Current Events > Question for Jordan Peterson fans

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8-bit_Biceps
06/25/18 2:53:03 AM
#1:


What exactly does it mean to clean up your own room? For instance, take myself. I don't have a good job, but I do have two jobs. They conflict though. One is telling me their software somehow has a hard time putting me on the schedule with just two available days and now some weeks I don't work any days at that job. I work like 20 hours with two jobs. I have a triple major. I'm teaching myself piano. I'm a very talented and curious individual. Does cleaning up your own room mean merely attaining a traditionally successful position in life, or does it mean continuously progressing and making an effort toward self actualization?

I can accept the latter, but the former would be ridiculous to accept at this current point in history. Then I would just have to ask, if someone ought to clean their room before protesting and *****ing about society, then are we to expect a world without protest? Is that his goal?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hi1kXrbxphw" data-time="
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8-bit_Biceps
06/25/18 5:37:44 AM
#2:


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Howl
06/25/18 6:50:35 AM
#3:


8-bit_Biceps posted...
@Howl


He's talked at length about this. He literally means cleaning your actual room. Not just that he means tidying it up. He means organizing it and working on it until it continually until it has reached the manifestation of an idealized version of the best possible version of that room that you can imagine given a function that you wish for it to accomplish. Then after you've done that, do that with another area of your life. Little by little your entire life will improve over time.

So the answer to your question is that it is about working towards self actualization. Your second question, he answered in the video you posted. How much of the things that are wrong in society are a result of people just being lazy and not working on self actualization? His point is that if everybody did this consciously he believes a great deal of problems in the world would just outright be eliminated all the while people being more happy in general.
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SmidgeIsntBack
06/25/18 6:52:39 AM
#4:


Peterson has a maid clean his room fyi.
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pinky0926
06/25/18 6:52:45 AM
#5:


- clean your room
- be better organised

wow this jordan peterson fellow truly is one of the great masterminds of our time
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Howl
06/25/18 6:56:21 AM
#6:


pinky0926 posted...
- clean your room
- be better organised

wow this jordan peterson fellow truly is one of the great masterminds of our time


The problem is that there's an entire generation of people that are so dumb that a message as difficult to comprehend as self-actualization, while not difficult to understand to intelligent people, had to be dumbed down for it to resonate. That's what he did by saying this.
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8-bit_Biceps
06/25/18 7:06:29 AM
#7:


pinky0926 posted...
- clean your room
- be better organised

wow this jordan peterson fellow truly is one of the great masterminds of our time


Saying stuff like, "There wouldn't be poetry without religion" and believing that truth is essentially only what is useful to you is not really mastermind thinking.
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pinky0926
06/25/18 7:06:49 AM
#8:


Howl posted...
pinky0926 posted...
- clean your room
- be better organised

wow this jordan peterson fellow truly is one of the great masterminds of our time


The problem is that there's an entire generation of people that are so dumb that a message as difficult to comprehend as self-actualization, while not difficult to understand to intelligent people, had to be dumbed down for it to resonate. That's what he did by saying this.


- "had to be dumbed down"
- calling "cleaning your room" "self-actualization"
- ???
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8-bit_Biceps
06/25/18 7:11:07 AM
#9:


Howl posted...
8-bit_Biceps posted...
@Howl


hen after you've done that, do that with another area of your life. Little by little your entire life will improve over time.


I want my room to function as an enclosed space which has a raised, soft platform to lay down and masturbate on. I want to have a TV facing this platform so that I can easily watch TV for this. I want a table to the side to hold my lamp and various foods. I also want a piano to play and to have easy access to it so I can get better at it. I think I am ready to conquer the world now.
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Howl
06/25/18 7:14:22 AM
#10:


pinky0926 posted...
Howl posted...
pinky0926 posted...
- clean your room
- be better organised

wow this jordan peterson fellow truly is one of the great masterminds of our time


The problem is that there's an entire generation of people that are so dumb that a message as difficult to comprehend as self-actualization, while not difficult to understand to intelligent people, had to be dumbed down for it to resonate. That's what he did by saying this.


- "had to be dumbed down"
- calling "cleaning your room" "self-actualization"
- ???


