Poll of the Day > I'm an anti-natalist.

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Mead
07/24/21 3:29:07 PM
#253:


Rabies is nothing to take lightly

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my resting temp can easily be in the 90's -Krazy_Kirby
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PunishedOni
07/24/21 3:29:30 PM
#254:


SunWuKung420 posted...
Angry does not equal rabid. Learn2science


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hi im chelsea ^__^
'thou shalt not suffer a dentist to live' - chelsea
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SunWuKung420
07/24/21 5:53:38 PM
#255:


PunishedOni posted...
That type of "rabid" isn't a communicable disease though. Try again.

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Notschmendrake
07/24/21 6:03:38 PM
#256:


SunWuKung420 posted...
Angry does not equal rabid. Learn2science

yeah guys, learn2science. but only the pedo "science" that sunny spews.
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PunishedOni
07/24/21 6:09:42 PM
#257:


SunWuKung420 posted...
That type of "rabid" isn't a communicable disease though. Try again.


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hi im chelsea ^__^
'thou shalt not suffer a dentist to live' - chelsea
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Reigning_King
07/24/21 9:01:50 PM
#258:


I'm out hiking so I don't have time now to respond to anyone bit you guys can take your off topic nonsense elsewhere.
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Mead
07/24/21 9:12:27 PM
#259:


Reigning_King posted...
I'm out hiking so I don't have time now to respond to anyone bit you guys can take your off topic nonsense elsewhere.

draw a hiking sword

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my resting temp can easily be in the 90's -Krazy_Kirby
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PunishedOni
07/24/21 10:55:49 PM
#260:


sorry for posting about rabies in the anti-nalist forum. ill make sure it never happens again

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hi im chelsea ^__^
'thou shalt not suffer a dentist to live' - chelsea
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SunWuKung420
07/24/21 10:56:57 PM
#261:


Reigning_King posted...
I'm out hiking so I don't have time now to respond to anyone bit you guys can take your off topic nonsense elsewhere.
Stop enjoying existence.

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Reigning_King
07/25/21 3:45:05 AM
#262:


PunishedOni posted...
sorry for posting about rabies in the anti-nalist forum. ill make sure it never happens again

https://youtu.be/LiYqTcaq_Zo

You better.

SunWuKung420 posted...
Stop enjoying existence.
I wasn't doing it because I wanted to. Why the hell would I spend several hours climbing a forested mountain full of bugs and sharp rocks in the heat for enjoyment?
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Naruto_fan_42
07/25/21 4:32:30 AM
#263:


edge. LORD! breakdown

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PM me if Ganondorf gets buffed
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Reigning_King
07/25/21 7:44:57 PM
#264:


Truth_Decay posted...
I've noticed you deal in extremes a lot.

- Unescapable rape room.

- Meticulous torture catered to someone's exact weaknesses.

- "Why don't you swap lives with someone experiencing great suffering/choose to live in this intense situation?"

Makes you come across as very naive and childish.

A large part of your argument rests on this notion of these non-existent people, which is exactly why your argument fails. You think it's bulletproof because these people don't exist, and if this situation were to ever occur there'd be no way to measure success vs failure.

If it's fair for you to use this hypothetical situation as a crutch for your weak argument, it's fair to say that in some parallel universe, were these non-existent people somehow granted a voice and given a choice to live with some suffering or not live at all, a vast majority would choose existence with suffering.

I'm confident saying this as I can point to current suicide statistics to back up the claim. In 2017, global averages were under 2%, with some countries seeing rates as high as 5%. Nothing to scoff at, as these figures amount to hundreds of thousands of lives lost, but a vast and overwhelming majority choose to live. Including those who live in harsh, adverse situations.

If your non-existent people were given an option, they would choose life with suffering.

So your whole philosophy is a pointless, impractical, and frankly moronic brain exercise. And if you're going to propose your pathetic theory is unassailable due to the fact that you're speaking on behalf of phantoms, what I've just shown you cancels all that out. All you're left with is... what, exactly?

Nothing! At the end of the day you're posing as a champion for ghosts! And that is as dumb as it is absurd.

This is all I'll say on the matter. You seem incapable of accepting how inane and banal your little theory is, and I'm sure you'll go on rejecting everything I post and choosing to continue patting yourself on the back while basking in the glow of sheer ignorance.

