Lurker > averagejoel

HollowKnail posted...

averagejoel posted...

HollowKnail posted...

while I appreciate your enthusiasm I think you need to look closer to reality

cool. you have shown that you are not listening to me, so I do not care what you think.

I have listened to you

no you haven't
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HollowKnail posted...

while I appreciate your enthusiasm I think you need to look closer to reality

cool. you have shown that you are not listening to me, so I do not care what you think.
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NonDairyMiltank posted...

averagejoel posted...

NonDairyMiltank posted...

the line i don't like you crossing is trying to imply other people need to change their dating/sexual preferences as a social justice issue

your entire line of thought is coming from this, and the premise it is based on is false. I am not implying that people need to change their preferences as a social justice issue. I am saying that people's preferences are informed by a system that does not like trans people.

okay.....?

you're not implying that people who avoid dating trans folk should change their preferences?
but you're also bothering to point out to them that those preferences are potentially discriminatory towards trans people?

that doesn't add up
why would you bother doing the latter if you didn't want people to change their preferences?

a cis gay guy doesn't want to date trans men (surprise surprise)
are you going to bother lecturing him on how his dating preferences for cis penis is discriminatory towards other people?

no?
then why bring it up at all? for the virtuous thrill of the guilt trip?
cause you're probably not goin to sell most gay men on dating trans men...

I want to change the system
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HollowKnail posted...

averagejoel posted...

NonDairyMiltank posted...

the line i don't like you crossing is trying to imply other people need to change their dating/sexual preferences as a social justice issue

your entire line of thought is coming from this, and the premise it is based on is false. I am not implying that people need to change their preferences as a social justice issue. I am saying that people's preferences are informed by a system that does not like trans people.

you are wrong though. maybe on a slight scale you are correct, but overall you are wrong.

elaborate please.
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HollowKnail posted...

try more like a couple of posters in this topic

where did I even use the word "evil" before this post?
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NonDairyMiltank posted...

the line i don't like you crossing is trying to imply other people need to change their dating/sexual preferences as a social justice issue

your entire line of thought is coming from this, and the premise it is based on is false. I am not implying that people need to change their preferences as a social justice issue. I am saying that people's preferences are informed by a system that does not like trans people.
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EverDownward posted...

if you're a dude and you only wanna put your thing in vaginas and the butts of women, fine. if you're a dude and you only wanna put your thing in the butts of men, fine. if you're a dude and you wanna put your thing in the vaginas and butts of men, women, and trans persons, that's fine, too.

why are people arguing?

because some people are very defensive about the idea that they might not be the perfect little trans ally they think they are
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HollowKnail posted...

I already said I'm attracted to transpeople so you have no point

my point is that you made a claim that I had said something, and you have not provided any actual evidence to support that claim
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HollowKnail posted...

oh wait, it couldn't be that he is co opting a cause to make himself look better right?

could it be that you don't actually have evidence for your claim?
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HollowKnail posted...

you literally said it. the fact that you're trying to hide it makes transgenders to be in the wrong

I'm not trying to hide anything. quote the post where I said it.
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HollowKnail posted...

you're asking the world to kiss your feet.

no I'm not. I'm asking you to provide evidence for a claim you made. you said

HollowKnail posted...

you claim any personage who does not want a trangender partner is faking

you also said that

HollowKnail posted...

it's more plain than your girlfriend

so it should be simple for you to quote the post where I made that claim.
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RdVEHfJqAvUPIbk posted...

averagejoel posted...

ok. I will not mention you again.

Thank you

provide evidence for your claim please.
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HollowKnail posted...

I would date a transgendered person

ok. cool

now

averagejoel posted...

provide evidence that I

claim any personage who does not want a trangender partner is faking

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RdVEHfJqAvUPIbk posted...

Mention me again and I'll mark you for harassment

ok. I will not mention you again. provide evidence for your claim.
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averagejoel posted...

HollowKnail posted...

averagejoel posted...

HollowKnail posted...

do you never read behinds lines?

quote where I said what you claim I said.

it's more plain than your girlfriend

so quote it. provide evidence that I

claim any personage who does not want a trangender partner is faking

@HollowKnail
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averagejoel posted...

