Board 8 > TV/Movie Mercs

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http://mercsfilmandtv.pbworks.com/w/page/120263088/Jack%20Spicer

Jack Spicer and Wuya (Xiaolin Showdown)
Villainous Male Human and Villainous Female Undead
4/week

Jack Spicer, boy genius, and Wuya are as they appear in Xiaolin Showdown. Jack Spicer comes equipped with his monkey staff, heli-bot, and [customization]. Wuya appears in her ghost form. She may not use magic, nor may she possess anyone. However, she may freely navigate the terrain and communicate with any of her teammates. In addition, they will be accompanied by [X] Jack-bots.

Abilities

Jack-bots, Attack! (Passive) - When rostered, Jack Spicer will be accompanied by X Jack-bots, where X is equal to the number of rostered enemies, including assists.

Customization - Jack Spicer may come to battle with two of the following Shen Gong Wu, in addition to his Monkey Staff.
-Changing Chopsticks
-Eye of Dashi
-Falcon's Eye
-Fist of Tebigong
-Jetbootsu
-Longi Kite
-Lotus Twister
-Serpent's Tail
-Silk Spitter
-Third-Arm Sash

Upgrades

Ability Upgrade:
Jack will be accompanied by an additional X Jack-bots. This upgrade may be taken multiple times.

Character Upgrade:
Jack may instead bring three Shen Gong Wu. In addition, the following options are added: Golden Tiger Claws, Ruby of Ramses, Shroud of Shadows, and Two Ton Tunic. The Golden Tiger Claws may only teleport to locations within the terrain.

New Ability:
Mala Mala Jong (Start of Battle) - Even Jack Spicer gets a win once in a while, and once every five weeks, he will manage to find the Heart of Jong during his battles. This week, he will use the Heart of Jong to bring in the feared Mala Mala Jong, a horrifying creature made up solely of Shen Gong Wu, as a free assist. Mala Mala Jong is classified as a Villainous Genderless Otherworldly, and Jack cannot use any of his customizations while Mala Mala Jong is active (Jack will still have his Monkey Staff and Jack-bots).

Mala Mala Jong is as he appears in his self-titled episode of Xiaolin Showdown. He is composed of the Helmet of Jong, Wushu Helmet, Two-Ton Tunic, Third-Arm Sash, Silk Spitter, Golden Tiger Claws, Fist of Tebigong, Jetbootsu, Shroud of Shadows, Longi Kite, Eye of Dashi and Ruby of Ramses.

Terrain

Jack Spicer's lab - A large laboratory full of scientific equipment. What any of it does is a mystery.

Part of me feels like he should have another starting ability, but I don't really think he needs it.
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For the hell of it, organizing the characters by genre:

Action:
Dominic Toretto
El Blanco
Eric Draven
Indiana Jones
Jim West
John McClane
John Rambo
John Wick
Max
Paul Serone
Power Rangers
Predator
Rick Grimes
Tommy Oliver
Westley

American Animation:
Aang
Baman and Piderman
Beast Boy
Courage the Cowardly Dog
Danny Phantom
Ed, Edd n Eddy
EVE
Gaston
He Man
HIM
Samurai Jack
Jackie Chan
Jack Spicer
Jafar
Mr. Incredible
Mulan
Po
Powerpuff Girls
Rick Sanchez
Scrooge McDuck
Shrek
Static
Sterling Archer
Stitch
Syndrome
Toph Beifong

Anime:
Arataka Reigen
Ash's Pikachu
Blue Eyes White Dragon
Dark Magician
DIO
Eren Yeager
Genos
Guts
Joey Wheeler
Joseph Joestar
Lucy
Mikasa Ackerman
Mr. Satan
Mumen Rider
Natsuki Subaru
Puri-Puri Prisoner
Revy and Rock
Rika Furude
Sasuke Uchiha
Seto Kaiba
Usopp
Walter von Schenkopp
Yoshikage Kira
Yugi Mutou

Comedy:
Chuck Bartowski
Killer Rabbit
Orgazmo
Ralph Hinkley

Drama:
Dexter
Dr. Gregory House
Olivia Moore

Fantasy:
Albus Dumbledore
Big Man Japan
Daenerys and Drogon
Gregor Clegane
Jareth
Jon Snow
King Kong
Lord Voldemort
Tom Bombadil
Willow Ufgood

