Board 8 > `````` Nominate SHEIK for CB11! #DownB

(+) Yeah! (+)

O P E R A T I O N O U S T :

vB) HaRRicH
vB) ZenOfThunder
3) Eddv
4) AxemRedRanger
5) MetalmindStats
6) UltimaterializerX
7) hombad46
8) STEINER
9) Shonen_Bat
10) TAFKAHurricane
11) Logience
12) Janus5k
13) Dels
14) WarThaNemesis2
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15) Kenri
16) Shaduln
17) Popcorn_Fairy
18) Tom Bombadil
19) Murphiroth
20) A new legend.....

SHEIKAH ON STANDBY:
jcgamer107

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/06/7a/76/067a765c276f3e51b91c82daabe3da27.jpg

BOARD 8'S STEPPING-STONE GOALS:
--> Five (5) blind pledges from Board 8 - DOUBLE SUCCESS
--> Ten (10) pledges within the rally's first week
--> Five (5) unique users adding Sheik-based signatures

BOARD 8'S MAJOR GOAL:
--> Eighty (80) pledges to support her getting into the contest by CB11's nomination-period

We've got five pledges in three days! Can we get five more in four days? If you're on the fence, this is a good time to help us hit our first goal.

Also, it'll be exciting to get our first people who lend their signatures to the cause -- we are encouraging that too so we hit our goal of five people. Every bit helps!
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Stay tuned for tomorrow -- we got something to say on duplicate characters!
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Up-B(ump)
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This is silly.

This isn't the same as Mega Man X

Or Metal Sonic

Or Dark Link

Or Linkle

Or etc etc etc.

She is not a "clone"

She is literally literally the same character as Zelda.
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So you're on our side when Sheik out-nominates Zelda that Sheik should replace Zelda, right?
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Here are two categories that blur together.....

TWELVE VARIATIONS OF EXISTING CHARACTERS:

Baby Rosalina
Dark Link
Dark Pit
Dark Samus
Devil Jin
Dry Bowser
Evil Ryu
Meta Ridley
Metal Mario
Phantom Ganon
Rose Gold Peach
Toon Link

TWELVE EXISTING CHARACTERS WITH DIFFERENT COSTUMES, TYPES, AND EFFECTS:

Crossdressing Cloud
Dr. Mario
Giga Bowser
Iroquois Pliskin
Jaycee
Mariachi Raiden
Mr. L
Safer-Sephiroth
Super Sonic
Wolf Link
Yellow Yoshi
Zero Suit Samus

Here are twenty-four characters that, more or less, we mostly agree shouldn't be in a contest. You may have your exceptions -- I could go either way on probably one of them -- but the point is we have a fear of our contests being overrun by duplicates who only have fans because of their more popular sources.

That fear is justified, but Sheik is not the same as them.

First of all, since Smash is why this rally began, Sheik is the more popular character when it comes to Smash -- kick Zelda out!

It's also worth noting Sheik did something these other characters failed to do: she convinced us she was different. She has an identity that was unique enough for us to take seriously on its own merits for the majority of her first game.

Sheik's personality had us sold compared to these other personalities listed above. We saw Cloud go into the dressing room. Snake almost gave his name away, allowing us to catch his near-mistake. Julia Chang's moveset was similar and her initials were her new name. Luigi was brainwashed after previously playing as him -- you get the gist. Meanwhile, in this important moment of gaming history, Sheik was immediately cooler than Zelda ever was before 1998 (sorry Robin Williams) and we didn't know the spoiler until nearly the end of the game.

So now we're supposed to say Sheik -- whose debut was better received than anything Zelda did previously and who is consistently out-tiering Zelda in another genre ever since -- we're supposed to say Sheik is not allowed because Zelda's here?

Nah. Sheik is the good stuff, not Zelda.

Sheik and Zelda are different enough from most duplicates and Sheik has more legitimate support than any duplicate. Release her from Zelda's shadow and nominate Sheik!
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You missed an important duplicate: Paper Mario (canonically confirmed to be a separate character from Mario)

Also, if we're using Smash Bros. select screen as an argument, Dr. Mario was the first variant character to be directly selectable from the screen in Smash!
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Dr. Mario also gets serious points docked for having a clearly similar name and appearance (as well as Paper Mario) as well as clearly similar mechanics to Mario in Smash. Sheik is far less similar to Zelda in those regards, especially since we're dealing with the LoZ-timeline and see in Ultimate that we have a Sheik and Zelda from different LoZ-games represented now.

That said, if Dr. Mario fans want to go and outrally Mario, that's their right to try and get their preferred variation in. We just think Sheik is different enough to merit having her own spot, and if our argument fails then we're replacing Zelda herself.

