Current Events > Capiitalism is no longer working!

(+) Yeah! (+)

Capitalism had a purpose, no that purpose wasn't creating new products/services. People do that on their own for their own self-fulfillment. It was used for improvements on already existing ideas, perfecting them so they could be sold for a much greater price at a cheaper expense.

That worked for a while, but now we see companies exploiting the rules of Capitalism. They go to mommy and daddy government with their pockets of cash, forcing all new competition that would create much better, revolutionary ideas in their field to die, so they can stay on top with their slowly-advancing technology. Other companies do improve their ideas, at slow and unnecessary increments in order to justify selling what is practically the same product every year. We should be further along with some products for mass consumption, but greed is causing innovation to be stifled.

I propose that we allow Capitalism to kill itself in a glorious, spectacular death, through the rise of technology and a.i they can't resist. Allow themselves to be caught up in their own greed, causing us all to be unemployed, killing their own consumer base, and forcing the government to seize the means of production. Our perfected A.I will be able to effectively control portions of the resources to best allocate goods and services to us, so we may all live an enjoyable, prosperous life, full of no work, all play, and mastery of the arts and sciences.

Comrades, rejoice, the pains that Capitalism brings will soon be over. Capitalism is like the mother in labor, and communism her child. It will be painful, but once the baby is birthed, we will see the most beautiful child, one that is even better than the mother. It will make its mother obsolete, and take over the laborous work that once she had to do.
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Capitalism is a neet.
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What rules of capitalism can be exploited?

I have a good or service, that I trade to you for an agreed to good or service.

THAT'S IT. Capitalism.
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https://www.economist.com/leaders/2013/06/01/towards-the-end-of-poverty

https://ourworldindata.org/extreme-poverty

https://www.amazon.com/Enlightenment-Now-Science-Humanism-Progress/dp/0525427570
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Even capitalists hate capitalism. They're always trying to control their market and kick the ladder out from under them since it's more profitable than competing.

Capitalism is the most free and fair economic system you can have.
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darkjedilink posted...

What rules of capitalism can be exploited?

I have a good or service, that I trade to you for an agreed to good or service.

THAT'S IT. Capitalism.

We see it every day. The leaders of Capitalists use their money to influence the government to do their bidding and cut out competition.
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The benefits of unfettered transnational capitalism do not outweigh the long term consequences, even if sweatshops reduce poverty.
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Damn_Underscore posted...

Capitalism is the most free and fair economic system you can have.

Nah, no longer. It doesn't promote true innovation, and it favors a small group of people than the majority.
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Some would argue it's been breaking down for more than a century, but go off sis.

Like these aren't hot takes, or cold takes. They really shouldn't even be considered takes. It's just observations of how capitalism tends to unevenly distribute power across class made by people for one-and-a-half centuries.
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There are very, very few countries in the world that are not capitalist.

Don't listen to Ronald Reagan. Just because there is minimum wage legislation and social welfare program doesn't mean you no longer have capitalism. You still do.
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MedeaLysistrata posted...

The benefits of unfettered transnational capitalism do not outweigh the long term consequences, even if sweatshops reduce poverty.

Which long-term consequences?
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Money in politics is an example of government regulation of capitalism. You'd rather have government regulation of capitalism than no government regulation right?
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frozenshock posted...

There are very, very few countries in the world that are not capitalist.

Don't listen to Ronald Reagan. Just because there is minimum wage legislation and social welfare program doesn't mean you no longer have capitalism. You still do.

and we are seeing that we are rewarding countries that are implementing many capitalist ideals such as China with power and influence, along with other countries like Saudi Arabia, and others.

They are a bane to social progress, and we are handing them the world economy on a silver platter due to greed.

It's time to stop the game of Capitalism, and go with a system that rewards people for promoting social justice and mastery of the arts and sciences.

Damn_Underscore posted...

Money in politics is an example of government regulation of capitalism. You'd rather have government regulation of capitalism than no government regulation right?

The fact that we need so much government interference in our capitalist society goes to show how flawed and breakable it is. I would rather have a society like Communism that at least can stick by its guns as long as you don't have the inefficiencies of organic human beings to get involved, which a future with A.I would bring us.
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Capitalism works. Crony capitalism is bad. Socialism is just shit and will destroy everything that is good.
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Damn_Underscore posted...