They say it is bliss, after all

Enjoy your topic.
I use extremes because they are good ways to illustrate points. People can argue about if two slightly different shades of gray should be considered the same but no one would argue that gray is the same thing as black or white. Also you pointing out the extreme nature of many of my examples or calling me names (ironically calling me childish as if that isn't the exact word to describe calling someone childish in a debate) isn't actually a refutation just so you know.

Your hypothetical situation is nonsense. As soon as you give an unborn, nonexistent people a voice then they automatically become something different because they now exist on some level. It is oxymoronic because the definition of nonexistent necessarily disqualifies anything capable of speech, choice, deliberation, etc. from being included in it.

Even if we entertain the thought despite that the data you cite that makes you so sure these nonexistent people would behave the way you claim is almost as bad. You are looking at data concerning real live human beings who exist physically and who have experienced many years of life to base their judgments on, why on earth would these impossible nonexistent (yet somehow existent and aware) people have the same types of thought processes, value systems, and biological urges (you know, like the urge to not die) that we have? This is confusing, yet again, the difference between choosing to live and choosing to be born, even if these unborn ghost people still thought exactly like normal humans the choice they would have to make to be born is vastly different from someone choosing if they want to kill themselves or not. This also doesn't factor in that babies don't have any memories before they're born and presumably these spirits aren't omniscient so the child born might suffer far worse than the spirit anticipated and they could still end up resenting life. AND EVEN THEN, if I concede everything to you and we sweep all of what I said under the rug your position is still bad because these unborn people aren't the ones choosing to be born, their parents are. Even if the desire of the parents to have a baby and the unborn's desire match up it is still a gamble in your set up since you say "the vast majority would want that". What about the minority who doesn't want to be born? How is it ethical to gamble with human lives like that? If you want to claim because "It's for the greater good." or something I demand to know what that good is. I have to say this "counter argument" of yours is one of the most ridiculous I've ever seen, it has more holes in it than a menger sponge.

On the other hand all I'm saying on behalf of the nonexistent is that they don't exist and thus cannot benefit from being born. Something that doesn't exist can't be harmed or benefited by anything, why do I need to point this out? Therefore every birth that takes place is nothing more than a selfish gamble on the part of the parents if not an accident dooming someone to suffering for their entire life.

Do you even understand my full position? You fire off a salvo of shots at the wall defending my position and claim to have seized victory before the smoke even clears seemingly not realizing that even if you broke through that defense I have several more layers behind it. I could tell you everything you said in your argument was correct and it still wouldn't invalidate anti-natalism.
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Reigning_King
07/25/21 8:06:03 PM
#265:


Mead posted...
It isnt something that can be factually proven one way or another. There will always be suffering but for many people there are some things in life that are so good, whether its people that we love and feel privileged to get to know, or just aspects of living life that bring joy and satisfaction. Things that make life worth living despite all of the pain and bad things that can happen along the way.

In my life I have been much happier by trying not to focus on the pain and struggles when possible, but dealing with the best way I know how while focusing on the positive things that I have going for me and just trying to spread some kindness and laughter when I can.

Cool so we agree with each other. The bolded bit is all that I was concerned with particular this back and forth.

A bit off topic but something that hasn't been brought up that I thought of because of the suicide stats that were brought up is that these guys seem to be under the impression that one day technology will advance to the point where there is no suffering (I've written examples of these sci-fi utopia to show how ridiculous the idea of ever eliminating all suffering even with god level tech would be) but a fact that hasn't been brought up is that suicide and depression rates are much higher in more technologically advanced society and time periods. I wonder how that plays into their vision of better tech reducing suffering to zero. Also that any type of tech used for good can be used for evil, even if we invent a matrix like simulation device that can give infinite pleasure why couldn't the same thing be used to give someone infinite pain as well?

SunWuKung420 posted...
#242 and #243 are hilariously wrong.
You disappoint me SWK, I thought you were better than that. If it's so wrong why not explain why? I mean it can't possibly be that hard if it's so erroneous. You can see from my posts itt that I'm willing to read and respond to any even half assed arguments, I never immediately write off things like you've (and many others) have so rudely done with me. If my post made you realize how empty and worthless that quote you posted was and you couldn't come up with a way to defend it, it would have been better for you to just not post again or hell, maybe admit that and learn not to buy into stuff like that?
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