Poll of the Day > Why do people hate FFXIII but praise FFX?

(+) Yeah! (+)

It had the same linear game design.

Probabaly because X doesn't have you press a single button to win every battle for the first 10 hours of the game.
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Combat. X is semiactive turn based with a ton of strategic options
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Lokchan posted...

with a ton of strategic options

abusing quick hit and spamming over drives isn't strategy -_-
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x is a liniear as fuck hallway with a bad story, bad voice acting, and a subpar combat system

that you absolutely can just mindlessly tap x and win every battle with relative ease without even having to pay attention
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X did not have a bad story at all. It was one of the best stories.

Lokchan posted...

Combat. X is semiactive turn based with a ton of strategic options

What? No, there's literally only like 4 different kinds of enemies you ever have to deal with, and it's always obvious which character you're supposed to bring out to one-shot it.
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helIy posted...

x is a liniear as fuck hallway with a bad story, bad voice acting, and a subpar combat system

that you absolutely can just mindlessly tap x and win every battle with relative ease without even having to pay attention

I've not played 13 but because of all of this is true I can't imagine there being a worse FF game than 10.
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X was good, and it was no more linear than your average JRPG. Minus the world map obviously, but that is largely a thing of the past.

The argument put forth in this thread is absurd.

^ you do know most of the level were hallays going right.

in 10 i just pressed x to win. i might have to switch out my character (like switch my paradigm) to win a fight faster.
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papercup posted...

What? No, there's literally only like 4 different kinds of enemies you ever have to deal with, and it's always obvious which character you're supposed to bring out to one-shot it

Believe it or not, this is actually important. It gives agency to the player.

Ok, a Hardened enemy, bring out a Pierce weapon - an elemental? Bring out Lulu or use magical weapons. That highly evasive enemy? Wakka!

It's as simple as the difference between a Goomba and a Spiny, but it's important and provides good game feel.
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People hate FFXIII because of the characters. The gameplay is great, especially once you actually learn how to use the paradigms.
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InfernalFive posted...

People hate FFXIII because of the characters. The gameplay is great, especially once you actually learn how to use the paradigms.

This.

The only bad aspects I found were:

Voice acting (especially Vanille and only the english VO, jap is decent)
Lack of exploration
Amount of tortoise farming, they're not fun battles

Everything else about the game is great, and the combat is the best part.
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Cotton_Eye_Joe posted...

It had the same linear game design.

... because X in my opinion is better in every area when compared to XIII.

helIy posted...

x is a liniear as fuck hallway with a bad story, bad voice acting, and a subpar combat system

that you absolutely can just mindlessly tap x and win every battle with relative ease without even having to pay attention

You're trying way too hard to have shitty opinions now man.
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wwinterj25 posted...

You're trying way too hard to have shitty opinions now man

can you honestly refute anything i said there?
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helIy posted...

can you honestly refute anything i said there?

Sure why not?

x is a liniear - For the most part yeah.

bad story - I strongly disagree. Final Fantasy X is one of the very few games that actually made me feel for the characters even more so at the end and that was due to the story. Getting onto character development here but I will say Final Fantasy X has some of the best party members/main characters in a Final Fantasy game period. Lulu, Auron and Yuna being some of the highlights. I also enjoyed the boss fights and the fact that the aeons actually had a strong presence in the narrative.

bad voice acting - It had some cheesy moments sure but I generally found the English voice acting to be good. This was the first time the series had voice acting and I found that to be a massive step forward for the series.

a subpar combat system - I liked you 'controlled' summons this time around. Not really much more to say. It's a turn based game so won't really have a deep, complex combat system. I did love the magic and overdrive commends though.

that you absolutely can just mindlessly tap x and win every battle with relative ease without even having to pay attention - Yeah no that's not how it works at all.


Of course I respect peoples opinions and understand not everyone will like games I like but you're literally pulling stuff out of your arse to troll games/folk these days and I can't take you seriously at all.
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The real contest is between FFX's story and Tales of Symphonia's story. Which had the better main story, the better sidequests, or the better sequels? Aannnd... *Drops race flag and flees the other direction*
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i had a big long thing typed up but then i accidentally brushed against my laptops screen and it took me to the topic list, and when i went back expecting what i typed to still be there, it was gone.

so fuck retyping it all, i'm just gonna go with a blanket "you're wrong."

so

wwinterj25 posted...

stuff

no. you're wrong.
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helIy posted...

i had a big long thing typed up but then i accidentally brushed against my laptops screen and it took me to the topic list, and when i went back expecting what i typed to still be there, it was gone.

