Current Events > Racists preferentially pull out the free speech argument.

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COVxy
09/05/17 7:57:55 PM
#1:


For hate speech over other instances of angry speech with consequences.

http://psycnet.apa.org/record/2017-17075-001

People, in general, use free speech as an unprincipled argument, it seems.
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averagejoel
09/05/17 7:59:36 PM
#2:


no way
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Smashingpmkns
09/05/17 8:00:19 PM
#3:


Freedom of Speech doesn't mean freedom of consequence. Conversation should end there.
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Kineth
09/05/17 8:01:04 PM
#4:


Let's see how many shitlords will argue against this.
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NINExATExSEVEN
09/05/17 8:03:33 PM
#5:


I can't load the link. What's it about?
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COVxy
09/05/17 8:05:42 PM
#6:


NINExATExSEVEN posted...
I can't load the link. What's it about?

Do claims of “free speech” provide cover for prejudice? We investigate whether this defense of racist or hate speech serves as a justification for prejudice. In a series of 8 studies (N = 1,624), we found that explicit racial prejudice is a reliable predictor of the “free speech defense” of racist expression. Participants endorsed free speech values for singing racists songs or posting racist comments on social media; people high in prejudice endorsed free speech more than people low in prejudice (meta-analytic r = .43). This endorsement was not principled—high levels of prejudice did not predict endorsement of free speech values when identical speech was directed at coworkers or the police. Participants low in explicit racial prejudice actively avoided endorsing free speech values in racialized conditions compared to nonracial conditions, but participants high in racial prejudice increased their endorsement of free speech values in racialized conditions. Three experiments failed to find evidence that defense of racist speech by the highly prejudiced was based in self-relevant or self-protective motives. Two experiments found evidence that the free speech argument protected participants’ own freedom to express their attitudes; the defense of other’s racist speech seems motivated more by threats to autonomy than threats to self-regard. These studies serve as an elaboration of the Justification-Suppression Model (Crandall & Eshleman, 2003) of prejudice expression. The justification of racist speech by endorsing fundamental political values can serve to buffer racial and hate speech from normative disapproval. (PsycINFO Database Record (c) 2017 APA, all rights reserved)
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COVxy
09/05/17 8:07:26 PM
#7:


I'll look into unpaywalling it when I get home.
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NINExATExSEVEN
09/05/17 8:09:39 PM
#8:


So essentially you have free speech afforded to you in America but don't act like you can say anything and not get in trouble?

Sounds legit.
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The Admiral
09/05/17 8:10:53 PM
#9:


COVxy posted...
Participants low in explicit racial prejudice actively avoided endorsing free speech values in racialized conditions compared to nonracial conditions, but participants high in racial prejudice increased their endorsement of free speech values in racialized conditions.


Basically people on both sides use free speech arguments when it suits the type of speech they support. Not only should this be common sense, I'm not sure why you and the paper go with the clickbait-ish title that only calls out one side for that behavior.
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Kineth
09/05/17 8:12:00 PM
#10:


2 so far.
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COVxy
09/05/17 8:13:40 PM
#11:


The Admiral posted...
COVxy posted...
Participants low in explicit racial prejudice actively avoided endorsing free speech values in racialized conditions compared to nonracial conditions, but participants high in racial prejudice increased their endorsement of free speech values in racialized conditions.


Basically people on both sides use free speech arguments when it suits the type of speech they support. Not only should this be common sense, I'm not sure why you and the paper go with the clickbait-ish title that only calls out one side for that behavior.


Because it's primarily what they found, because of the study design. I clarified in my post.
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Zikten
09/05/17 8:13:53 PM
#12:


Smashingpmkns posted...
Freedom of Speech doesn't mean freedom of consequence. Conversation should end there.

anti free speech people love to say this. you think you should be allowed to punch someone just cause you don't like what they say. well fine. but freedom of punching doesn't mean freedom of consequence either. punch and go to prison. and see how fun prison is and decide if it was worth the punch.


and no, I am for free speech in all cases. it's just that racism is the only time these days free speech ever comes up in discussion. but I support ALL free expression.
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That_Happened
09/05/17 8:21:27 PM
#13:


Zikten posted...
anti free speech people love to say this. you think you should be allowed to punch someone just cause you don't like what they say. well fine. but freedom of punching doesn't mean freedom of consequence either. punch and go to prison. and see how fun prison is and decide if it was worth the punch.

