Lurker > Dels

Though, did I not get the true ending? Osawa didn't explicitly die in mine, and I did get the post-credits scene.

Ah. I should do that.

I presume one of the guides linked earlier will tell me which choices to pick?

iiicon posted...

Dels posted...

finding one person to blame here seems impossible

and yet they found one. weird! wonder if that's the crux of why most people are calling jcgamer garbage.

I don't think someone is garbage though for having a wrong or bad opinion. =/ a lot of people think zoe quinn is a bad person. if you think that's wrong, surely not every person who feels that way is irredeemable. that's how i see it. i could be naive.

Paratroopa1 posted...

The topic title - "zoe quinn strikes again" - is all you need to know. This is coming straight out of the gamergate playbook, the harassment campaign of all harassment campaigns

I mean, I agree that the topic title was definitely the most unreasonable part. Like I said, finding one person to blame here seems impossible, and obviously jumping to that conclusion first and foremost is not going to be the best way to start a discussion.

Anyway, @jcgamer107 :

I understand why you'd think that Zoe coming forward with this led to his suicide, and that Zoe should have "known better".

But I feel like you're sort of missing the alternative, which is, like... what is she supposed to do, assuming her claims are true? Should she hide this for the rest of her life because telling the truth could hurt him?

I guess the way I see it is, imagine if you were in a position where someone had abused you, and no one knew about it, and they were famous and successful. Wouldn't you have a desire to tell the truth? And if you did, would you worry that "Well, if I say the truth, it might hurt him?"

Also, some others in this topic have said it, but the majority of people who have this sort of accusation outted about themselves actually don't commit suicide, as far as I know, so I'm not sure it actually follows that she'd know this would happen.

Also, from what I can tell from following way too much online drama over the past year, it seems like every person (on any side. of any issue) always issues a "Please don't harass the person, I'm not trying to hur them" clause and it doesn't seem to ever get followed. If I said "You said that but you knew people would do it anyway" about it, it'd basically be accusing almost every big online commentator of being guilty, because it's so universal.

It seems like the topic title was ill-advised, and I agree that people shouldn't really be blamed for coming forward with honest accounts of abuse (I think the idea is we want a world where people can support each other and share that they aren't alone)

That said, I do agree with Corrik that a large part of OP's post does seem to be against "mob culture", and against harassers. I feel we can probably all agree that some of the biggest "villains" in any of this are the people who went out of their way to harass anyone involved in this. (Or maybe I'm wrong?)

There are reasons why the legal system doesn't get involved in this type of thing which I think the OP can learn more about, but I'd rather assume the OP just doesn't realize the implications rather than assume he's deliberately obtuse. (The gist of it, as far as I can understand, is that the legal system usually cannot do anything about these cases even when they are true, and much of the accusation might not qualify as illegal even if he did horrible things)

Zoe Quinn is a divisive figure, and if you believe that lies have been spread about her to make her seem less trustworthy, then it's equally possible that the OP is a person who has been deceived by those lies than he is someone responsible for them. The things I've read about Zoe Quinn online have certainly made her seem untrustworthy. I admit I don't know enough to know the whole story about her. In this case, I don't have any reason to think she's lying, since it seems many people corroborated her story.

Ultimately, the OP seems quite upset about what happened, and I think his feelings are valid. He is upset that someone who was clearly not 100% all bad was driven to suicide, and I think that's a sad situation. When people are hurt, they look for someone to blame. Maybe OP is blaming the wrong people. I think it's understandable, even if it is misguided. I don't jump to the OP being a piece of shit. In fact, I think, on a scale of how unreasonable the OP could've been, they could've handled this much worse. (See: Literally any of the threads on the Steam Community for the game)

That's just my opinion. I don't think the OP has presented himself as being past the point of reason, so I don't think such a strong reaction is warranted. Please tell me if you think I'm wrong.