Also, sidenote about Paper Mario: kinda wish he'd be in Smash.
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Character select: Sheik!
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HaRRicH posted...

@Eddv
@AxemRedRanger
@MetalmindStats
@UltimaterializerX
@hombad46
@STEINER

Here's the rally you bravely jumped into -- thank you for your early support! Please share your opinion on contest philosophy regarding whether it is more appropriate to:

1) Allow both Sheik and Zelda into the same contests, or

2) Only allow Sheik in contests where she out-nominates Zelda.

We'll poll the board later but we're tallying Sheik-pledgers first...and either way we go, we're ready to get her in. What do you think though?

I say 2. Sheik is a version of Zelda.
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Cool, thanks for sharing your thoughts on the matter!

Happy 2019 day everybody!
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PLAYABLE FIGHTING GAME CHARACTERS IN A GAMEFAQS MATCH BEFORE SHEIK:

Lets change speed a bit from series and companies to genre -- time to compare Sheik against the rest of the playable characters we've seen from fighting games:
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PLAYABLE ORIGINAL FIGHTERS (24):

Akira Yuki (Virtua Fighter)
Akuma (Street Fighter, SFxT, Versus Capcom)
Chun-Li (Street Fighter, SFxT, Versus Capcom)
Dan Hibiki (Street Fighter, Versus Capcom)
Guile (Street Fighter, SFxT, Versus Capcom)
Heihachi (PlayStation All-Stars, SFxT, Tekken, Soul Calibur)
Iori Yagami (King of Fighters)
Ivy Valentine (Soul Calibur)
Jin Kazama (SFxT, Tekken)
Kasumi (Dead or Alive)
Kazuya Mishima (SFxT, Tekken)
Ky Kiske (Guilty Gear)
Kyo Kusanagi (King of Fighters)
Lu Bu (Dynasty Warriors)
M. Bison (Street Fighter, SFxT)
Nightmare (Soul Calibur)
Peacock (Skullgirls)
Sagat (Street Fighter, SFxT)
Scorpion (Mortal Kombat)
Siegfried (Soul Calibur)
Sol Badguy (Guilty Gear)
Sub-Zero (Mortal Kombat)
Terry Bogard (Fatal Fury, King of Fighters)
Tina Armstrong (Dead or Alive)
Yoshimitsu (Soul Calibur, SFxT, Tekken)

PLAYABLE ESTABLISHED FIGHTERS NOT IN SMASH (88):

2B (Soul Calibur)
Adol Christin (Ys vs. Sora no Kiseki)
Albert Wesker (Versus Capcom)
Amaterasu (Versus Capcom)
Amy Rose (Sonic the Fighters)
Archer (Fate/unlimited codes)
Bartz Klauser (Dissidia)
Big Daddy (PlayStation All-Stars)
Bomberman (DreamMix TV World Fighters)
Cecil Harvey (Dissidia)
Chie Satonaka (Persona 4 Arena)
Chris Redfield (Versus Capcom)
Cirno (a Touhou fighter spin-off)
Cole McGrath (PlayStation All-Stars, SFxT)
Dante (PlayStation All-Stars, Versus Capcom)
Daxter (PlayStation All-Stars)
Dr. Robotnik (Sonic the Fighters)
Earthworm Jim (Clayfighter)
Estelle Bright (Ys vs. Sora no Kiseki)
Ezio Auditore da Firenze (Soul Calibur)
Frank West (Versus Capcom)
Gilgamesh (Dissidia)
Geralt (Soul Calibur)
Golbez (Dissidia)
Haseo (.hack//Versus)
Isaac [Binding of Isaac] (Blade Strangers)
Isaac Clarke (PlayStation All-Stars)
Jade Curtiss (Tales of VS.)
Jak (PlayStation All-Stars)
Jecht (Dissidia)
Jill Valentine (Versus Capcom)
Kain Highwind (Dissidia)
Kat (PlayStation All-Stars)
Kefka (Dissidia)
Kite (.hack//Versus)
Knuckles (Sonic the Fighters)
KOS-MOS (Soul Calibur)
Kratos (PlayStation All-Stars, Soul Calibur)
Kratos Aurion (Tales of VS.)
Kuja (Dissidia)
Lightning (Dissidia)
Lloyd Irving (Tales of VS.)
Locke Cole (Dissidia)
Luke fon Fabre (Tales of VS.)
Marisa Kirisame (a Touhou fighter spin-off)
Mega Man X (Versus Capcom)
Metal Sonic (Sonic the Fighters)
Mike Haggar (Versus Capcom)
Morrigan Aensland (Darkstalkers, Versus Capcom)
Nathan Drake (PlayStation All-Stars)
Nemesis (Versus Capcom)
Noctis (Dissidia, Tekken)
PaRappa the Rapper (PlayStation All-Stars)
Phoenix Wright (Versus Capcom)
Poison (Street Fighter, SFxT)
Protoman (Power Battle)
Ragna the Bloodedge (BlazBlue)
Rayman (Brawlhalla)
Raiden (PlayStation All-Stars)
Ramza (Dissidia)
Ratchet (PlayStation All-Stars)
Reimu Hakurei (a Touhou fighter spin-off)
Rinoa Heartilly (Dissidia)
Roll (Versus Capcom)
Ryu Hayabusa (Dead or Alive)
Sackboy (PlayStation All-Stars)
Sephiroth (Dissidia, Ehrgeiz)
Servbot (Versus Capcom)
Sheena (Tales of VS.)
Shovel Knight (Blade Strangers)
Sigma (Versus Capcom)
Sly Cooper (PlayStation All-Stars)
Squall Leonhart (Dissidia)
Strider Hiryu (Versus Capcom)
Tails (Sonic the Fighters)
Terra Branford (Dissidia)
Tidus (Dissidia)
Tifa Lockhart (Ehrgeiz)
Vaan (Dissidia)
Vergil Sparda (Versus Capcom)
Viewtiful Joe (Versus Capcom)
Vincent Valentine (Ehrgeiz)
Yu Narukami (Persona 4 Arena)
Yuri Lowell (Tales of VS.)
Zack Fair (Ehrgeiz)
Zero (Versus Capcom)
Zeus (PlayStation All-Stars)
Zidane (Dissidia)
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ESTABLISHED PLAYABLE CHARACTERS IN SMASH (58):

