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Topic	Can someone pro-universal healthcare for America address something for me?
EggplantParm 04/11/17 10:24:10 PM #32:	shockthemonkey posted... You're not addressing the point that the wait time isn't getting longer for everyone. Some people couldn't get it before any doctor visit is by default a shorter time than never being able to see a doctor. Some people have to wait longer because there are people who previously couldn't see the doctor in front of them. The entire point you're trying to drive home is "it's better for the haves so fuck the have nots." All people will have to wait longer. Why are you ignoring the wait times I posted above? Why are you ignoring the fact that we are a country with ten times the population and live way more unhealthy lifestyles? No, I'm not saying fuck the have nots. In a perfect world, we wouldn't have to discuss this. But we don't live in a perfect world. You have wrote off every logical point--lack of resources, longer wait times, poorer care--for straw men and snide assumptions. 3rd_Best_Master posted... monkmith posted... why is there a general assumption that people without health care in this country don't go to the ER? the wait time isn't going to go up with universal health care, it has the potential to go down because those without insurance wouldn't be forced to hang out in the ER for hours for "free" service when they could instead go to a general practice doctor and get preventive health care. This. The whole "wait time" argument against UH always seems to ignore how healthcare in America is even approached. Many Americans already find that going to the doctor is either prohibitively expensive or time consuming so they don't schedule doctor's appointments and they don't partake in preventative healthcare. Instead, many of those people wait and wait and wait until a critical emergency occurs and they go wait in emergency rooms. Emergency rooms practice triage and they're already subject to wait times. Why should we not have UH for fear of wait times when wait times are how most people go to the doctor already? The only difference with UH is that they'll actually be able to afford to go and won't suffer through a medical bankruptcy due to a cough. If both systems will result in wait times then why not go for the option that most people can actually afford to use? My point is and has been from the get--the wait times will increase massively. It is common sense. If Canada, a country with 35 million people and a healthier population has documented extreme wait times for practically all things medically related, why wouldn't America face the same issues on a much more massive scale given the population and unhealthy lifestyles we live? These waits aren't just an inconvenience...they result in mental health issues for patients, worsening conditions, and even death. Saying "oh well, we wait anyway...what's more of a wait?" Isn't an argument. And you can repeat how ERs practice triage over and over but that won't change the fact that there are now more and more people in that pool. Has anyone responding actually read the articles that I posted? Why would America be any different than Canada? --- http://i.imgur.com/vStAH0d.jpg say amen or u heartless <cite>EggplantParm posted [p:877020968] in Can someon... [t:75226826]...</cite> <quote><cite>shockthemonkey posted...</cite> <quote>You're not addressing the point that the wait time isn't getting longer for everyone. Some people couldn't get it before any doctor visit is by default a shorter time than never being able to see a doctor. Some people have to wait longer because there are people who previously couldn't see the doctor in front of them. The entire point you're trying to drive home is "it's better for the haves so fuck the have nots."</quote> All people will have to wait longer. Why are you ignoring the wait times I posted above? Why are you ignoring the fact that we are a country with ten times the population and live way more unhealthy lifestyles? No, I'm not saying fuck the have nots. In a perfect world, we wouldn't have to discuss this. But we don't live in a perfect world. You have wrote off every logical point--lack of resources, longer wait times, poorer care--for straw men and snide assumptions. <cite>3rd_Best_Master posted...</cite> <quote><cite>monkmith posted...</cite> <quote>why is there a general assumption that people without health care in this country don't go to the ER? the wait time isn't going to go up with universal health care, it has the potential to go down because those without insurance wouldn't be forced to hang out in the ER for hours for "free" service when they could instead go to a general practice doctor and get preventive health care.</quote> This. The whole "wait time" argument against UH always seems to ignore how healthcare in America is even approached. Many Americans already find that going to the doctor is either prohibitively expensive or time consuming so they don't schedule doctor's appointments and they don't partake in preventative healthcare. Instead, many of those people wait and wait and wait until a critical emergency occurs and they go wait in emergency rooms. Emergency rooms practice triage and they're already subject to wait times. Why should we not have UH for fear of wait times when wait times are how most people go to the doctor already? The only difference with UH is that they'll actually be able to afford to go and won't suffer through a medical bankruptcy due to a cough. If both systems will result in wait times then why not go for the option that most people can actually afford to use?</quote> My point is and has been from the get--the wait times will increase massively. It is common sense. If Canada, a country with 35 million people and a healthier population has documented extreme wait times for practically all things medically related, why wouldn't America face the same issues on a much more massive scale given the population and unhealthy lifestyles we live? These waits aren't just an inconvenience...they result in mental health issues for patients, worsening conditions, and even death. Saying "oh well, we wait anyway...what's more of a wait?" Isn't an argument. And you can repeat how ERs practice triage over and over but that won't change the fact that there are now more and more people in that pool. Has anyone responding actually read the articles that I posted? Why would America be any different than Canada? --- http://i.imgur.com/vStAH0d.jpg say amen or u heartless</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
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