Poll of the Day > Usually have a pretty decent grasp on politics and motives, but why isn't...

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RedPixel
07/03/17 8:29:49 PM
#1:


...anybody able to put North Korea in its place?

Thought about including what I think I know, but I'd rather a clean slate before I offer my input.
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Lokarin
07/03/17 8:31:43 PM
#2:


Because they have a right to protect their sovereignty just like any other nation and to deny them that is a huge hyprocitical move by all the other nations who protect their sovereignty in the same way.
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RedPixel
07/03/17 8:33:44 PM
#3:


Lokarin posted...
Because they have a right to protect their sovereignty just like any other nation and to deny them that is a huge hyprocitical move by all the other nations who protect their sovereignty in the same way.

Yes, but when even the UN begins addressing it and the outsider is threatening nukes, I don't think it's quite the same ball game.
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Yellow
07/03/17 8:34:09 PM
#4:


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Golden Road
07/03/17 8:34:50 PM
#5:


Remember how it turned out when we tried to put Iraq in its place? Didn't really turn out so great. Getting rid of a bad leader is relatively easy, but actually turning things around for everyone living there, not so simple.
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RedPixel
07/03/17 8:35:42 PM
#6:


Yellow posted...
China.

As noble as it is to protect your younger brother... eventually the bigger dogs get tired of the little one's incessant yipping. Patience wears thin.
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TigerTycoon
07/03/17 8:36:34 PM
#7:


You usually have a pretty decent grasp on politics and motives, but countries that don't agree with other countries should invade them by force and make them behave in the way we personally find acceptable?

But to answer your question China supports North Korea as its "fellow" communist nation.

RedPixel posted...
As noble as it is to protect your younger brother... eventually the bigger dogs get tired of the little one's incessant yipping. Patience wears thin.

Nobility has nothing to do with it. China doesn't want to be the only communist nation, North Korea takes all the heat for them.
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JOExHIGASHI
07/03/17 8:38:17 PM
#8:


They don't have any resources we want also they can do a good amount of damage before we can curb stomp them
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Yellow
07/03/17 8:38:38 PM
#9:


RedPixel posted...
Yellow posted...
China.

As noble as it is to protect your younger brother... eventually the bigger dogs get tired of the little one's incessant yipping. Patience wears thin.

Yup, all we need is China's permission.
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Blighboy
07/03/17 8:41:39 PM
#10:


Don't they have like a hundred missiles pointed at south korea?
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Mead
07/03/17 8:43:28 PM
#11:


Blighboy posted...
Don't they have like a hundred missiles pointed at south korea?


Yeah they could absolutely devastate South Korea and Japan with their artillery alone
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Yellow
07/03/17 8:44:23 PM
#12:


Just make it an inside job.

Or economic deprivation. Doesn't have to be war.
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Zeus
07/03/17 8:45:21 PM
#13:


Because China and Russia are fine with it aggravating the West. If they cared to put pressure on NK, Kim Jong would fall into line. Otherwise they have nukes so we wouldn't try to invade.

Golden Road posted...
Remember how it turned out when we tried to put Iraq in its place? Didn't really turn out so great. Getting rid of a bad leader is relatively easy, but actually turning things around for everyone living there, not so simple.


Not even close to being the same thing, though.

RedPixel posted...

Yes, but when even the UN begins addressing it and the outsider is threatening nukes, I don't think it's quite the same ball game.


Keep in mind that the UN is a proxy for a handful of Western nations to exert their power on the rest of the world. What it says isn't particularly meaningful on a moral level and politically they have no real power.
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WhiskeyDisk
07/03/17 8:46:16 PM
#14:


After you take out North Korea, what do you do with the 25 million brainwashed peasants that make up the population?
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DorkLink
07/03/17 8:46:24 PM
#15:


Yellow posted...
Just make it an inside job


Do you think we have a bunch of secret North Korean insiders that we're friends with and have a secure line of communication to, or are you just misusing the term "inside job" here?
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RedPixel
07/03/17 8:46:31 PM
#16:


TigerTycoon posted...
You usually have a pretty decent grasp on politics and motives, but countries that don't agree with other countries should invade them by force and make them behave in the way we personally find acceptable?

When I said "put NK in its place" I didn't mean to imply anything; it was my intention to leave it as an open-ended question.

TigerTycoon posted...
But to answer your question China supports North Korea is a "fellow" communist nation.

Despite China being ONE of the leading nations, I would imagine they're anxious everyone would raise an eyebrow or two at them like, "hey, if China's defending the enemy, that makes THEM the enemy!"

Mead posted...
Blighboy posted...
Don't they have like a hundred missiles pointed at south korea?


Yeah they could absolutely devastate South Korea and Japan with their artillery alone

This is the kind of shit that makes me suspect that media is lying to us and isn't covering how dangerous NK really is. Severely underplaying it, sorta.
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TigerTycoon
07/03/17 9:06:51 PM
#17:


RedPixel posted...
Despite China being ONE of the leading nations, I would imagine they're anxious everyone would raise an eyebrow or two at them like, "hey, if China's defending the enemy, that makes THEM the enemy!"

