Current Events > So I've started learning Python today...

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CableZL
02/09/19 9:35:06 PM
1
I'm getting into the input/output stuff. I can already tell that there's no way I'd want to be a programmer and have to do this professionally. Nope nope nope.
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Sad_Face
02/09/19 9:39:12 PM
2
What's so repulsive about programming compared to IT, which you are already a professional at? I'm on the flipside, have no IT experience but can program (no longer for a job though).
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CableZL
02/09/19 9:47:27 PM
3
Sad_Face posted...
What's so repulsive about programming compared to IT, which you are already a professional at? I'm on the flipside, have no IT experience but can program (no longer for a job though).


I don't know if repulsive is the right way to refer to it. It definitely has its similarities to network engineering. With Cisco equipment, I deal with CLI a lot and I'm typing show commands to see info and configuration commands to make the devices work the way I want them to.

You know what, as I type this, I'm realizing it's more like network engineering than I originally thought... I'll probably need to reserve judgement about how much I do or don't like it until I understand it more.

I wouldn't want to be a network engineer if I didn't know what I was doing in the networking realm, either.
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CableZL
02/09/19 9:48:37 PM
4
I was typing out a few complaints about what I currently imagine programming to be and was like "Well, I kinda deal with that already... Yeah, that's pretty similar, too."

So I'll continue and see how I feel about it once I'm more proficient.
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Johnny_Nutcase
02/09/19 9:48:43 PM
5
Yeah I hate networking simply because I suck at it. If I got better at it, I might change my tune.
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BreezyExcursion
02/09/19 10:25:41 PM
6
idk man when u put python next to perl, python looks like english
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gm
Anteaterking
02/09/19 10:28:03 PM
7
BignutzisBack
02/09/19 10:28:59 PM
8
TC is it true that you got a coding job without a degree?
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darkmaian23
02/09/19 10:49:08 PM
9
Anteaterking posted...
Python is great.
CableZL
02/09/19 10:50:24 PM
10
BignutzisBack posted...
TC is it true that you got a coding job without a degree?

I became a network engineer without a degree
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BignutzisBack
02/09/19 10:52:18 PM
11
CableZL posted...
BignutzisBack posted...
TC is it true that you got a coding job without a degree?

I became a network engineer without a degree


Damn how many years did it take you to learn your skills or was it something you had been doing as a hobby when you were younger?
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FLUFFYGERM
02/09/19 10:55:43 PM
12
I'm surprised you haven't already written a good deal of code for your current job. Lots of things can be done with reusable scripts and the like.
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Sad_Face
02/10/19 12:14:52 AM
13
CableZL posted...
You know what, as I type this, I'm realizing it's more like network engineering than I originally thought... I'll probably need to reserve judgement about how much I do or don't like it until I understand it more.

Heh, once you get the hang of it, you'll come to love it.

BreezyExcursion posted...
idk man when u put python next to perl, python looks like english

Perl was my main language yet I've always been recommended Python. Since I was complacent, I put off learning python for ages, but I hopped the on board when my friend gave me a mini project to show him I could do the work so he could get me an interview at his company. I picked up Python in a day, never looked back at Perl.
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Popcorn_Fairy
02/10/19 12:19:48 AM
14
I had to take a Java Class for my degree. Glad that was the only programming I needed. Hated it. Much like working with the computers themselves.

Cisco is kind of fun too, but there's a lot of commands and shit to memorize.
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Johnny_Nutcase
02/10/19 2:12:32 AM
15
BignutzisBack posted...
CableZL posted...
BignutzisBack posted...
TC is it true that you got a coding job without a degree?

I became a network engineer without a degree


Damn how many years did it take you to learn your skills or was it something you had been doing as a hobby when you were younger?


