Board 8 > 24 years later, I finally got 120 stars in SM64

(+) Yeah! (+)

I dont know why it took me this long, I guess I never seriously tried before? It was a lot easier than I expected. There were a few stars that were a bit tough, but there were also a surprising amount that took like a minute to complete.

Two of the stars in Dire, Dire Docks were basically just swimming back to the sub area and then putting on a hat. The level design leads to a lot of retracing the same steps like that which isnt exactly thrilling

I think playing it again has moved the game down my favorites list kind of a lot. I still had fun with it, but it just doesnt live up to my childhood memory.

in conclusion, Banjo-Kazooie is the best N64 platformer forever
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MoogleKupo141 posted...

in conclusion, Banjo-Kazooie is the best N64 platformer forever

Can confirm

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MoogleKupo141 posted...

in conclusion, Banjo-Kazooie is the best N64 platformer forever

Great_Paul posted...

Deny

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See, i think going for every single star makes the game worse

There's a reason you only need 70 or whatever to beat the game

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The only painful stars are 100 coins in Tick Tock Clock and Rainbow Ride because it's so easy to mess up and die.

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100 coins in Dire Dire Docks was a problem for me too because theres only 106 in the whole level. I got to 95 or something and was just like... wait what, Ive already been everywhere how do I not have 100?

turned out there were some near the entrance that Id missed
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It's been years since I've gotten every star. Kind of wanna see if I can do it in one sitting.

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No matter how much I replay SM64, my opinion on it won't change
It's still one of the best games ever made

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Time for 120 shines!

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Who called me

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also working on it

it's so frustrating nowadays due to the terrible camera and controls

specially some of the later 100 coins

and yeah, Banjo-Kazooie is much much better

firefdr posted...

it's so frustrating nowadays due to the terrible camera and controls

The fact that they released it without a free camera is almost criminal. Its yet another indictment on nintendo

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the camera works fine and the controls work perfectly

if you have problems with them, that's on you, not the game
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yeah what's wrong with the controls

they're pretty fluid

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They're of an era and if you didn't play it then it's absolutely frustrating to control

Sorry old dudes you can be old like me now

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Camera isn't that bad.

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I still don't think the issue is the free camera, I don't actually mind that I can only move it in fixed amounts. What I actually found annoying is how you can't move it past walls/obstacles. That makes it really difficult to see in certain closed areas (Tick Tock Clock, the pyramid, the volcano, etc.). And the camera while using the fly cap is absolutely painful.

The controls, though? They work just fine. I don't see the issue at all.

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the problem mainly is without the notched octogon gate of the n64 control stick it's difficulty to make mario walk straight consistently. He's always moving around in weird directions when you least want it.

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I can't say I had that problem whatsoever but I used a Gamecube-like controller, so I dunno. Maybe that made a difference.

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LeonhartFour posted...

yeah what's wrong with the controls

they're pretty fluid

To make a 180, Mario has to run forward and do a small loop. If you're facing a ledge, this is incredibly annoying.

Likewise, if you are facing a wall and attempt to move away from it, due to the way the controls are programmed, Mario will instead hump along the wall like a dog.

There's a reason that the games aren't programmed like that anymore (hint: because it's bad).

The controls aren't awful but you'd have to actively suspend rational thought to consider them perfect.

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They were perfect, by 1996 standards.

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It's hard not to be perfect in a sample size of 1.

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Just do flips if you need to do a 180

I didn't say they were perfect, but I guess I've played it enough that I know how to compensate for the weird aspects.

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Pretty sure if you tilt the control stick in the complete opposite direction while standing mario will immediately turn around.

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I think I only ever got 117 or 118. The hundred coin star on rainbow ride was just so not going to happen. The sheer volume of places you have to visit in that stage, with one tiny movement error sending you plummeting, when it's often challenging to run straight right or straight left, kept me from ever making a real go at it. I had enough trouble practicing the wall kicks for the blue coins, which are extremely tightly timed.

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Funny because after playing mario 64 and getting 120 I went back to banjo, I never realized how amateur it feels. Banjo is a good platformer but the freedom of movement isn't even close to mario.

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As someone who only recently played Banjo-Kazooie for the first time in 2017, and whose nostalgia for SM64 is insanely high because it was one of the defining games of my childhood...

I can confirm Banjo-Kazooie is a way better game.

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I got a N64 when I was like 10 and I remember playing through SM64 back then without issues but I don't have any nostalgia for it. I turned it off after like an hour in 2020 because it was basically unplayable.

Maybe I'll give it another try but after 120 stars in Galaxy I seriously doubt it's going to feel any better.

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MoogleKupo141 posted...

in conclusion, Banjo-Kazooie is the best N64 platformer forever

DK64

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GildedFool posted...

DK64

Yikes

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SantaRPidgey posted...

Funny because after playing mario 64 and getting 120 I went back to banjo, I never realized how amateur it feels. Banjo is a good platformer but the freedom of movement isn't even close to mario.

the thing that really differentiates the games for me is the level design. Mario 64s missions involve a lot of retracing steps you already made which just isnt very fun. this may be an exaggeration, but it feels like half the courses in the game are mountains (im counting TTC which is secretly a mountain). its like Star 1 is climb this mountain and then star 2 is climb this mountain again, but different.

