Board 8 > How to Escape the Friendzone

(+) Yeah! (+)

I don't parrot anyone. I generally read more about this subject than any of the people you listed.

--
We can't stop here. This is bat country.
Brace for the G's, and fast heel-toe work.

Careful observation (by which I mean thinking about it for maybe a third of a second) reveals that on board 8, any topic featuring the words "alpha", "beta", or "friend zone" in the title are three times as likely as other topics to suck.

--
We clasped our hands, our hands in praise of a conquerors right to tyranny

Also, read that CNN article but flop the genders and then try to imagine the reaction to it.

--
We can't stop here. This is bat country.
Brace for the G's, and fast heel-toe work.

ExThaNemesis posted...

there's nothing wrong with guys in the friendzone other than their inability to grasp the facets of attraction. A girl collects beta orbiters because it allows her to soak in male attention and affection without having to reciprocate.

http://thechart.blogs.cnn.com/2012/06/14/every-woman-needs-a-gaggle-of-men/#comments

they call it a gaggle now, and CNN and other major media outlets are literally advising women to snag as many beta orbiters as possible.

I mean, the word "gaggle" makes me inherently not take this too seriously, but this basically talks about the line between "friend" and "sexual partner", and how it's blurring.

Just out of curiosity, is there a difference between this and a guy who has multiple female sexual partners to you?

From: yoshifan823 | #055

Just out of curiosity, is there a difference between this and a guy who has multiple female sexual partners to you?

Yeah. A guy with multiple sexual partners is going to be much happier!

--
We can't stop here. This is bat country.
Brace for the G's, and fast heel-toe work.

[This message was deleted at the request of the original poster]

From: yoshifan823 | Posted: 6/19/2012 10:41:25 PM | #045

Swifticuffs posted...

Two of my best friends are women. I don't see how it's being antisocial to not want to be friendzoned. If we get off our highhorses and stop thinking on this "deep" level like you're trying to think, life boils down to reproduction with a healthy mate. Healthy mate is someone hot. That's why when you go walking down the street and see a hot girl, the first thing a normal dude thinks is "wow i'd like to bone that chick." Which is also why when you fail to get that to transpire, you usually don't stick around because nine times out of ten the chick doesn't have much in common with the average male. I don't see what's fun about sitting through hours of drama 24/7 and just being reminded of not being able to tap something hot.

But way to automatically assume someone doesn't like hanging out with women entirely just because he doesn't like drama the hot ones produce. Maybe you need to grow up a bit more even moreso from your 15-17 year old days as you described up above.

That or get off the high horse that every net kid goes through at some time of life. Things are realllllyy simple.

I guess this is where we differ. Life is a lot more than just "reproduction with a healthy mate". We are not cavemen. People can want to be with someone for reasons other than physical attractiveness, and even then, you can not want to reproduce. There's careers, there's fulfilling life events, there are all sorts of things that people want things that don't just boil down to that.

bro who are you telling? i'm so far against marriage and having kids. But the point is I have enough intellect to understand that we as humans have painted this bigass picture of "love" and made things super complex. It boils down to what I said, end of story. It doesn't mean we're cavemen if we still understand where we came from and how all other mammals (or most I guess) act and why. Take control of that, but don't turn into one of these modern day hippies who buys into this whole love and perfect match and stuff. Wanting to be with someone outside of physical attractiveness sure... personality is boss, so is having some things in common. But let's say you do want kids? Let's say you do want to marry someone... looks are friggen' important. do you want an ugly ass kid so he can be made fun of forever? lol. do you want to get bored of your lover in 5 years and just have another typical divorce like the american population has become riddled with? Looks are damn important.

And yes, women are people. And from what I've seen, no matter where I go in whatever state I've been to, the hotter the girl, the more drama there is We've already detailed what that is... it doesn't mean women aren't people, it means the hot ones who need to be treated like princesses 24/7 (and I'm talking hot, my standards are high. these ones are usually complete pains.) aren't my idea of fun to be friends with. It's why my female friends are average or ugly. I don't want hot female friends, i want to screw the hot females I bump into. Otherwise see you later unless you have the greatest personality ever, like my uglier girlfriends have, and I've yet to encounter many that way. They're usually pre-Madonnas with nothing in common with me and I don't got time for it.

--
*~Swift~*

ExThaNemesis posted...