Cleaning your room and working on it to an extreme degree until it's perfect is the beginning of self-actualization. It's not just calling it self-actualization. It's literally what self-actualization is.
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8-bit_Biceps
06/25/18 7:15:19 AM
#11:


What if Jordan Peterson just has an ulterior motive for people to clean their room so that they just become more organized or their room always looks the same to channel less diverse/creative thoughts. What if he just wants the there to be less creative/leftist types so that he can prey on the weak and stupid conservatives like the rest of the rich conservatives.
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Howl
06/25/18 7:17:20 AM
#12:


8-bit_Biceps posted...
What if Jordan Peterson just has an ulterior motive for people to clean their room so that they just become more organized or their room always looks the same to channel less diverse/creative thoughts. What if he just wants the there to be less creative/leftist types so that he can prey on the weak and stupid conservatives like the rest of the rich conservatives.


This is also a real possibility tbh. The problem I have with him is the insane amount of money he's comfortable making for exploiting dumb people. What's he doing with that money? What's his greater endgame?
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Joelypoely
06/25/18 7:18:29 AM
#13:


Yes he means it both literally and metaphorically. It's essentially the Stoic message of fix the things within your control rather than worry about things which lie largely outside your control. What Peterson adds to this is the idea/belief that if you want to make significant changes to society or 'the system' you are apparently not justified in making decisions which affect the fate of thousands of people if you haven't 'cleaned your room' (have your personal life together) first. It's an interesting idea (and probably useful?) which I guess I agree with.
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Patchwork
06/25/18 7:18:49 AM
#14:


Jordan Peterson is... cringe-worthy, at times.
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pinky0926
06/25/18 7:21:13 AM
#15:


Howl posted...
Cleaning your room and working on it to an extreme degree until it's perfect is the beginning of self-actualization. It's not just calling it self-actualization. It's literally what self-actualization is.


I'm just having a chuckle at the concept that we need to wisdom passed down from a high level thinker to create inner happiness or something when it's just the same shit my mum told me to do when I was 8
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pinky0926
06/25/18 7:21:22 AM
#16:


Howl posted...
Cleaning your room and working on it to an extreme degree until it's perfect is the beginning of self-actualization. It's not just calling it self-actualization. It's literally what self-actualization is.


I'm just having a chuckle at the concept that we need the wisdom passed down from a high level thinker to create inner happiness or something when it's just the same shit my mum told me to do when I was 8
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Esrac
06/25/18 7:24:45 AM
#17:


pinky0926 posted...
Howl posted...
Cleaning your room and working on it to an extreme degree until it's perfect is the beginning of self-actualization. It's not just calling it self-actualization. It's literally what self-actualization is.


I'm just having a chuckle at the concept that we need to wisdom passed down from a high level thinker to create inner happiness or something when it's just the same shit my mum told me to do when I was 8


I suspect that the young men who are most appealed to by Peterson are those who probably didn't have a good upbringing.

Of course, I could be wrong. I can just understand how some discontented young men could take him as a role model. Especially if they didn't have good father figures in their lives to teach them how to be good men.

I mean, I could see a 20 year old me being into some of the stuff he's saying. My dad wasn't around at all when I was growing up and my mother wasn't particularly interested in the whole parenting thing anyway. We didn't go hungry or homeless, but neither of them cared to teach us anything, get involved with our schoolwork, or provide any kind of guidance. That's probably why my teen years were largely spend in a dark room playing games or on the computer. So, yeah, at that age an older male role model offering guidance on how to be a man would probably have been appealing.
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Howl
06/25/18 7:29:02 AM
#18:


pinky0926 posted...
Howl posted...
Cleaning your room and working on it to an extreme degree until it's perfect is the beginning of self-actualization. It's not just calling it self-actualization. It's literally what self-actualization is.


I'm just having a chuckle at the concept that we need the wisdom passed down from a high level thinker to create inner happiness or something when it's just the same shit my mum told me to do when I was 8


That's unfortunately wisdom that has been lost on an entire generation of people who have been raised in the hyper-materialistic vapid culture that creates people like Danielle Bregolli and makes her a millionaire today.

