Board 8 > Jesus, how do people get into Civ

(+) Yeah! (+)

Started playing Civ 6 and I have no idea wtf I'm doing

I can't even imagine how much time it must take to develop anything approaching an optimal strategy

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eh your first few games will suck. Civ 6 might not be the most friendly to newer players. I think 4 might be but im not sure.

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The game is not that hard, after you run through it a few times it starts to become much easier. Crap if you play on the easiest or 2nd easiest difficulty the computer won't really do much to get you.

Optimal strategy? I just play it and hope for the best.

Stick with it! It's not a difficult game and you'll understand the strategy within a game or two

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Just one more turn

Tens of thousands of times

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Not familiar with what Civ 6 looks like now. But 4 and 5 are easy starting points. 5 is more friendly i think.

But ultimately one more turn. At normal or the one above that the AI won't pose a threat but may at times annoy. Easier difficulties you'll just be so far ahead even on your first couple tries.

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they give more buffs and cheats to the AI in higher difficulties. Best I could do is difficulty 6, anything more is just ridiculous

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I dont know man.

I played it on the SNES back in the day.
And I made it though games, but I was often lost.

Cant imagine it these days.

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this is my question for total war

like total war three kingdoms is probably THE game for me but it's just so much

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You guys should definitely not try Crusader Kings 2

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Xiahou Shake posted...

You guys should definitely not try Crusader Kings 2

I tried a week or two ago...even the tutorial proved incomprehensible to me...

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I would highly recommend setting the difficulty to a lower level and then work your way up. This may sound wrong if you're like me and don't like the idea of taking things easy, but it does take a few games before you really "get" how the game elements work, and before then you're simply not on equal footing with the AI. Additionally, the "normal" difficulty isn't actually normally balanced, it's still in favor of the computer by a slight bit.

As you play more you'll get better and understand more about the gameplay and will be better prepared to take on the higher difficulty levels. But in my personal experience if you try to tough it out without knowing what you're doing you only end up feeling disappointed as you finish a 4+ hour game that you had absolutely no hope of winning from the very beginning because of things you didn't quite understand.

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Yeah, I figured that I probably picked a poor game to start with, especially considering it came with all the DLC. I played Civ 4 once like 10+ years ago and all I remember is having no idea what I was doing until my friend came over and murdered me with a even.

The only reason I started Civ 6 was because another friend told me to get it so we could play together.

I guess the biggest issue is I don't really know what to focus on early game. Like, how soon should I be settling new cities? What should my builders focus on early? I feel like I just end up wasting a lot of turns clicking next turn.

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Last Civ I played was 5, but I imagine similar strategies hold true for 6 as well.

I'd probably hit up a basic guide on youtube. There are several things that will hold true for any game like this, such as scouting out your starting region, get at least a few more cities going, and be on the lookout for other civilizations to potentially trade/snatch cities from.

Other things can matter too, like what type of landmass you're playing on (islands place more emphasis on a navy, while pangea makes it much easier to get to all the civs sooner), but a lot of it is stuff that will come with more time and experience.

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Being a great Civ player is all about understanding all the mechanics and knowing how to exploit the situation to your advantage. A part of it is also understaning what is worth building when, when you just start you have no clue which buildings are worthwhile.

Starting off on a high difficulty as a new player is dumb, this is not like Doom where the core mechanics are obvious and you just shoot shit Civ takes time to learn.

Having played every civ game since the original, I found 6 to be fairly unfriendly to get started with. The keyboard commands are wonky if they exist at all. Movement rules were changed considerably. Districts drastically alter the way you can construct things in your cities. There's considerably more tile resources than there used to be. 6 is not super hard for someone who's played the other games, but I can imagine it's not a kind launching point.

That said, I agree with what was said before -- Crusader Kings 2 is absurd. I have 1.1 hours played in that game, during which I attempted to decipher the tutorial and basically gave up crying. That game's an incomprehensible mess. (People who get into it swear it's amazing, though.)

If you want a Civ alternative, I'll suggest Endless Legend.

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Also, if you want a really basic strategy, do this:
1) Start with a scout, then a settler. (Build a second military unit first if you're playing above warlord.) In your subsequent cities, start with a monument, a worker, and then a slinger/archer.
2) Research the techs that you have a boost for, or that you know you will never get the boost for. Same with civics, except prioritize getting the one in the middle at the beginning that unlocks the early governments.
3) Set your initial cards to +strength to barbarians and +1 faith in capital. As soon as you get a pantheon, immediately switch off that to +1 production in all cities and keep that as long as you can.
4) Only build districts if you have an immediate bonus for them, until you learn what they do better.
5) Focus on expansion and building up. Don't play a warmongering game until you learn the mechanics. Wars are core to the general gameplay, but not to learning the mechanics. Just don't neglect having a military for defense.
6) Spend as much time early on exploring as you can. Grab goodie huts, learn where good city spots are, and also be prepared to beat down the barbs that spawn near you. Pay attention to the grunt notification that says a new camp spawned somewhere.

