Board 8 > Politics Containment Topic 215: Most Controversial Person to Ever Moonwalk

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Jakyl25
02/06/19 1:02:59 PM
1
ShadowYosuke
02/06/19 1:27:14 PM
2
I think people should look at their voting records, and see where they stand today as opposed to looking at what they did 30 years ago. Though Northam's response to this has been AWFUL. Very out of touch.
LordoftheMorons
02/06/19 1:36:35 PM
3
Doubt Northam resigns now
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Reg
02/06/19 1:36:38 PM
4
ShadowYosuke posted...
Though Northam's response to this has been AWFUL.

Yep. With a good response that showed he has changed for the better, this wouldn't be nearly as much of an issue as it is, and probably not resignation-worthy.
red sox 777
02/06/19 1:45:37 PM
5
Kind of disagree about the response. Looking at recent history, the way to stay in office after something bad happens appears to be to deny, deny, deny, distract, deny, distract, and just refuse to resign.
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Nelson_Mandela
02/06/19 1:48:29 PM
6
Are there recall laws in Virginia?
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LordoftheMorons
02/06/19 1:55:56 PM
7
Nelson_Mandela posted...
Are there recall laws in Virginia?

No recall elections. There is a recall process through the courts, though it doesn't look like anybody checks the requirements for that:
https://ballotpedia.org/Laws_governing_recall_in_Virginia
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TotallyNotMI
02/06/19 2:13:20 PM
8
Tag
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Not_an_Owl
02/06/19 2:26:16 PM
9
To my mind, the worst part of Northam's response is that he first came out and said it was him in that picture, then said it wasn't - which means he definitively lied, which is something Republicans can get away with but Democrats can't.

I can't help but worry that this episode will lead to total Republican control of Virginia until 2030 at the earliest.
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LordoftheMorons
02/06/19 2:30:21 PM
10
Statement from Dr. Vanessa Tyson on her assault allegations against Fairfax:

https://twitter.com/jaketapper/status/1093225709018013698

I have to say that she's making a much more believable case than he is.
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Peace___Frog
02/06/19 2:44:29 PM
11
I believe her 100%.
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LordoftheMorons
02/06/19 2:47:39 PM
12
I think this is generally right and that people are probably overstating how widely accepted it was 30 or 40 years ago that Racism Is Bad: https://twitter.com/primediscussion/status/1093194126005321728

Like, it should have been clear to everybody at the time that this was bad, but it sure seems like a lot of racist shit was going down in VA at the time (iirc there were at least two other photos of people in blackface in Northam's yearbook alone). It kinda feels like a blame shift from society as a whole to "a few bad apples."

(This isn't to say, of course, that ignorance or cultural norms at the time excuse the behavior. But we shouldn't pretend like racism was solved in the US in the 60s.)
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Xeybozn
02/06/19 3:00:55 PM
13
LordoftheMorons posted...
It kinda feels like a blame shift from society as a whole to "a few bad apples."

Which doesn't make any sense, as "a few bad apples" literally does ruin the rest of the apples. That's the whole point of the metaphor.
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Dancedreamer
02/06/19 3:02:43 PM
14
LordoftheMorons posted...
(This isn't to say, of course, that ignorance or cultural norms at the time excuse the behavior. But we shouldn't pretend like racism was solved in the US in the 60s.)


Racism isn't solved yet, either.
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Umitencho
02/06/19 4:02:47 PM
15
Not_an_Owl posted...
To my mind, the worst part of Northam's response is that he first came out and said it was him in that picture, then said it wasn't - which means he definitively lied, which is something Republicans can get away with but Democrats can't.

I can't help but worry that this episode will lead to total Republican control of Virginia until 2030 at the earliest.


At the minimum he is guaranteeing a Republican governor next cycle because the AA part of his voting base are just gonna stay home. Very easy to forgive someone when it wasn't your race or ethnicity used in the racist joke.
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LordoftheMorons
02/06/19 4:07:32 PM
16
Ehh Northam won by 9% last time (and Kaine won last year by 16%). As long as the Democrats can find another good candidate theyll probably still win. Depressing their margin could definitely make them lose some seats in the Legislature, though.
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Not_an_Owl
02/06/19 4:12:13 PM
17
Umitencho posted...
Not_an_Owl posted...
To my mind, the worst part of Northam's response is that he first came out and said it was him in that picture, then said it wasn't - which means he definitively lied, which is something Republicans can get away with but Democrats can't.

I can't help but worry that this episode will lead to total Republican control of Virginia until 2030 at the earliest.


At the minimum he is guaranteeing a Republican governor next cycle because the AA part of his voting base are just gonna stay home. Very easy to forgive someone when it wasn't your race or ethnicity used in the racist joke.

