Board 8 > NFTs are a scam right?

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Yesmar_
04/12/21 4:09:39 PM
#1:


Walter Benjamin must be rolling in his grave.

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Mac Arrowny
04/12/21 4:11:12 PM
#2:


Also terrible for the environment.
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skullbone
04/12/21 4:21:22 PM
#3:


It's not a scam but it's about as useless as collecting baseball cards or Pokemon cards. They only have value if we place value on them

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NFUN
04/12/21 4:27:50 PM
#4:


Yes, mar
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Xtlm
04/12/21 4:41:46 PM
#5:


skullbone posted...
It's not a scam but it's about as useless as collecting baseball cards or Pokemon cards. They only have value if we place value on them
And judging about how society works lately.
These things will get stupid expensive for no real reason other then 'gotta have that shiny thing that no one else has to be unique' and people will make bank.

Like CSGO skins or something.

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Snake5555555555
04/12/21 4:46:17 PM
#6:


This is probably a stupid question but how are NFTs bad for the environment if they're digital? This stuff just goes so far over my head.

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NFUN
04/12/21 4:46:52 PM
#7:


Snake5555555555 posted...
This is probably a stupid question but how are NFTs bad for the environment if they're digital? This stuff just goes so far over my head.

did you know computers require electricity
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Snake5555555555
04/12/21 4:48:28 PM
#8:


So it just uses a ton more energy to transfer or something then?

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PrivateBiscuit1
04/12/21 4:51:24 PM
#9:


The Annoying Orange said that they're actually definitely not a scam, linked a medium article, then spammed the rest of that tweet thread with nonsense gifs and stuff so that any legitimate responses would be way under the scroll.

So I'd say it's legit, yeah.

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Paratroopa1
04/12/21 4:55:02 PM
#10:


Snake5555555555 posted...
So it just uses a ton more energy to transfer or something then?
The long-story-made-short is that like cryptocurrency, NFTs require computers to idly use a lot of computing power to create. Roughly 0.5% of the entire world's energy consumption is currently being used to mine bitcoin - NFTs would increase this number if widely adopted.
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NFUN
04/12/21 4:56:03 PM
#11:


Snake5555555555 posted...
So it just uses a ton more energy to transfer or something then?

the lemma to my earlier statement is that a lot of computers require a lot of electricity
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Snake5555555555
04/12/21 4:57:22 PM
#12:


Paratroopa1 posted...
The long-story-made-short is that like cryptocurrency, NFTs require computers to idly use a lot of computing power to create. Roughly 0.5% of the entire world's energy consumption is currently being used to mine bitcoin - NFTs would increase this number if widely adopted.

Wow damn, I see now thanks. That's pretty insane.

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Leafeon13N
04/12/21 5:14:14 PM
#13:


Paratroopa1 posted...
Roughly 0.5% of the entire world's energy consumption is currently being used to mine bitcoin
It had gone up from 0.5 to 0.6 in a month and it has likely risen from there as that was mid March.
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Xtlm
04/12/21 5:26:05 PM
#14:


Ok ill bite.
Why do images and gif's use a lot of energy to create.

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mnkboy907
04/12/21 5:32:36 PM
#15:


Xtlm posted...
Ok ill bite.
Why do images and gif's use a lot of energy to create.

My limited understanding is the energy use comes from the fact that NFT ownership is a never-ending process of constantly checking and verifying online that the owner of the NFT is still indeed the owner of the NFT. Or something like that.

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Mac Arrowny
04/12/21 5:38:42 PM
#16:


I believe the energy use comes from encryption. Basically the computer spends a long time encrypting the NFT to a huge degree, which uses a lot of processing power.
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NFUN
04/12/21 5:46:11 PM
#17:


Mac Arrowny posted...
I believe the energy use comes from encryption. Basically the computer spends a long time encrypting the NFT to a huge degree, which uses a lot of processing power.

you'd think, but it's not encrypted. it's in a blockchain, because the "value" isn't in the file, but in the verification that the specific instance of the file is authentic. the actual "physical" thing of the NFT is just a fucking URL to it hosted on some website

NFTs are a scam, but that's mostly incidental. They're probably primarily a money laundering scheme
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Colegreen_c12
04/12/21 6:01:47 PM
#18:


the reason its expensive electronically is because its artifically made more expensive the more competition there are to mines coins.

It's the reason a bitcoin could cost like a penny to mine 10 years ago and 10's of thousands today. It's artifically harder.