You may think it's so dumb that it doesn't need to be said, but you can clearly see if you watch his fans that it does literally need to be said to them.

It's also interesting if you watch the difference between when he's talking to his followers and someone who's actually smart like Sam Harris, the level of rhetoric he employs increases pretty dramatically. This is one of the reasons I do not necessarily trust that he has purely altruistic goals in mind. It could just be that he knows people are generally just so dumb that if he speaks to them on his level they just won't understand what he's talking about though.
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JBaLLEN66
06/25/18 7:32:23 AM
#19:


God Jordan Peterson is a cult for alt right gamers.
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COVxy
06/25/18 7:37:44 AM
#20:


JBaLLEN66 posted...
God Jordan Peterson is a cult for alt right gamers.


I think it's a lot simpler than most people think. He's just the next figurehead of the anti-sjw group after Milo received bad press. The only reason any of them tout his philosophy bs is that they believe it props up his authority so that when he says the other things they agree with they can pretend like it stands on academic authority.
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Esrac
06/25/18 7:38:03 AM
#21:


JBaLLEN66 posted...
God Jordan Peterson is a cult for alt right gamers.


I don't think the alt-right is that big into him, since a lot of his lectures seem to involve how shitty the Nazis were.
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#22
Post #22 was unavailable or deleted.
deupd_u
06/25/18 7:54:21 AM
#23:


8-bit_Biceps posted...
What if Jordan Peterson just has an ulterior motive for people to clean their room so that they just become more organized or their room always looks the same to channel less diverse/creative thoughts. What if he just wants the there to be less creative/leftist types so that he can prey on the weak and stupid conservatives like the rest of the rich conservatives.

What in the motherfuck are you fucking talking about?

Anyway, it's pretty sad how blinded by prejudice left-leaning people are, that they willingly refuse to comprehend the simple English of someone who is of conservative view points, just to make him seem crazy. I don't know if it's a willful ignorance, or just the taking of baseless hit-pieces about him at face value. You would have to have one criminally insane mind to have such an axe to grind against Peterson, when he says the most reasonable things I could imagine. "Clean your room" just means "do everything within your sphere of influence to improve your life before you go raging against some sort of hypothetical, oppressive regime you believe is somehow responsible for your poor life position."

Side note: I suggest everyone watch this video every time he comes up, because I am sick of people whining about how "depressed" they are, when they just have a shitty life.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vKXD8ZEwAmw" data-time="

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JBaLLEN66
06/25/18 8:27:32 AM
#24:


Esrac posted...
JBaLLEN66 posted...
God Jordan Peterson is a cult for alt right gamers.


I don't think the alt-right is that big into him, since a lot of his lectures seem to involve how shitty the Nazis were.


The alt right's basis isn't some neo nazi party. Some of them just happen to be blatant neo nazis.
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JBaLLEN66
06/25/18 8:31:47 AM
#25:


deupd_u posted...
8-bit_Biceps posted...
What if Jordan Peterson just has an ulterior motive for people to clean their room so that they just become more organized or their room always looks the same to channel less diverse/creative thoughts. What if he just wants the there to be less creative/leftist types so that he can prey on the weak and stupid conservatives like the rest of the rich conservatives.

What in the motherfuck are you fucking talking about?

Anyway, it's pretty sad how blinded by prejudice left-leaning people are, that they willingly refuse to comprehend the simple English of someone who is of conservative view points, just to make him seem crazy. I don't know if it's a willful ignorance, or just the taking of baseless hit-pieces about him at face value. You would have to have one criminally insane mind to have such an axe to grind against Peterson, when he says the most reasonable things I could imagine. "Clean your room" just means "do everything within your sphere of influence to improve your life before you go raging against some sort of hypothetical, oppressive regime you believe is somehow responsible for your poor life position."

