Current Events > Street Fighter VI reviews are coming out

(+) Yeah! (+)

Kitt posted...

This game makes me want to get into Street Fighter and actually try to get good.

If I could get Drive Rush combos down it'd be doable.

Still don't know the correct counterplay when you're corner trapped. From everything I've assessed it feels like a 33/33/33 situation (they can attack you, throw you, or Drive Impact you and that is very messy to deal with).

dave_is_slick posted...

Don't forget to do a D20 into an IT4 if you wanna do a certain combo.

Now that being said, I might actually pick up a Street Fighter game, this game looks like it is dripping with style.

I played the demo this weekend. Character creator is pretty amazing.

Yeah I wouldnt pay full price either knowing these games come with multiple releases over the next year or so and will likely be cheap by the end of the year. If I was big into fighting games and wanted to keep up with the online base I could see myself jumping in.

Will wait for Ultra Super Street Fighter 6 Remix Tournament edition

Solid_Sonic posted...

If I could get Drive Rush combos down it'd be doable.

Still don't know the correct counterplay when you're corner trapped. From everything I've assessed it feels like a 33/33/33 situation (they can attack you, throw you, or Drive Impact you and that is very messy to deal with).

It's kind of a guessing game like that. It tends to be the nature of fighting games. I've been playing the demo a lot, practicing against the computer; parrying can be really helpful so as long as they don't go for a throw. That or you can react against their Drive Impact with your own if you're prepared for it.

Well in older Street Fighters the counterplay was more cut and dry. If you expected a throw you could safely backdash or try to break it and otherwise all you have to do is ride out any offensive pressure.

Drive Impact throws a wrench in that because even if you block it you're going to be pinned to the wall so the counterplay ends up split between three options and makes corner pressure far more oppressive than it used to be. Drive Reversal or Drive Parry can counter opponents who attack, backdashing can beat throws, and throws can beat Drive Impacts but you have very little leeway in terms of intelligently countering these options and it seems more like dumb luck.

Solid_Sonic posted...

If I could get Drive Rush combos down it'd be doable.

Still don't know the correct counterplay when you're corner trapped. From everything I've assessed it feels like a 33/33/33 situation (they can attack you, throw you, or Drive Impact you and that is very messy to deal with).

It's actually not that bad because you're 50/50 between attack and throw - drive impact is 100% reactable and you can answer with your own DI unless you're in burnout. So your options are reversal, block/tech, or poke with a fast button so you can recover fast enough to counter DI. Reversal loses to shimmy and can lose to DI, depending on character. Block/tech is a 50/50, tech loses to shimmy, able to respond to DI either way though, and poke loses to meaty, but wins against DI.

Is this one going to be more interesting as a spectator game than 5 at least?
Because 5 was so boring. Getting rid of chip kills sucked a lot of the tension out of it.

ViewtifulJoe posted...

Is this one going to be more interesting as a spectator game than 5 at least?

Probably

I actually might buy a fight stick what's a good one for the PS5

Irony posted...

I actually might buy a fight stick what's a good one for the PS5

Anything by Hori is a go-to.

Can't wait. I just wish Dudley was a part of the starting roster.

Irony posted...

I actually might buy a fight stick what's a good one for the PS5

I like qanba sticks, the new obsidian looks incredible. I'm planning to pick up a hitbox in future though, so that might be an option.

One other thing about DI that gets under my skin is that you can confirm into them if you use light attacks against someone trying to DI you, allowing you to convert from jabs to a DI after they already committed to it and it means they have to eat it.

Being able to read someone doing something and respond to it is fine but I don't think you should be able to get a full punish combo because someone else had the read and you just happened to be using attacks that recover fast enough to turn them into a DI.

My solution to this would be if a DI absorbs another DI the effect pushes the opponent away instead of gives them a crumple. Crumples should only happen for getting the read on a normal attack.

As an aside if you score a perfect parry you incur a damage scaling penalty, which is kind of odd.

ViewtifulJoe posted...

Is this one going to be more interesting as a spectator game than 5 at least?
Because 5 was so boring. Getting rid of chip kills sucked a lot of the tension out of it.