This is why I switched to Firefox.
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i was using firefox but decided to switch over to chrome for a bit because firefox kept on taking all my ram after playing like a minute of a youtube video

it's probably fixed by now but eh
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I normally think helly has terrible opinions, but I agree on FFX being a very subpar game. It had a decent battle system, and everything else was meh, to straight trash. So many plot holes, so many plot points that are repeated over and over (how many times did Yuna get kidnapped again?), and all but one or two of the characters are completely one dimensional.

And 13 just took everything wrong with 10, made those things worse, then broke the things that worked in 10.

I really liked FF XIII.
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Eh, I'm actually gonna go against the majority on this one and say I hated XIII's combat, and that the story has more merit than the gameplay, and that's taking into account how horrific the storytelling is presented.

Here's the thing: your role in FFXIII is that of a tactical adviser. You have a passive role in the actions your party takes because what you essentially do is hand out general commands and watch the ai take over. It's no different than, say, The Last Remnant. Anyone that says there's depth to the combat is grossly overestimating just how much input the player has.

Yes, there are times where you will constantly switch between paradigms, but don't fool yourself into thinking that means there's depth to the system. There isn't. You will always cycle through the same 3 paradigms for the most part. One for attacking, one for healing, and one for buffing/debuffing. Since you can't control your teammates, you're at the mercy of the ai, which you cannot alter like you could in a series like the Tales games. You only have direct control over one party member at a time, ever. And because combat is so fast paced, you will generally use auto-battle most of the time because the ai for your controlling character is very good at determining what the optimal dps rotation is. They will exploit the enemies weaknesses easily.

So what role do you have aside from monitoring your health bars, and making sure your buffs are up? Tossing out the occasional item and summoning your eidolons. Oh, but only one eidolon per character, so you don't even get a choice of determining what you wanna summon for any given situation.

I played through the entire thing twice with absolutely no issues, because you have to try to be bad at combat. Each chapter is designed to give you a specific amount of experience needed to get through with minimal difficulty. You are REQUIRED to progress through the crystarium in a certain order for each role. There is no customization there whatsoever. You can't even grind. You literally cannot play the game differently for the first 9 chapters. So for the last several chapters, you get a bit more leeway in arranging paradigms, so maybe you switch between several more sets than you otherwise would have. That is so insignificant that it's not even worth mentioning, because for paradigms that characters don't naturally tend towards, you have to invest a titanic amount of CP to unlock abilities, to the point where you'll never use those jobs until you hit the post game.

Even if you try to say that you enjoy directly inputting each command for your lead character, my rebuttal is this: you will generally only do so for boss fights, and you're still only controlling one character. I point to FFs 1 through 10, where you can control every single one of them, and 12, where you can fine-tune the ai with up to 12 gambits each, placing priority on certain actions over others. The ai in 13? Select a paradigm and pray.

The combat is such a huge low point that it is the only reason why I never desire to play through the game again. It is almost quite literally "press X to win" for the first half, and the second half is just "attack...aaaaand switch to heal....aaaand switch to attack...aaand switch to heal...." You're basically watching a movie. Don't get me wrong, FFX isn't the pinnacle of depth, but you at least had the option to switch every member in and out of combat at will to utilize their unique abilities... at least until you max the sphere grids during the postgame. It wasn't just watching your party members use optimal moves to get through every encounter.

I don't hate it, but X was simply better. In fact, it was my favourite FF
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XIII is okay but quite uninteresting characters tbh. It felt like a soap opera at times. But I actually liked the combat... especially for boss fights.

X is amazing, and a brilliant game.

Helly has bad taste in games.

That is all.
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I hated both FFX and FFXIII, but at least FFX was able to hold my attention long enough to actually finish the game.
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ComradeSeraphim posted...

I hated both FFX and FFXIII, but at least FFX was able to hold my attention long enough to actually finish the game.