RdVEHfJqAvUPIbk posted...

averagejoel posted...

we were talking ideas before. this is moving into the "action" area. they are separate conversations, and I am not willing to have the latter conversation with someone who does not already accept the ideas I brought up for the former.

You just want to scream 'bigot' over and over. That's not helpful.

where did I say that?

@RdVEHfJqAvUPIbk
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NonDairyMiltank posted...

why would they need to defend that choice?

because they want to ignore the idea that they might not be the perfect allies they think they are
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shorturl.at/tEGP8

(it's an article from the Independent)

Anti-Soviet warrior puts his army on the road to peace: The Saudi businessman who recruited mujahedin now uses them for large-scale building projects in Sudan. Robert Fisk met him in Almatig

OSAMA Bin Laden sat in his gold- fringed robe, guarded by the loyal Arab mujahedin who fought alongside him in Afghanistan. Bearded, taciturn figures - unarmed, but never more than a few yards from the man who recruited them, trained them and then dispatched them to destroy the Soviet army - they watched unsmiling as the Sudanese villagers of Almatig lined up to thank the Saudi businessman who is about to complete the highway linking their homes to Khartoum for the first time in history.

With his high cheekbones, narrow eyes and long brown robe, Mr Bin Laden looks every inch the mountain warrior of mujahedin legend. Chadored children danced in front of him, preachers acknowledged his wisdom. 'We have been waiting for this road through all the revolutions in Sudan,' a sheikh said. 'We waited until we had given up on everybody - and then Osama Bin Laden came along.'

Outside Sudan, Mr Bin Laden is not regarded with quite such high esteem. The Egyptian press claims he brought hundreds of former Arab fighters back to Sudan from Afghanistan, while the Western embassy circuit in Khartoum has suggested that some of the 'Afghans' whom this Saudi entrepreneur flew to Sudan are now busy training for further jihad wars in Algeria, Tunisia and Egypt. Mr Bin Laden is well aware of this. 'The rubbish of the media and the embassies,' he calls it. 'I am a construction engineer and an agriculturalist. If I had training camps here in Sudan, I couldn't possibly do this job.'

And 'this job' is certainly an ambitious one: a brand-new highway stretching all the way from Khartoum to Port Sudan, a distance of 1,200km (745 miles) on the old road, now shortened to 800km by the new Bin Laden route that will turn the coastal run from the capital into a mere day's journey. Into a country that is despised by Saudi Arabia for its support of Saddam Hussein in the Gulf war almost as much as it is condemned by the United States, Mr Bin Laden has brought the very construction equipment that he used only five years ago to build the guerrilla trails of Afghanistan.

He is a shy man. Maintaining a home in Khartoum and only a small apartment in his home city of Jeddah, he is married - with four wives - but wary of the press. His interview with the Independent was the first he has ever given to a Western journalist, and he initially refused to talk about Afghanistan, sitting silently on a chair at the back of a makeshift tent, brushing his teeth in the Arab fashion with a stick of miswak wood. But talk he eventually did about a war which he helped to win for the Afghan mujahedin: 'What I lived in two years there, I could not have lived in a hundred years elsewhere,' he said.

When the history of the Afghan resistance movement is written, Mr Bin Laden's own contribution to the mujahedin - and the indirect result of his training and assistance - may turn out to be a turning- point in the recent history of militant fundamentalism; even if, today, he tries to minimise his role. 'When the invasion of Afghanistan started, I was enraged and went there at once - I arrived within days, before the end of 1979,' he said. 'Yes, I fought there, but my fellow Muslims did much more than I. Many of them died and I am still alive.'

(more in the article)
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RdVEHfJqAvUPIbk posted...

averagejoel posted...

we were talking ideas before. this is moving into the "action" area. they are separate conversations, and I am not willing to have the latter conversation with someone who does not already accept the ideas I brought up for the former.

You just want to scream 'bigot' over and over. That's not helpful.

where did I say that?
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NonDairyMiltank posted...

averagejoel posted...

NonDairyMiltank posted...

averagejoel posted...