Money in politics is an example of government regulation of capitalism. You'd rather have government regulation of capitalism than no government regulation right?

Were that money being used to prop up regulations imposed by the government, you'd have a point. Instead that money is largely eroding regulations. Regulations in investment banking, regulations in consumer protection, regulation in waste management/disposal, regulation on how much money a single private entity can donate to a political campaign, etc.

Individual people like you and I don't benefit from those 'regulations' (or more accurately, the lack thereof). But who does benefit? The corporations with the capital to pay lobbyists and fund campaigns to elect government officials who are beholden to their private interests.
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we do benefit from deregulation sometimes, depending on what the regulations are and what the industry is.

example: the deregulation of airlines
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FLUFFYGERM posted...

MedeaLysistrata posted...

The benefits of unfettered transnational capitalism do not outweigh the long term consequences, even if sweatshops reduce poverty.

Which long-term consequences?

i just assume you will deny all of these but here goes:

- Stratification which leads to social unrest
- Environmental (broad)
- TNCs are less susceptible to state control, which is not bad in itself, but is bad when states are supposed to be the primary actors (although there are arguments that IT infrastructure is now the primary social actor so this is a long road to go down)

edit: fwiw the only hardline pro-capitalist i talk to about this stuff also thinks globalization is bad
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GreatEvilEmpire posted...

Capitalism works. Crony capitalism is bad. Socialism is just shit and will destroy everything that is good.

Societies that properly transition from Capitalist ideals, letting businesses take care of the people (which generally doesn't work, and will lead to Crony Capitalism 100% of the time) to Socialist ideals (making the general welfare of the people as the main concern) in a properly organized and timed manner are running laps around America. The people are happier, healthier, and more socially advanced than we are. Venezuela tried to rush it too quickly, and thus collapsed due to their own incompetence. If they slowly phased socialism in, they would have performed much better.

Not to mention, A.I will be able to better allocate resources without bias than any human being can.
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Damn_Underscore posted...

Capitalism is the most free and fair economic system you can have.

I agree. The harder you work, the more you should have to leave for your family. Thats why we are the land of the free
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PiOverlord posted...

Societies that properly transition from Capitalist ideals, letting businesses take care of the people (which generally doesn't work, and will lead to Crony Capitalism 100% of the time) to Socialist ideals (making the general welfare of the people as the main concern) in a properly organized and timed manner are running laps around America. The people are happier, healthier, and more socially advanced than we are. Venezuela tried to rush it too quickly, and thus collapsed due to their own incompetence. If they slowly phased socialism in, they would have performed much better.

It all eventually decays back into Feudalism anyway.

Communism cannot work in reality. Everyone has to want to have a communist society or it will fall apart. And that's why communist nations have so many of its citizens imprisoned/beaten/killed.
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This is why we should switch to double-capitalism.
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southcoast09 posted...

Damn_Underscore posted...

Capitalism is the most free and fair economic system you can have.

I agree. The harder you work, the more you should have to leave for your family. Thats why we are the land of the free

This is also true of scandinavian countries you know.
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I know this is a joke topic but

I enjoy eating meat so no thanks
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Damn_Underscore posted...

Communism cannot work in reality. Everyone has to want to have a communist society or it will fall apart. And that's why communist nations have so many of its citizens imprisoned/beaten/killed.

In the future, it will not matter because machinery and a.i that makes us organic humans obsolete will be able to work more efficiently for the nation than we ever could. We will prosper with greater luxuries than capitalism will provide (technology will be as advanced as it should be, not as advanced as corporations want them to be so they can hold back features for next year's product, and so on and so forth), and will be able to have virtually limitless free time. Big Pharma will no longer be in control of our health, pollution will be curbed significantly so the air we breathe will be natural as it should be, and the people will be happier because they aren't restricted in time with the 40 hour weeks (and typically more) that they have to give up, which actually leads to even less time with all the prep that goes into work, and stuff. We will be a perfect, utopian society.
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hollow_shrine posted...

Damn_Underscore posted...

Money in politics is an example of government regulation of capitalism. You'd rather have government regulation of capitalism than no government regulation right?

Were that money being used to prop up regulations imposed by the government, you'd have a point. Instead that money is largely eroding regulations.

It doesn't matter. Politicians influence the exact form of capitalism in the US - that is government regulation of capitalism. They could refuse money and gifts from lobbyists but they don't.
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Drowning__Fish_ posted...

