Poll of the Day > Geek+: Streaming Nerdy Nostalgia in 480i

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The Wave Master
01/04/20 10:31:13 PM
#251:


I have not played Magic since before I got really sick in 2014. I had a nice collection going, and then life hit, and I spent those 6 months in the hospital, and in and out of a coma for a few weeks in between. I'm so far behind on expansions that I have no idea what's going on any longer.

I finally hooked up the air fryer, and it is pretty swank. I did some home made frieds last night, and it got the cooked well and crisp without any oil. It's like magic. I'm going to get some cheese sticks this week and really chow down.

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ParanoidObsessive
01/04/20 11:44:36 PM
#252:


I_Abibde posted...
On that, I agree. Ice Age was a great expansion. Certainly good enough to kick the crap out of my Fallen Empires decks, heh. It was also a nice change after Tempest, which was the 'in' thing when I started trying to play.

I feel like your timing is off there...? Tempest was part of the Weatherlight/Rath Cycle. Which came after the Mirage Cycle, which came after Ice Age.

The early set order was the base set, then Arabian Nights, Antiquities, Legends, The Dark, Fallen Empires, Ice Age, Homelands.

Homelands got such a negative reaction that they panicked and decided to do Ice Age again, which is what led to Alliances, which is when they started playing with the idea of releasing sets as part of cycles. After that was Mirage/Visions, which was a cycle of its own.

Then they did Weatherlight, which led to an endless series of sets, cycles, and blocks that were basically all just one long running story, which is the point where I tuned out because it just didn't interest me at all, and my friend group had kind of stopped playing Magic by that point (actually, I kind of started faltering because Mirage wasn't that appealing to me, and only got a couple Visions boosters before dropping off).

When I first started playing it was during the tail-end of Revised/3rd Edition, right before the release of 4th Edition. It was the point where Fallen Empires was the "current" booster set, The Dark was still in circulation (but like I mentioned, some store owners had already started raising prices on them), and there were still packs and boxes from all the earlier sets still available if you looked hard enough (I remember seeing a full Arabian Nights box for $400). My group sort of peaked during Ice Age and Homelands, then tapered off after.

My friends sort of started getting back into it again around Time Spiral (just after they did Coldsnap, which was their third Ice Age set, a decade late), though most of us don't buy boosters any more, or pay attention to set metaplot or flavor text like we used to. Now we just occasionally buy a pre-constructed deck or individual cards off Amazon. Though I did buy a box of Unhinged at one point.





EDIT: Actually, on reflection, you might be thinking of Coldsnap - that was an Ice Age-related set that came out at some point after Tempest.
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WhiskeyDisk
01/04/20 11:49:37 PM
#253:


I've got to be honest. I've...never understood the entire TCG thing. I can deal with luck based factors, I have no issues with dice or gambling. I also have no problem with known boards with known pieces and known rules.

All that being said, TCGs always seemed to me like playing chess, except pulling the pieces out of a bag like Scrabble, but everyone gets to bring their own bag, which itself is a PTW/gacha in building the bag you bring.

It sort of combines the two things I hate the most about both concepts.

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ParanoidObsessive
01/05/20 12:13:59 AM
#254:


WhiskeyDisk posted...
I've got to be honest. I've...never understood the entire TCG thing. I can deal with luck based factors, I have no issues with dice or gambling. I also have no problem with known boards with known pieces and known rules.

All that being said, TCGs always seemed to me like playing chess, except pulling the pieces out of a bag like Scrabble, but everyone gets to bring their own bag, which itself is a PTW/gacha in building the bag you bring.

Kind of. But that's the appeal - different players get to play in different ways. Someone who wants to play with a massive army of giant creatures (sort of in the Yu-Gi-Oh! mold) and someone who mostly wants to play fast burn/hand denial (the way I used to play) can both enjoy the game. Without that flexibility, I probably never would have gotten into it - I definitely never got into any of the other games that came out around that same period where they came with two pre-made decks, one for each player (ie, I have a Star Wars box set where one player played as the Rebels/Light Side and the other player played Imperials/Dark Side, and you just took both decks out of the same box and played without buying any extra cards).