Side note: I suggest everyone watch this video every time he comes up, because I am sick of people whining about how "depressed" they are, when they just have a shitty life.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vKXD8ZEwAmw" data-time="


How about you go tell your Jordan Peterson boy to go actually go read the 10th chapter in his ***** book 12 Rules of Life because he has to repeat himself on every single god ***** vague statement he makes. WAIT, is he so ****** intelligent that he cannot even understand the very own book he wrote?
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MyBroTierno
06/25/18 8:38:35 AM
#26:


deupd_u posted...
Anyway, it's pretty sad how blinded by prejudice left-leaning people are, that they willingly refuse to comprehend the simple English of someone who is of conservative view points, just to make him seem crazy. I don't know if it's a willful ignorance, or just the taking of baseless hit-pieces about him at face value. You would have to have one criminally insane mind to have such an axe to grind against Peterson, when he says the most reasonable things I could imagine. "Clean your room" just means "do everything within your sphere of influence to improve your life before you go raging against some sort of hypothetical, oppressive regime you believe is somehow responsible for your poor life position."


This.

Peterson also makes the point that we, in Western society, live in the best society of any point in history. Why would I, or anyone else for that matter, want people who are incapable of cleaning their metaphorical room try to make sweeping changes to society without any possible idea of what unforseen consequences would occur? And if you can't organize your own life, what possible business do you have trying to organize mine?
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JBaLLEN66
06/25/18 8:44:38 AM
#27:


MyBroTierno posted...
deupd_u posted...
Anyway, it's pretty sad how blinded by prejudice left-leaning people are, that they willingly refuse to comprehend the simple English of someone who is of conservative view points, just to make him seem crazy. I don't know if it's a willful ignorance, or just the taking of baseless hit-pieces about him at face value. You would have to have one criminally insane mind to have such an axe to grind against Peterson, when he says the most reasonable things I could imagine. "Clean your room" just means "do everything within your sphere of influence to improve your life before you go raging against some sort of hypothetical, oppressive regime you believe is somehow responsible for your poor life position."


This.

Peterson also makes the point that we, in Western society, live in the best society of any point in history. Why would I, or anyone else for that matter, want people who are incapable of cleaning their metaphorical room try to make sweeping changes to society without any possible idea of what unforseen consequences would occur? And if you can't organize your own life, what possible business do you have trying to organize mine?


The funny thing is that the alt right has more in common with Islam then western society itself. Yall are just another counter revolutionary reactionary group lmao.
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MyBroTierno
06/25/18 8:48:19 AM
#28:


JBaLLEN66 posted...
MyBroTierno posted...
deupd_u posted...
Anyway, it's pretty sad how blinded by prejudice left-leaning people are, that they willingly refuse to comprehend the simple English of someone who is of conservative view points, just to make him seem crazy. I don't know if it's a willful ignorance, or just the taking of baseless hit-pieces about him at face value. You would have to have one criminally insane mind to have such an axe to grind against Peterson, when he says the most reasonable things I could imagine. "Clean your room" just means "do everything within your sphere of influence to improve your life before you go raging against some sort of hypothetical, oppressive regime you believe is somehow responsible for your poor life position."


This.

Peterson also makes the point that we, in Western society, live in the best society of any point in history. Why would I, or anyone else for that matter, want people who are incapable of cleaning their metaphorical room try to make sweeping changes to society without any possible idea of what unforseen consequences would occur? And if you can't organize your own life, what possible business do you have trying to organize mine?


The funny thing is that the alt right has more in common with Islam then western society itself. Yall are just another counter revolutionary reactionary group lmao.


Disappointing that people that want to try to argue about Peterson have to resort to nonsensical ad hominems to argue with him and can't actually say anything of substance, let alone form a coherent, logical and factual counterargument. Disappointing, but not surprising.
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8-bit_Biceps
06/25/18 6:19:50 PM
#29:


Joelypoely posted...
Yes he means it both literally and metaphorically. It's essentially the Stoic message of fix the things within your control rather than worry about things which lie largely outside your control. What Peterson adds to this is the idea/belief that if you want to make significant changes to society or 'the system' you are apparently not justified in making decisions which affect the fate of thousands of people if you haven't 'cleaned your room' (have your personal life together) first. It's an interesting idea (and probably useful?) which I guess I agree with.


