If existential fear won't get you to vote against Trump, then nothing will.

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Current Events » If existential fear won't get you to vote against Trump, then nothing will.
ssb_yunglink2 posted...
Okay so youre just willing to hope youre right instead of do literally anything to try and stop it
Dude is basically the shyguy poster up there with a painted veneer of self-righteousness and doesn't even realize it.
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I just have a negative response to fearmongering.

Someone tells me to be afraid, I go the other way.

There are a lot of people like that.
Cynic, n. A blackguard whose faulty vision sees things as they are, not as they ought to be. - Ambrose Bierce, The Devil's Dictionary
Rika_Furude posted...
So you refuse to put in any effort to save lives?

If it means taking lives in the process, yes.

No one can make you guilty for the blood of others. No one can drag you to Hell. You walk there of your own volition or you don't go there. I wouldn't kill one innocent to save a thousand innocents. That's the way that it is.

Don't be mad at me. I'm not running for reelection. Be mad at Biden. He's faced with the choice of withdrawing his support for genocide or letting the Republicans win. He'd rather lose the election than stop the slaughter.
Some people will not be significantly worse off themselves if they support Trump over other candidates. Those people have nothing to lose. And, if they hate the same groups that Trump hates, can use the president as validation for their actions and beliefs.
Post #55 was unavailable or deleted.
FortuneCookie posted...
Be mad at Biden.
i dont partake in chud mental gymnastics. im mad at people who want trump to win and people like you who contribute to a trump victory
Post #57 was unavailable or deleted.
Asherlee10 posted...
By not voting or voting for Trump you are complicit to the outcome.
In before some tankie comes out to denounce us for being complicit of the genocide at Gaza despite the fact that almost everyone here is against it.
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FortuneCookie posted...
No one can make you guilty for the blood of others. No one can drag you to Hell. You walk there of your own volition or you don't go there. I wouldn't kill one innocent to save a thousand innocents. That's the way that it is.
No, you're exactly the same as the guy in this topic proudly doing it because he'll be safe, you've just found a way to be self-righteous about it.
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Asherlee10 posted...
By not voting or voting for Trump you are complicit to the outcome.

No, I'm not. You can't make me guilty for something I haven't done. You can't say that, just for existing, I'm a murderer. If I vote, I murder the people of Gaza. If I don't vote, I murder everyone else who dies. No. It doesn't work that way. I'm only guilty if I'm an active participant.

Like I said, the responsibility is Biden's. He could be the sole individual standing between democracy and fascism and he chooses genocide. If genocide is the lesser of two evils, I'm staying out of the contest. I won't vote for either.
DrizztLink posted...
No, you're exactly the same as the guy in this topic proudly doing it because he'll be safe, you've just found a way to be self-righteous about it.

I've spoken against Trump. If he's Hitler, death awaits me too.
So we're going to get Trump again, fan-fucking-tastic.

Good fucking job, Biden. Your incompetent ass has basically doomed the country. Everyone fucking hates you, you can't fucking do anything right, and you can go join Hillary in the corner of shame for being the only fucking people in existence who can actually throw an election to Donald Trump.
"tell Biden to take responsibility for his actions, but I don't have to"
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Mystereave posted...
So we're going to get Trump again, fan-fucking-tastic.

Good fucking job, Biden. Your incompetent ass has basically doomed the country. Everyone fucking hates you, you can't fucking do anything right, and you can go join Hillary in the corner of shame for being the only fucking people in existence who can actually throw an election to Donald Trump.
What candidate would you prefer to Biden
Hee Ho
ssb_yunglink2 posted...
What candidate would you prefer to Biden
Hed just bitch about that candidate too. They all would.
Taxes, death, and trouble.
Brunt/Gaila 2024. Make Ferenginar Great Again!
It's fine. Just sleep in. You don't need to stand up to the self declared dictator who thinks Hitler had some good ideas.

You don't need freedom of speech.
You don't need the right to vote.
You don't need worker protections.
You don't need the right to fair trail.

Just ignore the problem and it will go aw- well, not go away. More like stick around for your lifetime.

But at least then people will know you stuck to your guns. Shame you never got to vote for anything ever again, and where did all your minority friends go btw?