China doesn't give a crap if you have a morally high opinion of them, they only care that you know they're powerful enough that you don't mess with them. Rest assured every other leading nation knows you don't F with China.

And the charade with North Korea isn't for the governments, its for the populace. The governments of the leading nations know China is the reason they can never do anything about North Korea, and they know why China does it.

The fact that there are people like you who blame North Korea before China for North Korea means it was money well spent by China. That's all they wanted out of it.
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Yellow
07/03/17 9:13:12 PM
#18:


Just tell China we'll give them ownership and call it a deal.
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Veedrock-
07/03/17 9:29:13 PM
#19:


Yellow posted...
Just make it an inside job. Or economic deprivation. Doesn't have to be war.

The end result is still war.
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Amuseum
07/03/17 9:47:10 PM
#20:


North Korea is in its place
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Muscles
07/03/17 9:47:24 PM
#21:


Because they aren't a real threat to anyone, you think if their amateur garbage missiles could do anything they wouldn't have already started WWIII
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SomeUsername529
07/03/17 11:45:15 PM
#22:


Lots of wrong information in this thread.

China doesn't give a fuck about being the "only" Socialist nation. Once Deng Xiaoping took over they reduced it to the fig leaf excuse of "socialism with Chinese characteristics" which just means capitalism with an authoritarian government. China is a capitalist country and socialism is deader than Mao.

North Korea would need missiles to hit Japan. No conventional artillery could shoot that far. South Korea is obviously the most easily available target but also not a particularly likely one outside of some insane desperation strike to take out a bunch of US/UN/allied group forces as well. North Korea wants unification more than the South at this point but they want it on their own terms. Zero chance of South Korea getting nuked; low chance of a majorly destructive first strike effort either.

China doesn't want to own North Korea. North Korea exists because China wants a buffer and a shitty neighbour to take heat. Owning them outright removes all the benefits and just gives them a massively dysfunctional frontier on their east cast to match the mess they've got on their west side in Xinjiang. Even if everyone knows China keeps the lights on in Pyongyang it keeps China from having a land border with a US ally.

To address the main question: North Korea is what it is because China is propping them up. The situation can't be dealt with extensively because China doesn't want the country to implode because it would be a massive war/refugee crisis on their doorstep and unification likely means a country that will have favourable relations with the US touching them.
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TheWorstPoster
07/03/17 11:48:58 PM
#23:


China is using North Korea as a puppet state, to distract the rest of the world from what they are doing.

No matter how pissed China gets at North Korea, any act of resistance is purely for show.

If we attack North Korea, we get invaded by China.
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#24
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XlaxJynx007
07/04/17 12:08:14 AM
#25:


Yellow posted...
Just make it an inside job.

Or economic deprivation. Doesn't have to be war.

For a short period of time I was almost positive that Dennis Rodman was a CIA operative for that reason. Then I remembered it was Dennis Rodman.
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helly
07/04/17 12:22:36 AM
#26:


when it comes to foreign affairs, it's usually always because of china that no one gets involved.

they just make too much shit we need. if they denied a country access to their goods, that countries economy would be absolutely crippled.
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WhiskeyDisk
07/04/17 12:34:56 AM
#27:


helly posted...
when it comes to foreign affairs, it's usually always because of china that no one gets involved.

they just make too much shit we need. if they denied a country access to their goods, that countries economy would be absolutely crippled.


but at the same time, perhaps China can actually prove it deserves its veto powers on the UN Security council, put its big boy pants on, and tug the leash when NK gets crazy like it has lately.
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helly
07/04/17 12:36:09 AM
#28:


but it wont, because china is scared of itself, for whatever reason

i guess maybe

idfk, it's just because of china, ok

like, you can't even acknowledge that taiwan exists because of china
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WhiskeyDisk
07/04/17 12:41:37 AM
#29:


helly posted...
but it wont, because china is scared of itself, for whatever reason

i guess maybe

idfk, it's just because of china, ok

like, you can't even acknowledge that taiwan exists because of china


there's still hope for China. they recently cut off NK's supply of coal and oil, and deployed something like a quarter million troops to the border with NK. i half think at this point that China would gladly be the anvil to our hammer if we went in,

the real problem is the guaranteed 8 Million casualties in Seoul from artillery and the 25 million brainwashed peasants SK would have to absorb after any reunification effort that involved deposing the Uns.
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InfestedAdam
07/04/17 3:13:36 AM
#30:


WhiskeyDisk posted...
the real problem is the guaranteed 8 Million casualties in Seoul from artillery and the 25 million brainwashed peasants SK would have to absorb after any reunification effort that involved deposing the Uns.

Well said. I actually wonder how well and how long North Korea can remain afloat if other countries stop importing from them.
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