I think most people agree with this. That there are consequences to both actions. I always thought the argument was "don't be surprised if you get punched for acting like a bitch", not "it should be legal to punch others."
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Smashingpmkns
09/05/17 8:22:52 PM
#14:


Zikten posted...
Smashingpmkns posted...
Freedom of Speech doesn't mean freedom of consequence. Conversation should end there.

anti free speech people love to say this. you think you should be allowed to punch someone just cause you don't like what they say. well fine. but freedom of punching doesn't mean freedom of consequence either. punch and go to prison. and see how fun prison is and decide if it was worth the punch.


and no, I am for free speech in all cases. it's just that racism is the only time these days free speech ever comes up in discussion. but I support ALL free expression.


I never said punching them is even a good response, nice jumping to conclusions. But I do not feel bad for them getting ostracized from their communities or fired from their jobs for hate speech. If people/employers don't want to associate with you because you have toxic ideologies then that is their right to cut you loose.
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Axiom
09/05/17 8:23:08 PM
#15:


This is just common sense. I mean just take a look at the people who cry incorrectly "free speech" whenever someone is punished for saying/doing something racist on social media or the like
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That_Happened
09/05/17 8:23:13 PM
#16:


NINExATExSEVEN posted...
So essentially you have free speech afforded to you in America but don't act like you can say anything and not get in trouble?


Free speech means the government can't punish you. It has nothing to do with how other people respond to your speech though: your job, for example. But I'm sure you've already heard this.
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I4NRulez
09/05/17 8:25:15 PM
#17:


NINExATExSEVEN posted...
So essentially you have free speech afforded to you in America but don't act like you can say anything and not get in trouble?

Sounds legit.


Its so you can question things in the country without the government censoring you or punishing you for it.

but there's limit and your public employer can fire you if what you're saying impedes with their rules and values.
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That_Happened
09/05/17 8:27:28 PM
#18:


The Admiral posted...
Basically people on both sides use free speech arguments when it suits the type of speech they support.

Yes, both sides. Racists and people who are not racist. Why are they only calling out the racists for their behavior, when the people who are not racist are saying....what exactly? "Hello?" "Lovely day we're having?"
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Smashingpmkns
09/05/17 8:29:14 PM
#19:


That_Happened posted...
The Admiral posted...
Basically people on both sides use free speech arguments when it suits the type of speech they support.

Yes, both sides. Racists and people who are not racist. Why are they only calling out the racists for their behavior, when the people who are not racist are saying....what exactly? "Hello?" "Lovely day we're having?"


Funny how the study says nothing about party alignment but they just assume... wonder why
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Kineth
09/05/17 10:51:18 PM
#20:


Good that the cockroaches ran.
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COVxy
09/05/17 11:06:14 PM
#21:


http://docdro.id/HCd7QXq

Full text.
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Annihilated
09/05/17 11:13:03 PM
#22:


Smashingpmkns posted...
That_Happened posted...
The Admiral posted...
Basically people on both sides use free speech arguments when it suits the type of speech they support.

Yes, both sides. Racists and people who are not racist. Why are they only calling out the racists for their behavior, when the people who are not racist are saying....what exactly? "Hello?" "Lovely day we're having?"


Funny how the study says nothing about party alignment but they just assume... wonder why


I always assume that the racists in question are SJWs. I sometimes forget that conservatives in some cases can also be racist.
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That_Happened
09/05/17 11:15:32 PM
#23:


Annihilated posted...

I always assume that the racists in question are SJWs. I sometimes forget that conservatives in some cases can also be racist.

Haha, awww you tried.
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NibeIungsnarf
09/05/17 11:15:33 PM
#24:


Of course free-speech provides cover for prejudice. That's literally rhe definition of free speech (among other things).

Something I really hate from modern day leftwingers is this notion that anything that the KKK can use as well as the common man can is bad.
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DrizztLink
09/05/17 11:16:27 PM
#25:


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CADE FOSTER
09/05/17 11:17:48 PM
#26:


They have the right to free hate speech but then the other side has the right to out them and get them publicly shamed
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Kineth
09/06/17 12:08:46 PM
#27:


Amazing that my first post got modded for flaming.
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ChromaticAngel
09/06/17 12:26:55 PM
#28:


NibeIungsnarf posted...
Of course free-speech provides cover for prejudice. That's literally rhe definition of free speech


No it's not.

The point of free speech is to protect civilians from anti-sedition laws.

It is not, and never was a license to spew fascist bullshit.
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Solar_Crimson
09/06/17 12:32:58 PM
#29:


Axiom posted...
This is just common sense. I mean just take a look at the people who cry incorrectly "free speech" whenever someone is punished for saying/doing something racist on social media or the like

Yep. It's very telling how the people who are so about free speech are the ones who use said free speech to make racist/sexist/homophobic/etc. remarks and then get triggered when people call them out on it.
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