Board 8 > Spider-Man topic (spoilers, none in first post)

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XIII_rocks
12/15/21 4:06:19 PM
#1:


To prevent the mcu topic turning into a heavily redacted CIA document
(Reposting because I criminally forgot the hyphen)

Fucking yes

One of the best MCU movies, and up there with Endgame as something to enjoy in the cinema

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XIII_rocks
12/15/21 4:24:59 PM
#2:


So

Spoilers are gonna start

Right now

Stop

OK let's go

Willem Dafoe is the man in this, and the fights with him did their best (while I think still being constrained by the MCU's overall lack of really vicious fight scenes) to match the brutality of the fight with Tobey Maguire Spider-Man in the first movie. That was something I really liked. The final fight particularly was so aggressive and nasty, and I love that

What I liked overall about this was how weighty it was. I previously said I wasn't as high on the other Holland movies as some because both him and the movies themselves feel flimsy and lightweight, and the charisma of RDJ hung over both of them - for all of TASM2's flaws, it feels like a big movie from the first 5 minutes, and that was never true of the Holland Spider-Man movies until this one. This movie was not at all flimsy, and Holland himself was leagues ahead of any previous performance. It felt weighty and somehow real despite all the crazy multiverse shit going on

May dying was horrific but I'm glad they did it, the movie is far stronger because of it, and the finale is clever on several different levels.

Stuff I didn't like - not much, but Jamie Foxx being suddenly "cool Jamie Foxx character" as opposed to the nerd he used to be felt a bit jarring, and Sandman was a fucking charisma vacuum and stood out like a sore thumb among the other 5 bad guys (though you could kind of see that coming). Also thought they could have done more to differentiate the three Spidermen in the final battle because I had almost no idea which one was which.

Two credits scenes were both good for different reasons. The second one was completely unexpected. Did not expect unreleased Dr. Strange 2 footage/trailer.

Obviously all the fanservice shit got a laugh out of me. I think...maybe some of it became a little cheap, but I have to admit I still loved it in the moment

I'm not sure how this will stand the test of time because it's so reliant on the big moments and the fanservice, and that can wear off on repeat viewings once the initial thrill is gone, but there is an awesome big-hearted movie underneath it all

Last thing: Civil War is still a Cap movie, he is the central driving character, but it (necessarily) loses focus on that and spins a lot of different plates - Iron Man, Natasha, Black Panther, Zemo all have their arcs.

This has a LOT of shit going on, but it is still absolutely Tom Holland's movie, and everything in it - all the fanservice and the extra characters - they all lead back to him. That's what might allow it to stand beyond its fanservice moments

Just some scattered thoughts, the adrenaline is pumping still. So good


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Nanis23
12/15/21 5:26:50 PM
#3:


Just came back home after seeing it.
I am not huge on Marvel movies, most of them are generic and overrated imo, and I really hated the first Iron Ma..I mean, the first Spider Man movie, and only watched the second one this weekend and though it was just "ok"

But this one was great. Like 9/10 great. It's not easy to excite me with fanservice or references/easter eggs, but they pulled it off perfectly. I loved how the entire crowd in the cinema clapped and cheered when Andrew showed up (and did the same thing when Tobey showed up)

Wasn't really a fan of the memory loss at the end (I usually hate this trope in general) but I am sure they will fix it at some later movie so it's not such a big deal

Humor scenes with the other two Spider Man were perfect too

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Pokalicious
12/16/21 1:57:49 AM
#4:


Tag for tomorrow

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BetrayedTangy
12/16/21 7:56:17 PM
#5:


I actually wasn't that crazy about this one. There was a ton I liked but I think it's sitting squarely in the middle as far as Holland's movies go.

First off I'm so tired of these big info dumps we get pre release. Everything that got big reactions in the theater, would've been so much bigger if no one suspected any of it.

Now I will say I absolutely loved seeing all the villains here. They all played off each other really well and Wilhem Dafoe put in a killer performance as usual. I do think Jamie Foxx was a bit jarring, but I'd think I'd rather that than seeing Nerdy Blue Electro again.