Horror:
Ash Williams
Carrie White
Chucky
Cujo
Erin
Ghostface
Hannibal Lecter
Happy Toyz Truck
Jacob Goodnight
Jason Voorhees
John Kramer
Mr. Babadook
Nix
Patrick Bateman
Pinhead
Samara Morgan
Stripe
The Birds
The Blair Witch
The Cloverfield Monster
The Creeper
The Facility Monsters
The Thing
Xenomorph

Martial Arts:
Ricky Ho
Sing
The Bride

Other:
Alton Brown
Grand Dad
Gunnery Sgt Hartman
Hulk Hogan
Joel, Mike, Crow and Tom Servo
Kool-Aid Man
Rocky Balboa
Samuel L. Jackson
The New Day

Sci-Fi:
Andrew Detmer
Demogorgon
Dr. Horrible
Emperor Palpatine
Gipsy Danger
Jobe
Mechagodzilla
Neo
R2-D2
Raptors
Sam Beckett
Sonny
T-800
Wikus van de Merwe

Superhero:
Colossus
Daredevil
Darkman
Deadpool
General Zod
Harley Quinn
Iceman
Juggernaut
Luke Cage
The Cape
The Joker
The Punisher
Thor
Wilson Fisk
Wolverine
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Big shocker I'm responsible for 2/3rds of the horror mercs
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The more I read these merc suggestions the more I think the top of the power curve should be like the terminator. Basically stuff that you could imagine a peak human with the right resources available killing

I could not be less interested in discussing Thor vs General Zod
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DeathChicken posted...

Big shocker I'm responsible for 2/3rds of the horror mercs

That's kind of where I am with the American Animation mercs
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Lopen posted...

The more I read these merc suggestions the more I think the top of the power curve should be like the terminator. Basically stuff that you could imagine a peak human with the right resources available killing

I could not be less interested in discussing Thor vs General Zod

I mean I don't necessarily think it's less interesting than Dante v. Bayonetta

(personally, yeah, Zod v. Thor doesn't thrill me but I think Thor v. a Powerpuff Girl or Cloverfield Monster v. Gipsy Danger would be a lot of fun)
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I can't picture Thor taking that fight remotely seriously until he's getting beaten up. Powerpuff Girl I mean
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Which gives the Powerpuff the upper hand!

Powerpuff clobbers him imo
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Dante vs Bayonetta is actually a lot more appealing to me. I feel like both of them have clearly defined strengths and weaknesses over the other despite both being ridiculous.

A lot of these high tier guys don't really feel like they're on a tier of strengths/weaknesses and it's sorta just a parameter off where you find the 7 who has slightly higher params than all the rest.

Thor vs a Powerpuff Girl is funny though.
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It would be theoretically interesting to run a TV/Movie mercs game with none of the 6+ upkeep mercs in it.
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Lopen posted...

Dante vs Bayonetta is actually a lot more appealing to me. I feel like both of them have clearly defined strengths and weaknesses over the other despite both being ridiculous.

A lot of these high tier guys don't really feel like they're on a tier of strengths/weaknesses and it's sorta just a parameter off where you find the 7 who has slightly higher params than all the rest.

Thor vs a Powerpuff Girl is funny though.

Except it is not because everyone would vote Dante overwhelmingly regardless because more played Devil May Cry vs Bayonetta.
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Actually Bayonetta won the 1v1 they had in M4
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Lopen posted...

Dante vs Bayonetta is actually a lot more appealing to me. I feel like both of them have clearly defined strengths and weaknesses over the other despite both being ridiculous.

A lot of these high tier guys don't really feel like they're on a tier of strengths/weaknesses and it's sorta just a parameter off where you find the 7 who has slightly higher params than all the rest.

Thor vs a Powerpuff Girl is funny though.

I'd argue that's only potentially an issue with the 7/weeks though. Most of the 6/weeks are powerful but still have very clearly defined weaknesses (Stitch gets owned by water, Dumbledore/Voldemort are glass cannons, Eren Yeager is overwhelmed by groups, Wolverine has limited range and strength, etc.).

The only 6s I worry about ideally are Genos and Neo, who both tip a little too close to 7s
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You do know that Thor would beat Superman right?
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Neo is pretty much the highest tier of combatant I find interesting to discuss in a mercs context yeah
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Like that's not to say that Thor vs General Zod in and of itself couldn't be an interesting discussion one time

But you do it again, because teams in mercs often fight multiple times

And then you throw say a buncha 6s and 5s on either side and literally none of them can do anything to Thor or Zod without ability nerfing, so it just boils down to Thor vs Zod again. That kinda upper level just isn't fit for mercs, doubly so when you consider TV and Movies don't really have much in the way of buffs or well defined mechanics, stuff like that.

