Board 8 > Politics Containment Topic 210: HQ of the War on Christmas

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red sox 777
01/10/19 7:30:47 PM
454
Also, Pelosi may be tough enough to hold the line, but she doesn't have an ironclad grip on other Congressional Democrats the way Mitch does with Republicans. Democrats don't like to fall in line, and a lot of them still believe the voters will give them credit for being reasonable, when this hasn't happened for ages. Oh, people say they want Congress to be reasonable and compromise, but that's not how their votes go. Over the past 10 years, the people have systematically voted moderates out of Congress and replaced them with ideologues and firebrands on both sides. This is what the people want and only Republicans as a party have embraced it.
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CaptainOfCrush
01/10/19 7:33:04 PM
455
red sox 777 posted...
When Democrats see that Republicans are fine with most of the government never reopening - they'll start to waver.

That's a bit stronger than I'd be willing to claim, but I don't think it's a ridiculous take or anything. Trump's most fanatical backers are almost certainly less likely than the average American to travel, leave their homes, or engage in activities that would result in them feeling the effects of a shutdown. I really don't think they'd care if the national parks turn into a dump, for example, because they're never gonna travel to see them.
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xp1337
01/10/19 7:38:09 PM
456
CaptainOfCrush posted...
red sox 777 posted...
When Democrats see that Republicans are fine with most of the government never reopening - they'll start to waver.

That's a bit stronger than I'd be willing to claim, but I don't think it's a ridiculous take or anything. Trump's most fanatical backers are almost certainly less likely than the average American to travel, leave their homes, or engage in activities that would result in them feeling the effects of a shutdown. I really don't think they'd care if the national parks turn into a dump, for example, because they're never gonna travel to see them.

National Parks, no.

Food Stamps, HUD assistance, farm/Agricultural loans? yes

And though the WH is trying to claim they can have tax refunds sent out, there's question if that order is legal and if isn't yikes

GOP caves here first lol if there's a cave (I think national emergency is the most likely outcome because Trump is just looking to save face and this is his only way if Democrats won't play ball)

Just look at Congress right now. Not even Manchin is deviating from the line. Meanwhile, there are already GOP defections in the House. Not many yet, true, but the number did rise.

Predix: Trump declares a national emergency sometime in the next week or so. Immediately gets tied up in the courts and won't be resolved for years at which point it won't even matter. Trump claims he got what he wanted (or we already built the wall or whatever), the GOP whines that the Democrats were obstructionists, Democrats decry the executive overreach and are the ones who launched those lawsuits. Government reopens.
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xp1337: Don't you wish there was a spell-checker that told you when you a word out?
CaptainOfCrush
01/10/19 7:42:02 PM
457
red sox 777 posted...
Democrats don't like to fall in line, and a lot of them still believe the voters will give them credit for being reasonable, when this hasn't happened for ages.

Disagree hard with this though. If Pelosi and Schumer (the Democrat establishment by most opinions) won't play ball, who will? The younger Democrats who skew further left and actually hate Trump?
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red sox 777
01/10/19 7:42:21 PM
458
It's important to understand that this is not about the wall. If Trump and Republicans wanted a wall that badly, they could have done it during the last 2 years. This is some kind of political power play.
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StealThisSheen
01/10/19 7:45:00 PM
459
red sox 777 posted...
It's important to understand that this is not about the wall. If Trump and Republicans wanted a wall that badly, they could have done it during the last 2 years. This is some kind of political power play.


This is giving Trump waaaay too much credit
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xp1337
01/10/19 7:45:17 PM
460
CaptainOfCrush posted...
red sox 777 posted...
Democrats don't like to fall in line, and a lot of them still believe the voters will give them credit for being reasonable, when this hasn't happened for ages.

Disagree hard with this though. If Pelosi and Schumer (the Democrat establishment by most opinions) won't play ball, who will? The younger Democrats who skew further left and actually hate Trump?

It doesn't even matter because even if you get some grumbling from some red-seat Democrats in the House (I'm putting the Senate aside because Schumer has no real power here that McConnell couldn't just take away if he really wanted to) for the sake of optics trying to protect themselves, only the Speaker can bring it to a vote short of a discharge position.

Pelosi won't care if some members have to complain publicly for political reasons. They're not gonna vote for a discharge petition lol.

Pelosi is the only one who matters here from the Democratic negotiation side.
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xp1337
01/10/19 7:49:22 PM
461
StealThisSheen posted...
red sox 777 posted...
It's important to understand that this is not about the wall. If Trump and Republicans wanted a wall that badly, they could have done it during the last 2 years. This is some kind of political power play.