This.

10 had good combat. Some of the best combat in the entire series, in fact. I stuck an Encounter None item on one of my characters as soon as I could to ensure the bosses would be super hard and really allow me to use the full depth of the combat system, and it was a blast. 13 was like... why am I not just hitting X? The AI inputs these Fire-Fire-Fire strings faster than I do so Auto-Battle ftw.

Also, 10 has somewhat relatable characters while 13 just doesn't. What was up with Hope's revenge plot and how he contradicted himself within minutes, for instance? Ugh. Wasted some 40 hours on that game hoping it'd get good.
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I feel like people dont really understand X is really a subtle, almost mockery of religious dogma.

The story is really deep and goes over a lot of peoples heads.

For example the strict, cult like traditions of Yevon and how it it all turns out to be a fraud, perpetuated by the very guy they are worshiping



The aeon Sin represents disaster, all that is unknown. The simple people of Spira just know that Sin attacks cities occasionally when they get too big. They dont know why, so they revere him as a deity that must be appeased.


Realistically Sin is just a powerful aeon created to limit the population and growth of cities controlled by a powerful Wizard but its not until the very end of the game that they realize this and their entire lives and traditions were fraudulent.

Almost like the game was saying something about traditions and religions in real life. Thats not even to mention the rampant corruption in the hierarchy itself and the fact that most of them are more interested in keeping Yevon alive than actually getting rid of Sin

Maybe because a lot of modern gamers started with X so it holds a high standard to them?

I started way back with 4 in 1991. But to me FFX is where the series lost itself. I didn't care much for the setting or characters. I hated the lack of world map, and how everything was just a linear hallway. The grid system wasn't all that interesting, and combat and weapons didn't require much thought. I just kept Titus with the Brotherhood for the whole game and never had any problems.

The voice acting by modern standards is pretty shitty. But back then it was good enough given the only really competition in voice acting back then was MGS 1-2.

The game was great looking, and certainly flashy. But it lacked character and charm to me. FFIX really spoiled me on that.
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Interesting comments about Final Fantasy XIII. I'll probably give it a try one day, maybe after Final Fantasy XII is ported to PC. I know some fans gave Final Fantasy VIII flack as well. Between VIII and XIII, which is more or less deserving of the flack they reserved? Overall I enjoyed VIII but can see where some fans didn't like it (i.e. Draw system)
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OmegaTomHank posted...

I feel like people dont really understand X is really a subtle, almost mockery of religious dogma.

That seems to be common in a lot of JRPGS. Anytime a church is involved the god is always evil.

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/GodIsEvil

Its almost as bad as Republic=Good, Empire=Bad.
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OmegaTomHank posted...

I feel like people dont really understand X is really a subtle, almost mockery of religious dogma.

The story is really deep and goes over a lot of peoples heads.

For example the strict, cult like traditions of Yevon and how it it all turns out to be a fraud, perpetuated by the very guy they are worshiping



The aeon Sin represents disaster, all that is unknown. The simple people of Spira just know that Sin attacks cities occasionally when they get too big. They dont know why, so they revere him as a deity that must be appeased.


Realistically Sin is just a powerful aeon created to limit the population and growth of cities controlled by a powerful Wizard but its not until the very end of the game that they realize this and their entire lives and traditions were fraudulent.

Almost like the game was saying something about traditions and religions in real life. Thats not even to mention the rampant corruption in the hierarchy itself and the fact that most of them are more interested in keeping Yevon alive than actually getting rid of Sin

I haven't played it in so long but this makes me so nostalgic about the game

I don't think I even picked up on half the themes when I was younger
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Miroku_of_Nite1 posted...

Maybe because a lot of modern gamers started with X so it holds a high standard to them?

I started way back with 4 in 1991. But to me FFX is where the series lost itself. I didn't care much for the setting or characters. I hated the lack of world map, and how everything was just a linear hallway. The grid system wasn't all that interesting, and combat and weapons didn't require much thought. I just kept Titus with the Brotherhood for the whole game and never had any problems.

The voice acting by modern standards is pretty shitty. But back then it was good enough given the only really competition in voice acting back then was MGS 1-2.