though i didn't get whatever the "true ending" is maybe? I still need to look up the bonus content stuff and read the side-chapters

whoops, i didn't update this again

suffice to say the last chapter was thrilling, the epilogue was very nice (though i'm not a fan of osawa dying because of contrived reasons - of course when the good guys have everything under control, someone has to get emotional and fuck it up, meh, not a fan of that trope. but at least they leave it open ended enough you can decide for yourself if he lives or not)

just absolutely fantastic game over all, made me care about every character, was incredibly emotional more than it had any right to be for a police thriller or whatever genre this is, and brilliantly interwoven plot that brought together every detail while giving every character an arc. total masterpiece, for sure.

glad i played it and got past my initial preconceptions from the visuals.

(and oh my god, sorry to say, but WAY more enthralling than Umineko. Like a night and day difference in terms of my urge to continue with this game, not just from the pacing but also because I genuinely liked every character in this game so there was never a single part where I didn't care about who was on my screen)

anyone have any recommendations for my next visual novel? I have Steins;Gate but is there some new version being released soon I should be waiting for?

What's the debate? They're not funny...

yeah i dunno i was trying to be open minded with the "well sex positive people exist and that part of tumblr exists so who am i to judge" thing but you may be right

surely if it was obvious that "i ask them if they're 18" was a cover for "i know they're not but, y'know, legally..." though he'd get in trouble for it before this? and wouldn't do it publically?

do other people do this?

isn't there a screenshot of her saying she was 100% okay with the stuff Jared did in regards to the nudes stuff?

TheRock1525 posted...

He better hope that Ross backs him up on "Ross knew and was OK with it".

pretty sure 3 months ago that dude tweeted that he just wanted to be left out of it

kind of disrespectful to bring him in by naming him honestly (from jared not you) but i guess i can understand if you think he can clear you of wrongdoing

StealThisSheen posted...

I mean it seems like you very much had your mind made up on "not guilty," so

as someone who, as i said, is 100% an outsider and therefore theoretically objective (though we all have our own biases), and someone who saw the initial allegations and trusted his wife and thought he seemed creepy and clearly bad, i definitely believe there is some merit to his side of the story. i remember seeing text messages and stuff months ago that showed that his wife encouraged him to start a relationship with the other woman and it seems their relationship was rocky all around and i can't say for sure if either party is solely to blame. of course, i don't have enough info, i don't know them, this is all strangers on the internet, which isn't the best way to reach a correct conclusion.

but in this video, the main thing i saw (and hence pointed out) is that he does literally show evidence that an accuser who said "he never asked if i was 18, he should've known" was lying, because he has chat logs saying "are you 18?" "yes, i am". say what you will about the rest, but that seems to be the only solid piece of evidence in the thing, and i think that should count for something.

probably should have led with that one instead of the other one, which i admit was definitely "well, they're a crazy person, so we can't know" and is not proof, it's entirely a he said they said situation. that said i do think it paints enough of a picture that there is reason to doubt the accusation. that's just my opinion. i could be wrong and being unfair and victim blaming. if i wanted to reach a correct conclusion i'd need to actually hear the accuser's defense of those inconsistencies, which i'm not doing because like foolmo said i'm not a judge or a lawyer or a juror, just a random guy on the internet.

foolm0r0n posted...

Did he address every accusation against him with evidence defending himself?

Obviously he's not gonna spend 45 minutes talking about stuff he can't refute, only the stuff he can.

That's why these things are a matter for lawyers in court and not a vlog. There's no way this can be legally productive, specifically because only a legal investigation would actually cover all the bases. So if he had a real legal defense he would've done that, not post a vlog.

