Classic-style JRPGs should just be called Turn Based Adventures

and CRPGs should be called "canned role playing games" because they only allow you an illusion of choice following set responses along predetermined story beats

That is not necessarily true. Also, at the very least you can heavily customize your character

really early RPGs like Ultima, Wizardry, and Might and Magic were a lot of dungeon crawling with blank slate PCs much like many tabletop games at the time. As the genre morphed into dragon warrior and final fantasy and the like, the namesake stuck around. But, you're mostly right.

Yeah, this is my take on it. I have been around since the beginning for all of this, and I think the names just kind of stuck. The original Final Fantasy was one of my absolute favorite NES games at the time. And Phantasy Star 2

I just want to say it's nice seeing someone name a Phantasy Star besides 4 which is usually the default favorite. I mean I get why but it is just a nice change of pace. My favorite is 3. I just love the whole generation aspect and it changing on who you marry but you keep your two cyborgs with you. I loved that game.

Also loved Final Fantasy from the start. I still remember the first game on NES near the end of my 8th grade year in school. A couple good friends of mine and I played the hell out of it that summer of 1990 between 8th and 9th grade.

I loved all 4 of the original ones. Only issue with 3 was how damn slow they walk.

Gotta ask, how old are you? I'm 47, as of today actually

What!? It's bsp's birthday??

Happy birthday, man!

Well, if anyone wants to give intelligent responses about what does and does not constitute an RPG

you can disagree if you want, but i wasn't kidding. what is the ultimate goal of roleplaying beyond freedom and immersion? minecraft offers both in spades. you have no set goal and can do literally whatever you want, be whatever you want. that village? raze it, pillage it, make it a homestead, setup a complex trade route along which you cultivate resources and never engage in active combat, turn it into a fortress and sic a platoon of iron golems on the neighboring pillager settlement, ignore it entirely . it's completely up to you to tell the story you want to tell and have the experience you want to have

i genuinely dislike the notion that "RPG" means "pick between a handful of prewritten dialogue responses (of which may or may not fit the RP youre trying to adhere to) to ultimately arrive at a predetermined conclusion (that very rarely has genuine impact on the overarching narrative of the game), according to a generally preset story role that invariably includes the player character in a grand narrative (they may or may not want to be involved in)"

like everyone's high on BG3 atm, but i literally hate that it starts you off (narratively speaking) with a literal life-or-death imperative quest and any sidetracking would seem (narratively speaking) detrimental to your player character

people think i'm joking when i say i preferred FFXIV 1.0, but how many mainstream MMORPGs allow you to progress the entire game as nothing but a crafting/gathering class? FFXIV1.0 did, and besides EVE, the most recent mainstream title that did so before that was what? SWG?

idk i just feel like there's beauty and unexplored depth in the minutiae of being something other than destined world savior, and i genuinely do not feel that "WRPGs" offer anything more than mostly meaningless dialogue responses and a generally shitty character creator over "JRPGs"

There is a difference between role playing, and choose your own adventure.

Role playing you often make a character or role and play out the story your dungeon master planned out.

With chose your own adventure you decide the path you take through the planned out story.

They often mix together, but can be separate things. Like role playing in the bed room you may dress as a French maid, but you usually just end up having sex, not cleaning.

I could be mistaken obviously, and if so I apologize.

They often mix together, but can be separate things. Like role playing in the bed room you may dress as a French maid, but you usually just end up having sex, not cleaning.

But as I grew older and had less and less time to play, I started to find the choice in CRPGs at least somewhat paralyzing

Awesome. She usually wants to be someone who is punished

My 17yo daughter gets like this. I just tell her to relax and enjoy. She is actually playing BG3 now

Awesome. She usually wants to be someone who is punished

Anyone here played Sea of Stars? It actually mitigates a lot of my complaints about turn based JRPGs. There are a lot less regular enemies, but they all hit hard. Timed button presses are crucial to playing well. And your MP is limited but goes back up when making regular attacks. As a result, you don't just mind numbingly choose "attack" over and over in regular battles. You still need to think, stay alert, and use magic.

Yeah. It was fun. Basically everyone says Chained Echoes is better, but I havent gotten to it yet.

I would not have suggested playing it without playing The Messenger first, though. Youll miss out on a lot. The Messenger is also a better game period IMO.

You're playing Sea of Stars, a game that was heavily criticized for having no actual customization. Compare this to FF6 where you can choose what weapons to equip, a wide range of relics that affect how a character deals damage, the Esper system which affects what magic they can cast, etc.

I finished The Messenger last week

Good deal. Thats such a well designed game. I also thought Sea of Stars music was a big step down, but hearing remixes of the few The Messenger tracks they reused was the highlight.

Yeah, the music in The Messenger was killer

But basically the worst thing a game can do to me is ask me to name an animal companion or something when the name will be permanent and I can't change it later.

Character creators / names being permanent are a huge pet peeve of mine. Like... just let me pick a preset and make up a name so I can get the goddamn game going, and then later let me revisit the character creator and put in a better name and get obsessive with it.

you can disagree if you want, but i wasn't kidding. what is the ultimate goal of roleplaying beyond freedom and immersion?

i genuinely dislike the notion that "RPG" means "pick between a handful of prewritten dialogue responses (of which may or may not fit the RP youre trying to adhere to) to ultimately arrive at a predetermined conclusion (that very rarely has genuine impact on the overarching narrative of the game), according to a generally preset story role that invariably includes the player character in a grand narrative (they may or may not want to be involved in)"

I mean there has to be a line drawn somewhere, otherwise you don't have any story at all. You just have a sandbox. Which is fine if you like sandboxes, but the appeal of something more structured is reactivity.

You can go into a sandbox and blow up an enemy fortress. But then it's on you to decide how the enemies respond. Do they surrender? Do they retreat? Did ignoring them doom a local village to oppression under them?

If you have to make up the consequences to your own actions you aren't really playing a game, but doing a creative writing exercise. >_>

this doesn't even make sense as a criticism lol. "they may or may not want to be involved in"? If you don't want to be involved in the plot then why are you playing the game? Why are you going to buy a game about destroying magic nazis and then criticize it for railroading you into fighting magic nazis instead of fucking off to some podunk to be a cobbler? >_> It seems like you're looking for life sims rather than anything actually story-based. <_<

Even in a pen-and-paper setting the worldbuilding is going to be limited to what your game master can think up. If you're dead set on being a black smith and not giving a shit about fighting Necromancer Nate the Undead Lord, but your game master has fuck all ideas on how to run a campaign about smithing, you're going to have awkward sessions >_>

Why are you going to buy a game about destroying magic nazis and then criticize it for railroading you into fighting magic nazis instead of fucking off to some podunk to be a cobbler