Seeing all the Spider-Men together was also really cool and honestly I'd say this cements Garfield as my favorite. Holland did still put in some serious work though, especially during May's death and while fighting Goblin. Plus I'm genuinely curious about where Peter goes from here, now that all of his supporting characters are out of the picture.

There's still something that I felt was missing from it though and I just can't put my finger on it. I'm not sure if it was the pacing or lack of consistency, but I just can't help but feel some lack of potential. I definitely need to think about it more.

Also wtf was the point of that Eddie Brock end credit scene? Not only does it make Venom 2's end credit bogus, but it doesn't make any sense. Eddie has no clue who Peter is. If they wanted a symbiote tease, maybe they just couldn't get Topher Grace, but we're getting Gorr next year, who could just as easily bring one in. I thought the Kraven and Scorpion Tease was a lot cooler.

Anyway I thought it was good, I just think the hype got a little out of hand for it.

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Mega Mana
12/16/21 10:52:43 PM
#6:


I loved it. There was so much to love that I loved so much of it. I had only minor quibbles that my brain is focusing on for some dumb reason (Alfred Molina's ever-changing wig, Lizard and Sandman felt very ancillary but that's also fair as their characters felt ancillary, Ned doing magic and opening portals reminded me of The Flash's Cisco going from tech best friend to best friend who also has latent portal powers, not getting Spider-Man 2's landlord for an insane final cameo), but like... there's 99% more things my brain just got sheer joy from that it's all... it's all just a giant tornado of moments I can't latch onto long without jumping to something else I loved.

Favorite sweetest moments OTTOMH:
  • Andrew Garfield saving MJ
  • "The power of the sun... in the palm of my hand." Just... ugh, with Happy Hogan at the end, too, it's insane that with all the Spider-Man history in here, like, how crazy different a universe this is because of Stark and his arc reactor. And fixing the chip and bringing back Otto? Loved.
  • Pretty much everything with the three Peters, especially talking about Uncle Ben.
Favorite hardest moments OTTOMH:
  • Giving us, the audience,an Uncle Ben moment. Like, that's the first time ever we had an attachment to one of the most important people in Peter's life and can feel that rawness more than a guy set up to introduce the mantra and pass away in the first thirty minutes.
  • The heaviness of that Spider-Sense before Dafoe's turn. We knew things would go to shit soon, but just the way that was portrayed and all that followed... oh man.
  • The freaking bandage. Such a small thing, but so important to Peter.
  • The backstab.
  • Did I mention Garfield saving MJ?
Favorite funniest moments:
  • Pretty much everything with the three Peters, especially how Peter shot web
  • Sandman and Electro comparing notes
  • Spider-Man overriding Doc Ock's arms the first time
  • Pretty much anytime the villains interacted in the cells
Favorite nostalgia/fanservice moments:
  • Lizard and Spider-Man fighting in the lab after going through the portal felt quickly reminiscent of the Stan Lee Amazing Spider-Man cameo, just enough of a familiarity without a direct homage.
  • Just the cast itself, Molina/Dafoe/Garfield/McGuire kiiiilled it. That goblin laugh.
  • C'mon. I don't care that it was a simple cameo. CHARLIE COX


Two silly things of note while they're on my mind:

  1. Doctor Strange never asks to be called doctor for good reason (unlike Osborn and Octavius): he is still a shitty-ass arrogant doctor. This whole thing could've been avoided if he told Spider-Man the risks and potential side-effects of the procedure before he started a live operation on his patient.
  2. Flash Thompson helped MJ and Ned get into MIT, and Spider-Man didn't even come swing him to school for two weeks or call him his best friend. After seeing his terrible blonde hair, I wouldn't be surprised if Venom Flash Thompson became a thing... especially with the jokes about Peter's best friend trying to kill him and dying in his arms...

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Mega Mana
12/16/21 11:13:38 PM
#7:


Like... I think this might be my favorite Spider-Man movie and one of my favorite MCU movies.