This is giving Trump waaaay too much credit

red sox lives in an alternate reality where Trump (and the GOP as a whole) are master strategists.

That they just suffered the largest Democratic landslide in the House since Watergate hasn't affected him in the slightest.

I mean, we all know what "really" happened. Trump said he'd sign the CR, McConnell and the Senate passed it 100-0 by unanimous consent, then Fox News had pundits accuse Trump of caving so he did a 180 and said he would reject any bill that didn't have the wall funding. So Ryan as basically his final act as Speaker ignored the Senate bill and voted on a wall bill which the Senate flat out said it didn't have the support for and that's how we ended up here. Now McConnell thinks a bill he passed 100-0 is a show vote not worthy of consideration because Trump had his feelings hurt and ego bruised by the TV.

I wish that wasn't the case because it's just so damn pathetic to type out.
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red sox 777
01/10/19 7:53:24 PM
462
Pelosi is not going to have more power in the House than Boehner or Ryan did, both of whom were almost at the mercy of the House Freedom Caucus. There is a class of Democrats who love pandering to "moderate" Republicans and will jump at the chance to look like the voice of reason.

Personally, it's Winter now, but I absolutely intend to visit some national parks come Spring/Summer and they better be open then and not full of trash. As far as who I'll be holding accountable....um.....probably moderate Democrats.
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CelesMyUserName
01/10/19 7:55:28 PM
463
this isn't about a wall, it's about ann coulter calling trump names

everything was all set to go ahead until coulter shut down the government
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xp1337
01/10/19 7:58:28 PM
464
CelesMyUserName posted...
this isn't about a wall, it's about ann coulter calling trump names

Fundamentally, yes. It's just that it's taking the form of the wall so they're linked at the moment.

But yes, this is about the TV calling him names. It's why I'm confident the way this ends is Trump declaring a national emergency. That it will be immediately challenged doesn't matter to him, it'll stop him hearing mean things from Fox. =(
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Reg
01/10/19 7:59:16 PM
465
xp1337 posted...
red sox lives in an alternate reality

Fucking amazed that some people here haven't learned that yet and quit giving him the attention he's looking for.
red sox 777
01/10/19 8:01:04 PM
466
Ann Coulter has been right about a lot of things, but she has to feign outrage constantly or people won't read her column. She's perceptive but too one-dimensional to be effective as a leader herself (which may be a result of this being the best way for her pundit role, but it's all we have to go on).

But yes, it's more about Ann Coulter calling Trump names than an actual wall. I don't think it would matter if the wall ended up being made of gold silk and came with water fountains and Trump steakhouses. The principle is that Trump promised it and the Democrats oppose it, so it must be built.
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CaptainOfCrush
01/10/19 8:09:12 PM
467
red sox 777 posted...
Personally, it's Winter now, but I absolutely intend to visit some national parks come Spring/Summer and they better be open then and not full of trash. As far as who I'll be holding accountable....um.....probably moderate Democrats.

All I can do is thank you for not trolling the stats topic this way during the last contest.

EDIT: I was worried you would, but I'm glad some things are still sacred around here.
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Mr Lasastryke
01/10/19 8:50:30 PM
468
red sox 777 posted...
Ann Coulter has been right about a lot of things,


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sYU_eDMr4xE" data-time="

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red sox 777
01/10/19 9:21:08 PM
469
CaptainOfCrush posted...
red sox 777 posted...
Personally, it's Winter now, but I absolutely intend to visit some national parks come Spring/Summer and they better be open then and not full of trash. As far as who I'll be holding accountable....um.....probably moderate Democrats.

All I can do is thank you for not trolling the stats topic this way during the last contest.

EDIT: I was worried you would, but I'm glad some things are still sacred around here.


Honestly I am probably far more angry at (moderate) Democrats than is good for me. Part of it is from living in a blue state for years, part of it is from reading stupid things people write, and part of it is from feeling let down by Obama.

I really dislike the mentality behind the punishment of stoning. Why use stoning as a way of administering capital punishment? The idea is that it is the community, as a whole, that is executing the punishment. And it absolves each individual person throwing stones of the feeling that they are killing another human being. They are not standing in judgment, they are not responsible for the outcome. They're not like a judge or jury who would feel awful if they made a mistake. There's no possibility for a mistake in a stoning, you just follow the crowd. And the people who are least able to argue for their own opinions are often the most willing to throw stones to enforce the will of the community.