Personally, I started out with a deck that was mostly smaller creatures, healing, and some minor direct damage (white/black), but eventually gravitated to an extremely creature-light, powerful damage spell-heavy deck that only healed by stealing life from the opponent and mostly just tried to murder them as quickly as possible (red/black). I also had a blue/black Millstone deck that existed solely to make the opponent discard all their cards, preventing them from actually doing anything until they lose by running out of cards (I called it my "No Fun" deck). At the moment, my main decks are a white/red deck that balances healing with spell attacks (still almost no creatures, only spells), and a white/black vampire deck I made that is built around a combo that causes infinite damage to everyone at the table who isn't me.

It also depends on who you play with, and how you play. I almost always play in games with 4-6 players, who are playing casually, using the old rules from the 90s (when we all learned how to play), and none of us play in tournaments (where everyone is way too serious and there's a huge pay-to-win factor involved in getting competitive decks). If I was playing in hardcore 1-on-1 professional circuit circles, I'd be playing very different decks (and not actually having any fun).

In my group, you could easily buy a single pre-made deck for $20-30 or so and be somewhat competitive (and a few boosters/individual card purchases would make you very competitive). There isn't a huge financial investment unless you want it to be. Conversely, there are people who probably spend hundreds (if not thousands) of dollars every year to get new cards, as the tournament scene only allows cards from the last block or two (ie, the last couple years).

Though my personal favorite CCG of all time was Legend of the Five Rings. Because that was a game where they would literally take the results of various tournaments and RPG sessions at conventions, and would integrate those results into the overarching plot of the story. So if Lion decks were beating Dragon decks in tournaments, then in the story the Lion would start to press into Dragon territory. If players were playing a lot of tainted cards in Crane decks, then in the plot the Crane were being corrupted by the Shadowlands. And so on. To the point where some players would literally play non-competitive decks or sub-optimal builds solely to attempt to influence the overall metaplot.

L5R actually built to a final tournament, where the deck the winner was playing would determine who became Emperor in-universe. The developers actually wrote an ending to the story for every clan, and put them in envelopes, which they then tore up when the last player with a deck from that clan was eliminated from the tournament (at GenCon). It was an incredibly huge deal, with an incredibly invested player-base, at a time when that sort of thing was almost completely unheard of:

http://www.alderac.com/2019/12/16/the-day-of-thunder-part-1-the-history-of-aeg-11
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WhiskeyDisk
01/05/20 12:18:06 AM
#255:


As a non-player, PO...I understood some of those words from context clues, but if we're being honest you could have literally made half of that post up out of thin air and I'd have had the same reaction to it. I doubt you're screwing with me, but for all intents and purposes, the best I can do is smile and nod and say...ok.

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Zeus
01/05/20 4:34:46 AM
#256:


I_Abibde posted... On that, I agree. Ice Age was a great expansion. Certainly good enough to kick the crap out of my Fallen Empires decks, heh. It was also a nice change after Tempest, which was the 'in' thing when I started trying to play.

The only thing I have to say about Tempest is fuck phasing.

The Wave Master posted...
I have not played Magic since before I got really sick in 2014. I had a nice collection going, and then life hit, and I spent those 6 months in the hospital, and in and out of a coma for a few weeks in between. I'm so far behind on expansions that I have no idea what's going on any longer.

I think I dropped out right around Le-Gi-Ons (which apparently was 2003, a bit earlier than I thought), or maybe the expansion before it which started the block.

I did pick up a few packs from the Kamigawa block despite not playing and, apparently a bit after that, I played in my first and only tourney -- a release sealed draft or whatever for Planar Chaos (and notably got a copy of Teneb the Harvester, which helped in a few games), which was the last time I played MtG (and I top 8'd, but it was just a local tourney).

ParanoidObsessive posted...
Then they did Weatherlight, which led to an endless series of sets, cycles, and blocks that were basically all just one long running story, which is the point where I tuned out because it just didn't interest me at all, and my friend group had kind of stopped playing Magic by that point (actually, I kind of started faltering because Mirage wasn't that appealing to me, and only got a couple Visions boosters before dropping off).