There is a toooonnn in here to like, and it also brings out some of the best parts of the Raimi/Garfield movies without having to deal with a lot of the stuff that hasn't aged well at all. Willem Dafoe is at the absolute peak, doing Green Goblin stronger and scarier than his original outing somehow. There's no Topher Grace, no montage of Peter Parker celebrating his powers being gone, no James Franco ham, no Kirsten Dunst, the cameos were MCU related and not hosts from The Soup.

Also, also, also... I loved that Happy Hogan was in the scene with Matt Murdock, and that he needs a really good lawyer. I really really hope there's a short made with Jon Favreau and Elden Henson just for the sheer silliness of Foggy Nelson representing Foggy Nelson.

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Murphiroth
12/16/21 11:47:41 PM
#8:


Super impressed with how well paced this was and how much they managed to do with such a large cast.
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XIII_rocks
12/17/21 1:35:10 AM
#9:


Mega Mana posted...
Lizard and Spider-Man fighting in the lab after going through the portal felt quickly reminiscent of the Stan Lee Amazing Spider-Man cameo, just enough of a familiarity without a direct homage.

Caught this too. Definitely felt it was deliberate

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XIII_rocks
12/17/21 1:37:29 AM
#10:


Mega Mana posted...
Willem Dafoe is at the absolute peak, doing Green Goblin stronger and scarier than his original outing somehow

Yeah I also felt he outdid his original performance which is bonkers really

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SwiftyDC
12/17/21 2:49:02 AM
#11:


Best superhero movie, it was amazing.

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ChaosTonyV4
12/17/21 9:38:21 AM
#12:


You know Im something of a scientist myself.

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JackMan
12/17/21 10:22:47 AM
#13:


I liked it overall, but I also felt like there were a lot of missed opportunities. Doc Ock says that Maguire is 'all grown up' so they're not pretending he's still as young as he was in the films, but they also don't really say anything about what he's done since the third film. Ditto for Garfield, other than that he's got a few anger problems now. Would have been nice to allude to some adventures we didn't get to see. But Garfield saving MJ from the fall and Maguire saving Osborne from being impaled with his glider again were nice bits of closure for both of them.

Also, the fact that we only got the two Spider-Men. The fun thing about Spider-Verse was that all the Spider-People were so different from each other, whereas the three Peters were so similar that, once the initial excitement of seeing them all together wore off, it got a bit tepid. Would have been cool for some more to show up, even if just during the finale before Strange cast the new spell.

I thought it was weird too when Strange showed back up near the end and MJ was like 'look, he's saving them!', but wasn't Strange's issue with Peter messing with their fate and screwing up the universe they came from and not that he didn't think Peter could do it?

And yeah, the whole Venom part was super frustrating. I was really hoping he was gonna stick around somehow (or at least, y'know, show up and do something). Unless they're still planning to do that with the part left behind, because it would be weird for there to be a separate MCU Venom.

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ScepterOfLove
12/17/21 10:29:16 AM
#14:


Saw it last night and my brain is still processing the hype but my kneejerk reaction is it's my favorite MCU movie and in the conversation for greatest comic book movie of all time
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Mega Mana
12/17/21 11:53:55 AM
#15:


JackMan posted...


Also, the fact that we only got the two Spider-Men. The fun thing about Spider-Verse was that all the Spider-People were so different from each other, whereas the three Peters were so similar that, once the initial excitement of seeing them all together wore off, it got a bit tepid. Would have been cool for some more to show up, even if just during the finale before Strange cast the new spell.

I'm very happy it just stuck to the movies we've had. It didn't need to be anything more than that for this movie, especially BECAUSE Spider-Verse exists. There's another Spider-Verse on the way and I wouldn't want to take anything away from that franchise by doing something even more similar here. Let Spider-Verse be experimental and go through the comics' catalogue and ideascape for things to do; let No Way Home enjoy taking twenty years' worth of movies and letting them wrap things up and enjoy waaaay more story and moments than I'd ever anticipated going in.

Edit: If the MCU does want to go forward with this, though, I'd rather see it in Doctor Strange or more What If.

Edit Edit: One of the biggest problems with the Clone Wars was how it just kept adding more and more and more diluting what the original identity crisis was more about, just adding things because they could and it was cool.