/s
Black Lives Matter. ~ DYL ~ (On mobile)
I've had this conversation with Genocide Joe guys a dozen times now

GJ: But genocide!
Me: Trump has said he will make it worse for Gaza, you won't do what you can to keep him out of office?
GJ: I don't like Trump either, but I won't vote
Me: So you don't really give a shit about genocide

*GJ abandons thread, thoroughly spanked*
Mystereave posted...
So we're going to get Trump again, fan-fucking-tastic.

Good fucking job, Biden. Your incompetent ass has basically doomed the country. Everyone fucking hates you, you can't fucking do anything right, and you can go join Hillary in the corner of shame for being the only fucking people in existence who can actually throw an election to Donald Trump.
Tagged as troll.
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Asherlee10 posted...
I didn't call you a murderer. I said you are complicit to the outcome and you are.

If your life is imperiled by the outcome of the election, blame Biden. Not me. All he had to do to guarantee reelection was to stop funding genocide and he refused.
ssb_yunglink2 posted...
What candidate would you prefer to Biden

My actual opinion on the matter (when I'm not being a grump who's inadvertently overdosed on political takes for the day) is that the whole "support of Israel" thing is a systemic American issue that's not tied to any party, so no possible presidential candidate would be able to just wipe it away regardless.

The whole "you're complicit in genocide if you support Biden" thing works the other way too, because Trump would be the same at best, but likely even worse. In fact, it even works if you abstain from voting, since at that point you're basically holding the door open for Trump, meaning you'd still be complicit in genocide anyway. There's literally no outcome that doesn't check that hypothetical "complicit" box in some way in the current political climate.

The fact is, one party will at least keep the systems in place that allow for incremental change towards the policies we want, while the other will actively set that back in every way they possibly can. Even if you don't approve of current policy, giving the Republicans power will only make it that much harder for the candidates you actually want to make any headway. Even if you get them into office, they'll be too bogged down undoing all the damage to make any of that progressive headway.
FortuneCookie posted...
If your life is imperiled by the outcome of the election, blame Biden. Not me. All he had to do to guarantee reelection was to stop funding genocide and he refused.

DrizztLink posted...
"tell Biden to take responsibility for his actions, but I don't have to"

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FortuneCookie posted...
If your life is imperiled by the outcome of the election, blame Biden. Not me. All he had to do to guarantee reelection was to stop funding genocide and he refused.
No, you'll be blamed whether you like it or not.
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FortuneCookie is the raindrop who insists holds no responsibility for the flood.
Black Lives Matter. ~ DYL ~ (On mobile)
In response to DrizztLink,

Yes, he's the one who ran for president. He accepted that responsibility. He chose to run for office.

He ran for office. I did not.
He has power and authority. I do not.

You cannot tell me that I have a president's responsibility when it is not within my power to withhold funding from Israel.
Even ignoring all the popular issues like Israel (which Trump is EVEN WORSE than Biden on), abortion (which Biden is clearly better), and Ukraine (which Trump will hand directly to Russia), you also have existential crisis shit like climate change etc. in which Trump would pretty much doom the planet around.

There is not a single policy or metric in which Trump has a better position than Biden. NOT ONE.

Take your pick, Biden is better in every way. And in all the things you'd hate Biden for, you'd hate Trump EVEN MORE. It's such a no brainer. Unless you explicitly LIKE racism and fascism. But if so you're not getting convinced by anything anyone says.
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FortuneCookie posted...
In response to DrizztLink,

Yes, he's the one who ran for president. He accepted that responsibility. He chose to run for office.

He ran for office. I did not.
He has power and authority. I do not.

You cannot tell me that I have a president's responsibility when it is not within my power to withhold funding from Israel.
I can't tell you anything at all.

You've already decided to use your martyr complex to make millions of actual martyrs.
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FortuneCookie posted...
If your life is imperiled by the outcome of the election, blame Biden. Not me. All he had to do to guarantee reelection was to stop funding genocide and he refused.

I'll blame everyone who could have done a small thing to help prevent it, but chose not to.
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Evil's win condition is for good men to do nothing.