Kek. Yeah, the running storyline -- particulary the super-long one that ran between blocks -- was pretty garbo. But that's kind of the issue these games tend to run into, because sooner or later there's the temptation to eschew lore in favor of an actual story.

ParanoidObsessive posted...
It also depends on who you play with, and how you play. I almost always play in games with 4-6 players

Kinda how we often did it, although it meant having separate decks for multi vs single especially when players were insisting on mana rush. It's kinda the only way to go when you've got a whole bunch of people together.

WhiskeyDisk posted...
As a non-player, PO...I understood some of those words from context clues, but if we're being honest you could have literally made half of that post up out of thin air and I'd have had the same reaction to it. I doubt you're screwing with me, but for all intents and purposes, the best I can do is smile and nod and say...ok.

The important takeaway is that a game like MtG rather uniquely facilitates all kinds of play styles, which you don't necessarily see in other CCGs. And, because the way MtG is structured, it also has more play options than other CCGs when it comes to things like group play (which is difficult to do at all with some CCGs).

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ParanoidObsessive
01/05/20 7:57:31 PM
#257:


Zeus posted...
The only thing I have to say about Tempest is fuck phasing.

Conceptually, it's a cool idea. Mechanically, it kind of sucks, because it takes too much coordination and pre-planning to make it worthwhile, otherwise it basically just turns into "You can't use half your cards half the time".



Zeus posted...
Kek. Yeah, the running storyline -- particulary the super-long one that ran between blocks -- was pretty garbo. But that's kind of the issue these games tend to run into, because sooner or later there's the temptation to eschew lore in favor of an actual story.




Zeus posted...
WhiskeyDisk posted...
As a non-player, PO...I understood some of those words from context clues, but if we're being honest you could have literally made half of that post up out of thin air and I'd have had the same reaction to it. I doubt you're screwing with me, but for all intents and purposes, the best I can do is smile and nod and say...ok.

The important takeaway is that a game like MtG rather uniquely facilitates all kinds of play styles, which you don't necessarily see in other CCGs. And, because the way MtG is structured, it also has more play options than other CCGs when it comes to things like group play (which is difficult to do at all with some CCGs).

In a way, it's like the people who play Fairy Chess. Adding new pieces that do different things changes the dynamic of play, and the fact that everyone at the table has a different deck means that you've got asynchronous play.
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I_Abibde
01/05/20 8:07:06 PM
#258:


ParanoidObsessive posted...
I feel like your timing is off there...?

It most likely is. I'm starting to think there's a rule of the universe that makes me forget things just enough that you have to correct me. :-P

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Zeus
01/07/20 10:52:12 PM
#259:


Thanks to Disney+ -- and my brother who got a free year of Disney+ from his cable provider or something then gave me his login -- I finally watched "The Book Job" from Simpsons season 23, which was hilarious right down to the throwaway jokes ("There's no law against sleeping inside a tyrannosaurus head."
"That's an allosaurus head."
"I want to call my paleontologist.")

Then I rewatched Treehouse 11 (still pretty fun) and Treehouse 15 (eh)

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ParanoidObsessive
01/07/20 10:53:33 PM
#260:


Zeus posted...
and my brother who gave me his login

ILLEGAL!

~reports you~
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The Wave Master
01/08/20 8:13:44 PM
#261:


Didn't realize how racist/on the point the original Breath of fire is...

Bo shoots a Bow.
Ox is big and strong.
Karn is a Carnie that throws daggers.
Ryu is a Dragon.
Gobi is a fish and clearly Chinese.
Nina is a bird.

Still loving the old school game though. Warts and all.


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Zeus
01/09/20 10:25:37 AM
#262:


Finally started Pokemon Shield last night. I like that they didn't go overboard with cutscenes like in S/M, although getting started still feels slightly longer than it should even if most of the opening chain of events feel more traditionally Pokemon.

