Poll of the Day > People on GameFAQs understand that Critical Race Theory is ANTI-racist, right?

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ComradeSeraphim
07/29/21 8:42:38 PM
#1:


And that it's been around since the 1970s? Please tell me you guys understand this...

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Sycophant
07/29/21 8:43:52 PM
#2:


I understand that it triggers conservatives so I support it. I am too stupid to grasp the fundamentals of it.
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Entity13
07/29/21 8:45:03 PM
#3:


Unfortunately, this country is backwards in so many ways, it would take a comedic genius to make anyone smile at this shit.

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SKARDAVNELNATE
07/29/21 8:45:45 PM
#4:


I think what they fail to understand is that anti-racism isn't about opposing racism. Anti-racism is about being racist in a way that changes who benefits from it.

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Greenfox111
07/29/21 8:46:17 PM
#5:


I honestly have no idea what it is but i hear people talking about it a lot and i honestly have no idea of whether any of them are for it or are mocking it or are just straight up against it

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ComradeSeraphim
07/29/21 8:52:28 PM
#6:


Sycophant posted...
I understand that it triggers conservatives so I support it. I am too stupid to grasp the fundamentals of it.
Basically it's a legal theory created by a black man that prospective lawyers have to learn about in law school. It is not being taught in grade school. What's being taught in grade school is diversity and inclusion training, which conservatives have been incorrectly referring to as "Critical Race Theory."

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Sycophant
07/29/21 8:53:49 PM
#7:


ComradeSeraphim posted...
Basically it's a legal theory created by a black man that prospective lawyers have to learn about in law school. It is not being taught in grade school. What's being taught in grade school is diversity and inclusion training, which conservatives have been incorrectly referring to as "Critical Race Theory."
Nothing wrong with diversity and inclusion. They are virtuous concepts.
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ComradeSeraphim
07/29/21 8:53:50 PM
#8:


SKARDAVNELNATE posted...
I think what they fail to understand is that anti-racism isn't about opposing racism. Anti-racism is about being racist in a way that changes who benefits from it.
lolwut? No...

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ComradeSeraphim
07/29/21 8:55:34 PM
#9:


Sycophant posted...
Nothing wrong with diversity and inclusion. They are virtuous concepts.
Tell that to the racists.

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wydrah
07/29/21 9:05:12 PM
#10:


I teach critical race theory in my English 10 honors class.

Imo people should stfu about it unless they have read the actual theory. Not an article that reaffirms your own worldview and gives you talking points on crt, but the actual theory itself.

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EvilMegas
07/29/21 9:10:05 PM
#11:


SKARDAVNELNATE posted...
I think what they fail to understand is that anti-racism isn't about opposing racism. Anti-racism is about being racist in a way that changes who benefits from it.
Too much CP has rotted your brain, dude.

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ComradeSeraphim
07/29/21 9:10:11 PM
#12:


wydrah posted...
I teach critical race theory in my English 10 honors class.

Imo people should stfu about it unless they have read the actual theory. Not an article that reaffirms your own worldview and gives you talking points on crt, but the actual theory itself.
K. Got any particular book recommendations?

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wydrah
07/29/21 9:24:14 PM
#13:


ComradeSeraphim posted...
K. Got any particular book recommendations?
Yes!

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/1565842715
This book is an anthology of foundational essays. It can be dense, but it covers the core tenets of CRT and gives a bit of historical insight to the development of it.

For anyone interested in how CRT as a legal framework intersects with public education policy, pedagogy, and other matters of education, I recommend this collection:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/113881945X

As a starting point for reading CRT texts, I recommend Derrick Bell's 1995 essay "Who's Afraid of Critical Race Theory?" It is 25 years ahead of the CRT outrage we currently see from the right, and not only does this essay predict it with damn near perfect accuracy, but it also contextualizes that outrage a bit. This essay is in the second book (Foundations of Critical Race Theory in Education).


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wydrah
07/29/21 9:28:56 PM
#14:


I haven't read this yet, but it is written/compiled by a reputable critical race theorist. I'm sharing it because it's a bit more affordable than the other books I linked. I bought it myself, but I haven't opened it yet. (My racist dog literally ate part of it...)

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/147980276X

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CoorsLight
07/29/21 9:32:50 PM
#15:


The people railing against CRT don't even know what it is, it's just a republican bogeyman that they're using to strip even more out of our curriculums' already pathetic coverage of America's racism
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SKARDAVNELNATE
07/29/21 9:34:57 PM
#16:


EvilMegas posted...
Too much CP has rotted your brain, dude.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1WuYvNSb_4

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Mead
07/29/21 9:36:30 PM
#17:


Its literally just teaching kids that some parts of the past still have an effect on society today.