If you want to defend him or keep watching him or whatever then fine, but don't pretend it's because he's cleared.

he addresses allegations from two people named charlie who said that he solicitied nudes from them even though they were minors. the first one he says has no proof (no chatlogs, etc) and the second one is the one he disproves by showing the chatlog showing he asked them if they were 18+.

he also covers another accusation that a woman accused him of googling her nudes and sharing them with people, which he says was misinterpreted because he googled a cosplay pic of her and showed people, and somehow it got distorted, but he does have proof that this woman (or another woman?) said he continued to treat her badly at an e3 panel which he proves he never attended. (because it didn't exist)

that's all he covers. i don't remember if there was anything else he was accused of so its possible there's stuff he didn't address. he doesn't talk about the stuff with his wife but he maintains it was a complex situation and that he wanted to leave her and made his intentions clear before the alleged cheating.

i mean, don't look at me, i don't know how this "running a tumblr blog to share nudes with strangers online" stuff works. but just because it's completely divorced from my lifestyle, doesn't mean i want to assume that anyone who does it must be a creep. sex positive people who believe that it shouldn't be a taboo exist. that seems to be how he defines himself.

neonreaper posted...

BetrayedTangy posted...

It does look like the minor sent the nudes to Jared, but only after Jared explicitly asked if they were 18+. Then lied on Twitter saying he never asked for their age.

If you have to ask, the answer is no

He knew.

i get the impression that he asked that as a standard question to any person who contacted him online via that blog, and he asked it before knowing what they looked like.

KokoroAkechi posted...

I mean, if it was legal council that gave him this advice, I don't want to tell someone who has a law degree how to do their job, but anyone who knows anything about internet culture can see that not saying anything is probably a bad idea.

I mean, in an ideal world, the proper thing to do in any case like this would be to take your time, not rush to reactions, put together your best case, and expect people to act reasonably

But I guess what you're saying is we don't live in an ideal world. But I don't really want to blame someone for trying to do the reasonable thing just because "they should have known that doesn't work"

I mean, I watched it, and he does literally have evidence regarding one of the two accusations. He shows chatlogs with an accuser who claimed they were underage and yet he continued to trade nudes or w/e with them, and in the chatlog, he asks them "are you over 18" and the person says "yes, i am, otherwise i wouldn't be doing this". And he shows proof that this accuser's initial tweets/accusation said "He never asked me if I was 18, he doesn't ask anyone this, and he should've known I was a minor"

Of course, you can always say chat logs can be doctored, but if the chat log is real, that does seem like evidence that that accusation was false.

(Disclaimer I never heard of this guy before 3 months ago and don't participate in any gaming youtube culture so I don't know any of the people involved)

it's ridge racer!

riiiiiiiiiiidge racer!

wait, "true end" what???????????

i finished the epilogue last night

will do post-game stuff and post final thoughts later

okay, chapter complete.

i don't have time to reach the ending right now though so i'll continue tonight.

god i should have realized, from when stanley's flashback about his brother's dead randomly mentioned dry ice

even when kano mistakenly suspected the truck earlier (my earlier post) i still didn't realize where it was going

oh. probably not necessary but

this page has major unmarked spoilers for everything after 19:00

lmao the dry ice machine

how to break kano's keep out at 19:05? the one after meeting kuze and he inner monologues about how much he's learned today

edit: nvm got it

you know, the only difference between this game and 24

is that no one has actually died in this game

sasayama got hospitalized but that's about the extent of it

i wonder if there'll be any deaths at all

when you look at the way all the plot threads get tied up and every character gets a redemption/forgiveness arc, it feels like this game is actually more in the cheesy "everyone gets a happy ending through the power of love" style, so maybe no one will die =P

achi, lying down dying after the explosion: yesssss! :D i was right about the cell phone not being the bomb!!!! woohoooooo!!!!! :D :D :D

When did Achi lose the Ecomonster on his shirt?

I noticed this as well. It's been a while. I can't remember if he ever changed shirts or if there was actually a wardrobe mistake during filming.

yes, those are certainly ewwls

thank you

It seems to me like the type of thing that sounds really cool in concept, but then once you play it a bit you'll be like "holy shit this is awful why did i think this was a good idea"

Even I'm tempted to try it for a bit though.