Chip kills suck and removing it meant more comeback moments.

Pogo_Marimo posted...

Chip kills suck and removing it meant more comeback moments.

For real. Who the fuck wants chip kills?

Solid_Sonic posted...

Oh...I guess sort of.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/7/7/5/AAA4MKAAEhfv.png

We're both right.

I actually like the new logo, because of that neat detail. The font used for the words Street Fighter is still awful, though.

ViewtifulJoe posted...

Is this one going to be more interesting as a spectator game than 5 at least?
Because 5 was so boring. Getting rid of chip kills sucked a lot of the tension out of it.

Dude no, that's not the reason 5 was boring to watch dude. In fact, chips not killing made it more exciting because now the player actually has to land a actual hit or use up their full meter for a Super in order to kills rather than spamming safe special moves. 5 was boring as fuck to watch because everyone was doing the same Optimal Combo route over and over again. There was little room for self-expression because a lot of the combos were so easy to do. 6 fixes this up by giving you a shit ton of options rather than taking it away like 5 did with its V trigger system.

Pogo_Marimo posted...

Chip kills suck and removing it meant more comeback moments.

Chip kills do not suck, they turn low health situations from merely disadvantageous to actual peril.
A 'comeback' means less if there was less real danger in the first place.

A few blocks followed by two confirms is way less exciting than a character that would have exploded after a gentle nudge successfully threading the needle through the projectiles and EX DPs.

Prestoff posted...

Dude no, that's not the reason 5 was boring to watch dude.

Oh I know, I just called out my least favorite part.
I remember the Mikas and the Nashs and the Karins. Everyone doing their one good combo, 3 frame minimum links blending it together even more. The boring v system stuff.
I miss the heinous strategies. I don't want to see a clean hit or a super every time. Show me a villain spamming Hidden Missiles for a win or something.

Ah, fair enough. If your complaint is the lack of diversity in matches, I can see your point.

Prestoff posted...

Ah, fair enough. If your complaint is the lack of diversity in matches, I can see your point.

Yeah, unpopular opinion but I wanted to see more pressure.
Not pressure as in "Oh, he is applying pressure to his opponent with a series of consecutive strikes in the neutral."
I mean stuff like Dhalsim setting the floor on fire, F.A.N.G. poisoning the opponent and Abigail being able to bulldoze his way through blocks. Clock's tickin', come up with something fast kinds of pressure. I'm still disappointed F.A.N.G. never really got off the ground apart from that one guy a while ago.

ViewtifulJoe posted...

Yeah, unpopular opinion but I wanted to see more pressure.
Not pressure as in "Oh, he is applying pressure to his opponent with a series of consecutive strikes in the neutral."
I mean stuff like Dhalsim setting the floor on fire, F.A.N.G. poisoning the opponent and Abigail being able to bulldoze his way through blocks. Clock's tickin', come up with something fast kinds of pressure. I'm still disappointed F.A.N.G. never really got off the ground apart from that one guy a while ago.

It's because people absolutely hate characters that can actually control screen space. See early Guilty Gear Testament and Zato.

There's just a high chance of them turning in to "Oh you made a mistake, you don't get to play the game any more" characters if done too well.

always wait for at least 2 season passes before picking up a mainline fighting game in a franchise like this.

Playing the demo and really enjoying it. So it a buy.

The drive mechanics along with how people respond to burnout is gonna provide a lot of explosive matches.

Holy shit fight sticks are expensive

Irony posted...

Holy shit fight sticks are expensive

Yeah. If you are a crafty person you can save a decent bit of money by building one yourself, but you still need to buy a board and components, will run you about $100 minimum most likely.

Irony posted...

Holy shit fight sticks are expensive

Unless you're an old hand at fighting games, don't bother. A standard controller or fight pad will be easier to learn with than a fight stick from the beginning. Only reason I use one is because I have the muscle memory from growing up playing SF2 in arcades.

That said Hori makes a very nice mini arcade stick for the PS4/5 and Switch that runs about 30 to 50 USD.

R_Jackal posted...

Unless you're an old hand at fighting games, don't bother. A standard controller or fight pad will be easier to learn with than a fight stick from the beginning. Only reason I use one is because I have the muscle memory from growing up playing SF2 in arcades.

