Poll of the Day > Trump commuted Roger Stone's sentence.

(+) Yeah! (+)

chlc3d posted...

Ok... I think this may be a good example of the point of confusion. I can agree with the statement that it 'sounds impeachable'. I do not understand how you would actually bring an impeachment trial on those grounds within the mechanisms of constitutional law. So if all you wanted to say this whole time is that it 'sounds impeachable', I don't really disagree. But if you think it is impeachable, I would like to understand why you think that.

you are talking in circles my dude

---

chlc3d posted...

This is a pretty adversarial model of human communication.

Mead's only offline social interactions are with his dogs. He's not used to human communication =p

BlackScythe0 posted...

... is zeus talking to himself?

It took me a second to figure out what BS0 meant, but is BS0 seriously still using that gimmick where he pretends half the board is me? ffs, he once accused me of being Helly... I keep thinking, "This is a new low for BS0," and then he rips the floor out from underneath himself and falls another few levels.

---

Mead posted...

you are talking in circles my dude

Ok then m'lady

---

CyborgSage00x0 posted...

About the only thing Trump has done that can be qualified as "good" is expose just how many problems the US government and Constitution has. Presidential pardons and the ability to commute needs to be stripped. Never a good reason for it to be there to begin with.

Yeah, the fundamental problem here is that the presidential pardon is utterly ludicrous. Even if it's possible to impeach Trump for this (people seem very mad about my skepticism on this point for reasons I can't comprehend, I guess because I'm criticizing the constitution...?), he could simply have waited until the end of his term to do it like Clinton did with Marc Rich

---

CyborgSage00x0 posted...

About the only thing Trump has done that can be qualified as "good" is expose just how many problems the US government and Constitution has. Presidential pardons and the ability to commute needs to be stripped. Never a good reason for it to be there to begin with.

I think it can be important, to undo sentences that are too harsh or to release people that were probably wrongly sent to jail. The legal system is pretty fucked up. Even when a prisoner's innocence seems likely, there's all sorts of bs hurdles put in the way of getting an appeal or new trial.

I do think there should be some sort of review panel that has to approve pardon/commutation requests, based on whether it meets the standards of a set of guidelines for why someone's sentence should be pardoned/commuted (not just, "I want him out"). Maybe like a 5 person panel, where the president's party chooses 3 seats and the other party chooses 2. So it's still weighted towards the president, but outrageous or corrupt requests can get shot down.

Zeus posted...

Mead's only offline social interactions are with his dogs. He's not used to human communication =p

It took me a second to figure out what BS0 meant, but is BS0 seriously still using that gimmick where he pretends half the board is me? ffs, he once accused me of being Helly... I keep thinking, "This is a new low for BS0," and then he rips the floor out from underneath himself and falls another few levels.

I don't remember that one.

Roger Stone did nothing wrong. He good boy.

---

EventualDecline posted...

Roger Stone did nothing wrong.

Then why was he convicted?
---

Phantom_Nook posted...

Then why was he convicted?

For threatening the life of a witness, and the dudes dog.

BlackScythe0 posted...

I don't remember that one.

Zeus is the craziest person here. His whole gimmick is old conspiracy nut on welfare. Hes literally Dale Grible.

---

FrndNhbrHdCEman posted...

Zeus is the craziest person here. His whole gimmick is old conspiracy nut on welfare. Hes literally Dale Grible.

That is the best comparison for him ever.

BlackScythe0 posted...

That is the best comparison for him ever.

I was rewatching KOTH and it was like seeing Zeus. But Dale wouldnt sell out to the Republican Party.

---

Zeus posted...

Considering that the investigation was the combination of a partisan witch hunt and fishing expedition

A partisan witch hunt by the Republicans who called it, the Republican-controlled congress that approved it, the Republican who served as special prosecutor, or the Republican justice department that oversaw it?

chlc3d posted...

Where does the constitution say abuse of power is grounds for impeachment?

The part where it says that the president can be impeached for "high crimes and misdemeanours". Which is anything that congress says it is.

The exact phrase "high crimes and misdemeanours" actually dates back several hundred years into English common law, and in the era where it was written "misdemeanours" didn't refer to "minor crimes" the way it does today, it refers to conduct that was legal but still "bad".

Something does not have to be illegal for it to be impeachable. This is why several Supreme Court justices have been impeached and removed for things like "drunkenness", which was not illegal but was seen to be bringing the court into disrepute.

Some things are illegal but not impeachable - if Trump stole a candy bar, jaywalked across the street, then got a speeding ticket on his way home, he's committed three crimes, but no one would reasonably say it was impeachable conduct.

By the same token, some things are impeachable, but not illegal. For instance, if Trump started giving out pardons on request to anyone who donated at least a million dollars to his re-election campaign, including pardoning murderers and rapists if their family was well-enough off, he would be completely within his legal authority as president (there are almost no restrictions on who the president can pardon and under what circumstances, so long as they were convicted of a crime in federal court), but it would be such a gross and blatant abuse of the powers he has been invested with it would almost certainly lead to impeachment and removal.

---

No surprise here.

---

streamofthesky posted...

I think it can be important, to undo sentences that are too harsh or to release people that were probably wrongly sent to jail. The legal system is pretty fucked up. Even when a prisoner's innocence seems likely, there's all sorts of bs hurdles put in the way of getting an appeal or new trial.

The solution to this is a better justice system, though.

---