I'm also playing without any of the expansions/add-ons.

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VintageGin posted...

Yeah, I figured that I probably picked a poor game to start with, especially considering it came with all the DLC. I played Civ 4 once like 10+ years ago and all I remember is having no idea what I was doing until my friend came over and murdered me with a even.

The only reason I started Civ 6 was because another friend told me to get it so we could play together.

I guess the biggest issue is I don't really know what to focus on early game. Like, how soon should I be settling new cities? What should my builders focus on early? I feel like I just end up wasting a lot of turns clicking next turn.

largely will depend on who you got for early focus.
settle new cities frequently in 6. there used to be a dynamic of tall vs. wide, that is, an empire with very few but very powerful cities vs. an empire with a ton of cities but few fully fleshed out and developed. in 6 it's wide vs. really wide. so yeah, make new places frequently.

as a basic idea, you can focus on science for science-heavy civs, those are typically gonna be the easiest. i don't remember how faith mechanics are in 6 so i can't help there. some focus on military, in which case you've gotta play aggressively, are meaning to find and fight bandits, then get ready to seige other cities.


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one turn at a time

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Civ games, and 4x games in general, aren't fun per se.

They give you that feeling of "five turns from now is gonna be really fun!", but you never actually get there

The genre's all about anticipation of progress


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banananor posted...

Civ games, and 4x games in general, aren't fun per se.

They give you that feeling of "five turns from now is gonna be really fun!", but you never actually get there

The genre's all about anticipation of progress

Depends on the person, I enjoy playing them from time to time they aren't something I will just play endlessly for weeks straight but every couple months I enjoy booting it up for some Civ action.

azuarc posted...

That said, I agree with what was said before -- Crusader Kings 2 is absurd. I have 1.1 hours played in that game, during which I attempted to decipher the tutorial and basically gave up crying. That game's an incomprehensible mess. (People who get into it swear it's amazing, though.)

It is amazing!

I only had to watch about two hours of tutorial on YouTube to get decent enough to fumble my way around in it >.>

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My favorite is Civ 4. My most played game of all time, I still play it from time to time and man it has like 9000 mods.

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I started with III i think but I only really play VI now.

VI added a ton of new mechanics and stuff that have added to the complexity (and rng) of the game. Some of it though was in older versions but having them all at once if you are new to the series can be overwhelming.

TBH, I'd start on Prince difficulty on standard speed on the default map settings (should be small). Although on prince picking quick or online doesnt give the ai an advantage like in higher difficulties (as they get bonuses to yields) but it does mean you have to micro a little better with your cities.

I say Prince because anything lower you are not really going to learn what is working and what is not. Even on Prince after a handful of games you'll notice the Ai is that really challenging.

Yeah start on a lower difficulty and just take it all in I guess?

BTW not entirely on-topic, but Sullla is going to do another round of games pitting the AI civs in Civ4 against each other. First game of Season 5 starts on Friday at noon EST.

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Civilization Revolution is pretty simple, I honestly haven't played other ones though so I'm not sure how they compare.

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LinkMarioSamus posted...

BTW not entirely on-topic, but Sullla is going to do another round of games pitting the AI civs in Civ4 against each other. First game of Season 5 starts on Friday at noon EST.

Is that like what Drew Durnil does?

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I don't even know who that is.

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BetrayedTangy posted...

Civilization Revolution is pretty simple, I honestly haven't played other ones though so I'm not sure how they compare.

they're better

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the same way you get into any densely mechanical game, you jump in and mess around until things click. maybe play a few shorter games on small maps with the base game ruleset while you figure things out? or use a real world map to help ground you?

CasanovaZelos posted...

I tried a week or two ago...even the tutorial proved incomprehensible to me...

In fairness, the tutorials for Paradox games are bunk. It took me watching a couple campaigns and specific tutorial videos from Arumba and/or Quill18 on YouTube before I almost knew what I was doing.

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Doesn't the game suggest to you what to build and research and stuff?

Just follow suggestions and see what happens.

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Xiahou Shake posted...

You guys should definitely not try Crusader Kings 2

azuarc posted...

That said, I agree with what was said before -- Crusader Kings 2 is absurd. I have 1.1 hours played in that game, during which I attempted to decipher the tutorial and basically gave up crying. That game's an incomprehensible mess. (People who get into it swear it's amazing, though.)

