LogFAQs > #931606008

LurkerFAQs, Active DB, DB1, DB2, DB3, DB4, Database 5 ( 01.01.2019-12.31.2019 ), DB6, DB7, DB8, DB9, DB10, DB11, DB12, Clear

Topic List	Page List: 1
Topic	I find it ironic that Democrats started all that impeachment process...
darkknight109 12/15/19 3:08:04 AM #65:	SKARDAVNELNATE posted... So, what about Trump's behavior is objectionable? Well, let's see here: 1) Withholding congressionally apportioned funds, for starters. Congress has the power of the purse and budgets are where the legislative branch's power is at its nadir. Trump does not have the authority to withhold money that has been congressionally apportioned. The president has the power to temporarily hold funds only in a narrow group of emergency situations and only for a maximum of 45 days without congressional approval (suffice to say there was no emergency in Ukraine and he did not have congressional approval). 2) Lying about it. Congress was not informed that the funds were being withheld and presidential aids were instructed to lie or mislead anyone in congress who asked, by claiming that there was a bureaucratic hold-up rather than stating that Trump had stopped up the funds. 3) Attempting to use the withholding of funds and a sought-after White House meeting to pressure Zelenskiy into publicly announcing an investigation for nakedly political purposes. Note how for the first three years of Trump's presidency - notably when Biden was not a presidential candidate - Trump did nothing. Only now, with Biden leading the polls and looking to be a serious threat to Trump's already-tenuous chances of re-election, has he decided this is a serious issue. 4) Giving serious credence to an internet conspiracy theory (the Crowdstrike nonsense) because Trump's fragile snowflake ego is still upset by the idea that Russia intervened on his behalf to help him win the election, something literally every US intelligence agency has established is fact. 5) Failing to follow the proper procedure for an investigation. In the event that Trump was serious that he wanted an investigation purely for non-political reasons, there is a process for that and it is not "go talk to my personal attorney, who is not a government representative" (possible Logan Act violation right there). What Trump should have done, to avoid even the appearance of a conflict of interest, is gone through the American ambassador to Ukraine and the American embassy, who would liaise with Ukrainian counterparts and set out the appropriate steps. SKARDAVNELNATE posted... It seems clear that Biden arranged for his son to have a job at a company that has had shady dealings in the past. Literally no evidence has come forward suggesting that the elder Biden had any role in getting his son a job. Burisma probably wanted his son on the board so they would have access to his rolodex, but that's not illegal (and if you're upset about ex-politicians and/or their relatives getting cushy board jobs despite having no qualifications, you're going to have a long, long, long list of people to go through, spanning the entire political spectrum). SKARDAVNELNATE posted... Trump learns of this and asks Ukraine to assist the US in getting to bottom of that. "Assist the US"? Then why isn't there an American investigation into this? Why is Trump getting Ukraine to do his dirty work? Answer: because it's spurious charges and Trump knows it. This is like Hillary's e-mails (doubly hilarious, given that Trump is using an unsecured phone to conduct government business, despite numerous attempts to get him to stop) - bullshit that he can use to smear his opponent so that his own scumminess and criminal misdeeds don't look quite so bad in comparison. SKARDAVNELNATE posted... If it were anyone other than Trump making the request the media stories would be about the Biden foreign nepotism scandal. What foreign nepotism scandal? Again, you don't seem to get this: there is absolutely no evidence that Joe Biden did anything improper in Ukraine or elsewhere. None. Zero. Zip. Zilch. Nada. No one has suggested that Biden got his kid the job. No witnesses have alleged it, no evidence has emerged to suggest it, this is entirely made up Trumpian bullshit to try and distract from the fact that Donald Trump, president of the United States, illegally used congressionally apportioned funds to solicit a bribe from the Ukrainian government in an effort to harm his most politically dangerous opponent heading into an election year. That's it. --- Kill 1 man: You are a murderer. Kill 10 men: You are a monster. Kill 100 men: You are a hero. Kill 10,000 men, you are a conqueror! <cite>darkknight109 posted [p:931606008] in I find it ... [t:78246484]...