I suppose a good metaphor here is like, you can't clear a path by clearing the brush 100 yards away before you clear the brush immediately in front of you first.
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8-bit_Biceps
06/25/18 6:33:50 PM
#30:


Howl posted...
It's also interesting if you watch the difference between when he's talking to his followers and someone who's actually smart like Sam Harris, the level of rhetoric he employs increases pretty dramatically. This is one of the reasons I do not necessarily trust that he has purely altruistic goals in mind. It could just be that he knows people are generally just so dumb that if he speaks to them on his level they just won't understand what he's talking about though.


I do this. I'm torn between wanting to be 100% sure my message gets across, but then also a desire to make my message a little bit more specific, eloquent, and to also play a role in bringing society up to a new standard of language.

Usually not having to ask people, "Do you know what that word is?" is better to me and more convenient and less awkward. And I know a lot of people will avoid looking dumb and asking what something means even though they should probably expect that they won't know some words.
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On_The_Edge
06/25/18 6:35:41 PM
#31:


It just means get your own shit together before you try to get other people's shit together. It's basically the same as Jesus' take the log out of your own eye before you try to take the speck out of your neighbors'
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soulunison2
06/25/18 6:36:58 PM
#32:


Pederson regurgitates common sense that
Neckbeards need told to them
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8-bit_Biceps
06/25/18 6:43:07 PM
#33:


soulunison2 posted...
Pederson regurgitates common sense that
Neckbeards need told to them


It makes sense that if you want to have influence and power you have to work on yourself, of course...but I hope he doesn't have an ulterior motive to get people to get set in a certain mindset that they should be working on themselves. We live in a very rat race like culture and it's possible for things to be too competitive that society suffers for it. That's where we are now, but also less jobs and automation, etc. etc. etc.

So in some instances it's good to complain about shit when your room isn't clean (clean metaphorically, like having good job). If everyone never complained until they got a good job then they wouldn't complain because most people's motives are selfish. Once they get that good job, suddenly they become a little less human and not connected to reality as much.
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COVxy
06/25/18 6:52:30 PM
#34:


"Separate your laundry into whites and colors to prevent bleeding."
~ Jordan B. Peterson
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thrashmetal14
06/25/18 6:53:21 PM
#35:


soulunison2 posted...
Pederson regurgitates common sense that
Neckbeards need told to them


The funny thing is, if a right winger said the same thing (gangbangers need to be told that killing people is bad, or something similar), the leftist types would go on about how they're racist and don't understand the socio-economic conditions that those poor gangbangers were brought up in.
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lesidesi
06/25/18 6:54:02 PM
#36:


Why waste time reading something by a pseudo intellectual psychologist when you could read something of a similar vein by a much more intelligent, much more successful, and much more influential person like ray dalio (principles)
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BignutzisBack
06/25/18 7:15:14 PM
#37:


Good to see Jordan is still triggering the usual posters lol
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MyBroTierno
06/25/18 8:11:39 PM
#38:


soulunison2 posted...
Pederson regurgitates common sense that
Neckbeards need told to them


Apparently common sense is in short supply judging by this thread.
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Solid Snake07
06/25/18 9:24:19 PM
#39:


I've always taken the jest of it to be that if you can't even motivate yourself to keep your own room clean how do you think you're gonna have the motivation to do something really meaningful with your life. So get off your ass and clean your room. It's just a repackaging of the old motivational strategy of taking small baby steps
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MyBroTierno
06/25/18 9:29:40 PM
#40:


Solid Snake07 posted...
I've always taken the jest of it to be that if you can't even motivate yourself to keep your own room clean how do you think you're gonna have the motivation to do something really meaningful with your life. So get off your ass and clean your room. It's just a repackaging of the old motivational strategy of taking small baby steps


That too. Peterson's working on multiple levels here.
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8-bit_Biceps
06/26/18 1:30:10 AM
#41:


COVxy posted...
"Separate your laundry into whites and colors to prevent bleeding."
~ Jordan B. Peterson


Translation: Conform, conform, conform.

I basically thought about mixing paint, artistry, creativity, etc. I definitely get how 'bleeding' can be distracting, but his approach seems to come off in this sense that there's more wrong with people than the system.
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