Current Events > Haste>All, Regen>All, Wall>All

(+) Yeah! (+)

Any boss is now fucked
---

Haste is the best spell there is.
---

Until they cast some stupid "removes all buffs" skill or drain your mana
---

nikko004 posted...

Until they cast some stupid "removes all buffs" skill or drain your mana

Bosses be shady af
---

*boss spams attacks that deal set numbers for damage, abilities that inflict multiple debuffs like stun and slow in a single hit and that ignore status resistance, and as they near death, attacks with one skill that if unmitigated deals max damage, or half of the damage cap if mitigated*
---

I like how all bosses are immune to status ailments.

oh wait, no I don't because it makes them useless.
---

lilORANG posted...

I like how all bosses are immune to status ailments.

oh wait, no I don't because it makes them useless.

I like when a Phoenix down kills dead guys, always cool
---

lilORANG posted...

I like how all bosses are immune to status ailments.

oh wait, no I don't because it makes them useless.

Also, every enemy susceptible to them should die too quickly for them to matter. And if a boss is vulnerable to any, it's something like

"Reflect counts as a debuff in the final fantasy series and therefore this boss IS able to suffer from a debuff."
---

Seriously. Why even have status spells if you can't use them against bosses? If you can beat the boss without using them, do you really need them for the small fries?
---

>not casting Big Guard instead

lmao TC
---

NeonOctopus posted...

>not casting Big Guard instead

lmao TC

---

lilORANG posted...

I like how all bosses are immune to status ailments.

oh wait, no I don't because it makes them useless.

The bosses in Grandia 2 aren't, and it makes every fight trivial.
---

Caution998 posted...

NeonOctopus posted...

>not casting Big Guard instead

lmao TC

---

imagine if haste could stack
---

FF7?

ff12?

A lot of bosses are vulnerable to slow. Don't forget that one.
---

~ Wastes 3 turns buffing characters

~ Boss casts spells that removes all buffs in just that one turn

*rage, rage, rage against the machine*
---

saspa posted...

~ Wastes 3 turns buffing characters

~ Boss casts spells that removes all buffs in just that one turn

*rage, rage, rage against the machine*

Every. Boss. Ever.
---

Haste is when you're on the offensive
Regen and wall are for defensive sissies
*runs away*
---

Haste is when you're on the offensive
Regen and wall are for defensive sissies
*runs away*

Haste helps on both offense and defense, tbh. More hits compared to your opponent but also, if the opponent goes on a frenzy and attacks twenty times in close succession, it might only be ten if you have haste, giving you more opportunity to heal.

This is what makes haste the best spell. Whatever you need to do, it makes you do it better.
---

Shotgunnova posted...

Caution998 posted...

NeonOctopus posted...

>not casting Big Guard instead

lmao TC

---

lilORANG posted...

I like how all bosses are immune to status ailments.

oh wait, no I don't because it makes them useless.

Well, in the games where they aren't immune (FFIV and I Am Setsuna, for example) status ailments are completely broken.

But yeah, I never bother casting defensive buffs like regen and wall. I'll cast auto-revive though >_>
---

And then the boss has Heartless Angel and Ultima set to cast on death.
---

nikko004 posted...

Until they cast some stupid "removes all buffs" skill or drain your mana

In FF4:The After Years there is a fight with Mysterious Girl and Bahamut. Bahamut does his countdown from 5 like always, except right before it goes off, Mysterious Girls gets an automatic pre-empt and uses the Black Hole move (same as Zeromus) which dispells any reflects you put up so you get hit with the full force of the megaflare it fucking sucks omg. It's not a "forced defeat" fight either. you have to actually survive and win by attacking.
---

DevsBro posted...

Seriously. Why even have status spells if you can't use them against bosses? If you can beat the boss without using them, do you really need them for the small fries?

The gameplay mechanics in FF were pretty bad when it came to this stuff. Individual battles were designed in a grindy way that emphasized dealing maximum damage as quickly as possible to end them, and boss battles usually made status ailments ineffective. There was very little tactical or strategic use in the game at all. There were also certain spells/attacks that were always so much better than others that the inferior choices had no point in the game.
---

The Admiral posted...

DevsBro posted...

Seriously. Why even have status spells if you can't use them against bosses? If you can beat the boss without using them, do you really need them for the small fries?

The gameplay mechanics in FF were pretty bad when it came to this stuff. Individual battles were designed in a grindy way that emphasized dealing maximum damage as quickly as possible to end them, and boss battles usually made status ailments ineffective. There was very little tactical or strategic use in the game at all. There were also certain spells/attacks that were always so much better than others that the inferior choices had no point in the game.

this trend has decreased over time. FF12, 13, and 14 are all pretty heavy and even generous on using statuses on bosses. FF8 also had doomtrain which puts statuses on bosses as well.

Not sure about 15 since I haven't played it yet.
---

What if there were a system where statuses were weaker against bosses? Like casting Stop only made bosses Slow? or they took half/quarter poison damage?
---

Or what if they do like in Child of Light, where casting more effective statuses takes more time, and if you're hit while casting, it skips your turn?