Neo I could at least humor that maybe were he were tied up in a battle with Agent Smith that John Wick could have an impact on that fight by landing some bullets on him while he's distracted. General Zod just completely ignores him though.
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Movie Thor gets the shit kicked out of him by Ultron. Unless you think Superman vs Ultron is a debatable fight...
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The result of Thor vs Zod is pretty irrelevant to the gist of what I'm saying regardless. If Zod stomps the snot out of him then that just makes them both being 7s even more dumb.
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That was more directed at Corrik and the stuff about Thor smoking Superman
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Lopen posted...

Neo I could at least humor that maybe were he were tied up in a battle with Agent Smith that John Wick could have an impact on that fight by landing some bullets on him while he's distracted.

I mean I don't know why you'd be rostering John Wick in high tier imo

like I do think 6/weeks could still hurt the 7s. Like seeing Thor trying to deal with a Stitch crawling on him would be hilarious imo

I DO think that in tv/movie mercs the power difference is big enough that high->mid paydowns probably shouldn't be a thing
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DeathChicken posted...

Movie Thor gets the shit kicked out of him by Ultron. Unless you think Superman vs Ultron is a debatable fight...

I am going from memory, but I believe this is incorrect. I believe at the end of the movie that multiple avengers were taking out masses of Ultrons like they were fodder and Thor even might have took out a shit load with his lightning.

Kryptonians weak to magic. Thor has magical powers. Has just as much durability. Has just as much speed, power (moreso).

Thor should stomp Zod whether in suit or not.
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ew I need to stop saying imo so much imo
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Johnbobb posted...

I mean I don't know why you'd be rostering John Wick in high tier imo

Sure

I just wanted to have Keanu Reeves fighting Keanu Reeves for humor's sake

But I mean you could go as high as you need and it generally applies. Like 5/weeks aren't influencing that fight either. Arguably Neo isn't really contributing anything in Zod vs Thor, and he's a 6.
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Lopen posted...

Johnbobb posted...

I mean I don't know why you'd be rostering John Wick in high tier imo

Sure

I just wanted to have Keanu Reeves fighting Keanu Reeves for humor's sake

But I mean you could go as high as you need and it generally applies. Like 5/weeks aren't influencing that fight either. Arguably Neo isn't really contributing anything in Zod vs Thor, and he's a 6.

Neo is absolute fodder in that scenario.
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no arguably

neo gets dunked on there
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That's why I kind of mentioned before that Superman would have to be like a 9. Wonderwoman like an 8. and so on. Some of these characters are so ridiculously overpowered to the rest that it is laughable.
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Thor's main weakness is his intelligence... which Superman's is basically on the same page of.
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Now Voldemort could probably influence things since who knows what the hell you need to survive Avada Kedavra besides plot intervention. His problem is anything at all from a high tier is going to maul him, but that becomes less of an issue if whoever he's fighting is occupied
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So rules I'm thinking if TV/Movie Mercs happens for real

1. Only one 7/week per team
2. No buy downs
3. Maybe make 7/weeks take up two spots even in high tier?
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Johnbobb posted...

So rules I'm thinking if TV/Movie Mercs happens for real

1. Only one 7/week per team
2. No buy downs
3. Maybe make 7/weeks take up two spots even in high tier?

It doesn't matter how many spots they take up is kind of what Lopen was getting at. They solo everything basically. There are 7s that solo whole groups of 6s.

Thor can solo a whole group of 6s.
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Yeah the power gap is too much with these kinds of characters with very little in the way of buffs/healing to mitigate things. 7+s will demolish everything below them moreso than any other.
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I mean, I just don't really agree with that. I think there are quite a few 6s that could do serious damage to the 7s individually, and I think a group of 3 6s could take down most 7s
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But what would your suggestions be as far as dealing with the power gap?
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Johnbobb posted...

But what would your suggestions be as far as dealing with the power gap?

Ban all super heros probably.
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That would pretty dumb to ban like, Daredevil because Thor is really good
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Corrik posted...

Johnbobb posted...

But what would your suggestions be as far as dealing with the power gap?