That's the feeling I get from the left, and it frightens me.
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SmartMuffin
01/10/19 9:52:32 PM
470
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1083531644785455104

literally the most amazing thing to ever happen on Twitter
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Maniac64
01/10/19 10:11:10 PM
471
https://realestate.usnews.com/places/texas/mcallen/crime

Seems like he is right to say its safe and if there is a bunch of immigrants coming through there it seems to speak towards them not really making things more dangerous.
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Jakyl25
01/10/19 10:27:43 PM
472
SmartMuffin posted...
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1083531644785455104

literally the most amazing thing to ever happen on Twitter


I actually dont get it. Whats amazing?
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MoogleKupo141
01/10/19 11:08:59 PM
473
SmartMuffin posted...
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1083531644785455104

literally the most amazing thing to ever happen on Twitter


I was recently thinking "gee, I haven't seen Smartmuffin lately"

it's nice to know you are still alive
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ChaosTonyV4
01/11/19 12:00:32 AM
474
Jakyl25 posted...
SmartMuffin posted...
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1083531644785455104

literally the most amazing thing to ever happen on Twitter


I actually dont get it. Whats amazing?


MAGA dorks think Ascosta is accidentally proving walls work, even though he LITERALLY just said migrants are still coming in and the towns residents still feel safe.
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Jakyl25
01/11/19 12:03:41 AM
475
ChaosTonyV4 posted...
Jakyl25 posted...
SmartMuffin posted...
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1083531644785455104

literally the most amazing thing to ever happen on Twitter


I actually dont get it. Whats amazing?


MAGA dorks think Ascosta is accidentally proving walls work, even though he LITERALLY just said migrants are still coming in and the towns residents still feel safe.


Oh?

Walls dont work is the dumb counter argument anyway.

Whether they work or not is irrelevant as to whether we need one
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pyresword
01/11/19 12:06:47 AM
476
red sox 777 posted...
CaptainOfCrush posted...
red sox 777 posted...
Personally, it's Winter now, but I absolutely intend to visit some national parks come Spring/Summer and they better be open then and not full of trash. As far as who I'll be holding accountable....um.....probably moderate Democrats.

All I can do is thank you for not trolling the stats topic this way during the last contest.

EDIT: I was worried you would, but I'm glad some things are still sacred around here.


Honestly I am probably far more angry at (moderate) Democrats than is good for me. Part of it is from living in a blue state for years, part of it is from reading stupid things people write, and part of it is from feeling let down by Obama.

I really dislike the mentality behind the punishment of stoning. Why use stoning as a way of administering capital punishment? The idea is that it is the community, as a whole, that is executing the punishment. And it absolves each individual person throwing stones of the feeling that they are killing another human being. They are not standing in judgment, they are not responsible for the outcome. They're not like a judge or jury who would feel awful if they made a mistake. There's no possibility for a mistake in a stoning, you just follow the crowd. And the people who are least able to argue for their own opinions are often the most willing to throw stones to enforce the will of the community.

That's the feeling I get from the left, and it frightens me.

This sounds terrible! If any real group of people acted like this then that would indeed be cause for concern.
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Jakyl25
01/11/19 12:15:17 AM
477
CelesMyUserName
01/11/19 12:17:33 AM
478
i like how that's the amazing GOTCHA tweet that made Smuffin come out from hiding from the general poli topics and now he's probably not coming back about it

Jakyl25 posted...
https://twitter.com/davidklion/status/1083491987712606208?s=21

Too accurate

alright now this is a worthy post
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Corrik
01/11/19 5:24:58 AM
479
White House preparing lists for nominee to replace RBG just in case. She has missed oral arguments and sessions now which she hasn't done in 25 years. A lot of clamor she may be unable to continue.
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Reg
01/11/19 7:36:49 AM
480
Jakyl25 posted...
So Texas Republicans in this county are totally just openly bigoted now

https://twitter.com/coffeeshopjihad/status/1083359932722958337?s=21

We dont think hes suitable as a practicing Muslim to be vice chair because hed be the representative for ALL Republicans in Tarrant County, and not ALL Republicans in Tarrant County think Islam is safe or acceptable in the U.S., OBrien wrote.

Update: The vote to remove this guy from his leadership position failed by a 139-49 margin.