Bayonetta
Bowser
Captain Falcon
Captain Olimar
Charizard (+ Pokken Tournament)
Chrom
Cloud (+ Dissidia, Ehrgeiz)
Diddy Kong
Donkey Kong
Duck Hunt Dog
Falco Lombardi
Fox McCloud
Ganondorf
Ike
Isabelle
Jigglypuff
Joker
Ken (+ Street Fighter, SFxT, Versus Capcom)
King Dedede
King K. Rool
Kirby
Link (+ Soul Calibur)
Little Mac
Lucario (+ Pokken Tournament)
Lucina
Lucas
Luigi
Mario
Marth
Mega Man (+ Versus Capcom)
Meta Knight
Mewtwo (+ Pokken Tournament)
Mr. Game & Watch
Nana
Ness
Pac-Man (+ SFxT)
Palutena
Pikachu (+ Pokken Tournament)
Pit
Pokemon Trainer Red
Princess Daisy
Princess Peach
Richter Belmont
Ridley
Rosalina
Ryu (+ Street Fighter, SFxT, Versus Capcom)
Samus Aran
Shulk
Simon Belmont (+ DreamMix TV World Fighters)
Solid Snake (+ DreamMix TV World Fighters)
Sonic (+ Sonic the Fighters)
Squirtle
Toon Link
Wario
Wolf O'Donnell
Yoshi
Young Link
Zelda

GRAND TOTAL: 170

Sheik stands out strength-wise here -- there arent many who can compete with her. Eight of the Noble Nine are represented in a fighting game, and after that we're not ready to pick nine other characters previously playable in a fighting game to beat her. By that metric, she beats 90% of the fighters we've ever seen before.

We also don't know another GameFAQs fighting game snub who would beat Sheik. After looking at Blade Strangers, BlazBlue, Brawlhalla, Clayfighter, Darkstalkers, Dead or Alive, Dissidia, DreamMix TV World Fighters, Dynasty Warriors, Ehrgeiz, Fatal Fury, Guilty Gear, .hack//Versus, King of Fighters, Mortal Kombat, Persona, PlayStation All-Stars, Pokken Tournament, Power Battle, Skullgirls, Sonic the Fighters, Soul Calibur, Street Fighter, Street Fighter x Tekken, Super Smash Bros., Tales of VS., Tekken, Touhou fighters, Versus Capcom, Virtua Fighter, Ys vs. Sora no Kiseki...is there a game character we haven't seen from any of these series who you would take over Sheik? Or maybe another fighting game series we haven't seen represented here yet? Really doubt it.

Nominating Sheik likely means nominating our strongest fighting genre snub, one so strong she places in the top 10% of fighting genre characters we've ever seen featured in a GameFAQs match. That seems pretty worthwhile! We just have to get her in.