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Punnyz
04/12/21 6:07:38 PM
#19:


I understand most everything else bad with NFTs but I don't understand the "bad for the environment" thing

I mean, is it any worse than use using our phones or computers to post here right now?

if it IS worse, why or how?

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GANON1025
04/12/21 6:11:13 PM
#20:


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Paratroopa1
04/12/21 6:11:37 PM
#21:


Punnyz posted...
I understand most everything else bad with NFTs but I don't understand the "bad for the environment" thing

I mean, is it any worse than use using our phones or computers to post here right now?

if it IS worse, why or how?
So like, imagine that instead of just using your computer or phone to do a normal task, you instead had a bank of hundreds of computers that you had playing Crysis 3 on the highest settings 24/7 in a competitive arms race with other people doing the same thing

that's why and how it's worse
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Mac Arrowny
04/12/21 6:18:25 PM
#22:


Thanks GANON, that was enlightening.
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red13n
04/12/21 6:19:12 PM
#23:


Punnyz posted... I understand most everything else bad with NFTs but I don't understand the "bad for the environment" thing

I mean, is it any worse than use using our phones or computers to post here right now?

if it IS worse, why or how?
Dumb way I have been describing the harm of crypto:

Because when say, you use your computer to calculate 1+1, it just straight up calculates 1+1. It doesn't need to grow more complex.

Everytime say bitcoin or whatever calculates 1+1, it needs to leave a record of that 1+1 that is unique to that calculation. In doing this, it requires bitcoin to become more and more complex, even for simple computations. Every time 1+1 is done in bitcoin, it is more complex than the last time it was calculated, requiring more processing power. Everyday computing doesn't have this problem, power consumption doesn't have a need to grow more and more complex. Every time you put 1+1 in your PC, it requires the same amount of processing power.

By nature bitcoin is designed to grow more and more power hungry, individual PC's do not.

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Paratroopa1
04/12/21 6:21:28 PM
#24:


red13n posted...
Dumb way I have been describing the harm of crypto:

Because when say, you use your computer to calculate 1+1, it just straight up calculates 1+1. It doesn't need to grow more complex.

Everytime say bitcoin or whatever calculates 1+1, it needs to leave a record of that 1+1 that is unique to that calculation. In doing this, it requires bitcoin to become more and more complex, even for simple computations. Every time 1+1 is done in bitcoin, it is more complex than the last time it was calculated, requiring more processing power. Everyday computing doesn't have this problem, power consumption doesn't have a need to grow more and more complex. Every time you put 1+1 in your PC, it requires the same amount of processing power.

By nature bitcoin is designed to grow more and more power hungry, individual PC's do not.
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HeroDelTiempo17
04/12/21 6:21:54 PM
#25:


Punnyz posted...
I understand most everything else bad with NFTs but I don't understand the "bad for the environment" thing

I mean, is it any worse than use using our phones or computers to post here right now?

if it IS worse, why or how?

It's a matter of scale.

Running the entire internet data centers is by current estimates something like 1-2% of global energy usage. So using the 0.5% number posted earlier, NFTs as much energy as 25%-50% of the internet for nowhere near the same benefit.

Also, the more NFTs are made, the harder they get to make, and the more energy they tend to require. That's baked in to the process get them to retain value by making them artificially scarce.

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Xeybozn
04/12/21 6:25:11 PM
#26:


Paratroopa1 posted...

So like, imagine that instead of just using your computer or phone to do a normal task, you instead had a bank of hundreds of computers that you had playing Crysis 3 on the highest settings 24/7 in a competitive arms race with other people doing the same thing

that's why and how it's worse

The issue isn't just that blockchain stuff uses a ton of power, it's that there's no real good reason they have to. Really, there aren't many good reasons to use blockchains even ignoring the energy cost, but the energy usage outweighs any positives by a lot.
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Yesmar_
04/12/21 6:25:12 PM
#27:


I'm really slow when it comes to how laundering money works, but how would that work with an NFT? Isn't your purchase linked to your crypto account via the blockchain? You can't purchase it in cash like with real estate or art.

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Colegreen_c12
04/12/21 6:25:29 PM
#28:


red13n posted...
Dumb way I have been describing the harm of crypto:

Because when say, you use your computer to calculate 1+1, it just straight up calculates 1+1. It doesn't need to grow more complex.

Everytime say bitcoin or whatever calculates 1+1, it needs to leave a record of that 1+1 that is unique to that calculation. In doing this, it requires bitcoin to become more and more complex, even for simple computations. Every time 1+1 is done in bitcoin, it is more complex than the last time it was calculated, requiring more processing power. Everyday computing doesn't have this problem, power consumption doesn't have a need to grow more and more complex. Every time you put 1+1 in your PC, it requires the same amount of processing power.