Still depressing that it came to this, even if unsurprising from scum.
TheRock1525
01/11/19 9:59:28 AM
481
https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/films/news/the-rock-snowflakes-millennials-political-correctness-dwayne-johnson-wwe-a8722621.html

Welp, The Rock has gone the full "old man blames millenials" route.
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The Mana Sword
01/11/19 10:04:36 AM
482
Mr Lasastryke
01/11/19 10:04:56 AM
483
CelesMyUserName posted...
i like how that's the amazing GOTCHA tweet that made Smuffin come out from hiding from the general poli topics and now he's probably not coming back about it


i think the last time he posted here was when he informed us that we're all terrible people for chasing jdtay away.

he certainly picks his battles!
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LapisLazuli
01/11/19 11:09:41 AM
484
CelesMyUserName
01/11/19 2:04:22 PM
485
lindsey is such a god damn goon
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Peace___Frog
01/11/19 3:46:53 PM
486
https://twitter.com/ABC/status/1083815921142153217

Families of Sandy Hook shooting victims win legal victory in lawsuit against InfoWars and Alex Jones, after judge grants families discovery requests, allowing access to InfoWars internal marketing and financial documents. https://t.co/aKqPnSrfwZ https://t.co/Iidnvo97pP


Oh boy
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~Peaf~
Reg
01/11/19 3:50:10 PM
487
After the NRA, I want to take bets on how strongly tied to Russia that turns out to be...
Jakyl25
01/11/19 4:18:23 PM
488
Peace___Frog
01/11/19 4:59:09 PM
489
It's a wonder that he even wants to still be a Republican, honestly
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red13n
01/11/19 5:11:20 PM
490
Jakyl25 posted...
https://www-m.cnn.com/2019/01/10/us/gop-tarrant-county-vote-shafi/index.html

At least this had a good ending


"only 49 to reject him"...

Only. As if the number of crazy is somehow small.
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pxlated
01/11/19 6:14:23 PM
491
No evidence of cancer remaining in RBG


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SmartMuffin
01/11/19 6:50:12 PM
492
Jakyl25 posted...
SmartMuffin posted...
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1083531644785455104

literally the most amazing thing to ever happen on Twitter


I actually dont get it. Whats amazing?


This has been a meme on non-famous-people right-wing Twitter for like six months now. That Acosta's anti-Trump tweets sound much more hilarious if prefaced by "Dear Diary" and you pretend he's some sort of angsty teenager. It's pretty much never been picked up by anybody really famous or anything. Originated with some random dude who doesn't even have his precious blue checkmark.

So it basically confirms that Trump is up to date with the latest ring-wing Twitter memes. That there actually is a reasonable chance that he's aware of us and is listening to us.
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Inviso
01/11/19 6:51:02 PM
493
SmartMuffin posted...
Jakyl25 posted...
SmartMuffin posted...
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1083531644785455104

literally the most amazing thing to ever happen on Twitter


I actually dont get it. Whats amazing?


This has been a meme on non-famous-people right-wing Twitter for like six months now. That Acosta's anti-Trump tweets sound much more hilarious if prefaced by "Dear Diary" and you pretend he's some sort of angsty teenager. It's pretty much never been picked up by anybody really famous or anything. Originated with some random dude who doesn't even have his precious blue checkmark.

So it basically confirms that Trump is up to date with the latest ring-wing Twitter memes. That there actually is a reasonable chance that he's aware of us and is listening to us.


Oh believe me, Trump fits RIGHT in with you right-wingers on Twitter.
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StealThisSheen
01/11/19 6:51:47 PM
494
Trump, if you really wanna win over America, give me money

All the cool people are giving me money
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Mr Lasastryke
01/11/19 6:52:13 PM
495
well i'm glad trump cares about the stuff that really matters
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Peace___Frog
01/11/19 6:53:23 PM
496
Oh so smuffin finally admitted that he's a sexist, racist waste of space. Neat. Good end to the topic.
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~Peaf~
Jakyl25
01/11/19 6:58:13 PM
497
SmartMuffin posted...

So it basically confirms that Trump is up to date with the latest ring-wing Twitter memes. That there actually is a reasonable chance that he's aware of us and is listening to us.


Considering that he has literally reposted things from /pol/ before this isnt something you should just be figuring out
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SmartMuffin
01/11/19 6:59:00 PM
498
http://reason.com/blog/2019/01/11/brickbat-relying-on-guesswork

This is maybe my favorite WTFgovernment story ever

Remember, if you get pulled over in California, the officer will, at some point, be required to write down how gay you look.
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LordoftheMorons
01/11/19 7:07:54 PM
499
https://www.cnn.com/2019/01/11/politics/tulsi-gabbard-van-jones/index.html

No thanks
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pxlated
01/11/19 7:10:12 PM
500
good riddance 2018
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