They also seem to put more customization options early on, which was one of the thing I hated about X/Y (where I think you could only adjust your hat at the beginning) and S/M (where the default outfit was also terrible). I would rather just have a lot more customization right at the beginning like other RPGs with character creation, though.

My Genesis Mini that I picked up for $35 from Gamestop arrived a few days ago, but it'll probably gather dust next my still unopened ps4 (which I should open to check). I might have been somewhat more likely to start playing that had I not started Shield.

Also I wound up picking up a Marvel's Sandman Pop! for 3.50 or something on clearance at my local Walgreen's mostly because it was marked down to $3.50. I had liked the look of it prior, but it wasn't something I absolutely wanted. Speaking of wants, I picked up the new(er) Mighty Muggs Starscream for $6 at a Homegoods not that long ago. I had never found the original (back when the line was bigger and lacked the face-change gimmick), so it had been a want. I will say that it's cuter than the original (and, in general, the revamped line usually does look nicer even before you factor in the changing faces), even if it's smaller and lacks a more classic design.

These days the Mighty Muggs line apparently usually retails for $10, so it's priced comparably to Funko's Pop! line. The Pop!s usually feature more body sculpting whereas Hasbro's Mighty Muggs mostly just use paint. The face-change feature is nice, although usually I won't be a fan of all 3 faces. Starscream's shocked face is great. I also saw the Megatron (which iirc had an angry face and an injured face) but I didn't care enough at the time to pick him up. Mighty Muggs also have the benefit of having a hard-plastic package that's designed to be stackable (although I'm wondering how stable the weight distribution is). The line's biggest drawback (besides not having much body sculpting) is probably just the far weaker selection. Funko is a licensing machine which uses its existing distro and low costs to sell a massive variety of characters, whereas Hasbro really just plays things safe. (And, as a reminder, Hasbro's license of Marvel, Star Wars, etc, is why Funko's Pop!s from those franchises are bobbleheads. I've never liked that as much as the normal Pop!s)

New Simpsons was a half-decent Lisa episode, which is a bit of a rarity. The Artie Zink crap, which I think was technically the b-side, was lousy other than a few Homer jokes that would have felt at home in an earlier season (the elevator discussion, Homer eating that pig, etc)

ParanoidObsessive posted...
ILLEGAL!

~reports you~

"Heh heh, the perfect crime... Marge, I have to be in court next Tuesday."


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CyborgSage00x0
01/10/20 12:16:00 AM
#263:


So, the Witcher wasn't half bad, despite it being pretty hard to tell what is going on. Cavill was a good fit for Geralt...as one would hope, seeing as he demanded the role.

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Korruptor
01/10/20 9:11:44 PM
#264:


Finally started Pokemon Shield last night. I like that they didn't go overboard with cutscenes like in S/M, although getting started still feels slightly longer than it should even if most of the opening chain of events feel more traditionally Pokemon.

Speaking of Pokeymans Sword and Shield, national dex readded as dlc loooooool, pokemon is finally dead to me.
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Metalsonic66
01/10/20 9:26:32 PM
#265:


It's been dead to me for several generations now

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Zeus
01/10/20 10:55:37 PM
#266:


Korruptor posted...
Speaking of Pokeymans Sword and Shield, national dex readded as dlc loooooool, pokemon is finally dead to me.

Kinda expected it, tbh. It was a stupid, silly move.

In general, I've been annoyed by these shenanigans, but I'm not to the point where I'd quit the franchise even if many of my favorites were pointlessly cut (and, in general, they should have at *least* kept all of the starters around)

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CyborgSage00x0
01/10/20 11:16:40 PM
#267:


Zeus posted...
Kinda expected it, tbh. It was a stupid, silly move.
Nintendo initially said that it would take too long to add everyone Pokemon, with all their attacks and animations, without pushing S&S too much. Considering they now plan on adding them without the need to pay for it, it seems likely they were telling the truth.