By nature bitcoin is designed to grow more and more power hungry, individual PC's do not.

Unfortunately this isn't true at all. This would actually make more sense than what it actually is

It's literally just this

Colegreen_c12 posted...
the reason its expensive electronically is because its artifically made more expensive the more competition there are to mines coins.

It's the reason a bitcoin could cost like a penny to mine 10 years ago and 10's of thousands today. It's artifically harder.


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NFUN
04/12/21 6:33:36 PM
#29:


Yesmar_ posted...
I'm really slow when it comes to how laundering money works, but how would that work with an NFT? Isn't your purchase linked to your crypto account via the blockchain? You can't purchase it in cash like with real estate or art.

The value of money laundering with real estate or art isn't in that's it's untraceable or anything like that (shouldn't be too hard to find who owns a property, even with shell companies, etc). The value is that that value of what you're purchasing is speculative. You can't really define art's value: painting a picture in ten minutes, calling it 'avant garde' and selling it for $10M is more "reasonable" than buying a banana for that price. NFTs are bullshit inherently, with inherent bullshit prices
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PrivateBiscuit1
04/12/21 6:50:36 PM
#30:


https://twitter.com/annoyingorange/status/1381363954618834946?s=19

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JackMan
04/12/21 7:00:44 PM
#31:


PrivateBiscuit1 posted...
https://twitter.com/annoyingorange/status/1381363954618834946?s=19
https://twitter.com/QueerSwine/status/1381509975248408576?s=20

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Tom Bombadil
04/12/21 7:01:38 PM
#32:


I thought that bubble already popped

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changmas
04/12/21 10:01:20 PM
#33:


i've made a couple thousand off of NBA Top Shot to date and have a few that I'm saving long-term. I wouldn't touch NFTs that aren't based on national sports leagues or other massive products

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foolm0r0n
04/12/21 10:40:50 PM
#34:


red13n posted...
Every time 1+1 is done in bitcoin, it is more complex than the last time it was calculated, requiring more processing power.
That's not at all how it works. Mining (calculation) difficulty adjusts up and down based on the # of people trying to mine. The # of miners usually goes up, sometimes down, but overall up so far. And yeah, it's totally artificial.

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UshiromiyaEva
04/12/21 11:18:09 PM
#35:


NFT is the same thing as BitCoin to me...not in the actual processing sense, but if the person you're talking to is heavily defensive of the idea then you should do everything you can to not take that person's advise about anything else.

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MoogleKupo141
04/12/21 11:28:12 PM
#36:


changmas posted...
i've made a couple thousand off of NBA Top Shot to date and have a few that I'm saving long-term. I wouldn't touch NFTs that aren't based on national sports leagues or other massive products


so does anyone want these things for their own sake and not as a thing to sell? Is there someone out there actually collecting Top Shots or is it just speculators selling back and forth to each other?
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banananor
04/12/21 11:29:43 PM
#37:


NFTs are pretty much the same thing as "buying" a star/the right to name a star

it's useful as long as you think people care about the registry

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foolm0r0n
04/13/21 6:33:25 PM
#38:


UshiromiyaEva posted...
NFT is the same thing as BitCoin to me...not in the actual processing sense, but if the person you're talking to is heavily defensive of the idea then you should do everything you can to not take that person's advise about anything else.
Bitcoin is good and you should keep posting

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Emeraldegg
04/13/21 7:04:11 PM
#39:


MoogleKupo141 posted...


so does anyone want these things for their own sake and not as a thing to sell? Is there someone out there actually collecting Top Shots or is it just speculators selling back and forth to each other?

Right now from what I can tell a lot of it is speculative, but they're trying to make it so that it's not like that and that actual collectors are the main users.
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changmas
04/13/21 7:07:05 PM
#40:


MoogleKupo141 posted...
so does anyone want these things for their own sake and not as a thing to sell? Is there someone out there actually collecting Top Shots or is it just speculators selling back and forth to each other?

around the end of February speculation was at an all time high (and i wouldve made almost $30k if i had sold everything i had then) but its been a bear market since then and so i think a lot of the speculation has gone away. Certainly most users are still trying to make money ultimately but i think theres plenty of actual collectors now

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UshiromiyaEva
04/13/21 7:30:52 PM
#41:


foolm0r0n posted...
Bitcoin is good and you should keep posting

Case in point.

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NFUN
04/13/21 8:05:22 PM
#42:


UshiromiyaEva posted...


Case in point.

why are you following his advice then?
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