NonDairyMiltank posted...

well no shit

welcome to the world of modern dating
its casually loaded with prejudice and discrimination
thats a commonly practiced natural aspect of it
theres even mainstream dating apps crafted to filter certain people out
anyone whos a minority knows this, because we feel the brunt of it...

if you dont match what someone else wants, all you can do is toughen up buttercup and try elsewhere

you think thats wrong and the world needs to change? okay
tell us your plan for convincing most people to accept dating trans people
because right now most people don't

people thinking about their preferences and recognizing that their preferences are informed by a societal system that fundamentally does not respect trans people as human beings would be a decent start

okay, you convinced a bunch of people that their sexual/dating preferences are influenced by a "systemic whatever" and accept that
unshockingly most of them are still not interested in changing their dating habits, shrug and just continue with their familiar preferences after the guilt trip

what now?
how do you proceed to convince them to accept dating trans people?

you have to have more to your little campaign than "just so know that's bad and here's why"
you said making people more aware was a start...okay, how are you convincing people to care about your message?
whats their incentive?

if guilt is all you're really selling, don't be shocked if the average person
browbeating turns away more audiences than attracts...especially when you're trying to convince them to like something

we were talking ideas before. this is moving into the "action" area. they are separate conversations, and I am not willing to have the latter conversation with someone who does not already accept the ideas I brought up for the former.

translation: cop out

your translator is malfunctioning if that's legitimately your takeaway
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HollowKnail posted...

averagejoel posted...

HollowKnail posted...

do you never read behinds lines?

quote where I said what you claim I said.

it's more plain than your girlfriend

so quote it. provide evidence that I

claim any personage who does not want a trangender partner is faking

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NonDairyMiltank posted...

averagejoel posted...

NonDairyMiltank posted...

well no shit

welcome to the world of modern dating
its casually loaded with prejudice and discrimination
thats a commonly practiced natural aspect of it
theres even mainstream dating apps crafted to filter certain people out
anyone whos a minority knows this, because we feel the brunt of it...

if you dont match what someone else wants, all you can do is toughen up buttercup and try elsewhere

you think thats wrong and the world needs to change? okay
tell us your plan for convincing most people to accept dating trans people
because right now most people don't

people thinking about their preferences and recognizing that their preferences are informed by a societal system that fundamentally does not respect trans people as human beings would be a decent start

okay, you convinced a bunch of people that their sexual/dating preferences are influenced by a "systemic whatever" and accept that
unshockingly most of them are still not interested in changing their dating habits, shrug and just continue with their familiar preferences after the guilt trip

what now?
how do you proceed to convince them to accept dating trans people?

you have to have more to your little campaign than "just so know that's bad and here's why"
you said making people more aware was a start...okay, how are you convincing people to care about your message?
whats their incentive?

if guilt is all you're really selling, don't be shocked if the average person
browbeating turns away more audiences than attracts...especially when you're trying to convince them to like something

we were talking ideas before. this is moving into the "action" area. they are separate conversations, and I am not willing to have the latter conversation with someone who does not already accept the ideas I brought up for the former.
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HollowKnail posted...

do you never read behinds lines?

quote where I said what you claim I said.
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HollowKnail posted...

averagejoel posted...

DarkProto05 posted...

I respect trans-persons but don't want their dicks. I also respect men but don't want their dicks, does that make me homo-phobic or a misandrist? You're trying too hard to either 1. troll or 2. play the victim.

I have already addressed this. please read my previous responses to you before attempting to continue this conversation further.

and yet you claim any personage who does not want a trangender partner is faking

where did I claim that?
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DarkProto05 posted...

I respect trans-persons but don't want their dicks. I also respect men but don't want their dicks, does that make me homo-phobic or a misandrist? You're trying too hard to either 1. troll or 2. play the victim.

I have already addressed this. please read my previous responses to you before attempting to continue this conversation further.
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MARKINGRAM22 posted...

averagejoel is a delusional narcissist who would rather create enemies then to accept that some people don't like penis' sexually or surgical vaginas and can still support trans rights.

I assure you I am neither delusional or a narcissist. and I said nothing about genitals or surgery or trans rights. did you even read any of my posts?
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HollowKnail posted...

averagejoel posted...

biggernails posted...

averagejoel posted...