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Korruptor
01/11/20 4:32:32 PM
#268:


Nah, considering the game's attacks/animations were pathetic, they were probably better off importing them from the last generation.
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Metalsonic66
01/11/20 4:45:30 PM
#269:


Just go back to static sprites lol

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Zeus
01/12/20 1:19:07 AM
#270:


Picked up another Universal Horror Mystery Mini and got Dracula, so I feel okay stopping here. I wouldn't mind a Gillman, but this is good.

Also I saw a copy of Neil Gaimon's Neverywhere miniseries the other day, which reminded me that the tv miniseries was a thing. Slightly kicking myself for not just buying it on the spot, although I'm not sure if I'd enjoy it any more than the comic.

Korruptor posted...
Nah, considering the game's attacks/animations were pathetic, they were probably better off importing them from the last generation.

I thought they HAD imported most of them finally?

Metalsonic66 posted...
Just go back to static sprites lol

Would also generally be nice.

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ParanoidObsessive
01/14/20 2:41:09 AM
#271:


Zeus posted...
Also I saw a copy of Neil Gaimon's Neverywhere miniseries the other day, which reminded me that the tv miniseries was a thing. Slightly kicking myself for not just buying it on the spot, although I'm not sure if I'd enjoy it any more than the comic.

If I recall correctly, that started out as the TV show, then was popular enough for Gaiman to expand on it a bit by adapting it as a full novel, then that got re-adapted into the comic.

So if you read the comic and didn't like it, it's possible that it lost something in translation. Then again, if it's more the setting itself or the premise you don't like, that might be something that's going to be consistent regardless.

I can't really give a recommendation, because honestly, I've never been a huge fan of Gaiman, and I've always felt like a lot of his stuff was a bit overrated. But that might just be because I knew too many Mall Goth types who couldn't stop fellating him over Sandman.
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WhiskeyDisk
01/14/20 3:12:26 AM
#272:


Neverwhere was an interesting premise with a lot of potential, but the execution was not his best work by a long shot. There's at least two major plot holes an astute 8 year old could point out on a first read through that kind of kill it for me as far as the novel goes.

It still has a special place in my collection for me personally because my copy is signed, and his big release signing at the Borders in the WTC was how myself and the 4 people I went with ended up drinking Guinesses with him after the signing while sitting on the giant leather couch in Borders' flagship store in the WTC, neither of which exist now.

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Zeus
01/14/20 6:01:03 AM
#273:


ParanoidObsessive posted...
I've never been a huge fan of Gaiman, and I've always felt like a lot of his stuff was a bit overrated. But that might just be because I knew too many Mall Goth types who couldn't stop fellating him over Sandman.

I have very conflicted feelings regarding Gaiman. On one hand, many of his works are genius. However, other works are merely pretentious... and some things are just outright bad. Sandman is his claim to fame and also one of my biggest points of contention, given the nature of the series.

Then, of course, there's the matter of things like Coraline which I absolutely loved, only to find out that the movie took a few substantial liberties with Gaimon's novel and the biggest changes were clearly for the better. And one of the things I liked most, the artistic style, was -- as I understand it -- entirely the work of Selick and an artist he hired. So the genius that I admired in the work wasn't necessarily the genius of Gaimon. Gaimon had a pretty cool idea (albeit one clearly inspired by other works) and others used that concept to create something incredible.

Speaking of, I think I often miss that kind of element when watching a film or show. I tend to think, "Wow, that's really neat or creative, that seems so beyond anything I might do," while overlooking that many of these things are highly collaborative where, rather than having a singular vision, a group came together to create something cool

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ParanoidObsessive
01/14/20 6:21:41 AM
#274:


The one story of his I really liked was his short story based on Zelazny's Night in the Lonesome October, where he's sort of crossing film noir with Lovecraft with a werewolf main character. But that might just be because I absolutely love A Night in the Lonesome October.

Then again, I've always been a sucker for film noir Lovecraft:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7jK3q1fNLeA
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ParanoidObsessive
01/14/20 7:21:52 AM
#275:


Sooo... this is a thing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jLMBLuGJTsA
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ParanoidObsessive
01/14/20 9:53:33 AM
#276:


WhiskeyDisk posted...
I've got to be honest. I've...never understood the entire TCG thing. I can deal with luck based factors, I have no issues with dice or gambling. I also have no problem with known boards with known pieces and known rules.