</cite> <quote>SKARDAVNELNATE posted... </cite> <quote>So, what about Trump's behavior is objectionable?</quote>Well, let's see here: 1) Withholding congressionally apportioned funds, for starters. Congress has the power of the purse and budgets are where the legislative branch's power is at its nadir. Trump does not have the authority to withhold money that has been congressionally apportioned. The president has the power to temporarily hold funds only in a narrow group of emergency situations and only for a maximum of 45 days without congressional approval (suffice to say there was no emergency in Ukraine and he did not have congressional approval). 2) Lying about it. Congress was not informed that the funds were being withheld and presidential aids were instructed to lie or mislead anyone in congress who asked, by claiming that there was a bureaucratic hold-up rather than stating that Trump had stopped up the funds. 3) Attempting to use the withholding of funds and a sought-after White House meeting to pressure Zelenskiy into publicly announcing an investigation for nakedly political purposes. Note how for the first three years of Trump's presidency - notably when Biden was not a presidential candidate - Trump did nothing. Only now, with Biden leading the polls and looking to be a serious threat to Trump's already-tenuous chances of re-election, has he decided this is a serious issue. 4) Giving serious credence to an internet conspiracy theory (the Crowdstrike nonsense) because Trump's fragile snowflake ego is still upset by the idea that Russia intervened on his behalf to help him win the election, something literally every US intelligence agency has established is fact. 5) Failing to follow the proper procedure for an investigation. In the event that Trump was serious that he wanted an investigation purely for non-political reasons, there is a process for that and it is not "go talk to my personal attorney, who is not a government representative" (possible Logan Act violation right there). What Trump should have done, to avoid even the appearance of a conflict of interest, is gone through the American ambassador to Ukraine and the American embassy, who would liaise with Ukrainian counterparts and set out the appropriate steps. SKARDAVNELNATE posted... </cite> <quote>It seems clear that Biden arranged for his son to have a job at a company that has had shady dealings in the past.</quote>Literally no evidence has come forward suggesting that the elder Biden had any role in getting his son a job. Burisma probably wanted his son on the board so they would have access to his rolodex, but that's not illegal (and if you're upset about ex-politicians and/or their relatives getting cushy board jobs despite having no qualifications, you're going to have a long, long, long list of people to go through, spanning the entire political spectrum). SKARDAVNELNATE posted... </cite> <quote>Trump learns of this and asks Ukraine to assist the US in getting to bottom of that.</quote>"Assist the US"? Then why isn't there an American investigation into this? Why is Trump getting Ukraine to do his dirty work? Answer: because it's spurious charges and Trump knows it. This is like Hillary's e-mails (doubly hilarious, given that Trump is using an unsecured phone to conduct government business, despite numerous attempts to get him to stop) - bullshit that he can use to smear his opponent so that his own scumminess and criminal misdeeds don't look quite so bad in comparison. SKARDAVNELNATE posted... </cite> <quote>If it were anyone other than Trump making the request the media stories would be about the Biden foreign nepotism scandal.</quote>What foreign nepotism scandal? Again, you don't seem to get this: there is absolutely no evidence that Joe Biden did anything improper in Ukraine or elsewhere. None. Zero. Zip. Zilch. Nada. No one has suggested that Biden got his kid the job. No witnesses have alleged it, no evidence has emerged to suggest it, this is entirely made up Trumpian bullshit to try and distract from the fact that Donald Trump, president of the United States, illegally used congressionally apportioned funds to solicit a bribe from the Ukrainian government in an effort to harm his most politically dangerous opponent heading into an election year. That's it. --- Kill 1 man: You are a murderer. Kill 10 men: You are a monster. Kill 100 men: You are a hero. Kill 10,000 men, you are a conqueror!</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Topic List	Page List: 1