From: yoshifan823 | #055

Just out of curiosity, is there a difference between this and a guy who has multiple female sexual partners to you?

Yeah. A guy with multiple sexual partners is going to be much happier!

I meant between a man with multiple sexual partners and a woman with multiple sexual partners, but this brings up an interesting point. You immediately assume that any guy in this situation is going to be only having sex with that one woman? How do we know any of the guys in this situation don't think the same way?

Swifticuffs posted...

bro who are you telling? i'm so far against marriage and having kids. But the point is I have enough intellect to understand that we as humans have painted this bigass picture of "love" and made things super complex. It boils down to what I said, end of story. It doesn't mean we're cavemen if we still understand where we came from and how all other mammals (or most I guess) act and why. Take control of that, but don't turn into one of these modern day hippies who buys into this whole love and perfect match and stuff. Wanting to be with someone outside of physical attractiveness sure... personality is boss, so is having some things in common. But let's say you do want kids? Let's say you do want to marry someone... looks are friggen' important. do you want an ugly ass kid so he can be made fun of forever? lol. do you want to get bored of your lover in 5 years and just have another typical divorce like the american population has become riddled with? Looks are damn important.

And yes, women are people. And from what I've seen, no matter where I go in whatever state I've been to, the hotter the girl, the more drama there is We've already detailed what that is... it doesn't mean women aren't people, it means the hot ones who need to be treated like princesses 24/7 (and I'm talking hot, my standards are high. these ones are usually complete pains.) aren't my idea of fun to be friends with. It's why my female friends are average or ugly. I don't want hot female friends, i want to screw the hot females I bump into. Otherwise see you later unless you have the greatest personality ever, like my uglier girlfriends have, and I've yet to encounter many that way. They're usually pre-Madonnas with nothing in common with me and I don't got time for it.

Then the problem isn't with their looks, it's with their attitude. You're judging all hot women before you really know them, assuming that they're all high maintenance and need to be treated like princesses 24/7. There are most definitely girls like that, but their attractiveness is pretty unrelated to it.

And I don't know about you, but people tend to get more or less attractive the more I learn about them. A girl who is really hot, but kinda shallow, personality-wise isn't going to be as attractive to me as someone who isn't quite as hot, but our personalities are much more in sync. I'm not going to want to stay with someone because they're physically attractive, because there's only so long you can look at someone and not see them for their personality. I'd much rather have someone I can spend time with and have fun with, and those are the marriages that last, not the ones where there's a hot girl involved. Those marriages end because the people just didn't have enough in common, and grew apart.

From: yoshifan823 | #058

How do we know any of the guys in this situation don't think the same way?

Because if they did, they wouldn't be sharing a chick with 7 other dudes

--
_foolmo_
'I love you so much' - SineNomine

foolm0ron posted...

From: yoshifan823 | #058

How do we know any of the guys in this situation don't think the same way?

Because if they did, they wouldn't be sharing a chick with 7 other dudes

So I'll ask you the same question. What's the difference between a girl who is having sex with multiple guys, and a guy who is having sex with multiple girls?

From: yoshifan823 | Posted: 6/19/2012 10:57:16 PM | #059

Swifticuffs posted...

bro who are you telling? i'm so far against marriage and having kids. But the point is I have enough intellect to understand that we as humans have painted this bigass picture of "love" and made things super complex. It boils down to what I said, end of story. It doesn't mean we're cavemen if we still understand where we came from and how all other mammals (or most I guess) act and why. Take control of that, but don't turn into one of these modern day hippies who buys into this whole love and perfect match and stuff. Wanting to be with someone outside of physical attractiveness sure... personality is boss, so is having some things in common. But let's say you do want kids? Let's say you do want to marry someone... looks are friggen' important. do you want an ugly ass kid so he can be made fun of forever? lol. do you want to get bored of your lover in 5 years and just have another typical divorce like the american population has become riddled with? Looks are damn important.

And yes, women are people. And from what I've seen, no matter where I go in whatever state I've been to, the hotter the girl, the more drama there is We've already detailed what that is... it doesn't mean women aren't people, it means the hot ones who need to be treated like princesses 24/7 (and I'm talking hot, my standards are high. these ones are usually complete pains.) aren't my idea of fun to be friends with. It's why my female friends are average or ugly. I don't want hot female friends, i want to screw the hot females I bump into. Otherwise see you later unless you have the greatest personality ever, like my uglier girlfriends have, and I've yet to encounter many that way. They're usually pre-Madonnas with nothing in common with me and I don't got time for it.

