I wish folks realized how "From the river to the sea" feels to Jews

Why do conservatives hate jews but love israel

So to some, Israel not being a Jewish majority State, means to them no more Jewish people. While to some, it just means a liberal binational State.

I mean, it would depend on how it would be done. I think those pushing for the liberal binational State need to also be pushing for a very strong constitution, because there are a lot of people who hate each other in that region and a lot of work needs to be done to fix that. A lot of the people who are the most "afraid" though are just afraid that they will have the same thing done to them that they are trying to do to the Palestinians. Its a guilty conscience at work.

Cmon...a guilty conscience at work? so you think there's no risk of this, and you think that if the powers were reversed the Israelis would be treated much better....?

Tbh, I think there is a risk from both sides, which is why I support a two state solution despite disagreeing in principle with a religious/ethnic majority State of any kind.

A Jewish person hearing that chant, what they hear is not free Palestine, when they hear "from the river to the sea" what they hear is "kill all the Jews"

Im in agreement there, too, fwiw, but again, I didn't mean to make this a discussion about the conflict itself

So what do they hear when Netanyahu uses the phrase? When a Palestinian hears it Israel Jews hear "Kill all Jews" so when Netanyahu uses it should we all hear the leader of Israel saying to kill all Palestinians? I'm guessing the supporters of Israels genocide would somehow say no, it's different.

You just want us to view it exclusively in a vacuum without the additional context of an actual factual ongoing genocide?

So yes, it goes both ways. Neither side should be using this phrase, in light of such a violent conflict, with genocidal influences on both sides.

It usually implies the end of Israel in a recognizable form.

If "from the river to the sea" implies a mostly contiguous 2-state solution, it's not offensive.

It usually implies the end of Israel in a recognizable form.

Having been in protests with people of all faiths and background, including Jewish people, I know exactly what the phrase does and does not mean. You don't get to control the speech of others . So I'll say this:

From the River to the Sea, Palestine will be free.

And if that makes you uncomfortable:

From the Sea to the River, Palestine will live forever.

If you're an activist who aims to persuade others and spread your message, you absolutely should control your speech and listen to criticisms.

What would you say to people who feel that "Black Lives Matter" means "Kill All the Whites"?

If Fox News or other bad faith actors are being critical of something, no protestors should certainly should not have to entertain their asinine requests.

I don't see why we should be centering people's feelings

Oh no the Jewish fee fees

Meanwhile Palestinian babies are starving to death in bombed out hospitals.

That is a really bad look to people watching

A Jewish person hearing that chant, what they hear is not free Palestine, when they hear "from the river to the sea" what they hear is "kill all the Jews"

This is silly.

If Fox News or other bad faith actors are being critical of something, no protestors should certainly should not have to entertain their asinine requests.

They should teach the meaning to people who are uneducated on the matter, if the person is actually willing to learn.

Why do conservatives hate jews but love israel

Exactly. "All lives matter" is an innocent phrase on its surface, but it is far more loaded in reality and it might not vocally say anything against Black people, but it is hard to use innocently in context. So why not find a better phrase that is not loaded? It makes it hard to assume good faith.

Yes, this is something that is true. It's hard to call it paranoia based on history. Being oppressed does not give an excuse to be oppressors. But regardless, talk of the dissolution of Israel gives very valid fears to some Jewish people that it would mean a mass killing of Jews.

But even then, it doesn't make a person anti-semitic. Still, this topic will always be loaded to Jewish people, who might be a strong force in Israel, but not world-wide.

The specific phrase in question, especially how it has been used by Hamas representatives, makes the fear feel even more visceral.

Let's not play this game...it's a conservative tactic. (What I mean is, highlighting an individual instance and trying to use it to frame one side as violent, etc)

Misrepresenting criticism of Israel as antisemitism should be a bannable offence by this point. It's fucking vile, and the ONLY thing it achieves is trivializing actual anti-Semitism.

If I had to guess Jews here in America and Jews there in Israel to them simply arent one in the same.

This would also explain why they do not bother with nor care for Nazis here or anti semitism mostly until it was directed towards Israel specifically.

Don't know why some people are plugging their ears and ignoring the history of the phrase and how its changed over time.

Yeah. Him even being here tho, does seem to prove that pre-exCElusion purgs don't disqualify you from CE access as he was purg'd at the time it happened. (Or at least, that admins will give another chance to such users.)

Many anti-Israel Jewish people do not want Israel to exist and find it religiously offensive that the state associates itself with their religion. The state = / = its people and a state can be ended without exterminating the people inside it.

In this day and age criticizing Israel means you get a pass if you throw in antisemitic rhetoric. Then a bunch of antisemitists will insist that nobody ever does that, because their biases prevent them from recognizing it, and antisemitism isn't real unless it's explicit and literal; despite being the same people who would argue about how subtle and nuanced other prejudices are. But they're antisemitic, so their standards change when they hear "Jew".

This board's consistent denial of antisemitism is disgusting.

Antisemitism is certainly real but these days literally any criticism of Israel is deemed to be antisemitic by genocide deniers.

It doesn't help that many schmucks take the bait and think doing shit like vandalizing menorahs and posting antisemitic graffiti on them as helping the Palestinian cause when in reality it does the opposite.

*Sigh*

I don't know what I expected, but I wish people would at least realize, if nothing else, what harm they are doing to their own cause, when they are told these things, and call it tone policing and carry on.

The problem is a lot of people use that phrase to call for the genocide of Israelis. Not as a phrase that simply means wanting an end to the State of Israel replaced by Palestine.

It's not one or the other you piece of pig shit.