All that being said, TCGs always seemed to me like playing chess, except pulling the pieces out of a bag like Scrabble, but everyone gets to bring their own bag, which itself is a PTW/gacha in building the bag you bring.

Since we were talking about this recently, I figured I should post this now:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBIsZlV1jHk
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Metalsonic66
01/14/20 4:36:02 PM
#277:


I don't know how to feel about a Morbius movie

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I_Abibde
01/14/20 6:23:54 PM
#278:


I didn't know how to feel about a Venom movie, but that turned out all right, IMO.

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Metalsonic66
01/14/20 6:38:15 PM
#279:


It wasn't bad but it wasn't great either. It was a big misstep to exclude Spider-Man from his origin.

From that perspective, Morbius is a step forward at least

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WhiskeyDisk
01/14/20 6:39:50 PM
#280:


If anything, my main concern is that Leto gonna Leto.

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The Wave Master
01/14/20 7:48:53 PM
#281:


Venom wasn't good but it wasn't too terrible. However, once was enough for me. I don't need to see Venom ever again.

I don't care about the emo vampire either. I think Jared Leto will do a solid job as Mochael Morbius, but just like Venom I'm not payng money in theaters to see this, and will just only watch it once when it comes on HBO, which I get for free.

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Zeus
01/14/20 8:02:46 PM
#282:


I didn't like Venom much. I knew that the Morbius movie was coming and, given that he's not as tied to Spider-Man (and is less-known to the general public), he's a pretty good fit for this kind of an approach.


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ParanoidObsessive
01/15/20 9:05:54 AM
#283:


Metalsonic66 posted...
It wasn't bad but it wasn't great either. It was a big misstep to exclude Spider-Man from his origin.

Ehh. If you want to do Venom as an anti-hero out of the gate, it's almost better to drop Spider-Man. That way you don't have the whole hang-up with how much Eddie and the symbiote hate Peter/Spider-Man, and the co-comittant terrorism and assaults that make it kind of harder to root for a character.

It's not like Spider-Man is necessary to explain Venom either, honestly. The whole premise behind the character is symbiotic shape-changing alien of dubious morality that gives you super-powers. The fact that Spider-Man got it in the comic was almost incidental (and was mostly just done to justify giving him a costume change). They could easily have done the same storyline with anyone and hit most of the same story beats.
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Metalsonic66
01/15/20 5:40:50 PM
#284:


I dunno. I feel like his shift from only wanting revenge on Spider-Man to becoming his own hero is a big part of his character.

They could have still done something similar without Spider-Man, if they had started him as more of a sleazeball instead of being "The guy who wanted to do the right thing but poked the wrong hornets nest"

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WhiskeyDisk
01/15/20 6:12:06 PM
#285:


The real question is:

CAN WE EAT HIS PANCREAS?

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ParanoidObsessive
01/16/20 2:20:45 AM
#286:


Metalsonic66 posted...
I dunno. I feel like his shift from only wanting revenge on Spider-Man to becoming his own hero is a big part of his character.

Yeah, but the problem with that is, you need like 3-4 movies to actually tell that story. And you can't even really start those stories until you have an established Spider-Man (which means at least a few more movies beforehand).

First, you need the story where an experienced Spider-Man gets the symbiote, loves the effect it has on him, then realizes it's using him, then he has to resist it, and ultimately get rid of it. Then you need the part (either in that same movie, or a completely separate movie) where Eddie Brock is "ruined" by Spider-Man and develops his hatred. Then you have the movie where Eddie gets Venom, they bond over their shared hatred of Peter/Spider-Man, he fights Spider-Man, and generally does the villain thing. THEN you can finally have a movie where Eddie repents and becomes a good guy.

(And that's not even getting into the fact that the LOOK of the costume doesn't even really make much sense if you don't have Spider-Woman in the universe for Peter to steal the look from, or the fact that he got it during Secret Wars, which you're likely never going to see on-screen).