Then the problem isn't with their looks, it's with their attitude. You're judging all hot women before you really know them, assuming that they're all high maintenance and need to be treated like princesses 24/7. There are most definitely girls like that, but their attractiveness is pretty unrelated to it.

And I don't know about you, but people tend to get more or less attractive the more I learn about them. A girl who is really hot, but kinda shallow, personality-wise isn't going to be as attractive to me as someone who isn't quite as hot, but our personalities are much more in sync. I'm not going to want to stay with someone because they're physically attractive, because there's only so long you can look at someone and not see them for their personality. I'd much rather have someone I can spend time with and have fun with, and those are the marriages that last, not the ones where there's a hot girl involved. Those marriages end because the people just didn't have enough in common, and grew apart.

This has to be a joke right? I've said in my experiences and "usually." Not that every chick I've ever met who was hot had the personality of a squash or something to that extent. Jeez.

And of course people get more or less attractive the more you know about them. That's how you sculpt your perceptions of them. I met two hot girls at a bar last night. I could have boned the one if I stayed out later as she and her girlfriend asked me and some of my friends to follow them to their next destination for drinks... I thought the one girl was a complete flake, the one I'd have to pursue since my buddy was leaning towards the other. The second I saw her light up a cigarette I said forget it, and just did my own thing. The more we know, the more or less attractive someone may or may not become.

as for why marriages fall apart, it's usually a little of what you said coupled with cheating of some sort. Guess why people cheat? I promise you, it's not for someone with an amazing personality bud.

--
*~Swift~*

From: yoshifan823 | #061

So I'll ask you the same question. What's the difference between a girl who is having sex with multiple guys, and a guy who is having sex with multiple girls?

Nothing ethically, but again the guy is going to be much happier.

--
We can't stop here. This is bat country.
Brace for the G's, and fast heel-toe work.

From: yoshifan823 | #061

So I'll ask you the same question. What's the difference between a girl who is having sex with multiple guys, and a guy who is having sex with multiple girls?

I like extha's answer

Oh wait I see what your question is.
I mean if the girl likes banging a lot of dudes then that's fine, but usually a girl likes to stick with 1 guy, so she would probably eventually just choose one (or a completely separate guy, more likely) and abandon the rest, while the guy would be fine banging all of them.

--
_foolmo_
'It's easy to get yourself in trouble if you start quoting people who don't like you in your signature' - Mods

From: yoshifan823 | Posted: 6/19/2012 11:00:10 PM | #061

foolm0ron posted...

From: yoshifan823 | #058

How do we know any of the guys in this situation don't think the same way?

Because if they did, they wouldn't be sharing a chick with 7 other dudes

So I'll ask you the same question. What's the difference between a girl who is having sex with multiple guys, and a guy who is having sex with multiple girls?

the genitalia. Do some research on STDs to understand why women are frowned upon a bit more when it comes to this. Do some research on nether regions at that. Despite Keggle exercises and all that junk, a males stuff isn't gonna change from getting it in a lot. A girls will. Purity of a female is so much more important sometimes lo

--
*~Swift~*

and what ulti said isn't exactly wrong either

women do want the same thing men do. they just behave like yoshifan does here and try to paint this stupid picture to cover their tracks. It all boils down to wanting sex, period. No matter how awesome someone's personality is, the average person (someone with all their working senses) is gonna see someone first and make an initial judgement RIGHT THERE on looks. period. it's what matters most, women even think this way, they just try to act all entitled and paint it up all nice

so congrats yoshi, you're on the female level

--
*~Swift~*

From: Robazoid | Posted: 6/19/2012 11:07:21 PM | #067

See, just look at that

How is calling Ulti an 'alpha male' wrong?

(This is a good time to note that I'm putting alpha male in quotations)

there's nothing wrong with being an alpha male. it means you're born with or smart enough to get the qualities necessary to be successful in life. It doesn't only have to pertain to women.

--
*~Swift~*

See, just look at that

How is calling Ulti an 'alpha male' wrong?

(This is a good time to note that I'm putting alpha male in quotations)

EDIT: Oh you deleted that post earlier where you pissed yourself with laughter at the mere thought that Ulti was an 'alpha male'. Well, good then.