But they are sensitive snowflakes as usual so it terrifies them and they insist that all racism ended when slavery did.

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wydrah
07/29/21 9:42:58 PM
#18:


Mead posted...
Its literally just teaching kids that some parts of the past still have an effect on society today.

But they are sensitive snowflakes as usual so it terrifies them and they insist that all racism ended when slavery did.
Ehhh it's more complicated than that. I think there is reason for controversy, and I think CRT itself deserves criticism (as any critical theory does).

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wydrah
07/29/21 9:43:52 PM
#19:


But the GQP and conservatives in general have completely lost their minds about it and have become frothing idiots immune to truth, so there's that as well.

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BEERandWEED
07/29/21 9:55:12 PM
#20:


All people are equal. It's really not that complicated.
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Entity13
07/29/21 9:58:49 PM
#21:


BEERandWEED posted...
All people are equal. It's really not that complicated.

It's more that all people should be treated just and fair, but society has a long, painful history of dancing around fairness based on skin color, what's between a person's legs, or even if someone can even use their legs. It is up to us in the present to be critical of our flaws in the past in order to become something better than our past.

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HelIWithoutSin
07/29/21 9:59:25 PM
#22:


BEERandWEED posted...
All people are equal. It's really not that complicated.

Racism solved! Thanks dude!

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Mead
07/29/21 10:04:59 PM
#23:


wydrah posted...
Ehhh it's more complicated than that.

elaborate if you dont mind

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wydrah
07/29/21 10:37:08 PM
#24:


It's important to remember that Critical Race Theory is not just about race. That's only 1/3 of the name. It's CRITICAL Race THEORY.

Here's Wikipedia's definition of critical theory: "Critical theory (also capitalized as Critical Theory)[1] is an approach to social philosophy that focuses on reflective assessment and critique of society and culture in order to reveal and challenge power structures."

Necessarily, any critical theory is going to ruffle feathers. This is true for feminist, Marxist, and queer theory in addition to CRT. Hell, it's true for seemingly innocuous literary theory like Reader-Response Criticism.

I think a lot of lefties have good intentions when they defend CRT, but they inherently misunderstand it because, in their eagerness to act on their moral compass, they neglect to actually learn CRT. So they resort to articles that attempt to explain, but only scratch the surface or misrepresent it (even with good intentions). Although CRT certainly does overlap quite a bit with "teaching the history of racism," CRT is more than that. To diminish CRT to simply teaching objective truth is to ignore the actual theorists and their ideas.

As an example of something from CRT that challenges power structures, we can look at the idea of interest convergence. I'm simplifying this, but interest convergence is the idea that Black people's lives in America only get systemically better when their interests converge with the interests of White people.

In a 1980 essay (linked below in full for curious readers), Derrick Bell argues that the 1954 Brown v Board of Education decision, which unanimously struck down segregation and forced the desegregation of schools*, only happened because it is what most benefited White society. It's an interesting read, thought dense at times.

Bell's three main points in arguing this are, briefly:
  1. The US was waging a global public relations war with the Soviet Union, and second/third world countries recognized the hypocrisy of exporting American democracy and capitalism abroad while oppressing Black folks domestically. Desegregating would help us fight the commies.
  2. In 1948, Truman desegregated the military. Black veterans who fought in WWII and the Korean War risked their lives abroad returned to the US were confronted with the reality that they fought for a country that doesn't want them. Add onto this the rampant violence that Blacks faced (Emmett Till was killed only the year after Brown was decided) and the communist sympathies among the civil rights movement, and you can imagine how astute Whites in power read these tea leaves.
  3. White folks in power at the time began arguing that in order for the South to better industrialize and improve their economy, segregation needed to go.


There is a footnoted version of this essay in the first book I linked above, but you can read the essay without footnotes here (I didn't reread this essay to ensure accuracy, but I skimmed it and it seems to be the full essay): https://www.hartfordschools.org/files/Equity%20Page/Interest_Convergence_by_Bell.pdf

*American schools are not and never were desegregated. Surprise!