I know this is a joke topic but

I enjoy eating meat so no thanks

Just because you are brainwashed by your education to believe that communism is flawed, that doesn't mean everyone who believes the truth about it is some sort of joke.
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Regulatory capture is the inevitable outcome of capitalism.
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ImTheMacheteGuy posted...

This is why we should switch to double-capitalism.

so... fascism is what you want
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PiOverlord posted...

darkjedilink posted...

What rules of capitalism can be exploited?

I have a good or service, that I trade to you for an agreed to good or service.

THAT'S IT. Capitalism.

We see it every day. The leaders of Capitalists use their money to influence the government to do their bidding and cut out competition.

That's literally not capitalism. It's actually a quasi-socialist setup.
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FLUFFYGERM posted...

we do benefit from deregulation sometimes, depending on what the regulations are and what the industry is.

example: the deregulation of airlines

Sometimes, but more often than not, deregulation causes more harm than good.
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Given that humans are inherently greedy, it is the only system that will work for the time being. Expecting humans on the whole to take care of each other without incentive is a pipe dream.

darkjedilink posted...

PiOverlord posted...

darkjedilink posted...

What rules of capitalism can be exploited?

I have a good or service, that I trade to you for an agreed to good or service.

THAT'S IT. Capitalism.

We see it every day. The leaders of Capitalists use their money to influence the government to do their bidding and cut out competition.

That's literally not capitalism. It's actually a quasi-socialist setup.

It's the only thing Capitalism can go to. In theory, it is okay I guess. In practice, Capitalism doesn't work, and never has.

nemu posted...

Given that humans are inherently greedy, it is the only system that will work for the time being. Expecting humans on the whole to take care of each other without incentive is a pipe dream.

That is why I said we are not socially and technologically advanced enough. We are getting there though, and soon we will be able to sit back and relax in our communist society.
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*The Unites States is the wealthiest and most powerful country in the world*

"Capitalism isn't working! We should convert to communism like the USSR did before they collapsed and stopped existing. It just makes sense."
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16-BITTER posted...

PiOverlord posted...

Capitalism doesn't work, and never has.

I got my paycheck yesterday. Bought some food today. Seems like it's working to me.

After wasting away 40 inefficient hours slaving away to some guy who would sooner shoot you in the middle of the street than pay you fairly for the work you provided.

Capitalism wastes our most precious resource greater than any other economic structure, our time.
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Orlando_Jordan posted...

*The Unites States is the wealthiest and most powerful country in the world*

"Capitalism isn't working! We should convert to communism like the USSR did before they collapsed and stopped existing. It just makes sense."

A few people control most of the wealth and nearly all the power. The common man like me and you...we are left with nothing. That isn't a working society, that is a greedy society that will sooner break down than what I propose. Slowly advance technology, let capitalism strangle itself, and use the technology to create a much more efficient communist society that cares about us, and gives us all equal power.
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16-BITTER posted...

PiOverlord posted...

After wasting away 40 inefficient hours slaving away to some guy who would sooner shoot you in the middle of the street than pay you fairly for the work you provided.

46

"Fairly" You're advocating for communism, you don't even know what that word means.

Literally wasted 46 hours (not including commute, the time necessary to mentally and physically prepare for your workday, and time necessary to mentally and physically unwind from the day) for unfair compensation. Money isn't the only benefit you can receive. The time given for practically the same standard of living (actually better as I outlined before) is much greater than whatever money you would receive. And instead of going for something as unfulfilling as money, you can work for mastery of skills and arts, something a lot more satisfying than money.
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Capitalism was never intended to benefit the many, but rather the few and if it consequentially benefits the many then adjustments would be made to change that.
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gunplagirl posted...

Capitalism was never intended to benefit the many, but rather the few and if it consequentially benefits the many then adjustments would be made to change that.

At first it did benefit us, giving us advanced improvements on ideas to give us greater technology and services. Companies then realized they could withhold many improvements for future releases to make more cash, and from there capitalism has failed us.
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PiOverlord posted...

Orlando_Jordan posted...

*The Unites States is the wealthiest and most powerful country in the world*

"Capitalism isn't working! We should convert to communism like the USSR did before they collapsed and stopped existing. It just makes sense."