--
**R.O.B.A.Z.O.I.D**

My main issue was that you laughed and implied I was dumb or wrong for listing Ulti as an alpha male when I don't think he's posted anything in the last few months that wasn't in some way an attempt to make himself look alpha.

--
**R.O.B.A.Z.O.I.D**

Yoshi, have you ever heard of the 'selfish gene' theory?

Human beings really are driven by their libidos. It's nothing to be ashamed of.

--
Fast Falcon ate my bracket for dinner in the guru contest.

From: Robazoid | Posted: 6/19/2012 11:10:33 PM | #071

My main issue was that you laughed and implied I was dumb or wrong for listing Ulti as an alpha male when I don't think he's posted anything in the last few months that wasn't in some way an attempt to make himself look alpha.

ulti is one of my favorite buddies. it was a joke post to attempt to troll him/extha

i deleted it to not offend them because it's hard to get sarcasm out of a text read

--
*~Swift~*

"And this is why roissey is dumb. Him, and his followers, view women as inferior, existing solely to f***, and they spout horrible "biotruths" because they would like to convince themselves that they're better than other guys because "at least we admit it", when in fact, they're just dumb guys who view women as inferior, existing solely to f***. There's a huge strain of misogyny running through this entire group of people, just like their political counterparts, Men's Rights Activists. If it makes me appear weak to respect women as people in your eyes, I'll take it, because clearly your eyes are f***ed up."

So... This. Exactly this, all over again.

yeah you're hopeless lol

--
*~Swift~*

Yoshifan, if you weren't so busy plugging your ears and shrieking 'lalalala not true can't hear you!' you'd see that a lot of the stuff on heartise(what he's called now)'s website is about improving long term relationships, which is another area where game is a flat out necessity.

--
We can't stop here. This is bat country.
Brace for the G's, and fast heel-toe work.

From: yoshifan823 | #039

vcharon posted...

Hey, here's a word of advice yoshifan: Stop arguing about this topic on this board.

I know. I'm almost as dumb, because I think that with enough common sense and shame, these guys will change, when they need a lot more than that.

....Change what?


You said that the concept of the friend zone is flawed, then went ahead and described exactly how it happens, even saying it happened to you. Is it unhealthy? Maybe. But it's a thing and it exists, there's really nothing flawed about the concept. It happens to both guys and girls. It may happen to the people on this board, but it's not an issue that's unique to board 8ers or somethign.

Soooo I honestly have no idea what your point is here.

--
The batman villians all seem to be one big joke that batman refuses to laugh at - SantaRPG

CoolCly posted...

From: yoshifan823 | #039

vcharon posted...

Hey, here's a word of advice yoshifan: Stop arguing about this topic on this board.

I know. I'm almost as dumb, because I think that with enough common sense and shame, these guys will change, when they need a lot more than that.

....Change what?


You said that the concept of the friend zone is flawed, then went ahead and described exactly how it happens, even saying it happened to you. Is it unhealthy? Maybe. But it's a thing and it exists, there's really nothing flawed about the concept. It happens to both guys and girls. It may happen to the people on this board, but it's not an issue that's unique to board 8ers or somethign.

Soooo I honestly have no idea what your point is here.

That was aimed at the whole "roissey alpha/beta" crowd, not the friend zone thing.

Also, I don't think I can take any dude seriously with stuff like:

https://heartiste.wordpress.com/the-sixteen-commandments-of-poon/
https://heartiste.wordpress.com/dating-market-value-test-for-men/
https://heartiste.wordpress.com/dating-market-value-test-for-women/

It's just so hilariously off point that I can't help but laugh. If you can say "(C) ”This could be trouble ’cause I’m that kind of guy.” *smirk*" without laughing, and without a shred of irony, you are the problem. You will be laughed at, and mocked as soon as you go away. Which you will do without telling anyone, because you are mysterious and cool.

From: yoshifan823 | #079

You will be laughed at, and mocked as soon as you go away.

Ah, it all comes to this. Fear of rejection.

--
_foolmo_
'It's easy to get yourself in trouble if you start quoting people who don't like you in your signature' - Mods

yoshifan823 posted...