Certifications. He must have self taught himself all of this shit. It's impressive, because networking can be a nightmare. I went through a Cisco Networking "academy" and it sucked.
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I've learned that life is one crushing defeat after another... until you just wish Flanders was dead. - Homer Simpson
CEOffendsMe
02/10/19 2:13:26 AM
16
Imagine giving up at the part where you learn input and output LMFAO.
MarqueeSeries
02/10/19 3:14:08 AM
17
Python is a pretty interesting language, and much friendlier than shit like C++

It's actually lightly integrated into physics and engineering degrees at my school. Mostly vpython, but some general use coding as well
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Nidhoggr
02/10/19 3:22:07 AM
18
I'm currently learning C++ and it sucks.
Minute
02/10/19 3:22:37 AM
19
CEOffendsMe posted...
Imagine giving up at the part where you learn input and output LMFAO.

dude i took like a semester of C and I still don't fully understand scanf lmao
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darkmaian23
02/10/19 3:46:04 AM
20
@Nidhoggr
Why are you learning C++? I'm doing it as a hobby because I've been upset for years that I never really understood it when I wrote code for school and personal projects. The amount of stuff that you need to know to be proficient in modern C++ is insane. Honestly, it feels like the language never ends. After going through numerous books, tutorials, and samples, I'm convinced that nobody knows how to write good modern C++.

@Minute
I've always enjoyed the relative simplicity of pure C, but it's so easy to make mistakes with pointer arithmetic and buffer sizes.

Any thoughts on Go? I like the idea of the language and code is fairly readable, but I don't like the opinionated style of the language; it seems overbearing. The creators of Go insist generics aren't needed, but parts of the language use something like generics behind the scenes. And why does it care where the curly braces go?
Minute
02/10/19 3:49:04 AM
21
darkmaian23 posted...
I've always enjoyed the relative simplicity of pure C, but it's so easy to make mistakes with pointer arithmetic and buffer sizes.

Yeah, I really liked the control C gives you, but man it's easy fuck up. "Sorry, can't do while(!feof(FILE *)), that'll get you an extra character. Gotta do while(fgetc(FILE *) != EOF) because THAT makes sense."

like why even have feof lol
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Nidhoggr
02/10/19 3:52:01 AM
22
darkmaian23 posted...
Why are you learning C++? I'm doing it as a hobby because I've been upset for years that I never really understood it when I wrote code for school and personal projects. The amount of stuff that you need to know to be proficient in modern C++ is insane. Honestly, it feels like the language never ends. After going through numerous books, tutorials, and samples, I'm convinced that nobody knows how to write good modern C++.

Doing it for school at the moment. But l'm thinking of continuing it even after I finish the class and become proficient in it enough for a career.
Minute
02/10/19 3:53:13 AM
23
I JUST started C++ this semester (in January) so I can't really comment, but it seems like one of the best languages to know.
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Johnny_Nutcase
02/10/19 3:55:36 AM
24
Minute posted...
I JUST started C++ this semester (in January) so I can't really comment, but it seems like one of the best languages to know.


C++ was easy for me somehow. I took Java and got lost quick.
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I've learned that life is one crushing defeat after another... until you just wish Flanders was dead. - Homer Simpson
BB mofo
02/10/19 4:56:19 AM
25
BreezyExcursion posted...
idk man when u put python next to perl, python looks like english


Ah, the old "Obfuscated Perl" contests of old that ran back in the 90s. Where the goal was to write code that would cause the judges to pull out their hair.
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CableZL
02/10/19 7:29:12 AM
26
BignutzisBack posted...
CableZL posted...
BignutzisBack posted...
TC is it true that you got a coding job without a degree?

I became a network engineer without a degree


Damn how many years did it take you to learn your skills or was it something you had been doing as a hobby when you were younger?

I started studying on my own and getting certifications. It also helped to be working in a NOC doing graveyard shifts. I was studying at home and at work because there was hardly anything to do during the night shift.

Rough time line of getting my certs:

Started studying in May of 2013
CCENT - 3 Months
CCNA Routing and Switching - 7 months (2 week break for GTA5)
CCNA Security - 1 year 1 month
CCNP Routing and Switching - 3 years (6 month break waiting for study material for new exams)
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CableZL
02/10/19 7:29:40 AM
27
CEOffendsMe posted...
Imagine giving up at the part where you learn input and output LMFAO.