Northam can't run for another term until he's been out of office for 4 years. Virginia is weird that way.
---
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ShadowYosuke
02/06/19 4:20:14 PM
18
The Republicans will probably put Corey Stewart or E.W. Jackson up for election.
Peace___Frog
02/06/19 5:19:03 PM
19
https://twitter.com/brianklaas/status/1093245162418044931

Today in "no one in the trump administration cares how much they emulate authoritarian regimes, they just want to be told that they're loved even if it's not true"
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~Peaf~
Mr Lasastryke
02/06/19 5:31:17 PM
20
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uCeTsaJOXDw" data-time="


trump polling people on whether or not he's right
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xp1337
02/06/19 5:46:32 PM
21
time to demote virginia to territory status until we figure out wtf is going on. promote DC and Puerto Rico in its stead

*sigh* Herring's admission is closer to that thought experiment I posed back when the Northam story first broke about a scenario in which I wouldn't necessarily think it was an auto-out but ugh seriously Virginia? Northam and Fairfax should definitely go. I'm more uncertain about Herring and would defer to whatever Virginia's legislative black caucus thinks of it all. If they want him out, then him too.

But in terms of what will actually happen, I don't think any of the three leave. Northam was already resisting leaving but with this Herring news I think he refuses to go unless Herring goes claiming "if he doesn't have to resign why do I!?" ignoring the different circumstances. And Fairfax has been extremely defiant this whole time and has been denying the whole way through.

what a mess
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LordoftheMorons
02/06/19 5:52:19 PM
22
Hey, VA is a great state! :(
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MoogleKupo141
02/06/19 6:15:27 PM
23
...is it?
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Suprak the Stud
02/06/19 6:19:20 PM
24
Yeah VA is a top ten state easy!
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Moops?
"I thought you were making up diseases? That's spontaneous dental hydroplosion."
Jakyl25
02/06/19 6:30:13 PM
25
West Virginia: Now somehow the superior Virginia
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xp1337
02/06/19 6:30:55 PM
26
yo suprak i sent out the siren but did you see that Klobuchar announced she has a "big announcement" to make Sunday?
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xp1337: Don't you wish there was a spell-checker that told you when you a word out?
MoogleKupo141
02/06/19 6:32:07 PM
27
Jakyl25 posted...
West Virginia: Now somehow the superior Virginia


we should demote current Virginia to East Virginia
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Xeybozn
02/06/19 6:51:15 PM
28
LordoftheMorons posted...
Hey, VA is a great state! :(

Yeah, but the politicians are fucking awful. Though that's neither new nor unusual.
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Nrrr
02/06/19 6:53:03 PM
29
Shocked to hear the literal capital of the Confederacy has racist politics
LordoftheMorons
02/06/19 7:05:50 PM
30
Xeybozn posted...
LordoftheMorons posted...
Hey, VA is a great state! :(

Yeah, but the politicians are fucking awful. Though that's neither new nor unusual.

I really like Warner and Kaine!

But yeah oof this current line of succession
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Nelson_Mandela
02/06/19 7:49:08 PM
31
xp1337 posted...
yo suprak i sent out the siren but did you see that Klobuchar announced she has a "big announcement" to make Sunday?

She will be the John Kasich of 2020
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Suprak the Stud
02/06/19 7:53:35 PM
32
I think it is somewhat ignorant of us to go oh Virginia when the issue isnt Virginia as much as it is a non-insignificant chunk of older white Americans. Anyone here want to take bets that not a single member of their state legislature never did something like this in the late 70s and early 80s? We can pretend our parents and grandparents generations werent racist and this is a Virginia thing, but that is just a way to try and ignore the uncomfortable truth. Sure plenty of people might have grown since then and look back at horror or embarrassment now, but the times of America being horrifically racist arent ancient history.
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Moops?
"I thought you were making up diseases? That's spontaneous dental hydroplosion."
Suprak the Stud
02/06/19 7:56:02 PM
33
xp1337 posted...
yo suprak i sent out the siren but did you see that Klobuchar announced she has a "big announcement" to make Sunday?


MY BODY IS READY

I dont know if she has a great shot in the primary due to how crowded the field is and she isnt exactly the charismatic figure that is going to stand apart, but shes a great politician and I think she would have the easiest path to a victory over Trump. Shes also probably the candidate the republicans would have the hardest time hating.

I recognize her shortcomings in a crowded primary field, but man oh man am I at least excited it seems like shes going to run.
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Moops?
"I thought you were making up diseases? That's spontaneous dental hydroplosion."
Suprak the Stud
02/06/19 7:56:53 PM
34
Nelson_Mandela posted...
xp1337 posted...
yo suprak i sent out the siren but did you see that Klobuchar announced she has a "big announcement" to make Sunday?

She will be the John Kasich of 2020


I worry this will be exactly her fate though.
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Moops?
"I thought you were making up diseases? That's spontaneous dental hydroplosion."
Umitencho
02/06/19 8:27:17 PM
35
I say the more candidates the better.
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SgtSphynx
02/06/19 8:29:26 PM
36
Suprak the Stud posted...
Anyone here want to take bets that not a single member of their state legislature never did something like this in the late 70s and early 80s?