"And this is why roissey is dumb. Him, and his followers, view women as inferior, existing solely to f***, and they spout horrible "biotruths" because they would like to convince themselves that they're better than other guys because "at least we admit it", when in fact, they're just dumb guys who view women as inferior, existing solely to f***. There's a huge strain of misogyny running through this entire group of people, just like their political counterparts, Men's Rights Activists. If it makes me appear weak to respect women as people in your eyes, I'll take it, because clearly your eyes are f***ed up."

So... This. Exactly this, all over again.

Women are just as shallow as men, thus i do not "respect women" as a whole. Because guess what? I dont respect men as a whole either! Never lower self-respect for some girl's (or really anyone's) approval. I'm not saying you need to walk around being a total jackass, but never lose your self-respect.

The three things that just about all girls 18 to late 20s (the main demographic of what we are talking about here) place utmost importance on:
1) Age. If you are older than her, she'll be more interested
2) Money. If you make more money than her, she'll be interested
3) Height. If you are taller than her by a fair amount, she'll be interested

All three of those things to me are just as shallow as what men are interested in: looks, sex appeal, and how easy she is to get with. Yes, ill admit women are a bit less shallow in raw looks, but my god do you really think people in this topic are misogynists? Women as a whole are just as shallow and stupid.

So who cares if your goal is to have sex with as many as you want?

From: yoshifan823 | #079

If you can say "(C) ”This could be trouble ’cause I’m that kind of guy.” *smirk*" without laughing, and without a shred of irony, you are the problem.

Why is it okay for a girl to say something ridiculous and ham-fisted like "I'm not that kind of girl" but it's a problem if a guy responds with something equally ham-fisted?

--
_foolmo_
'You are obviously intelligent and insightful' - Sir Chris about me

Sigh. Why does any topic involving "alpha" / "beta" males always get so many posts?

--
Fire Emblem: Awakening has the best music ever. Listen to it \/
http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL68CA009923BACBEE&feature=plcp

The secret is to not actually date women. Dating is so bad.

--
Tornadoman78:
tornadoman and tornadogirl like to kick box each other in my tornaolayzers and she dosent even mind getting hit

From: Metal_DK | #081

So who cares if your goal is to have sex with as many as you want?

There's no problem at all with wanting to have lots of sex with lots of people, the only issue I have is how often the associated attitude tends to come across as less "most people, men or women, are after sex, let's just go **** each other and who cares about everything else?" and more "women are useless for anything other than having sex". Board 8 is usually pretty good about not going outright into the latter category, but board 8 is also not the only place these discussions show up.

--
Mistake you're making - overlooking the fact that we might not want to be saved.

foolm0ron posted...

From: yoshifan823 | #079

You will be laughed at, and mocked as soon as you go away.

Ah, it all comes to this. Fear of rejection.

It's not fear of rejection. If I acted like the ideal guy in that dumb test, rejection would happen. A lot. Because normal people do not act that way. If you're putting on some facade for the purpose of getting laid, the smarter girls are gonna notice, and you are left with the ones who don't know better. And they're generally not worth it, in my eyes. If your sole purpose for going out is to find a girl to sleep with, then that might work, but if you start living your life like that, the only girls you're gonna attract are the ones who wouldn't be worth it for the long haul. Not even talking in terms of "one true love!!!!", but just in terms of day to day living. What happens when you can't keep that facade up any longer? I'm not interested in sleeping with random girl after random girl. If the way I act naturally leads me into a one night stand, that's cool, but I don't go out with the intention of getting laid.

I keep hoping I'll stop seeing this topic at the top of the topic list.

--
Still smilin'
:>

vcharon posted...

I keep hoping I'll stop seeing this topic at the top of the topic list.

You know, a way to stop that is to not post in it.

From: yoshifan823 | #086

If I acted like the ideal guy in that dumb test, rejection would happen. A lot.

So it's fear of rejection.

Unless you are claiming that using the technique exemplified in the test would NEVER work? Because this site is for teaching betas who get ZERO girls, to get a girl. More than zero is an improvement.

Also keep in mind that you are completely missing the point of the articles on that blog, which is common, so don't feel bad. I won't even try to explain to you how not every word on that blog is to be taken literally, since the concept seems way beyond your grasp. Just keep that in the back of your head, though.

--
_foolmo_
'Ulti is like when your parents post something on your facebook status' - Sir Cobain

foolm0ron posted...

From: yoshifan823 | #086

If I acted like the ideal guy in that dumb test, rejection would happen. A lot.