Well? What are you waiting for? Sheiks ready for the fight!
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Forward-B(ump).
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Time for more.
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*gathers needles*
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*double-jumps back on stage*
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vanish to ledge grab
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TRUST IN THIS RALLY:

Look, we get it -- we're asking for your support on a very difficult goal. I recognize some of you are Zelda-fans, and some of you are even Tetra-fans who are salty I'm pushing for somebody else to replace Zelda. This rally is not only for your nomination of Sheik, but also for you to support Sheik potentially in spite of Zelda. #DownB

We get it if you think we cant get enough nominations to make it worth YOUR nomination too...but you need to know we CAN get enough, and your nomination IS worth it. In fact, we cant do it without you.

How do we know that? This isnt our first rodeos. Heres what weve done with our rallies to earn your faith so far:

When HaRRicH ran the Nomination Rally Tournament:

2009: all three winners -- Pokemon Red/Blue/Yellow, Star Fox 64, and Donkey Kong Country 2 -- got into the game contest.

When HaRRicH ran personal rallies:

2009/2010: Doc Louis got into the vote-in polls thanks to Team Chocolate.
2013: Epona got an 8-seed thanks to The Stable.
2018: Metal Man got a 13-seed despite not being included in the character database thanks to the Metal Men.

Also remember you got our main man ZenOfThunder working on the case!

When ZenOfThunder ran personal rallies:

2013: Corvo got a 15-seed and Yoshimitsu got a 20-seed.
2018: Metal Sonic got a 5-seed despite not beginning the rally until nominations opened thanks to the Metal Army.

Notice how well our last rally around a LoZ-character did: Epona was considered a joke by many...but when the oats settled, she became an 8-seed and she out-seeded the 16-seed Zelda. Also notice that same year the 15-seeded Corvo also out-seeded Zelda. This means youve got two people who have out-seeded Zelda separately at the same time...now TEAMING UP TOGETHER to out-seed Zelda again, this time for Sheik. #DownB

Listen, every rally weve led has only worked because of other people -- we're just the guys typing too much and bumping too often before we start trading nominations. These rallies happen because of YOU believing in the cause, and we're asking you to believe again.

Well do our part. If you want a part in this too, then pledge today and well take it all the way together. Just dont doubt that its possible -- we CAN do this!
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yup, clearly if you could get epona an 8-seed in a year when zelda was 16(?!)-seed, then this is more than feasible

okay i looked it up

pretty sure Haguile is the user whose name starts with an H who is really into murder mysteries

i think

you can see why i got confused

Totally understandable!

Metalmind brought up the fair point that a lot of Board 8-rallies were automatically 8-seeds, though my opinion is we should have been higher than an 8-seed that year then. Zen also out-rallied Zelda with Corvo that year, so she ain't shit and we're coming for her.
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Up-tilt.
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*mashes A*
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*clings to the wall*
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I'm keen on back-tilt myself
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Just don't tilt back too far. You might fall backwards.
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Down-air bay-bee.
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Jump, forward-air, double-jump, forward-air.
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Melee sheik truly has the tastiest ground -> air combos
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They are tasty, and she makes her opponents eat them.
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HaRRicH posted...

Down-air bay-bee.

I was thinking, I like her down-air in Melee more where you can throw it out as you're moving and still have control of the character/let gravity move you downward. Not the biggest fan of the recent trend of down-airs being these kicks that just automatically zip you downward for so many characters.
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Yeah, I noticed more and more charactera have that move in Ultimate. It's kinda like how too many chatacters in SSB4 got Down-B countera.
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jcgamer107 posted...

Not the biggest fan of the recent trend of down-airs being these kicks that just automatically zip you downward for so many characters.

Yeah I gotta say I absolutely hate those moves.
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I like the attack! It just doesn't have to be everybody's attack.
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Up for attacks too similar.
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Isn't sheik zelda
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Yes and no:

http://imgur.com/gallery/ewjazK0
http://imgur.com/gallery/34NMIo3

Smash gives us good reason to view Sheik as separate and good reason to prefer Sheik over Zelda.

If you're hung up on them being the same person in LoZ:OoT though, that's fine. Sheik-fans will just out-nominate Zelda then.
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Upsy daisy.
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*grabs a hammer*
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*grabs and mashes attacks while grappled*
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Nothing like a well-timed Up-B kill.
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HaRRicH posted...

Nothing like a well-timed Up-B kill.

especially when you hit off-screen
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Yes yes, those are pretty grand.
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Down-tilt sweep!
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Huzzah!
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Can't stop, won't stop.
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*lands the Sheikah Dance*
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SURPRISE BOUNCING FlSH!
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