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Not Dave
12/17/21 12:17:14 PM
#16:


this movie is so fucking good

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ninkendo
12/17/21 1:41:46 PM
#17:


There was a lady in the front row clapping and screaming at the top of her lungs for every little reveal

Wanted to throw something at her

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ChaosTonyV4
12/17/21 1:50:55 PM
#18:


Everyone around me was clapping and yelling for each reveal, even my homie I went with lol.

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XIII_rocks
12/17/21 1:53:25 PM
#19:


I had a great theatre for it - I was worried because sometimes busy cinemas in Qatar can be a nightmare. People don't respect it, one time a kid played games on his phone at full volume etc. I was hoping because it was opening night everyone there was a fan and I was right. Lots of whooping and cheering but nothing that distracted from the movie, only added to the experience. I don't think I missed any dialogue for instance.

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ShatteredElysium
12/17/21 2:00:41 PM
#20:


I deliberately picked the smallest auditorium in the cinema to try avoid that. I don't mind it in small doses but some people are way over the top with it. I think the one I picked out had like 5 rows / 40 seats.
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HanOfTheNekos
12/17/21 3:03:22 PM
#21:


I'll say more when I get home, but u was disappointed. I have mixed feelings. Worst of the 3 spideys

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HanOfTheNekos
12/17/21 3:58:34 PM
#22:


I'm going to spoiler this post so that people who loved it don't have to be bogged down by my critiques, but I will simply say that, the more I'm sitting on it afterward, the less fondly I feel.

Prepare yourself for disappointment, and you'll never be disappointed. I prepared myself to think this movie was going to try to be too much and come out feeling pretty meh, and I ended up being right for for the wrong reasons.

To start with - they tricked me. The first half of this movie was excellent and I was starting to feel like the movie could really end highly in my rankings. Then Ned did magic and the Spideys showed up and it became schlock.

Utter schlock.

There's something to be said for taking drips of nostalgia and references, even heavy doses of it, and using that as a medium to bring an audience into emotional investment. There's also something to be said for losing track of any sort of depth or meaning and becoming a pastiche.

It just really felt like there was no purpose to the other spideys aside from making jokes and references and getting people excited off of nostalgia. We didn't need that. Any of that. At best, it gave Andrew Garfield a moment to save MJ and make up for his two movies. Cool. Whatever.

Curing the villains was unnecessary. So unnecessary. And Peter didn't need other spideys to get him past Aunt May's death or stop him from killing Goblin.

WE ALREADY HAD DOC OCK. We ALREADY HAD a sympathetic science nerd who understood the error of unchecked scientific pursuit there. Somebody who understood how passion can lead to so much danger. AND HE LOST HIS WIFE! HE KNEW WHAT IT WAS LIKE TO LOSE SOMEONE.

There was a really amazing story being written here about how the villains fuck off and grab the spell and get some distance, and how the person to be there for Peter was Doc Ock. He still gets the same "it was worth it because you helped me" deal, where Doc Ock can return to his time and help Spidey stop him from destroying Manhattan just like he did in the actual movie.

Spidey didn't need other Spideys because he already had help in Doc Ock and Sandman, who had shown that he just wanted to go home. And this is a dumb gripe since it's me writing what I think should have happened, but it's so easy to have Sandman get convinced to turn on Spidey and Doc Ock through some dramatic irony of thinking if he goes back, he'll just die, when we know as an audience that he survives his film.

I mean every one of them is going to die except for Lizard and Sandman, right? The theme of the movie tried to be sacrifice for the sake of others, except, you know, the half of the movie that was 'what if we made the spiderman pointing meme into a movie'. Doc Ock should have been the one to teach that, knowing that he'd be sent back just to die to his own machine. And you can still have Goblin blow up the spell and Peter make that sacrifice in the end.

Instead we got corny fanservice from two Spidermen who added nothing but jokes to the movie. I almost vomited at "You're Amazing!"

Spidey has been my favorite hero for most of my life and I was beyond thrilled by both of his mcu movies, but this one really suffered by trying to be a worse The Force Awakens.