That's pretty much impossible to do (well) in any realistic film series. And when you try to condense the entirety of that story into a single film, you get Spider-Man 3.

It's easier to do with serial TV (like the 90s Spider-Man animated series). But there's nowhere near as much money in that as there is in movies, and I'm not even sure Sony HAS TV rights at the moment, so that's never happening.

Conversely, his origin story in the Ultimates universe (which is the version of a LOT of the characters that the MCU has been using, or at least a sort of hybrid of 616 and Ultimate - which is why you got both Loki AND the Chitauri as the threat that forms the Avengers, as a blend of both origin stories) is much, much different. The symbiote was made in a lab, by both Peter and Eddie's parents, who were coworker scientists, and Peter and Eddie were childhood friends. Then Eddie becomes Venom, and never actually reforms, remaining a villain right up to the end of the line. If they'd gone out of their way to make sure Venom showed up in a Spider-Man film, THIS is the version you'd probably be getting. Because it's WAAAY easier to write a story about (in fact, this was basically Harry Osborn's storyline in Amazing Spider-Man 2).

Though I'd argue that "guy who hates Spider-Man, but who later decides to be a good guy" isn't even THAT key to his character. He really only spent a short time in the comics as a dedicated villain, and then mostly became a more complex character who probably spent more time away from Peter than interacting with him. It just feels like it's important because it's the origin we already KNOW for him... but "science made a weird symbiote/found aliens in space, guy gets infected, goes a bit crazy, but then tries to be a good guy" is actually a pretty solid basis for a movie.



Metalsonic66 posted...
They could have still done something similar without Spider-Man, if they had started him as more of a sleazeball instead of being "The guy who wanted to do the right thing but poked the wrong hornets nest"

I think that's sort of what they were trying to do. But film execs are VERY hesitant to have main characters who start out completely evil or amoral, so it got sterilized into "Well, you know, he's not such a bad guy, really." The most you get is "Hey, he's rebellious! And he read people's e-mail without permission! And he got fired for accusing people of stuff he couldn't prove! Sure, I mean, yeah, they DID those things, but still! And hey, at least we included the parts where he was a reporter who got fired and was all bitter about it afterward! That's like A++ accuracy to the comics right there! WHAT MORE DO YOU WANT?!"

It's the same reason why you got Scott Lang Ant-Man having to explain that, sure, yes, he's a thief who hacked into corporate servers and rerouted millions of dollars, but hey, it was totally a Robin Hood situation because the company was corrupt and he was just trying to do the right thing. Hey everybody, we can root for him as a hero now! Meanwhile, comic book Scott was just a petty burglar using his tech knowledge to break and enter and steal (and keep all the money). And then literally stole the Ant-Man suit (without Hank Pym's knowledge) so he could be a better thief. It's also why you get stuff like 20th Century Fox Magneto trying to do things like turn all humans into mutants, rather than, you know, kill off most humans and enslave the others so mutants can rule. Film Magneto starts out complex. Comic Magneto was cartoonish evil for 15 years before there was even a HINT that he was maybe more complex.

It's part of why I never expect complete accuracy to the comics for most characters, especially the less moral or more violent/lethal ones, when they get films. The most I usually hope for is that the new interpretation mostly keeps the spirit of the original character while telling a well-constructed story of its own.
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Metalsonic66
01/16/20 2:24:59 AM
#287:


Honestly they could have summed up the Spider-Man connection with a 5-minute intro if they wanted. Even connected it to the Webb movies without using Garfield himself.

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ParanoidObsessive
01/16/20 2:39:05 AM
#288:


Yeah, but then it's pointless and overcomplicated, and detracts from the movie as needless fanservice more than it adds to it by being faithful to the original version.
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Metalsonic66
01/16/20 3:17:38 AM
#289:


Doing the whole Secret Wars story would be too much even for a big interconnected universe like the MCU.

Maybe one day we'll get a good live-action version of the Black Suit storyline.