As another example of CRT not simply teaching fact, we can consider the idea of challenging perceived objectivity and providing alternative narratives. In the United States, racism is often hard to combat because of how systemic it is (which is CRT's primary goal--tackling the systemic nature of racism). The Tulsa Massacre is a good example of this. The White people in power tried to cover/clean it up. It wasn't until 2021 that Congress heard testimony from survivors.

Systemically, the United States relies on official documentation to ascertain truth. But what happens when the people creating and maintaining that official documentation are racist? The result is a situation in which Black people are depicted negatively by data (e.g., arrest records) and must defend themselves with personal narratives that simply cannot be backed up by official documentation (e.g., personal accounts of racial profiling, such as "driving while Black"...or, perhaps more accurately, "doing x while Black").

I think this is a big deal, because when we teach, we look for scientific data. But the oral tradition, to which personal narratives and family lore belong, is excluded from that. So CRT also challenges how we ascertain truth as a society, not just what the truth is.

Finally, I'll share a short story that Derrick Bell wrote. It is science fiction, not historical. It imagines the future and a world in which aliens have made contact with us. What does racism look like in that world, according to Critical Race Theory?

"The Space Traders:" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y6-n9axdiOs
Text: https://whgbetc.com/the-space-traders.pdf

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wydrah
07/29/21 10:40:42 PM
#25:


Entity13 posted...
It's more that all people should be treated just and fair, but society has a long, painful history of dancing around fairness based on skin color, what's between a person's legs, or even if someone can even use their legs. It is up to us in the present to be critical of our flaws in the past in order to become something better than our past.

As Derrick Bell wrote in one of the essays I mentioned above: "Criticism brings awareness."

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Mead
07/29/21 10:46:06 PM
#26:


I dont think most liberal people are even trying to adamantly defend it, a lot of us had never even heard of it before conservatives started losing their minds about it

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wydrah
07/29/21 10:49:05 PM
#27:


Mead posted...
I dont think most liberal people are even trying to adamantly defend it, a lot of us had never even heard of it before conservatives started losing their minds about it
Very true. CRT is just another bogeyman for the right.

But the left is kind of at a disadvantage here, imo. The right doesn't need to read CRT to know they hate it. It's enough for them to know that CRT advances the rights of Black folks, so no reading is necessary.

The left, in order to defend it, needs to actually know what it is! And ain't no one got time to read hundreds of pages of dense critical theory, as if the layperson even has the background knowledge of law and history to fully understand it.

But if the left doesn't defend it, then the right has a free punching bag, and we're all fucking sick and tired of the right beating up innocent Black people and ideas. (Subtle Olympics reference.)

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Fam_Fam
07/29/21 10:59:22 PM
#28:


racist systems (in the US) help white people at the expense of minorities.

colorblind approaches allow for the status quo to continue by choosing to do nothing to counteract effects of racist systems (I don't see race - so I don't engage with it).

anti-racist systems are designed to counteract racist systems by doing the opposite of what racist systems do in order to bring balance.
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kivos
07/29/21 11:04:51 PM
#29:


CoorsLight posted...
of America's racism
I get sick of hearing this shit from the left. Watching the Olympics is an easy way to see America is the most diverse country by far on the face of the planet. People of different ethnicities representing America than any other country. Almost every other country is primarily dominated by one race representing it. You have more chances of success and being put on a platform in America than you do anywhere else and in any other country. Drop this victimization bullshit. It's funny to see you people act like the right has boogiemen but all this thread is is showing insecurity to a boogie man yourself so you have a reason to show your "victimization".

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wolfy42
07/29/21 11:10:52 PM
#30:


Entity13 posted...
Unfortunately, this country is backwards in so many ways, it would take a comedic genius to make anyone smile at this shit.


RIP George Carlin:(

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wydrah
07/29/21 11:18:24 PM
#31:


kivos posted...
I get sick of hearing this shit from the left. Watching the Olympics is an easy way to see America is the most diverse country by far on the face of the planet. People of different ethnicities representing America than any other country. Almost every other country is primarily dominated by one race representing it. You have more chances of success and being put on a platform in America than you do anywhere else and in any other country. Drop this victimization bullshit. It's funny to see you people act like the right has boogiemen but all this thread is is showing insecurity to a boogie man yourself so you have a reason to show your "victimization".
calm down buddy

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Fam_Fam
07/29/21 11:21:18 PM
#32:


BEERandWEED posted...
All people are equal. It's really not that complicated.

except that's not really true. people have differences, and that's not a bad thing. i hate this "all people are equal BS". if that were the case, then we wouldn't need the ADA, for instance (this is where one typically backpedals to redefine "equal").
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Mead
07/29/21 11:21:59 PM
#33:


kivos posted...
Watching the Olympics

who the hell wants to watch the Olympics?