NonDairyMiltank posted...

well no shit

welcome to the world of modern dating
its casually loaded with prejudice and discrimination
thats a commonly practiced natural aspect of it
theres even mainstream dating apps crafted to filter certain people out
anyone whos a minority knows this, because we feel the brunt of it...

if you dont match what someone else wants, all you can do is toughen up buttercup and try elsewhere

you think thats wrong and the world needs to change? okay
tell us your plan for convincing most people to accept dating trans people
because right now most people don't

people thinking about their preferences and recognizing that their preferences are informed by a societal system that fundamentally does not respect trans people as human beings would be a decent start

then tell the truth

I'm not sure what you're talking about here. I haven't lied so far in this topic

are you so sure about that?

I'm 100% sure that I haven't lied and I'm also 100% sure that I don't know what you're referring to
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biggernails posted...

averagejoel posted...

NonDairyMiltank posted...

well no shit

welcome to the world of modern dating
its casually loaded with prejudice and discrimination
thats a commonly practiced natural aspect of it
theres even mainstream dating apps crafted to filter certain people out
anyone whos a minority knows this, because we feel the brunt of it...

if you dont match what someone else wants, all you can do is toughen up buttercup and try elsewhere

you think thats wrong and the world needs to change? okay
tell us your plan for convincing most people to accept dating trans people
because right now most people don't

people thinking about their preferences and recognizing that their preferences are informed by a societal system that fundamentally does not respect trans people as human beings would be a decent start

then tell the truth

I'm not sure what you're talking about here. I haven't lied so far in this topic
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peanut butter and dick

NonDairyMiltank posted...

well no shit

welcome to the world of modern dating
its casually loaded with prejudice and discrimination
thats a commonly practiced natural aspect of it
theres even mainstream dating apps crafted to filter certain people out
anyone whos a minority knows this, because we feel the brunt of it...

if you dont match what someone else wants, all you can do is toughen up buttercup and try elsewhere

you think thats wrong and the world needs to change? okay
tell us your plan for convincing most people to accept dating trans people
because right now most people don't

people thinking about their preferences and recognizing that their preferences are informed by a societal system that fundamentally does not respect trans people as human beings would be a decent start
---

peanut butter and dick

DarkProto05 posted...

averagejoel posted...

RdVEHfJqAvUPIbk posted...

this is such a non fucking issue

indeed. so why are people getting so defensive over the idea that their preferences might be informed by a discriminatory system?

Oh man the victim complex is real. Straight men not wanting a penis is their own personal choice not "the man" telling them what to do.

what victim complex? transphobia is a societal system. it has an effect on people's dating preferences and the choices they make. is that so hard to accept?
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RdVEHfJqAvUPIbk posted...

this is such a non fucking issue

indeed. so why are people getting so defensive over the idea that their preferences might be informed by a discriminatory system?
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im not 13 posted...

I can't take your posts or point seriously because you actually believe that people don't care about genitals when selecting a mate

You also believe it's "silly" for a man to want to procreate with his selected partner.

Just because YOU think it's silly doesn't mean everyone else does or should

it's not that it's silly. it's that it's transphobic. which is the entire point in the first place.
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MARKINGRAM22 posted...

averagejoel posted...

I wasn't arguing with you in the first place.

no one is trying to strongarm people into dating partners they aren't into. we're only saying that it's discriminatory to discount a diverse group of people based on a characteristic that they can't control.

Yes, dating is discriminatory, but not dating or being attracted to someone doesn't automatically mean hate. Your argument is absurd and doing a disservice by labeling people who are supporters phobic.

again, transphobia is a system. actively hating trans people is not the only way to partake in that system.
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NonDairyMiltank posted...

ImmatureContent posted...

