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TopicAny of you don't think tom brady is the greatest QB of all time?
MooglesRUs
10/04/21 1:07:15 AM
#17:


xp1337 posted...
I was being very brief because this isn't exactly a discussion where anyone is going to change their minds and I didn't want to risk getting dragged into a "brady haters going wahhhhhhh" type dialogue that is all too common I find.

The chief argument I see from Brady as GOAT supporters are the 7 championships and I mean... first off there's the whole "Wins really shouldn't be considered a QB stat" thing but that ship has sailed in most sports discussions. But when you look at it from this angle the cheating, uh, actually is pretty damn relevant? Sports media honestly tends to kind of gloss over and have short memories on these kinds of things which is super aggravating to me personally. Like, maybe you didn't mean it this way, but to me what you're saying there is like saying, "Honestly, if you set aside the sign stealing, the Astros' World Series season had barely a speck." Well, okay, yeah, if you're setting aside the actual blemish then I guess most players/careers/seasons of top players look pretty spotless! The only area where cheating actually seems to have stuck to players in any of the major North American sports is the steroid era in Baseball and really only in the HoF voting which is itself a rather weird insiders club type thing.

There's also the fact, to me, that Brady feels like he's been protected/favored by the refs more than pretty much any other player I can think of. He's gotten calls throughout his career that no one else gets - even his opponents in the very games he's getting the calls! Rule changes that favor him when that isn't enough. Like, in basketball you have star calls or homer calls but with Brady he gets them where ever they play and even other top players aren't getting them at that level. It's why things like that blatant OPI in Week 1 against the Cowboys not being called is the kind of thing you just expect (and the media barely talks about if they do at all) because it's just so routine that Brady teams get those things.

Now he's getting the all-time stats records but a lot of those are longevity records. I mean, when Favre held basically all of them it's not like anyone (seriously) thought Favre was the GOAT. He just picked them up because he was an ironman. That Brady is still able to play in the league at his age is legitimately impressive and historic though, no doubt about it, but I mean, of course it's gonna lead to him surpassing these records. If Peyton played to the same age he'd still have them today!

Anyway, that's a lot of me addressing pro-Brady arguments but as for other QBs...

In his era, I never got the feeling he was as "feared" as Peyton. Peyton basically revolutionized QB play with basically being a coach on the field who would just run the offense from the line. Peyton just often had inferior teams around him that he carried. It's reductive as shit, but the Colts that season when Peyton got hurt being atrocious was really telling in that regard, the whole team collapsed without him.

In terms of pure talent you've got Rodgers and Mahomes who I don't think any but the most fanatical Brady supporters would contest that in terms of pure talent they've got Brady beat. Mahomes's career is just starting though so that's a work in progress but he sure seems like he could easily become the GOAT.

And then if you want to go back to rings... well, sure if you put aside the scandals and just go "7 > " then there's no discussion we can have here but you can make a Jordan-esque argument that Montana's undefeated 4-0 is more impressive than Brady's 7-3 in the same way that Jordan's 6-0 is held up as superior to players who have more appearances and somehow Russell being 11-1 doesn't just slam the door on every NBA discussion ever. FTR, I don't buy this kind of argument because it in essence rewards a player for losing before the championship round rather than actually getting there but a lot of people gravitate towards it. So like, if you say Brady's 7-3 record is fully legit then I'd be with you that it's better to have that than 4-0.

also this is petty and not football related but he's just supremely unlikable to me imhotbqh.

The most annoying thing about that is that basketball is the ONE sport where actually you can win a game on your own. Somehow Russell winning 11 rings as THE GUY doing it is lesser than this clown playing with the best coach AND special teams, AND defensive cast, AND offensive cast of all time in a game where it is 1,000% a team game and you cant win games on your own.

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