That said Hori makes a very nice mini arcade stick for the PS4/5 and Switch that runs about 30 to 50 USD.

I tried learning UMvC3 on pad back in the day and just couldn't do it. Fighting games felt much more natural to me with a stick. It's all preference, but you definitely pay a premium for this particular preference, but it's also a nice little accessory.

R_Jackal posted...

Unless you're an old hand at fighting games, don't bother. A standard controller or fight pad will be easier to learn with than a fight stick from the beginning. Only reason I use one is because I have the muscle memory from growing up playing SF2 in arcades.

That said Hori makes a very nice mini arcade stick for the PS4/5 and Switch that runs about 30 to 50 USD.

While I was playing the beta I was having the exact same issue that I was having with ersona 4 Arena Ultimax were there some moves I can only manage to pull off with the d-pad while others I'm only able to pull off with the analog stick. I'm actually hoping an arcade stick will help with that

I'll wait for the Turbo Edition

Dalthine posted...

A lot of fighting games are starting to put in the work to help casuals get in. Some of the Guilty Gear games have a control mode that contexts based on range and auto combos, Dragonball FighterZ has auto combos, and Granblue has specials on one-button use a la Smash, just based on cooldowns.

SF6 as I understand has two different versions of casual controls, with two different levels of what it does for you (only one was available in the beta but they had the other planned). The lesser of the two I think is even useable online, but you do a little less damage. Someone following it closer might be able to clarify.

But this isn't what FGs need to get casuals in. Having the game play itself (badly) for you doesn't teach the player how to actually play fighting games, it just extends the time that casuals spend on online until they get fed up getting stomped by people with basic fundamentals.

Making execution easier won't teach a casual about frame advantage, footsies, pressure etc. Its not combos or quarter circles holding casuals back, its the game beneath the game. A player of average skill could probably wash a scrub with just sweeps, and giving scrubs free, unoptimal combos won't tell them why they got washed by sweeps, nor tell them what they should to stop it next time.

One of the better tutorials/new player experiences is in Fantasy Strike. The game has a simplified control scheme, yes, but the actusl work the game puts to making it accessible for casuals is how it breaks down core concepts in an digestable way. Hitboxes are big, distinct and clear, movesets are small but deep and the tutorial actually delves into stuff like frames and mix. Stuff like that majes a game soooo much more casual friendly than a bunch of combo trials filled with dumb unoptimised combos.

IceCreamOnStero posted...

But this isn't what FGs need to get casuals in. Having the game play itself (badly) for you doesn't teach the player how to actually play fighting games, it just extends the time that casuals spend on online until they get fed up getting stomped by people with basic fundamentals.

Making execution easier won't teach a casual about frame advantage, footsies, pressure etc. Its not combos or quarter circles holding casuals back, its the game beneath the game. A player of average skill could probably wash a scrub with just sweeps, and giving scrubs free, unoptimal combos won't tell them why they got washed by sweeps, nor tell them what they should to stop it next time.

One of the better tutorials/new player experiences is in Fantasy Strike. The game has a simplified control scheme, yes, but the actusl work the game puts to making it accessible for casuals is how it breaks down core concepts in an digestable way. Hitboxes are big, distinct and clear, movesets are small but deep and the tutorial actually delves into stuff like frames and mix. Stuff like that majes a game soooo much more casual friendly than a bunch of combo trials filled with dumb unoptimised combos.

The problem is none of that shit matters to casuals and it didn't to any of us when we started. We all wanted to hit buttons and see cool shit happen, and flex on our friends. No footsies or anything involved. Modern Controls do an absolutely excellent job at that.

The community bringing up the stuff constantly is what keeps casuals out, though I admit the tutorials don't help much either, but that's why having good PvE modes is so important--it lets them get the basics down in low stress.

R_Jackal posted...

The problem is none of that shit matters to casuals and it didn't to any of us when we started. We all wanted to hit buttons and see cool shit happen, and flex on our friends. No footsies or anything involved. Modern Controls do an absolutely excellent job at that.