If they wanted to have more than one Spidey, then they missed out on a chance to have a Miles Morales, native to the mcu, get bit by a bug that crossed over from the multiverse. And throw that in a post-credits scene, I don't care.

I know a lot of this became me doing some dumb "here is what should have happened", but at the very least, I will leave off by saying it got derivative, corny, and lost its purpose just to hand it through heavy-handed telling.

Schlock.

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ZenOfThunder
12/17/21 4:12:38 PM
#23:


shit ruled

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HanOfTheNekos
12/17/21 4:23:11 PM
#24:


Oh yeah. Matt Murdock's appearance was so incredibly hype and I loved it and it was probably my favorite moment of the movie, and I completely forgot it happened until reading this topic because the movie let me down so hard.

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Grand Kirby
12/17/21 4:30:06 PM
#25:


ninkendo posted...
There was a lady in the front row clapping and screaming at the top of her lungs for every little reveal

Wanted to throw something at her
That was basically every single person in the theater I was in and it was great. This worked well as an "event" movie experience where the energy of the crowd made it a lot of fun.

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TheRock1525
12/17/21 5:57:12 PM
#26:


HanOfTheNekos posted...
Schlock

So this movie is perfect for me.

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Leonhart4
12/17/21 10:34:20 PM
#27:


The MCU did the impossible: it made a One More Day type storyline good

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Leonhart4
12/17/21 10:34:54 PM
#28:


Also everyone in the theater cheered at the Andrew Garfield reveal and went crazy at the Tobey Maguire reveal

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TheRock1525
12/17/21 10:35:45 PM
#29:


Did they de-age Maguire?

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Leonhart4
12/17/21 10:42:38 PM
#30:


TheRock1525 posted...
Did they de-age Maguire?

Nope, he's older, although it's barely even acknowledged.

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ScareChan
12/18/21 2:37:20 AM
#31:


it was very fan fic, but it was fun. I just don't get how Venom got booped in and booped out when the spell was supposed to work the way it did. But I am hype for symbiote.

I appreciated how they handled May though

Oh no! She's down by what's definitely a killing atta-- oh. She's walking it off before Peter is she's fine.
...Oh no she just said "With great power comes great responsib--" yup and she's down. Okay, well fuck.

To expect it, then get your hopes up long enough that she's fine then drop the hammer line that you know what comes next was done well.

Also Danny Rojas bartender

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TheRock1525
12/18/21 3:35:25 AM
#32:


They missed the perfect opportunity for Topher Grace Venom to show up only for Tom Hardy Venom to show up and bite his head off.

But, like, off screen so it can stay PG-13.

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ZenOfThunder
12/18/21 8:08:14 AM
#33:


ScareChan posted...
it was very fan fic, but it was fun. I just don't get how Venom got booped in and booped out when the spell was supposed to work the way it did. But I am hype for symbiote.

they handwaved this one in the Venom 2 post-credits; Venom basically said that all symbiotes across all dimensions are connected in some way and share infinite knowledge, implying he is aware of the events of Spider-Man 3. He then very briefly shares this knowledge with Eddie

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Mega Mana
12/18/21 11:04:27 AM
#34:


Leonhart4 posted...
The MCU did the impossible: it made a One More Day type storyline good

Yes. Right? Insane!

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HanOfTheNekos
12/18/21 12:08:39 PM
#35:


Morning after gripes:

Maguire and Garfield were pointless characters. They were so unneeded.

Spidey needs help? As previously mentioned, he already saved Doc Ock. Sandman would be on his side if he learned the others didn't want to press the button to send him back. Ned and MJ. Fucking Happy. And hey, they introduced Daredevil in the movie - would've been great to loop him in if Happy could do anything to help.

Spidey needs someone to guide him through dealing with loss? Well, let's take a look at characters in this movie who have dealt with the loss of someone close. Again, Doc Ock. Again, Happy, hello? He was also close with me. Doctor Strange is a good choice as well. Oh, and there's one more person who has dealt with loss and had a movie about learning to move on without the person they lost. It was even an uncle figure. Who was it again? Oh yeah.

Peter Parker.