Who said anything about giving up?
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CEOffendsMe
02/10/19 3:51:29 PM
28
CableZL posted...
CEOffendsMe posted...
Imagine giving up at the part where you learn input and output LMFAO.

Who said anything about giving up?


CableZL posted...
I can already tell that there's no way I'd want to be a programmer and have to do this professionally. Nope nope nope.
CableZL
02/10/19 3:54:42 PM
29
CEOffendsMe posted...
CableZL posted...
CEOffendsMe posted...
Imagine giving up at the part where you learn input and output LMFAO.

Who said anything about giving up?


CableZL posted...
I can already tell that there's no way I'd want to be a programmer and have to do this professionally. Nope nope nope.

That doesn't mean I'm not still learning python. It just means I wouldn't want to be a programmer professionally.
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NotWhiteNinja
02/10/19 3:55:22 PM
30
Python is an utterly shit language. Don't form your overall impressions about programming from it.

IMO, the "nicest" language I've encountered is Pascal, but unfortunately there's very little professional demand for it these days. C# is fairly widely-used and quite a nice language, probably the best compromise between "nice language" and "widely used" tbh.
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warlock7735
02/10/19 3:56:09 PM
31
Python is absolutely terrible as a language. Whitespace has no place in semantics
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luigi13579
02/10/19 4:04:37 PM
32
NotWhiteNinja posted...
Python is an utterly shit language.

warlock7735 posted...
Python is absolutely terrible as a language.

"There are only two kinds of languages: the ones people complain about and the ones nobody uses."- Bjarne Stroustrup

Python does have its issues, as all languages do, but I have gotten a lot out of it, as have many others. I suppose that doesn't necessarily make a language "good" (PHP), but eh, that's programming for you. Sometimes you just have to pick a language (within reason) and run with it.
warlock7735
02/10/19 4:07:26 PM
33
luigi13579 posted...
NotWhiteNinja posted...
Python is an utterly shit language.

warlock7735 posted...
Python is absolutely terrible as a language.

"There are only two kinds of languages: the ones people complain about and the ones nobody uses."- Bjarne Stroustrup

Python does have its issues, as all languages do, but I have gotten a lot out of it, as have many others. I suppose that doesn't necessarily make a language "good" (PHP), but eh, that's programming for you. Sometimes you just have to pick a language (within reason) and run with it.

Personally I think c#in the dotnet world is excellent. If course, it's not ideal for all applications, but damn if it's not nice to code in.
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Veracity
02/10/19 4:08:53 PM
34
Pythons main draw is machine learning and data analysis. The libraries it can access make it the top in those areas.
Butterfiles
02/10/19 4:09:37 PM
35
what are you using to learn it?
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luigi13579
02/10/19 4:12:00 PM
36
warlock7735 posted...
Personally I think c#in the dotnet world is excellent. If course, it's not ideal for all applications, but damn if it's not nice to code in.

I quite liked C# when I used it myself, better than Java anyway, although the latter does have a massive standard library and is more portable (unless things have changed on that front).
CableZL
02/10/19 4:12:06 PM
37
Butterfiles posted...
what are you using to learn it?

I'm starting with the CBT Nuggets series for it. I also got some other study materials, but that's what I'm doing right now.
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CEOffendsMe
02/10/19 4:15:23 PM
38
CableZL posted...
CEOffendsMe posted...
CableZL posted...
CEOffendsMe posted...
Imagine giving up at the part where you learn input and output LMFAO.

Who said anything about giving up?


CableZL posted...
I can already tell that there's no way I'd want to be a programmer and have to do this professionally. Nope nope nope.

That doesn't mean I'm not still learning python. It just means I wouldn't want to be a programmer professionally.