A few people control most of the wealth and nearly all the power. The common man like me and you...we are left with nothing. That isn't a working society, that is a greedy society that will sooner break down than what I propose. Slowly advance technology, let capitalism strangle itself, and use the technology to create a much more efficient communist society that cares about us, and gives us all equal power.

Face it, capitalism rewards those who are intelligent, hard-working, and adaptable. Why should NEETs be coddled? Communism is just going to reward people who are drains on society.
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How do doctors work in a communist society? There will always be some people who will do it out of the goodness of their hearts, but that is a super small number of people. If everyone is in the same position economically, what incentive is there to spend years and years studying compared to just chilling out in some menial position?

nemu posted...

How do doctors work in a communist society? There will always be some people who will do it out of the goodness of their hearts, but that is a super small number of people. If everyone is in the same position economically, what incentive is there to spend years and years studying compared to just chilling out in some menial position?

A.I and other machinery will be able to replace many of the jobs we require from our doctors and nurses now. Organic humans will be largely unnecessary.
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@gunplagirl posted...

Capitalism was never intended to benefit the many, but rather the few and if it consequentially benefits the many then adjustments would be made to change that.

https://www.economist.com/leaders/2013/06/01/towards-the-end-of-poverty

https://ourworldindata.org/extreme-poverty

https://www.amazon.com/Enlightenment-Now-Science-Humanism-Progress/dp/0525427570
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Orlando_Jordan posted...

PiOverlord posted...

Orlando_Jordan posted...

*The Unites States is the wealthiest and most powerful country in the world*

"Capitalism isn't working! We should convert to communism like the USSR did before they collapsed and stopped existing. It just makes sense."

A few people control most of the wealth and nearly all the power. The common man like me and you...we are left with nothing. That isn't a working society, that is a greedy society that will sooner break down than what I propose. Slowly advance technology, let capitalism strangle itself, and use the technology to create a much more efficient communist society that cares about us, and gives us all equal power.

Face it, capitalism rewards those who are intelligent, hard-working, and adaptable. Why should NEETs be coddled? Communism is just going to reward people who are drains on society.

Capitalism rewards many who are born into wealthy families who get resources you and I could never dream of. Congrats, you got into Harvard...after being given the best resources available, and having previous family so they give you unfair admission based on family history and wealth rather than actual skill.
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PiOverlord posted...

nemu posted...

How do doctors work in a communist society? There will always be some people who will do it out of the goodness of their hearts, but that is a super small number of people. If everyone is in the same position economically, what incentive is there to spend years and years studying compared to just chilling out in some menial position?

A.I and other machinery will be able to replace many of the jobs we require from our doctors and nurses now. Organic humans will be largely unnecessary.

For menial jobs, yes, but we are hundreds of years away from automated doctors. If we're just barely getting to the point of automated driving being commonplace, it will be a while before we can trust a machine to transplant a heart. The best we can do right now is provide machines to help them.

PiOverlord posted...

gunplagirl posted...

Capitalism was never intended to benefit the many, but rather the few and if it consequentially benefits the many then adjustments would be made to change that.

At first it did benefit us, giving us advanced improvements on ideas to give us greater technology and services. Companies then realized they could withhold many improvements for future releases to make more cash, and from there capitalism has failed us.

*shrugs and points at printing press not being motivated by money, widespread increase of some basic levels of literacy, points at lowest literacy rates in generations in the US* I get what you're saying but there's so much nuance to be aware of
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nemu posted...

PiOverlord posted...

nemu posted...

How do doctors work in a communist society? There will always be some people who will do it out of the goodness of their hearts, but that is a super small number of people. If everyone is in the same position economically, what incentive is there to spend years and years studying compared to just chilling out in some menial position?

A.I and other machinery will be able to replace many of the jobs we require from our doctors and nurses now. Organic humans will be largely unnecessary.

For menial jobs, yes, but we are hundreds of years away from automated doctors. If we're just barely getting to the point of automated driving being commonplace, it will be a while before we can trust a machine to transplant a heart. The best we can do right now is provide machines to help them.

The advancement of technology like A.I is growing at an exponential rate. Don't use linear models to describe where A.I will be. Our brains will be dissected and replicated in a much more advanced, efficient way than we could ever dream of. They will quickly make us obsolete, and it will happen before we even realized they could get that far.
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