The community bringing up the stuff constantly is what keeps casuals out, though I admit the tutorials don't help much either, but that's why having good PvE modes is so important--it lets them get the basics down in low stress.

But that stuff has to come up. Once a casual goes online they're going to have to come across and familiarise themselves with these concepts if they don't want to hit a wall.

The bad way to deal with this is how most FGs handle it, hope the players figure it out for themselves and then be surprised why new players drop the games.

IceCreamOnStero posted...

But that stuff has to come up. Once a casual goes online they're going to have to come across and familiarise themselves with these concepts if they don't want to hit a wall.

The bad way to deal with this is how most FGs handle it, hope the players figure it out for themselves and then be surprised why new players drop the games.

The thing is, people in the FGC equating bringing people in with slamming them with all this knowledge so they can hold up right away as like a "hit the ground running" thing. Looking at it, if I had to just now get in to Fighting Games for the first time I'd probably cut and run as soon as people started talking about frame advantages and the like because it's just not interesting. At all. It is helpful to know, but that's the thing: You don't need to.

No matter what you think all that shit doesn't help too much unless you're aiming to go pro. I gave up on frame data and the like about... 15 years ago and I can still hit plat equivalent rank pretty reliably on most fighters just feeling stuff out.

For a casual player, all that information is wasted essentially. Having an in-game resource to see it/a "professional/advanced" tutorial in-game would be cool that explains it though.

I've brought a lot of people in to fighting games honestly, and the one thing I've almost universally seen is that as the burden of knowledge goes up, interest goes down, so starting with the most pure and simple basics and gradually increasing until you can feel them losing interest is the best approach I've had, and letting them figure it out/ask from there. Dumping all the info in-game would likely just scare folks off though due to how definitive it all sounds.

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]


The first set of DLC characters look very boring outside of maybe aki

I mean unless you like the costumes a bunch it's usually better to skip season passes for fighters and just buy who/what you want for whoever you(want to) play.

Or you just wanna support the company, but Capcom is doin pretty well lately so I wouldn't feel guilty if you skip.

warlock7735 posted...

I tried learning UMvC3 on pad back in the day and just couldn't do it. Fighting games felt much more natural to me with a stick. It's all preference, but you definitely pay a premium for this particular preference, but it's also a nice little accessory.

Same with me. The only fighter I played until the last couple years was Dead or Alive on Xbox 360 with a pad, but when tried the hobby again buying an arcade stick was one of the things that legitimately helped me stick with it. It makes the game a more enjoyably tactile experience even if the learning curve was higher.

Has anybody ever gotten a commission done at https://thearcadestick.com/

R_Jackal posted...

The thing is, people in the FGC equating bringing people in with slamming them with all this knowledge so they can hold up right away as like a "hit the ground running" thing.

Its more about giving players a pathway into understanding the game properly. Most FGs don't tell players what they're doing wrong or what doing right looks like, and the average casual probably isn't invested enough by that point to go online and look it up. What that results in is players dropping the game before they can get into it, so they can go back to games that actually present them with a recognisable skill curve.

Looking at it, if I had to just now get in to Fighting Games for the first time I'd probably cut and run as soon as people started talking about frame advantages and the like because it's just not interesting. At all. It is helpful to know, but that's the thing: You don't need to.

No matter what you think all that shit doesn't help too much unless you're aiming to go pro. I gave up on frame data and the like about... 15 years ago and I can still hit plat equivalent rank pretty reliably on most fighters just feeling stuff out.

But that's a pretty poor comparison. It sounds like you're a veteran who already has good enough fundamentals. Tutorials aren't for people like that, they're for people who don't understand how to play the game beyond mashing.

For a casual player, all that information is wasted essentially. Having an in-game resource to see it/a "professional/advanced" tutorial in-game would be cool that explains it though.

You don't necessarily need to dump a bunch of frame data tables in one go, but just introducing the concepts of being plus and minus and stuff like that would go a long way to getting casuals towards the competency stage. At that point you can leave them alone because they've reached a point where they'll seek out the info if necessary. But the problem is FGs make no attempt to make a new player competent.

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]

It takes some getting used to but, in my opinion, feels better in the end. Good luck.