The big open worlds of BK are much more interesting. also, this isnt gameplay related, but the worlds in BK have more personality too. I just like being in that universe so much more.
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azuarc posted...

I think I only ever got 117 or 118. The hundred coin star on rainbow ride was just so not going to happen. The sheer volume of places you have to visit in that stage, with one tiny movement error sending you plummeting, when it's often challenging to run straight right or straight left, kept me from ever making a real go at it. I had enough trouble practicing the wall kicks for the blue coins, which are extremely tightly timed.

Not to be that guy, but like... get good? This isn't even a particularly difficult star. Just jump from where you start to the (very forgiving, not a bottomless pit) obstacle course, get the blue coins after practicing the timing for the wall jumps, and ride the carpet up to the castle. You don't need to get on the carpet again and never had to before, and the ride up to the castle is very simple. Rainbow Ride is one of the few courses in which you can actually freely move the camera since there's no walls, and it gives you a better view of the platforming than any other stage. The stage has a lot of coins; you can get a fourth of them on the spinning platforms with the Lakitus on them.

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MoogleKupo141 posted...

the thing that really differentiates the games for me is the level design. Mario 64s missions involve a lot of retracing steps you already made which just isnt very fun. this may be an exaggeration, but it feels like half the courses in the game are mountains (im counting TTC which is secretly a mountain). its like Star 1 is climb this mountain and then star 2 is climb this mountain again, but different.

Agree completely, btw. This is my main criticism of the game. There's a lot of stars that only work because you get kicked out of the stage, since it's literally doing what you just did before again.

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MoogleKupo141 posted...

Mario 64s missions involve a lot of retracing steps you already made which just isnt very fun.

I think what makes it fun is that each time you can discover new paths and shortcuts and ways the level interconnects. There are so many places where a well timed triple jump on a slope can cut a decent amount of minutes off of your run. Like yeah jumping up tick tock clock over and over is a bit of a nightmare but jumping up the last time was completely different in path/speed/confidence that it as a completely different level.

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MawiIe posted...

I think what makes it fun is that each time you can discover new paths and shortcuts and ways the level interconnects. There are so many places where a well timed triple jump on a slope can cut a decent amount of minutes off of your run. Like yeah jumping up tick tock clock over and over is a bit of a nightmare but jumping up the last time was completely different in path/speed/confidence that it as a completely different level.

I agree with this point - honestly, I feel like I could write a whole book on why I think some degree of repetition in gaming is actually an important tool, and the ability to discover something new among the familiar is one of those reasons

Surskit posted...

Not to be that guy, but like... get good? This isn't even a particularly difficult star. Just jump from where you start to the (very forgiving, not a bottomless pit) obstacle course, get the blue coins after practicing the timing for the wall jumps, and ride the carpet up to the castle. You don't need to get on the carpet again and never had to before, and the ride up to the castle is very simple. Rainbow Ride is one of the few courses in which you can actually freely move the camera since there's no walls, and it gives you a better view of the platforming than any other stage. The stage has a lot of coins; you can get a fourth of them on the spinning platforms with the Lakitus on them.

Respectfully disagree. If I'm not good enough to beat it by now, I'm never going to be. Platformers with pits and questionable cameras are always going to kill me. The controls in 64 are simply such that a level as open as Rainbow Ride is literally the worst thing ever. And I don't know why, but the perspective in that level always messes me up. Like, it takes me ages just to work my way through the red coin maze for some reason. I admit it's not that technically challenging to do, but I can never do it. The only reason I don't die there is because it's almost impossible. (And yet, I have died there from falling too much.)


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Even speedrunners mess Rainbow Ride up from time to time, so "get good" doesn't really seem applicable.

The rest of the game doesn't really do much to prepare you for the more challenging, unforgiving platforming in the latter two stages, so it shouldn't be a surprise people struggle with them.

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Agreed. Tick Tock Clock is hard for different reasons, though. Other than camera angles being a factor, you generally can get good at TTC. They're more challenging than in some stages, but I can certainly get all 7 stars there.

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idk I'm a pretty crap gamer and absolutely suck at platformers. Most of the time I don't even try to play any games that are even remotely hard because I know I'll just be frustrated and have a bad time, yet I didn't find Rainbow Ride's 100 coins difficult whatsoever. I just practiced the wall jumping for the blue coins; the rest of the coins weren't difficult to get since usually you won't fall to your death if you do screw up in the platforming until you have to ride the carpet, which again, you only have to do once and there's a single obstacle that may screw you over (a slippery block you have to jump while riding the carpet). If you're bad at the red coin maze, it may take a few tries but you won't actually die.

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Yeah I think rainbow ride is actually fairly easy to get the 100 coins in. Like I had much more challenge getting it on all the other later levels. Most of the tricky platforming in RR is above the three spinning discs so it's pretty easy to save yourself from permanent death. I did have to go back up the carpet three times to find all the coins but managed to do it in a single life.

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SantaRPidgey posted...

Banjo is a good platformer but the freedom of movement isn't even close to mario.

Yeah they have completely different goals. I think B-K's level design does a better job at bringing out the best of its leisurely pace though. In 64 the fun really comes from mastering mario's movement, and the level design doesn't really do a whole lot for it (there shouldn't be water levels in a game like this imo).

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