Yeah, my friend/former roommate played a lot of the Paradox games (Crusader Kings, Europe Universalis, and Hearts of Iron). Everything I saw him playing those, he was just endlessly fiddling with sliders. I knew from seeing all that that those games are not for me.

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HanOfTheNekos posted...

Doesn't the game suggest to you what to build and research and stuff?

Just follow suggestions and see what happens.

It does, except it makes several suggestions and several kinds of suggestions (advisor or linked to a certain victory type). And from what I've seen sometimes you get only one type of suggestion for a given build opportunity (eg military)

iiicon posted...

the same way you get into any densely mechanical game, you jump in and mess around until things click. maybe play a few shorter games on small maps with the base game ruleset while you figure things out? or use a real world map to help ground you?

I essentially jumped into a game with computers on default settings after completing the tutorial. A few hours into the game I realized I was probably pretty behind based on score, but I had no idea if that was due to one big fuck-up or the accumulation of a lot of little fuck-ups.

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part of this is a decision based on the civ you have and the other part is based on what you want to do.
do you want to conquer everything in sight? or do you just want to overwhelm everyone with scientific advancements? there's overlap between those two of course, you need more science to be able to put out better technology/soldiers, but you can do science in a passive way, building up forces to avoid getting attacked. if you want to avoid combat you can go culture/faith/diplomacy, those aspects got fleshed out a lot more in 6 iirc. in those cases you're mainly gonna good guy/behind the scenes your way to control in a modern era. and of course that isn't unique from science or military; there's something to be said for a religious army that converts people in war.

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CasanovaZelos posted...

I tried a week or two ago...even the tutorial proved incomprehensible to me...

The best way to learn CK2 is literally to just watch some Lets Plays of it.

You'll learn most of the big mechanics that way which gives you a frame of reference for how to deal with stuff you don't know when you play it yourself.

But yes its super dumb to get into.

VintageGin posted...

I essentially jumped into a game with computers on default settings after completing the tutorial. A few hours into the game I realized I was probably pretty behind based on score, but I had no idea if that was due to one big fuck-up or the accumulation of a lot of little fuck-ups.

Score doesn't tell the whole story, honestly.

Civ weights wonders very highly on score but often they don't provide a huge enough advantage (though they are fairly big and good) to present an accurate picture of where you stand vs the others.

Also there are several catch up mechanics like spies, so even if you are behind you can make up the difference.

TBH I learned most of what I know of Civ V from watching Twitch streams

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Yeah its true watch a few streamers and youll start to understand much better how to play Paradox games and Civ.

i don't think i'd have learned Civ on streamers, not at first.
6 is just a weird one to start on because there's a lot thrown at you and the guilds stuff was all new.

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Like tbh, it's pretty hard to explain the entire game to someone and it's easier if like a specific question was asked about something here like about How this mechanic works, when do I build this, how does combat work, etc.

VintageGin posted...

I essentially jumped into a game with computers on default settings after completing the tutorial. A few hours into the game I realized I was probably pretty behind based on score, but I had no idea if that was due to one big fuck-up or the accumulation of a lot of little fuck-ups.

This is also why I could never get into 4X games despite a lot of my friends being into those types of games. The only way to actually figure out everything is to just play more games to get a better feel for what you should be doing, but when each of those instances take several hours to get through I always feel like my time is much better placed on other games rather than beating my head trying to figure out these ones.

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banananor posted...

Civ games, and 4x games in general, aren't fun per se.

They give you that feeling of "five turns from now is gonna be really fun!", but you never actually get there

The genre's all about anticipation of progress

Lies. When you finally get your engine going and are raking in money/science/etc. that feeling is better than drugs.

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I also really like when you get way ahead of the curve and start developing technology the world won't see for hundreds of years.

Computer research done 200 years before it would come out in our actual world type of thing.

well.
it's the free game on epic game store this week so maybe you'll get more people.

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Monopoman posted...

I also really like when you get way ahead of the curve and start developing technology the world won't see for hundreds of years.

Computer research done 200 years before it would come out in our actual world type of thing.

I always do this but with nuclear weapons.

Kinglicious posted...

well.
it's the free game on epic game store this week so maybe you'll get more people.

There goes my weekend

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And to think, I almost bought Civ 6 a few days ago...

Goodbye free time, hello world domination.

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I bought Civ 6 when it was on sale for 50$ on steam. Of course that was with all the expansion packs.

I never played Civ until I took advantage of the free copy of VI from the Epic store. I dunno man I just played the tutorial to completion then started a new game on the easiest difficulty. It's pretty addicting and fun! The tutorial just walks you to a win. Using those same strategies works on the lowest difficulty. I presume I'll just bump it up by one each time I win until I hit a plateau.