Some people mistakenly think themselves above this.
Black Lives Matter. ~ DYL ~ (On mobile)
Ill always vote, but Im not sure thatll do more than buy us four more years. Project 2025 wont go away if Trump loses, it just becomes Project 2029. Eventually the pendulum will swing and well get a Republican President and Congress again. And the mask is off at this point, I dont think GOP voters will accept any attempt to go back to a semi-functional republic.

Voting is great and all, its the best option available at this moment. But lets not pretend that voting harder is going to solve all our woes either, or that a not-insignificant population of this country has already decided political violence to overthrow a legitimately elected president is a better alternative than democracy. Once the GOP made the choice to side with the Jan 6th terrorists, they made it clear they will support more violence to get their way.

You all ready for that possibility? That no matter how you vote this year, or next year, or four years from now, that all of that could be tossed away because the right-wing finally decides to do away with the pretense democracy?

Because in the same way we should all vote so that were not complicit in Trump winning the presidency this election, we should also decide whether were going to be complicit in Trump or another right-wing scumbag seizing power by not fighting back beyond the ballot box.
Horith posted...
Ill always vote, but Im not sure thatll do more than buy us four more years. Project 2025 wont go away if Trump loses, it just becomes Project 2029. Eventually the pendulum will swing and well get a Republican President and Congress again. And the mask is off at this point, I dont think GOP voters will accept any attempt to go back to a semi-functional republic.

Voting is great and all, its the best option available at this moment. But lets not pretend that voting harder is going to solve all our woes either, or that a not-insignificant population of this country has already decided political violence to overthrow a legitimately elected president is a better alternative than democracy. Once the GOP made the choice to side with the Jan 6th terrorists, they made it clear they will support more violence to get their way.

You all ready for that possibility? That no matter how you vote this year, or next year, or four years from now, that all of that could be tossed away because the right-wing finally decides to do away with the pretense democracy?

Because in the same way we should all vote so that were not complicit in Trump winning the presidency this election, we should also decide whether were going to be complicit in Trump or another right-wing scumbag seizing power by not fighting back beyond the ballot box.

Until there's a paradigm shift within the GOP, every election from here on out will be the most important of our lives, with far-reaching REAL repercussions (and loss of current freedoms) every single time the GOP wins. It's nice to want a better situation, but for now we have to deal with the problem in our face.
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They can kill me, but they'll killing someone who opposed them to the bitter end.

May as well, seeing as I'm a minority and they'd want to kill me regardless. Why not give them trouble?
Black Lives Matter. ~ DYL ~ (On mobile)
SilvosForever posted...
I'll blame everyone who could have done a small thing to help prevent it, but chose not to.
I sincerely hope you've convinced everyone you know in real life to vote blue because every vote counts even more now.
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DrizztLink posted...
Well, as long as you're okay.

Sure, millions of other people will lose their rights, women will die in droves, but you personally should be able to skate so that's perfectly acceptable.

Hope you don't consider yourself a good person.

All of those things will happen if I personally dont vote? I dont hold that much power my guy. Im on your side and Im rooting/want Biden to take it. I have no incentive to vote. I wish voting had something like go vote and well give you a $10 prepaid card or free dozen donuts at DD or something. I am a good person.

shyguybry posted...
All of those things will happen if I personally dont vote? I dont hold that much power my guy. Im on your side and Im rooting/want Biden to take it. I have no incentive to vote. I wish voting had something like go vote and well give you a $10 prepaid card or free dozen donuts at DD or something. I am a good person.
The rights of tens of millions of people are on the line and you refuse to do anything unless maybe they toss a little cash your way.

So yes, you proved my point. Reconsider your opinion.
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FortuneCookie posted...
I wouldn't kill one innocent to save a thousand innocents. That's the way that it is.
That's just being bad at math.
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SilvosForever posted...
Until there's a paradigm shift within the GOP, every election from here on out will be the most important of our lives, with far-reaching REAL repercussions (and loss of current freedoms) every single time the GOP wins. It's nice to want a better situation, but for now we have to deal with the problem in our face.

Do you think the average voter sees it that way? Do you think well be able to convince them that they should be eternally afraid of the GOP, while the GOP is also trying to convince voters they should be eternally afraid of the Dems? Most people do not pay nearly that much attention, and eventually theyre just going to go numb from it all and not vote, or vote for the GOP. We cant keep making every election one where our democracy is at stake no matter how true it is, because eventually the average voter is going to think were crying wolf.