I live in Florida, it's almost guaranteed for every member of my state legislature regardless of age.
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Nelson_Mandela
02/06/19 8:32:38 PM
37
Suprak the Stud posted...
Nelson_Mandela posted...
xp1337 posted...
yo suprak i sent out the siren but did you see that Klobuchar announced she has a "big announcement" to make Sunday?

She will be the John Kasich of 2020


I worry this will be exactly her fate though.

I meant that comparison in this way as well
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Nrrr
02/06/19 8:36:57 PM
38
More candidates isn't always better. They can't all fit in one debate, there isn't enough coverage to go around (and it's always insanely unequal), and too many are basically carbon copies. The only results are basically a lot of dropouts early on or alot of vote splitting leading to whoever has name ID or early state advantage gaining traction. And everyone knows half of them are running for cabinet spots and to raise their name ID anyway. The ones who raise more and have bigger name ID will eat the rest unless the media fawns them like with Trump. Bernie, Warren, Harris (maybe Booker if she flames out like I suspect) are basically the only necessary candidates and I suspect they are the final 3 similar to what we saw with Obama, Clinton, Edwards.
LordoftheMorons
02/06/19 8:38:51 PM
39
The problem with a big field is LFF (which got us Trump).
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Nelson_Mandela
02/06/19 8:59:36 PM
40
My guesses for the nominee (in order of likelihood):

Biden
Harris
Hillary
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Beto
Klobuchar
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Booker
Warren
Sanders
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Fodder
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"A more mature answer than I expected."~ Jakyl25
"Sephy's point is right."~ Inviso
Reg
02/06/19 9:19:24 PM
41
From the "Only vaguely interesting even though it would be a huge scandal in any other administration" pile:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/t-mobile-executives-seeking-merger-approval-booked-more-than-52-nights-at-trumps-hotel- (remove this space) -more-than-previously-known/2019/02/06/cd6fa7e6-29ca-11e9-b011-d8500644dc98_story.html

It's literally bribery but nobody seems interested in doing shit about it \_()_/
Peace___Frog
02/06/19 10:03:27 PM
42
Suprak the Stud posted...
Sure plenty of people might have grown since then and look back at horror or embarrassment now, but the times of America being horrifically racist arent ancient history.

And there's a sizable chunk that look back with nostalgia, not horror. That's an even bigger issue.
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HaRRicH
02/07/19 12:27:37 AM
43
Lots of candidates and voices are great to have*.

*as long as people drop out sooner in the primaries than they did in the 2016 Republican primary. They can also have the MAIN Democratic primary with the top six polling and then feature a second smaller primary with the others around that same time.
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Umitencho
02/07/19 1:02:36 AM
44
Nelson_Mandela posted...
My guesses for the nominee (in order of likelihood):

Biden
Harris
Hillary
---
Beto
Klobuchar
---
Booker
Warren
Sanders
---
Fodder


Hilary has basically retired and there would be massive backlash if she ran again. Biden has been mum. Then again the trail has just started so who knows when he throws his hat in pile if at all.

Pick Hilary again, and watch Trump get re-elected and just take her fall as a story of when you let your opposition decades to tear down one of your best people.
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red sox 777
02/07/19 1:12:09 AM
45
Hillary will benefit from LFF if she chooses to run again.
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Xeybozn
02/07/19 1:31:19 AM
46
Hillary would need at least some support for LFF to help her. 0% can't win no matter how many entrants split the remaining vote. Besides, it's not like Hillary did very well in her previous primary runs; losing to a first-term senator and not completely stomping Bernie Sanders despite having huge advantages against both of them makes me think Hillary might be bad at winning elections.
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LordoftheMorons
02/07/19 1:42:36 AM
47
Hillary beat Sanders by like 15%! Of course that's lower than most people's prior expectations, but it wasn't close at all. Also she's won the popular vote in every election she's ever run in...! (Though unfortunately for all of us that's not the same thing as winning elections).

Anyway, I would love for Hillary to win the presidency in 2020, but it's absolutely not happening. She's less popular than ever because people blame her for losing to Trump, and she'd lose support from a lot of people who do still like her because they no longer think she's electable after losing the first time. All of this is moot though because she's not running.
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GuessMyUserName
02/07/19 3:13:08 AM
48
just you wait for VP Hillary
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LordoftheMorons
02/07/19 3:39:30 AM
49
Whoops, forgot to post this fantastic Pelosi clap:
https://twitter.com/jowrotethis/status/1093012712525684736
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red sox 777
02/07/19 7:49:50 AM
50
Also, just you wait for Trump to give the order for Republicans to cross over and vote for Hillary in the primary, en masse.
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