NonDairyMiltank posted...

whether or not you agree with Blaire White, you're not going to get very far tryin to socially strongarm people into dating partners they ain't into

"oh but you wanted me before you knew i was trans" =/= actually attracted to you

it means they were attracted to what they THOUGHT you were
BIG difference...

if you wanna identify as a different gender than what you were born as, more power to you
just remember that not everyone you try to date is gonna agree with your assessment and thats just how it has to be

This is complete bullshit. If you attracted to someone, you are attracted to them.

they're attracted to what they THINK the person is, the whole package

if evidence shows what they thought doesn't match with what they presumed the person was, don't be shocked that the attraction suddenly takes a nosedive

i got nothin personally against trans folk, but i'm never surprised when someone exclusively lookin for cis partners says nope to dating trans (because thats the preference of most people in the world)

I don't think anyone here is surprised by that. we're saying that it's discriminatory against trans people to do so, and is in line with a societal system that discriminates against trans people.
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just coming in here to say that Trudeau is far from good
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MARKINGRAM22 posted...

averagejoel posted...

transphobia is not limited to outright hatred, and attraction is not limited to wanting to date someone

Alright so you have no argument left.

I wasn't arguing with you in the first place.

NonDairyMiltank posted...

you're not going to get very far tryin to socially strongarm people into dating partners they ain't into

no one is trying to strongarm people into dating partners they aren't into. we're only saying that it's discriminatory to discount a diverse group of people based on a characteristic that they can't control.
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Zangulus posted...

averagejoel posted...

doesn't everything sweet contain sugar?

No.

isn't it like... what makes things sweet?
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doesn't everything sweet contain sugar?
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MARKINGRAM22 posted...

I don't really know how else you could argue someone has to hate trans people to not date one.

transphobia is not limited to outright hatred, and attraction is not limited to wanting to date someone
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biggernails posted...

averagejoel posted...

biggernails posted...

averagejoel posted...

biggernails posted...

maybe. but to assume this it de facto true of every person that turns it down is asinine and perhaps even heterophobic

then it's a good thing that that isn't the assumption being made

then what is your point?

that transphobia is a system which has an effect on peoples' dating preferences. did you actually read my post?

eh, you're about half right, but half bs. attraction is a thing fostered by society that is true, but even still I find myself attracted to certain transgendered women so I don't think your assertion carries a full salt load

not being attracted to specific trans women is not necessarily transphobic. not being attracted to trans women as a whole absolutely is.
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biggernails posted...

averagejoel posted...

biggernails posted...

maybe. but to assume this it de facto true of every person that turns it down is asinine and perhaps even heterophobic

then it's a good thing that that isn't the assumption being made

then what is your point?

that transphobia is a system which has an effect on peoples' dating preferences. did you actually read my post?
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Were_Wyrm posted...

Wouldn't not having a gender count as a gender?

no. that's called agender. completely different thing
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biggernails posted...

maybe. but to assume this it de facto true of every person that turns it down is asinine and perhaps even heterophobic

then it's a good thing that that isn't the assumption being made
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Feline_Heart posted...

The guy in The Punisher wasnt a child molestor. Also

Ghetto_Turtle posted...

the fuck are you even tryin to say

there was a guy in one episode who tried to sell frank child porn. maybe that's what tc is talking about?
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people seem to have skipped this post for some reason.

averagejoel posted...

transphobia is best thought of as a system. our society is transphobic. we were raised in society. this has an effect on the way we view the world, whether or not we realize it.

it is reasonable to assume that this would have an effect on peoples' dating preferences.

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biggernails posted...

Lyrica posted...

If a guy is willing to hit on a woman, buy her a drink, take her home, and then she says, "I'm trans," well, there's no denying that the guy was ATTRACTED to her. There's no such thing as being "tricked" into something you're attracted to. You're either attracted or you're not.

Okay so what about the case where a woman finds out a man is poorer than she thought when she goes back home with him. Is she then obligated to still be attracted if she no longer is? The fact is attraction is a complicated thing and is sometimes tied to expectations and possibilities.

the woman is being classist
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transphobia is best thought of as a system. our society is transphobic. we were raised in society. this has an effect on the way we view the world, whether or not we realize it.

it is reasonable to assume that this would have an effect on peoples' dating preferences.
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breakfast is ideal for a first date imo. super easy to spend more time together afterwards
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fhqwhgads posted...

averagejoel posted...

I would probably be Warned for voicing my opinion on this

Please do.

nope
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I would probably be Warned for voicing my opinion on this
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