Board 8 > Reality TV Discussion Topic: Delayed by the Writers' Strike

(+) Yeah! (+)

Per the previous request, new topic with no spoilers for last night's Survivor finale.

Previously on Survivor...

Aw, whatever. I watched last night's and hardly care now.

And no, I don't hate Heidi.

I think Heidi is pretty boring for most of the game, up until the final 11. If you look at her as a storyline of someone who wants to make big moves, and they constantly either wind up failing, or just doing nothing to benefit her as she intends, then she doesn't have a terrible edit.

I think Carolyn could have done better in front of the Jury. I wanted to see her talk about the early game and the sanctuary with Danny and Brandon

Well earned win by Yam Yam though!

Really disappointing result but I think it says more about the edit than the jury themselves.

I think what I said tracks with the jury:

I do think Yam Yam could win since he's super convincing socially, especially in the recent episodes where they've shown him talking 1:1. Carolyn is more generally likably but not 1:1 likable.

Yam Yam had DAYS of brilliant jury management that was just too boring for TV. But probably all of Carolyn's big moves were put in. So it looks even in the edit but in reality Yam Yam was ridiculously strong.

Carolyn was undeniably smarter and bolder in the game though. I wished she got some votes for that alone, esp from Carson. But as much as everyone is a gamebot, it seems like socials do rule this game as much as ever.

yeah i think there's a difference between, like, "oh, i can see now that this person is worthy of respect and has many admirable qualities" and "i personally get along with this person well" and i think people were being genuine when they praised carolyn in the former way but i guess its still not equal to the latter

It's important to note that, even though Carolyn got a very strong edit that pushed her as a contender...Yam Yam still ended the season with 80 confessionals and is like, the 6th-highest confessional count EVER. So we definitely got to see his game in full and understand why he could get votes come the endgame.

Inviso posted...

It's important to note that, even though Carolyn got a very strong edit that pushed her as a contender...Yam Yam still ended the season with 80 confessionals and is like, the 6th-highest confessional count EVER. So we definitely got to see his game in full and understand why he could get votes come the endgame.

Off the top of my head, four of those ahead of him are Russell in Samoa, Rob in Amazon, Tai in Kaoh Rong, and Richard in Borneo

Since when are confessionals where you see a player's game?

foolm0r0n posted...

Since when are confessionals where you see a player's game?

For a while now. It used to be that we'd see scenes of strategizing and we might get confessionals to explain what we just saw, but somewhere along the line, producers just started putting in confessionals to justify their winners. We saw it with Gabler, how production would regularly give him confessionals to justify his under-the-radar strategy in 43, Fabio was constantly given "I'm gonna play dumb" confessionals in Nicaragua. That sorta thing.

Also, I was wrong. Yam Yam had 83 confessionals and is NINTH overall, not sixth. He is, however, the second-highest confessional count in the back half of Survivor's history at this point, and third-highest since Heroes vs. Villains.

1. Russell Hantz (Samoa) - 108
2. Rob Cesternino (Amazon) - 101
3. Colby Donaldson (Australia) - 98
4. Tony Vlachos (Cagayan) - 97
5. Rob Mariano (Redemption Island) - 97
6. Richard Hatch (Borneo) - 92
7. Kelly Wiglesworth (Borneo) - 85
8. Lex van den Berghe (Africa) - 84
9. Yamil "Yam Yam" Arocho (44) - 83
10. Kathy Vavrick-O'Brien (Marquesas) - 82

Oh wow, I thought Tai had some ungodly number of confessionals in 32. I remember someone saying that that season had the most overall confessionals since Borneo, and knew he had the most in that season, so maybe that's why.

Tai had 74, which is still high, but only those ten I listed hit 80 or more.

Tai had 74, Aubry had 70, Michele had 57, and those are already extremely high numbers for the final three alone.

Inviso posted...

Michele had 57

This is quite surprising to me, since I always felt like she seemed under-edited, especially for a winner. Maybe that harkens back to what I said about the overall number of confessionals being skewed quite high in that season. 57 there probably seemed like 40-ish in most seasons of the time.

Inviso posted...

He is, however, the second-highest confessional count in the back half of Survivor's history at this point, and third-highest since Heroes vs. Villains.

It's so bizarre to think of Redemption Island being in the first half of Survivor history now.

Out of curiosity/nerdiness I decided to compile the confessional count for winners and some of these numbers are pretty surprising.

Rob - 97
Tony (28) - 97
Richard - 92
Yam-Yam - 83
Mike - 73
Tony (40) - 73
Chris D - 71
J.T. - 71
Ben - 70
Tina - 69
Ethan - 68
Cochran - 67
Jenna - 61
Todd - 60
Tom - 60
Earl - 59
Michele - 57
Brian - 56
Sandra (7) - 55
Adam - 53
Kim - 53
Nick - 53
Tommy - 52
Tyson - 48
Amber - 47
Natalie A - 46
Gabler - 45
Sarah - 45
Yul - 45
Aras - 44
Jeremy - 44
Maryanne - 43
Danni - 41
Fabio - 40
Erika - 39
Wendell - 39
Denise - 37
Vecepia - 36
Parvati - 32
Bob - 31
Sandra (20) - 27
Sophie - 25
Chris U - 23
Natalie W - 15

Are they counting 1-liner confessionals too?

I'm pretty sure the rules are as follows:
-Their chyron has to be shown for it to count as a confessional
-If less than 10 seconds of footage is shown in between, it counts as the same confessional when it resumes. If 10 seconds of footage or more are shown, it's considered a new confessional when it resumes.

Length of the confessional doesn't matter AFAIK

Did Natalie W have any idea she won the season before the final votes were read at the live finale?

the edit just makes it seem like they were trying to blindside her just as much as the viewers

Chaeix posted...

Did Natalie W have any idea she won the season before the final votes were read at the live finale?

the edit just makes it seem like they were trying to blindside her just as much as the viewers

I'd think so. Shambo called Russell after filming ended to tell him that he'd lost even though she'd voted for him. Russell thought she was pulling his leg. Whoops.

Juries talk about that stuff all the time and there's no real way for production to prevent it.

As soon as they cut to the live show you could see it in Russell's face - he knew he had lost.

Just moving this into the new topic for reference.

The cream of the crop:
1. Kaoh Rong
2. Vanuatu
3. Pearl Islands
4. San Juan Del Sur
5. China
6. Philippines

Very good seasons with a few minor flaws:
7. Marquesas
8. Borneo
9. Heroes vs. Villains
10. Nicaragua
11. Guatemala
12. Gabon
13. Survivor 42

Largely solid seasons, but with some major flaws that prevent them from being better:
14. David vs. Goliath
15. Cagayan
16. Exile Island
17. Fiji
18. Amazon
19. Survivor 44
20. Survivor 41
21. Heroes vs. Healers vs. Hustlers
22. Micronesia
23. Palau

Has some distinctly negative aspects, but has enough fun and enjoyable content to not hate outright:
24. Game Changers
25. Winners at War
26. Blood vs. Water
27. Edge of Extinction
28. Samoa
29. South Pacific

Mostly bland and forgettable:
30. Tocantins
31. Africa
32. One World
33. Australia
34. Ghost Island
35. Survivor 43

Extremely, extremely negative and unpleasant, but at least KINDA interesting in that negativity:
36. Thailand
37. Worlds Apart
38. Island of the Idols

Aggressively boring and soulless, and revolving around a twist that honestly makes the season worse through its existence:
39. Millennials vs. Gen X
40. Cook Islands
41. Caramoan
42. Cambodia
43. All-Stars
44. Redemption Island