FUCK the Olympics.

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CoorsLight
07/30/21 1:12:05 AM
#34:


kivos posted...
Watching the Olympics is an easy way to see America is the most diverse country by far on the face of the planet. People of different ethnicities representing America than any other country.

Wow you sure showed me. I had no idea that people of different races live in America
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Zeus
07/30/21 1:14:57 AM
#35:


People on GameFAQs understand that Critical Race Theory is ANTI-racist, right?

People on Gamefaqs understand your gimmick is shitty, right?

You know what? Fuck it. You never break character when you're doing your nonsense, and I'm sick of the nonsense. I'm doing what I should have done the last time you brought that alt to PotD -- adding it to my ignore list.

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zebatov
07/30/21 2:16:44 AM
#36:


wydrah posted...
I teach critical race theory in my English 10 honors class.

But TC said they dont do that.

Well now I just dont know what to believe!

@Zeus
Whose alt is this?

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wydrah
07/30/21 2:33:47 AM
#37:


zebatov posted...
But TC said they dont do that.

Well now I just dont know what to believe!

@Zeus
Whose alt is this?
It's *almost* untaught in k12 schools. I teach a wide variety of literary theories, and CRT intersects with that somewhat. I wouldn't do it in a nonhonors class of sophomores. And I only spend a few weeks on it. As far as I know, there isn't much teaching of the actual theory in k12. Buuut, CRT did pioneer/popularize ideas that are becoming mainstream, and thus trickling into schools. Part of the reason for this, though, is because although CRT isn't high school curriculum, the actual theory of CRT deals intimately and extensively with systemic racism in public k12 schools. So, when you hear of schools doing things like "decolonizing/diversifying the curriculum," that is coming from, at least in part, decades of CRT scholarship.

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SKARDAVNELNATE
07/30/21 11:12:46 AM
#38:


wydrah posted...
Here's Wikipedia's definition of critical theory: "Critical theory (also capitalized as Critical Theory)[1] is an approach to social philosophy that focuses on reflective assessment and critique of society and culture in order to reveal and challenge power structures."
I recall hearing a while back that racism was redefined as prejudice plus power. My critism of anti-racism is that it only cares about the power aspect of that definition. Instead of denouncing the prejudice aspect it's treated as a useful tool to exert power over society. I believe in the classical definition that racism is discrimination on the basis of race. Under this definition anti-racists are more descriminatory and more obsessed with race than the average person.

wydrah posted...
As Derrick Bell wrote in one of the essays I mentioned above: "Criticism brings awareness."
Yet it's been made taboo to criticize anti-racism.
Here's another quote, though I don't know by whom: "To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize."

Mead posted...
I dont think most liberal people are even trying to adamantly defend it, a lot of us had never even heard of it before conservatives started losing their minds about it
I dont think most liberal people know what's really going on in politics. I consider myself liberal because I oppose the authoritarianism shown on the left. Though I suspect that by liberal you meant the political left.

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wydrah
07/30/21 11:27:18 AM
#39:


SKARDAVNELNATE posted...
I recall hearing a while back that racism was redefined as prejudice plus power. My critism of anti-racism is that it only cares about the power aspect of that definition. Instead of denouncing the prejudice aspect it's treated as a useful tool to exert power over society. I believe in the classical definition that racism is discrimination on the basis of race. Under this definition anti-racists are more descriminatory and more obsessed with race than the average person.
You're just throwing a bunch of ideas out. Where are you getting these definitions? What do you mean by the "classical" definition of racism. What does "classical" even mean in this context? I think you are misusing terminology that you're making up on the spot in order to sound more educated.

You remind me of people who argue (fallaciously) that MLK wanted a colorblind society and that CRT and anti-racism undermine his vision.

Anyway, CRT specifies systemic racism. Systemic racism simply means your definition, but built into the systems of society. By not acknowledging systemic racism, you are suggesting that racism is limited to the individual. This would mean that racists in power, for some reason, never used their power to corrupt the systems they were in charge of in order to perpetuate racism further. But people like you don't want to acknowledge this obvious reality because, I guess, it shatters the view certain people have of America that it's the land of the free and the home of the brave.

As for your accusation that anti-racists are the real racists, I look forward to you actually backing that up. You did no work to support that claim, and the leap you took to your conclusion is mighty.