Ban all super heros probably.

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Johnbobb posted...

Superhero:
Colossus
Daredevil
Darkman
Deadpool
General Zod
Harley Quinn
Iceman
Juggernaut
Luke Cage
The Cape
The Joker
The Punisher
Thor
Wilson Fisk
Wolverine

Literally only Zod and Thor are 7/weeks out of those.

Do you mean just ban Zod and Thor? Are they that much worse than Cloverfield Monster or Gipsy Danger?
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Deadpool and Wolverine outright decimate most the field.

You could argue a lot of them are okay beyond those 2 on the list. (in addition to the 7s)

Perhaps... ban all above street level super heros it should have been worded.
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Corrik posted...

Deadpool and Wolverine outright decimate most the field.

...No?

Deadpool loses to most 6/weeks, and Wolverine is fucked by any magic users or anyone that can keep him at a distance
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Don't Ban The Cape
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Johnbobb posted...

Corrik posted...

Deadpool and Wolverine outright decimate most the field.

...No?

Deadpool loses to most 6/weeks, and Wolverine is fucked by any magic users or anyone that can keep him at a distance

Deadpool isn't even like killable based on his movie.

Wolverine has to have strong nerfs and hard counters to his build to not be unbeatable (which to be fair I think you did nerf him in his build)

And, no I don't really think Magic is a hard counter to him outright.

Dr Strange is probably okay though.
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Corrik posted...

Deadpool isn't even like killable based on his movie.

Honestly his regeneration is pretty slow in the film

like when he loses his hand it takes him at least 24 hours to regrow it

So I mean, if someone can like blow him up, or even just chop off his head and kick it off into the distance, I'd say he's pretty much KO'd as far as the match is concerned (even if technically he might be able to regrow himself a week later)
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I think that applies to all mercs in general

Some might have harder times technically dying than others, but if a merc is the last on their team and they're rendered unable to fight any longer, it's still a victory for the other team.
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I maintain that Wolverine is way the hell overblown given all the times he's knocked out by relatively piddly things like guns

Also a generic Hand ninja kicks his ass in The Wolverine, that was pretty funny
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Still curious if there's any more suggestions as to how to deal with the 7/weeks. Nerf suggestions? Are there some that are too OP compared to others? (really the only complaints I've seen have been about Thor and Zod, not so much the giant monsters). Maybe make 7/weeks take 3 slots?

Also curious, on an unrelated note, who among the upper tier do you think could survive an Avada Kedavra (either with defense tactics or somehow tanking it)?
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Fair enough
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DeathChicken posted...

I maintain that Wolverine is way the hell overblown given all the times he's knocked out by relatively piddly things like guns

Also a generic Hand ninja kicks his ass in The Wolverine, that was pretty funny

Man that's kind of how I feel about Luke Cage after the Defenders (and it's why I dropped him a tier)

In Luke Cage, he's presented as this badass who takes on entire rooms of guys without breaking a sweat, including tanking a rocket launcher and a collapsing building.

In The Defenders, literally one punch from Elektra KOs him
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I think the op 7s should be moved up go 8s or 9s and cost the appropriate upkeep/buydown/whatever to roster.

Thor is a definite op hero. Maybe you could nerf him by saying he starts out unworthy to yield his hammer until upgraded and that he can only wield it once every whatever weeks when upgraded.
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You can certainly block Avada Kedavra if you get something between you and the projectile (like a statue). I don't think they ever specify just how it actually kills people, so it's hard to say if can be tanked
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Corrik posted...

Thor is a definite op hero. Maybe you could nerf him by saying he starts out unworthy to yield his hammer until upgraded and that he can only wield it once every whatever weeks when upgraded.

Maybe I'm remembering Thor wrong, but isn't he basically a 2 without his hammer?

Corrik posted...

I think the op 7s should be moved up go 8s or 9s and cost the appropriate upkeep/buydown/whatever to roster.

Well that's kind of why I was saying about having them take up more spots to roster. Or maybe even giving them a Lich King type passive, where they take up more spots if rostered away from their home terrain (in particular, I could see that working for Thor by having him weakened if he's not in Asgard)
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Johnbobb posted...

Maybe I'm remembering Thor wrong, but isn't he basically a 2 without his hammer?

Guess we'll find out in Ragnarok!

(But considering it looks like he fights Hulk without it and survives, I'd say no)
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