirds of the strength of men. However, when you factor out the larger muscle mass in men and compare muscular strength relative to cross-section area of muscle, the strength of male and female athletes is nearly equal.

Endurance

Endurance is largely determined by a body's efficiency when converting calories into energy. Female athletes are more efficient than male athletes at converting glycogen to energy. Glycogen is a secondary source of fuel you use when glucose levels drop. This is why female athletes excel in ultra-long-distance sports and rarely hit the wall during long races. It also explains why ultra-running, which includes races longer than a marathon, is one of the few sports where elite female and male athletes regularly compete together, and in which female athletes sometimes win.

And the part about testosterone suppression over the span of years and trans athletes? *Crickets*

Not worth mentioning because it makes no difference

Testosterone makes no difference?

This is definitely CE.
---

voldothegr8 posted...

gunplagirl posted...

CornBarn posted...

gunplagirl posted...

Literally had committees determine that's total bull s***

didnt realize your favorite committees are infallible and unbiased final authorities

I wasn't aware some random CE alt was more qualified on sports mechanics and biology

Says the person ignoring biology

You said that testosterone doesn't make a difference.
---

Funbazooka posted...

CornBarn posted...

why dont trans people compete in a trans division? anything else is unfair

Tbh I don't think they would have the numbers for it.

There's no good solution. Like nemu said, we've reached the "life's unfair, tough shit" moment.

it would be unfair to women to make them compete against transwmen who had years of physical advantage built into their skeleton, muscles, etc

Funbazooka posted...

CornBarn posted...

why dont trans people compete in a trans division? anything else is unfair

Tbh I don't think they would have the numbers for it.

There's no good solution. Like nemu said, we've reached the "life's unfair, tough shit" moment.

So unfair, that's why she's lost most of her races? Well, from that we can clearly determine through inference that cis athletes have an unfair advantage. /Sarcasm
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gunplagirl posted...

nemu posted...

gunplagirl posted...

An, rather than actually sticking to facts you're fear mongering and not interested in the science behind the determinations or requirements for trans athletes to compete.

Gosh, what possible reason could a cis person have to ignore science if it's means they get to call a trans athlete who loses most of the time some sort of cheater /sarcasm

What science? They're going from the starting point of "transpeople are eligible to compete" and then deciding random hormone nonsense as if that negates the natural advantage.

No, they went from
Trans people can't compete
To
Trans people should be able to but how can we even the field
To
What sort of requirements, however strict, will allow for fair competition
To
Okay we took several years and after consulting with experts we decided on these requirements for trans athletes to compete

The end goal is to have them compete regardless. They need to be able to compete for organizations to be progressive. That does not make for good grounds of a case of objective study. What is their scenario for some 6'8 mass of muscle MtF? How is that fair that she competes with women? Does lowering her testosterone somehow negate that massive physical advantage?

Lotta transphobia ITT...

Also lotta denying data and evidence and facts ITT...
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