Yet it's been made taboo to criticize anti-racism.
Here's another quote, though I don't know by whom: "To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize."
What's the relevance here? I literally said CRT deserves criticism.

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SKARDAVNELNATE
07/30/21 11:39:06 AM
#40:


wydrah posted...
What do you mean by the "classical" definition of racism.
The definition I was taught in primary school.

wydrah posted...
You remind me of people who argue (fallaciously) that MLK wanted a colorblind society and that CRT and anti-racism undermine his vision.
You mean this quote...
"I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their character."
Do the anti-racists care about the content of a person's character?

wydrah posted...
What's the relevance here? I literally said CRT deserves criticism.
Post #4 where I got modded for doing so.

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wydrah
07/30/21 11:43:51 AM
#41:


Okay, you are ignorant. You are using a definition you learned when you were 10 to discuss graduate level ideas. You aren't even considering that maybe your teacher gave you a bad definition? Or that you don't remember it clearly? Either way, you think learning something in 5th grade gives you credibility. Sorry, you are very wrong.

And yes, you are exactly the person I thought you were, re: that MLK quote. You probably only have read his "I Have a Dream" speech (years ago in 11th grade). You are such a scholar lmao.

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wydrah
07/30/21 11:44:28 AM
#42:


"everything i learned about racism i learned when i was 10"

lmao

i hope your sex education didn't end in 5th grade too

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EvilMegas
07/30/21 11:49:16 AM
#43:


I have him marked as CP enthusiast, so that makes your sex Ed joke a little more fun to me lol

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Entity13
07/30/21 11:49:22 AM
#44:


Don't we hate how many lies or half-truths we were taught in each level of public school? All the things we learned and re-learned a little different every few years until we got to college and realized how inaccurate each idea or concept was? I get young brains only being able to take in so much information at once, but it seems to me some brains more than others find difficulty taking in correct information after years of taking in faulty information. This includes matters of racism, both systemic and individualistic, throughout history and today.

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Krazy_Kirby
07/30/21 11:51:57 AM
#45:


Fam_Fam posted...
racist systems (in the US) help white people at the expense of minorities.

colorblind approaches allow for the status quo to continue by choosing to do nothing to counteract effects of racist systems (I don't see race - so I don't engage with it).

anti-racist systems are designed to counteract racist systems by doing the opposite of what racist systems do in order to bring balance.


racist systems like affirmative action?
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wydrah
07/30/21 11:54:55 AM
#46:


Krazy_Kirby posted...
racist systems like affirmative action?
Affirmative Action has helped White women more than Black folks.

This is a perfect fucking example of CRT's notion of interest convergence lmao

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EvilMegas
07/30/21 12:52:09 PM
#47:


Krazy_Kirby posted...
racist systems like affirmative action?
Jesus Christ lmao

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Muscles
07/30/21 1:05:52 PM
#48:


All this shit would be completely unnecessary if people just lived by the golden rule. Why is it so hard to just be nice to people? Will we ever get to that point?

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wydrah
07/30/21 1:10:32 PM
#49:


Muscles posted...
All this shit would be completely unnecessary if people just lived by the golden rule. Why is it so hard to just be nice to people? Will we ever get to that point?
Untrue. The nefariousness of systemic racism is it does not depend upon individuals to be overtly, willfully racist. The racism is embedded into our systems by past racists, and those systems will never be purged of racism until active measures are taken by people who come after those racists who started it.

This is at the core of why conservatives are pissed off over CRT (the ones who understand at least some of CRT, anyway). To purge our systems of racism, it requires people who benefit from that system to acknowledge their privilege and actually put in hard work to effect the positive change of creating a society with no systemic racism.*

*This actually isn't a goal of CRT, because completely eliminating systemic racism is unrealistic. But it's the dream, I guess.

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Muscles
07/30/21 1:30:33 PM
#50:


I'm not denying that systemic racism is real. I know it is and it's abhorrent but if cops and judges treated minorities like actual people during arrests/trials wouldn't it eliminate (or at the very least, minimize) the racism in the system? Like how there are many old ridiculous laws still on the books but no one is going arrest you for them

Maybe that wouldn't help and I'm wrong thinking that if all cops and judges weren't racist that the systemic racism would become a non issue because no one would be taking advantage of it

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Muscles
Chicago Bears | Chicago Blackhawks | Chicago Bulls | Chicago Cubs | NIU Huskies
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Topic List
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