Nostalgia, y'know.

I clicked 3 but I meant to click 4. Oops.

3 is my second favourite, behind 4.

Grimlyn posted...

what the

xXEgukXx is here?!

impossible, he's still in prison after being arrested by Chris Hansen

colliding posted...

swirIdude posted...

When are we getting AA7, for cripes sake??

My vision, which will never happen, for AA7 is that it'll be the first game to feature some sort of mechanic that allows you to choose your character, so each case would have two routes that would each feature separate puzzles that eventually come to the same conclusion.

It also has a layton-esque world map instead of "move," gumshoe and maggey's kid as a sidekick for athena, sarge as the wright anything agency's "tech expert" and pearls finally getting that makeover.

Man, I like your vision.

oh wow!

i had no idea.

i'll have to check that out later, but can't really google it right now for fear of spoilers

Mega Mana posted...

- Achi has an interesting typo right away. Under 'Brain-dead,' '...there are two conditions for declaring breath death.'

I noticed that as well. lol

- The likelihood of failure could be part of the plan...? I KNOW WHO ALPHARD IS!

I know right?

- "Wait for me, Maria. This time, I'm going to come for you."
- END OF OSAWA

<3 ;-;

Mega Mana posted...

- Is it it me or are the two debt collectors the worst actors of the entire cast. The Hawaiian shirt guy just looks so stupidly goofy, and not in an over-the-top Yanagi sort of way. He's just like, "This is my bad guy scowl" and Orange Cassidys the effort.

They definitely play into the over-the-top cheesiness more than many, but I think they're great.

- !!! The subway! He was on the phone! Kano and Sasayama! But who was phone?

Wait, what? What am I missing?

WAIT. Was the printer guy the one on the phone earlier?! on the subway?!

OHHHHHH.

Oohhhhhh.

But does it mean anything? Did we decide that guy was a bad guy? Or was it all a coincidence?

Does mean that Kano and Achi have no Bad Ends this chapter???
O_O
O_O
- *gets trophy for finding all bad ends for chapter... after one bad end* WHAAAAAAAAT?!?!?!!?

lol. i guess so. kano and achi just proceed through the endo electronics thing with no hitches possible from the dialogue options, osawa doesn't get in any trouble spots, and... yeah. i guess they felt they needed one bad end in the chapter though so they put in minorikawa's and went wild with it lol

I really have no idea what's going to happen

Sure, maybe we just take down the bad guys and save Maria, but... hm.

but yeah, Canaan being Alphard is a) much more terrifying and b) much more surprising. I hadn't really considered it at all. Granted, I was blinded by the fact that she was already such an unrealistic character, but I really got the sense we were meant to think she was cool and just accept her and trust her. Well done though, I got fooled. Should've realized we never saw her face in those flashbacks.

not sure i can keep going. might need to rest a bit.

no hints for bad ends is gonna be tough as well, i've been over-relying on them.

mostly because jumping around picking every dialogue option hoping for something to change is pretty annoying with the lack of text skip, tbh

god, this chapter was a dead end just an hour ago, now its got so many interweaving branches i can't keep track of it

LordoftheMorons posted...

Maria also hasn't seen Canaan...!

oh shit. is that why maria passed out? canaan covertly knocked her out so that maria couldn't say "wait, who are you?"

this doesn't make her any less realistic. now not only is she a 16 year old expert assassin operative of lockpicking, but ALSO the leader of a worldwide organ trafficking and drug cartel?

holy shit, i never noticed we never saw canaan's face in maria's flashbacks

...Did we...?

No. Wait.

That's not right.

Didn't we see Canaan in Maria's flashbacks?

....?!?!?!?!?!

Canaan is Alphard?!

this chapter is insaaaaaaaane!!!!!

kano can tell from palmer's eyes that he's never risked his life before

doesn't sound like the real alphard to me...

god, stanley thinks alphard purposefully got the wrong sister kidnapped?!

geez...