So it's fear of rejection.

Unless you are claiming that using the technique exemplified in the test would NEVER work? Because this site is for teaching betas who get ZERO girls, to get a girl. More than zero is an improvement.

Also keep in mind that you are completely missing the point of the articles on that blog, which is common, so don't feel bad. I won't even try to explain to you how not every word on that blog is to be taken literally, since the concept seems way beyond your grasp. Just keep that in the back of your head, though.

Thanks for the backhanded comment. Please, explain this concept, I always enjoy broadening my horizons.

These techniques are okay for like desperation moves, but the general advice of "be confident at all times" is so much better than the gaming going on here. I mean it helps in literally every aspect of life.

Being confident at work gives me leads on projects I want and a general leadership role in the office. Being confident with my friends makes me someone they feel like they can depend on and go to, and being confident with women makes them want to be around you because confident, driven men are the modern equivalent of the strong warriors of an earlier age.

I dont understand people who dont have it in them to be self-confident. Those kinds of people using game will only work rarely, primarily by tricking women into thinking you might actually be a worthwhile person. Its really kind of sad the blog needs to exist.

--
http://img.imgcake.com/nio/81edpngej.png
The one and only Underdog Millionaire and UCA CORPORATE Champion

Right. The basic idea of "like yourself, try to better yourself, and be confident in yourself" are good things to keep in mind. It's just that it's slathered in so much condescension and hateful speech that while it implants those good ideas, it puts much, much worse ones in there, too.

So yoshi, are you in a successful long term relationship with a hot young girl that you've maintained for any length of time without having to use any of that evil game stuff?

--
We can't stop here. This is bat country.
Brace for the G's, and fast heel-toe work.

From: ExThaNemesis | #093
So yoshi, are you in a successful long term relationship with a hot young girl that you've maintained for any length of time without having to use any of that evil game stuff?
Ive gotten laid using game, but my relationships have just kind of naturally occurred as the result of my own normal actions.

--
http://img.imgcake.com/nio/81edpngej.png
The one and only Underdog Millionaire and UCA CORPORATE Champion

From: yoshifan823 | #090

I always enjoy broadening my horizons.

Clearly you do not

--
_foolmo_
'Oh please, if foolmo made that analogy you'd think it was picture perfect' - Biolizard28

foolm0ron posted...

From: yoshifan823 | #090

I always enjoy broadening my horizons.

Clearly you do not

Haha, keep stalling.

From: yoshifan823 | #096

foolm0ron posted...

From: yoshifan823 | #090

I always enjoy broadening my horizons.

Clearly you do not

Haha, keep stalling.

You got me

You have shown me up in this topic with all your walls of text

I bow to your intellect

--
_foolmo_
'Illegal activities is a slight misnomer, most of it is not related to material that is actually illegal.' - nintendogrl1

From: yoshifan823 | #061
What's the difference between a girl who is having sex with multiple guys, and a guy who is having sex with multiple girls?
The girl hasn't had a hundred thousand years of genetic hardwiring to make her act this way. If anything, she should be the opposite - demure and picky about her partner until she snags a true stud. A girl in the situation you described could very well be damaged goods and unstable; as ExTha said, the guy banging multiple girls will almost certainly be a lot happier.

And let's not forget that it's way, way, WAY easier for girls to get sex. Girls can be promiscuous if they want, but unless they've just been uncontrollably gamed up by multiple casanova players, I don't have to respect it; certainly not as much as I would a man who gets hot girls on the regular.

--
Yoblazer: http://i32.tinypic.com/zlf1w7.gif
Watch and you'll see... someday I'll be... part of your world!

How I broke out of my friend zone:

Stopped giving a **** about getting out of the friend zone and just acted like myself when I'm with my male friends.

--
http://backloggery.com/shados http://last.fm/user/ShadosNeko
VISUALSHOCK! SPEEDSHOCK! SOUNDSHOCK! NOW IS TIME TO THE 68000 HEART ON FIRE!

the answer boils down to "make yourself the prize, not her, be confident, and make your true intentions visible".

there's a post on roissy/heartiste called "Overconfidence Is The Heart Of Game". If there's any one lesson to be learned about game, it's that. If you see yourself as infinitely high value, you can act without the deferential and supplicating attitude (especially toward women) that is the antithesis of game.

--
SuperNiceDog shoots the lights out