Regardless, it is hilarious to get frustrated just with input and output since that's the most basic thing anyone learns (i.e. hello world).
voldothegr8
02/10/19 4:20:59 PM
39
I do general helpdesk and sys admin duties currently, I'm starting to lean towards specializing in virtualization. I'm a step away from being certified in VMware. I'm with you though TC, fuck programming. Good money to be made but I just don't have the mind for it.
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CableZL
02/10/19 4:23:23 PM
40
CEOffendsMe posted...
CableZL posted...
CEOffendsMe posted...
CableZL posted...
CEOffendsMe posted...
Imagine giving up at the part where you learn input and output LMFAO.

Who said anything about giving up?


CableZL posted...
I can already tell that there's no way I'd want to be a programmer and have to do this professionally. Nope nope nope.

That doesn't mean I'm not still learning python. It just means I wouldn't want to be a programmer professionally.


Regardless, it is hilarious to get frustrated just with input and output since that's the most basic thing anyone learns (i.e. hello world).


It's not that I'm frustrated with input /output. It was more the thought (maybe entirely unfounded) that I'd constantly have to go back and correct code that I've put out if I were to do it professionally.
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VoightKent
02/10/19 4:26:20 PM
41
Programming is literally what God used to create the world.

Do you hate God, OP?
CableZL
02/10/19 4:26:43 PM
42
VoightKent posted...
Programming is literally what God used to create the world.

Do you hate God, OP?

I'm not religious.
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CEOffendsMe
02/10/19 4:30:08 PM
43
CableZL posted...
VoightKent posted...
Programming is literally what God used to create the world.

Do you hate God, OP?

I'm not religious.


No wonder you are struggling!
LookANinja
02/10/19 4:31:14 PM
44
I don't mind Python, but i'm also taking C++ this semester. We should make a C++ topic lol.
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CableZL
02/10/19 4:38:38 PM
45
CEOffendsMe posted...
CableZL posted...
VoightKent posted...
Programming is literally what God used to create the world.

Do you hate God, OP?

I'm not religious.


No wonder you are struggling!

They doesn't make any sense.
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Sad_Face
02/10/19 8:31:08 PM
46
Veracity posted...
Pythons main draw is machine learning and data analysis. The libraries it can access make it the top in those areas.

I'm currently doing the intro Machine Learning course with Udacity. I'm a total believer of the language. It's bloody powerful.

CEOffendsMe posted...
CableZL posted...
VoightKent posted...
Programming is literally what God used to create the world.

Do you hate God, OP?

I'm not religious.


No wonder you are struggling!

lol
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CableZL
02/11/19 9:19:27 AM
47
Learned about else and elif statements yesterday. Moving along smoothly. I think my biggest problem at this point is that I don't feel like I've truly internalized the information I've learned to where I can do a whole lot with it, but it has only been two days. That will likely come with time and continued efforts in learning this stuff.
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s0nicfan
02/11/19 9:25:51 AM
48
Python is great as a prototyping language, and I give it all the credit in the world for pushing academia out of Matlab and into something that is at least portable, but it's still not where it needs to be to be truly functional. It's amazing how much performance improvement you get out of porting python code to c++ just due to crippling inefficiencies in the language itself.

Also, Cable, do yourself a favor and spend some time learning about software and systems engineering/design while you're learning Python. The language is already a mess in terms of format, but bad software design can make what you produce functionally useless outside of the specific application you created it for.
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treewojima
02/11/19 12:53:40 PM
49
Hobbyist programmer here, been doing it since I was 12. Started out in VB, graduated to C and C++ and went from there. Python is nice, never preferred it myself but I'll use it for quick mock ups of ideas that I'll usually port over to C/++. It's a good language to cut your teeth on and get the basics down - program flow, control structures, etc. One idea for practicing is to write something that you'd find useful or fun, rather than just doing the boring exercises on websites or in workbooks.
Romulox28
02/11/19 12:55:09 PM
50
cable, check out a book called Automate the Boring Stuff with Python, i think you'd enjoy it
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