I won't say the May death was done poorly at all. I mean, it put him in prime position to be like "I have no parents, I have no aunt", but you know, maybe if they used Happy a bit more in this movie (he was pretty phenomenal in the bits he was in), then there's an avenue there.

Oh. Well.

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skullbone
12/18/21 3:55:14 PM
#36:


I was expecting some sort of closure for Tobey and Andrew, especially after Tobey's line that his relationship with MJ is complicated. The fact that we didn't see anything makes me wonder if they're considering future projects with them like an animated show or something.

At the same time it wasn't really their movie so we don't NEED that kind of resolution but I would have appreciated it.

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Leonhart4
12/18/21 3:59:10 PM
#37:


Yeah, I don't expect them to do anything with that. I think they were just designed to be foils and complements for Holland's situation.

One of the great conflicts of Spider-Man is the dichotomy of being both Peter Parker and Spider-Man. It felt like Garfield had become Spider-Man at the expense of being Peter, and vice-versa for Tobey.

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SwiftyDC
12/18/21 4:10:15 PM
#38:


Watched it again! Man, the theatre was sooo hyped on Friday night.

The one small complaint that I have that hit me the 2nd time through and not the 1st, is Tobey not "spider-sensing" Goblin's stab.

Doesn't matter though, this has never happened in cinema before. Connecting the past and the present in a movie. Nothing comes close to this type of cross-over in a film. It was very fan-service-y... but they did it the right way. Other minor notes, I really do appreciate Dafoe's performance as Green Goblin, so fucking good. And Garfield probably stole the show as being the "best" Spider-man in this film, IMO.

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ZenOfThunder
12/18/21 4:18:31 PM
#39:


imo Garfield was always the best Spider-Man despite me really not liking both of his films. Maguire was a better Peter Parker. Tom Holland is mid-tier for both but definitely stepped up in this one

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LinkMarioSamus
12/18/21 4:43:12 PM
#40:


Won't watch this movie until it comes on TV but good to see appreciation for Willem Dafoe.

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ZenOfThunder
12/18/21 4:45:46 PM
#41:


best part of the post-credits:

THE CHAOS DIMENSIOOOOOON

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/1/9/5/AAHLcRAACtob.jpg

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Mega Mana
12/18/21 5:48:34 PM
#42:


ZenOfThunder posted...
best part of the post-credits:

THE CHAOS DIMENSIOOOOOON

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/1/9/5/AAHLcRAACtob.jpg

He wants to take you for a ride

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#43
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MrGreenonion
12/18/21 10:03:14 PM
#44:


XIII_rocks posted...
Jamie Foxx being suddenly "cool Jamie Foxx character" as opposed to the nerd he used to be felt a bit jarring
He was changed by the MCU's different energy. Remember, all the electricity in the world is generated by arc reactors now, and when Electro absorbed it, it literally made him like Tony Stark (the goatee specifically, the overall coolness and style in general).

I thought that was an amazing subtle touch, frankly.

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MrGreenonion
12/18/21 10:04:37 PM
#45:


ZenOfThunder posted...
best part of the post-credits:

THE CHAOS DIMENSIOOOOOON

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/user_image/1/9/5/AAHLcRAACtob.jpg
I literally yelled out "SHUMA-GORATH!" in the theater

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ScepterOfLove
12/18/21 10:29:34 PM
#46:


Andrew Garfield has always been the best actor to play Spider-Man and this movie cemented that even further for me.

His catch and reaction to seeing Zendaya was okay. He finally got closure to a 7-year old cliffhanger I never expected to see mentioned again. What a genuinely amazing cinematic moment
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#47
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Anagram
12/19/21 1:06:43 AM
#48:


I couldnt believe Venom went back, what a pointless scenario.

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WazzupGenius00
12/19/21 1:13:58 AM
#49:


SwiftyDC posted...
Doesn't matter though, this has never happened in cinema before. Connecting the past and the present in a movie. Nothing comes close to this type of cross-over in a film.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godzilla:_Final_Wars

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Leonhart4
12/19/21 2:44:26 AM
#50:


Anagram posted...
I couldnt believe Venom went back, what a pointless scenario.

Hmm...

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