The best thing we can do is vote, but eventually dealing with the problem is very likely going to require a more violent solution. Faith that the system will eventually get us back on the rails is fine; blind faith to that making us ignore that the system may also fail is not.
Asherlee10 posted...
JFC. You're a real piece of work.

I mean, Im not lying. Trump was elected and life went on normal for me for the most part besides all of COVID. Bidens president now and life is going at the usual norm for me. You gotta stop creating enemies with anyone who doesnt do exactly as you do.

Horith posted...
Do you think the average voter sees it that way? Do you think well be able to convince them that they should be eternally afraid of the GOP, while the GOP is also trying to convince voters they should be eternally afraid of the Dems? Most people do not pay nearly that much attention, and eventually theyre just going to go numb from it all and not vote, or vote for the GOP. We cant keep making every election one where our democracy is at stake no matter how true it is, because eventually the average voter is going to think were crying wolf.

The best thing we can do is vote, but eventually dealing with the problem is very likely going to require a more violent solution. Faith that the system will eventually get us back on the rails is fine; blind faith to that making us ignore that the system may also fail is not.

I think the average voter is completely oblivious and apathetic to politics in general, and that one of the two parties (hint hint) is clearly trying to weaponize that apathy for their advantage.

When one party wants people to NOT vote and one party wants EVERYONE to vote - which of the two would you assume is probably better for the country?
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shyguybry posted...
You gotta stop creating enemies with anyone who doesnt do exactly as you do.
Says the guy okay with fascists making corpses out of people who lives their lives differently.
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Evening_Dragon posted...
That's just being bad at math.

Statistically, so is being upset at people who aren't voting in most states.

I'm only popping up cuz this is basically a continuation of stuff from the other thread from yesterday, but, I still can't believe this doesn't make sense to people. If you're in a solid red or solid blue state, which is most of the states, it's basically a statistical impossibility that your vote could matter.

Again, just using my state - which is solid red, up 10-15% on average for Republicans for the last 50+ years. You would need to sway 300k+ Republicans and Independents to switch, or convince at least that many NEW voters to vote Dem. That's literally not going to happen w/o major demographic shifts (ie old people dying).

I'll take being called lazy or apathetic or whatever, but to act like we are somehow actively contributing negatively is just wrong and silly.
"To be, or not to be - there is no such question. To be! But to be what...?"
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nekrodev posted...
I'll take being called lazy or apathetic or whatever, but to act like we are somehow actively contributing negatively is just wrong and silly
It is silly, because you're describing my own fucking county not that long ago.

It's now blue.

Guess how that happened?
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The only long-term solution is for one of the two parties to lose so soundly, so completely, that they effectively lose all voice in governance and have to change their policies. It happened hundreds of years ago with the whigs, and it can happen again. In that instance, the democratic umbrella would probably splinter into two new parties if the GOP faded away, one "centrist-moderate" group and one more progressive group.

But that's assuming the GOP goes on a loss-streak and the overton window shifts left. Every time the GOP wins it's a long-term setback to having more progressive parties in the country. The same could be said for the other side. If the Dems lost over and over and over, then the dem party itself becomes more conservative over time.

That's why EVERY election matters. Because policies and the thought war itself gradually shift over decades. All we can do is decide which direction it will slowly move.
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shyguybry posted...
I mean, Im not lying. Trump was elected and life went on normal for me for the most part besides all of COVID. Bidens president now and life is going at the usual norm for me. You gotta stop creating enemies with anyone who doesnt do exactly as you do.
So, whose alt is this?
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I'm in fucking South Carolina and I'll still be voting blue. What's your excuse nek?
Black Lives Matter. ~ DYL ~ (On mobile)
DrizztLink posted...
It is silly, because you're describing my own fucking county not that long ago.

It's now blue.

Guess how that happened?

In some places, you could maybe flip one district here or there, but I'm specifically talking about the state, in this case instance. In terms of my district, it's way worse - you'd need to flip it from a 65-35 split.
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Umbreon posted...
I'm in fucking South Carolina and I'll still be voting blue. What's your excuse nek?

Among others, that it won't make a difference. I'm also in South Carolina.
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Current Events » If existential fear won't get you to vote against Trump, then nothing will.
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