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I_Abibde
01/16/20 7:55:10 PM
#290:


ParanoidObsessive posted...
Comic Magneto was cartoonish evil for 15 years before there was even a HINT that he was maybe more complex.

*goes to look at Marvel Essentials*

Magneto and Xavier have one conversation (via telepathy) in the '60s run of Uncanny X-Men that states that the two of them could be allies, if only just -- yeah, you know the deal.

Had to wait for Claremont to pick that ball up, I guess.

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Revelation34
01/16/20 7:59:47 PM
#291:


Metalsonic66 posted...
Doing the whole Secret Wars story would be too much even for a big interconnected universe like the MCU.

Maybe one day we'll get a good live-action version of the Black Suit storyline.


What about the original version of the infinity war? Could they have done it if they had the rights to all the characters back then?
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Metalsonic66
01/16/20 8:35:06 PM
#292:


Do you mean Infinity War or Infinity Gauntlet?

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Revelation34
01/17/20 1:54:07 AM
#293:


Metalsonic66 posted...
Do you mean Infinity War or Infinity Gauntlet?


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Infinity_War
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Metalsonic66
01/17/20 2:02:59 AM
#294:


I know what Infinity War is

The movie was based more on Gauntlet really.

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Zeus
01/17/20 8:22:17 AM
#295:


Metalsonic66 posted...
Doing the whole Secret Wars story would be too much even for a big interconnected universe like the MCU.

idk, they could probably swing it, but I'm no sure the content carries itself well enough.

Metalsonic66 posted...
Maybe one day we'll get a good live-action version of the Black Suit storyline.

I'm not sure you *could* do a good version of it. Especially since even the cartoons seem to rush that storyline (because it's a major continuity shift that could confuse viewers during rebroadcasts unless, of course, they do it as a season-long event which is really how it should be handled anyway)

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Metalsonic66
01/17/20 8:26:35 AM
#296:


Zeus posted...
I'm not sure you *could* do a good version of it. Especially since even the cartoons seem to rush that storyline (because it's a major continuity shift that could confuse viewers during rebroadcasts unless, of course, they do it as a season-long event which is really how it should be handled anyway)
It only took a few episodes for Spectacular Spider-Man to tell the story in a condensed but still satisfying way.

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ParanoidObsessive
01/17/20 12:07:10 PM
#297:


I_Abibde posted...
Magneto and Xavier have one conversation (via telepathy) in the '60s run of Uncanny X-Men that states that the two of them could be allies, if only just -- yeah, you know the deal.

Had to wait for Claremont to pick that ball up, I guess.

And even he didn't do it right away. He didn't really start playing with the idea until X-Men #150 (though once he started, he pulled that particular thread real hard).

Three years earlier, he was writing the story where Magneto got pissed off and captured the X-Men and strapped them down so they could be helpless like babies and had his nanny robot treat them like infants.
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WhiskeyDisk
01/17/20 12:45:49 PM
#298:


ParanoidObsessive posted...
And even he didn't do it right away. He didn't really start playing with the idea until X-Men #150 (though once he started, he pulled that particular thread real hard).

Three years earlier, he was writing the story where Magneto got pissed off and captured the X-Men and strapped them down so they could be helpless like babies and had his nanny robot treat them like infants.


Was that before or after Magneto mastered Animal Magnetism?

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Zeus
01/17/20 10:02:06 PM
#299:


Been glancing at comics now and again in my adventures. Some of these have included issues from:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jughead:_The_Hunger

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_Girl

https://www.cbr.com/justice-league-dark-otherkind/

idk, moving past the really mainstream stuff, there's some interesting stuff in recent years. Archie in general has had a number of quirky titles over the years (as have a few other classic comics/cartoons), although the concept for this is a bit more fun.

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Zeus
01/17/20 11:18:16 PM
#300:


Oh, plus I saw an issue of Teknophage, which kinda ties together glancing at comics (albeit this isn't a recent series) *and* Gaimon who, back when I originally read a few issues, was a name that meant nothing to me. It was also a series that had a kinda neat premise but I remember the execution being meh.

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