The game was great looking, and certainly flashy. But it lacked character and charm to me. FFIX really spoiled me on that.

I actually think X was the peak of the series when it came to the story and overall game.... but IX is my personal favourite, character and charm is a perfect way to describe IX
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OmegaTomHank posted...

The story is really deep and goes over a lot of peoples heads.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H47ow4_Cmk0

holy shit dude no

a 4 year old wrote the story
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Shaneariffic posted...

OmegaTomHank posted...

I feel like people dont really understand X is really a subtle, almost mockery of religious dogma.

The story is really deep and goes over a lot of peoples heads.

For example the strict, cult like traditions of Yevon and how it it all turns out to be a fraud, perpetuated by the very guy they are worshiping



The aeon Sin represents disaster, all that is unknown. The simple people of Spira just know that Sin attacks cities occasionally when they get too big. They dont know why, so they revere him as a deity that must be appeased.


Realistically Sin is just a powerful aeon created to limit the population and growth of cities controlled by a powerful Wizard but its not until the very end of the game that they realize this and their entire lives and traditions were fraudulent.

Almost like the game was saying something about traditions and religions in real life. Thats not even to mention the rampant corruption in the hierarchy itself and the fact that most of them are more interested in keeping Yevon alive than actually getting rid of Sin

I haven't played it in so long but this makes me so nostalgic about the game

I don't think I even picked up on half the themes when I was younger

Took me a lot of doing the side quests on the second replay to really get it.

Personally, I like the semi-turn base battle system. Then again I am a sucker for Active Time Base battle systems and respective turn-base
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helIy posted...

no. you're wrong.

jeez stfu now you're just being annoying

dude literally posted a decent summary against your shit opinion and your summary was "deleted"

welcome to the list bruh, enjoy your stay
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My opinion:

FFX is Sakaguchi -- his last game for the series. I consider it the last truly good Final Fantasy, though FFXII might have been up there if Matsuno had been allowed to finish it his way.

FFXIII is pure Nomura -- superficially pretty, but ultimately hollow, empty.
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helIy posted...

no. you're wrong.

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Every moment of FF13 was drudgery for me. Even when you reach the whatever... 'open' area. I was especially annoyed when the game 'opened up' literally after you beat it. Post game content is fucking dumb.

I found FFX to be mostly enjoyable. I think it had the most polished battle system of the series and I happened to like that there was a reason to use different characters - even if it became null at the end.

It was visually pleasing and I think even today holds up decently well. The music was great too.

I just didn't get any of that with FF13. The entire game was a chore for me.

It's arguably the worst game in the 4-10 series, and it was the beginning of the end, but it's still a decent game and definitely holds up better than 13.
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Everything after IX is arse

I'm not a huge fan of X, but XIII had a huge problem (other than being too linear for the majority of it and being like a 20 hour tutorial) of dropping you into the game world, and not really explaining anything. When right off the bat everyone is talking about Cocoon, Pulse, L'Cie, Fal'cie, etc left and right, it's straight up disorientating.

X is the downfall of the series everything people say is wrong with XIII can be applied to X at least XIII had a unique system and for anyone saying you just had to press X clearly didn't finish the game as some of the later fights are near impossible if you're not constantly switching paradigms
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...

Final Fantasy XII was the best FF!

*Runs away*

DeathMagnetic80 posted...

I'm not a huge fan of X, but XIII had a huge problem (other than being too linear for the majority of it and being like a 20 hour tutorial) of dropping you into the game world, and not really explaining anything. When right off the bat everyone is talking about Cocoon, Pulse, L'Cie, Fal'cie, etc left and right, it's straight up disorientating.

That's why they had that huge journal for you to spend 5 hours reading.

mastermix3000 posted...

welcome to the list bruh, enjoy your stay

this guy seems upset

wwinterj25 posted...

helIy posted...

no. you're wrong.

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I_Abibde posted...

My opinion:

FFX is Sakaguchi -- his last game for the series. I consider it the last truly good Final Fantasy, though FFXII might have been up there if Matsuno had been allowed to finish it his way.

FFXIII is pure Nomura -- superficially pretty, but ultimately hollow, empty.

Nomura was just the character designer for xiii, you're probably thinking of Toriyama who directed it
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