That way if you try to cast instant death on the boss, he's obviously going to hit you to save his hide... uuuuuuunless you cast haste on the caster and slow on the boss, and also bait him into casting his own lengthy spell to waste time.
---

Full buff dispel is my least favorite boss move in FFXI after Death. Hell, more than Death if its AoE and Im on a support.
---

You're basically describing why the old Final Fantasy battle system was a failure and is largely rejected nowadays. If you're going to go the turn-based route, battles need to have actual strategy and likely be far longer (and less numerous) than they are in most Final Fantasy games. If not, then ditch the turn system for an action-RPG style like the Ys games, which take the tedium out of grinding and don't let you level up by literally putting a rubber band on the controller (e.g. Lethe River trick in FF6).
---

just have every turn based game use the SMT3 press turn system

where you actually get punished for fucking up
---

Garioshi posted...

imagine if haste could stack

In FFIV there's several levels of slow.

Spiders silk or whatever the item is called has a 100% stick rate if it isn't fully resisted (100% immunity), will automatically land the highest level of slow possible.

This is especially useful in FFIV TAY because it's easy to acquire two or three stacks, if not in the chapter they first can be bought in, then the "everyone comes together" chapter. Can't buy any in the final chapter. But even one stack should be enough to defeat every super boss plus the two or three formations of enemies that can potentially wipe the party as you arrive on mid level floors.
---

The Admiral posted...

DevsBro posted...

Seriously. Why even have status spells if you can't use them against bosses? If you can beat the boss without using them, do you really need them for the small fries?

The gameplay mechanics in FF were pretty bad when it came to this stuff. Individual battles were designed in a grindy way that emphasized dealing maximum damage as quickly as possible to end them, and boss battles usually made status ailments ineffective. There was very little tactical or strategic use in the game at all. There were also certain spells/attacks that were always so much better than others that the inferior choices had no point in the game.

I is definitely grindy, the fact they have such a high encounter rate was because they expected you to flee from most fights anyways.
II is grindy for sure.
III can be abused to gain job levels fast, just defend 3-4 times as most jobs and every fight or two you'll level up that job. But even without doing that, you'll still gain sufficient levels if you do most fights (nes) or all fights (DS remake versions)
IV isn't grindy at all until possibly the tower of babil or lunar ruins. The levels characters join at is what the devs expected you to be at and enemies stats reflect that. I've had edge join 3 levels higher than me before and only had one hard fight before then and it was a trap chest that summoned a dragon.
V is grindy because abilities. But actually rewards you even with minor investments.
VI, not terribly grindy to be able to get to end game, grindy to beat.
VII, oh god the grind. You're either too weak or too strong.
VIII, never grind exp, do grind cards. Pretty much mandatory to do so if you beat enemies regularly and level up, as well. :(
IX, doesn't really punish you for not grinding as long as you get certain cote skills.
X, don't need to grind if you know how to break the game. Otherwise, helps but isn't necessary until (once again) the end.
XII... Grinding for those rare drops in vanilla, grinding for drops for money in izjs, grinding for cp in tza
XIII. I hate everything about this game and the fact you need to grind every chapter without exception is part of it
XV doesn't need to be grinded too badly but only if you are willing to invest in magic skills to boost them over and over. The super bosses are total bs even if you grind levels like heck. Its like if you had a sponge wall that was encased by death slime armor.

Obviously the MMOs are grind fests, gotta keep the power creep up and keep people subbing somehow.
---

s0nicfan posted...

lilORANG posted...

I like how all bosses are immune to status ailments.

oh wait, no I don't because it makes them useless.

The bosses in Grandia 2 aren't, and it makes every fight trivial.

Yeah then it ends up like FF13 where you can poison stall the final boss
---

In FF9 theres a boss that you can use a tent on and it inflicts blind, poison and silence (IIRC) on it lol
---

The_Juice_ posted...

s0nicfan posted...

lilORANG posted...

I like how all bosses are immune to status ailments.

oh wait, no I don't because it makes them useless.

The bosses in Grandia 2 aren't, and it makes every fight trivial.

Yeah then it ends up like FF13 where you can poison stall the final boss

You mean the super boss? Because the final boss uses doom.
---

Most of the FFs really sucked with buffs and debuffs making them mostly useless but there are a couple that actually integrated more than Haste into their system well. Tactics, 10, and 12 come to mind---even on (or even especially on) bosses. I hear 13 did as well, but I hated that one so I stopped playing it. The earlier ones really didn't benefit from the status effect games much at all but they started getting better with it later on.
---

this is why i like DnD and games based off DnD

status effects DO work on bosses, but require you to stack supporting debuffs first to break their superior saves

buffs are not clearly superior 100% of the time
---

Generally it's actually magic stomping int he beginning and then physical at the end when all of your damage reaches the damage cap because physical attacks are quicker and resource-less.
---

Vanish + Doom
---