Board 8 > Politics Containment Topic 105: Ossoff wins Handel-y? Or Too Much to Handel?

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Mr Lasastryke
06/21/17 11:15:57 AM
#251:


https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/877101173412638720

older tweet, but "ossoff wants to raise taxes to the highest level"? pretty sure he didn't want a tax rate of 100%.
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BowserCuffs
06/21/17 11:40:58 AM
#252:


Fun fact: My conservative father was pleasantly impressed with how far Ossoff got despite completely coming out of left field.

It kinda surprised me because he's usually in line with Fox News but he was actually disagreeing with their dismissive tone towards the democrats.
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MrGreenonion
06/21/17 1:52:02 PM
#253:


BowserCuffs posted...
Fun fact: My conservative father was pleasantly impressed with how far Ossoff got despite completely coming out of left field.

It kinda surprised me because he's usually in line with Fox News but he was actually disagreeing with their dismissive tone towards the democrats.

That dismissive tone is damage control. Republican pundits know what's coming in 2018, and they're trying to convince people it's not in hopes that they'll get demoralized and it actually won't come. It's not gonna work.
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Peace___Frog
06/21/17 1:59:27 PM
#254:


Sessions has hired a personal lawyer. I desperately hope that everyone in that administration comes out of it with such a destroyed reputation that they can never do anything meaningful again once this crashes and burns.
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-FFDragon-
06/21/17 2:02:11 PM
#255:


They and the Republican party in general will come out of this just fine. Maybe not as peak strong as they were coming into 2017, but fine.
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Peace___Frog
06/21/17 2:04:37 PM
#256:


I'm aware. I'm hoping that they won't, but chances are they will because people have short memories and they'll do good damage control to separate themselves from trump.
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Eddv
06/21/17 2:04:57 PM
#257:


If the Democrats want to win all they have to start doing is talking about the AHCA 24/7

The thing is awful and i have few doubts that the secret senate plan is going to be awful as well.
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kevwaffles
06/21/17 2:11:06 PM
#258:


-FFDragon- posted...
They and the Republican party in general will come out of this just fine. Maybe not as peak strong as they were coming into 2017, but fine.

Republican party will definitely be fine, but at least certain individuals certainly won't even if nothing happens to Trump himself.
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BowserCuffs
06/21/17 2:47:51 PM
#259:


MrGreenonion posted...
BowserCuffs posted...
Fun fact: My conservative father was pleasantly impressed with how far Ossoff got despite completely coming out of left field.

It kinda surprised me because he's usually in line with Fox News but he was actually disagreeing with their dismissive tone towards the democrats.

That dismissive tone is damage control. Republican pundits know what's coming in 2018, and they're trying to convince people it's not in hopes that they'll get demoralized and it actually won't come. It's not gonna work.

Between this and my father's reaction, there's hope.
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Suprak the Stud
06/21/17 3:19:08 PM
#260:


metroid composite posted...
I'm eyerolling pretty hard on the social media responses I've seen "oh this isn't so bad, it's a deep red district"

Yeah, I used to live there, and...no it's not really? Decatur boasted about having the second highest density of lesbians in the country:

http://www.decaturmetro.com/tag/lesbian-population/

And there seems to be some truth to this--the church I went to in Decatur was a lesbian church

I saw plenty of Obama 2008 bumper stickers when I was driving around (more than McCain honestly).

The general election this go around was 48% Trump to 47% Hillary in that district (actually closer than the special election tonight).

Don't get me wrong, I get that Dekalb isn't the entire district. Fulton county is part of the same congressional district, and it's a rich suburb that leans towards whatever candidate promises them low taxes. But when I heard the district might flip my reaction was "yeah, I wouldn't be surprised." Especially when I heard that Karen Handel had pissed off local Republicans.


Losing by 5 points is...honestly just bad. And the spin I'm seeing on twitter about how super duper red this district is, is seriously making me eyeroll. It's always had the potential to swing blue; it's part of Atlanta which is a big hub city, attracting educated people from all over the country, and LGBT people from all over south. (It's the richer whiter suburbs of Atlanta, but still Atlanta).


This is exactly what I said about Montana, too. The guy who won literally just lost a gubentorial election to a democratic candidate, and we're supposed to be excited because "ooh it was kinda close!" The spin they put out is dumb and kinda sad, tbqh.

We can get excited when, uh, we actually start winning elections.
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MrGreenonion
06/21/17 3:47:37 PM
#261:


Eddv posted...
If the Democrats want to win all they have to start doing is talking about the AHCA 24/7

The thing is awful and i have few doubts that the secret senate plan is going to be awful as well.

The Senate bill may actually be worse. Obviously nobody's seen it outside the 13 Republicans writing it, but there are rumors floating around about parts of it. One I've heard is about the cuts to Medicaid; they're said to take effect a few years later than in the House bill, but in exchange the cuts are going to be even deeper.
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Metal_DK
06/21/17 3:55:52 PM
#262:


I live in the 6th district. Its slightly bluer than say...in 2002 or something. But its still primarily red, and this "close loss is still encouraging" is questionable, or at least not worth much yet and would need another 10ish years before we check back on the shift.

I also question this "well this area almost went Clinton in the election" mentality as moreso just "not Trump". I know a lot of people in the 6th who hate Trump, but have no problems with Pence or Ryan or somebody, which is absurd to me but w/e.
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FFDragon
06/21/17 6:39:57 PM
#263:


The only thing as good as Trump Criticizes Trump is Pence Criticizes Pence:

https://twitter.com/GovPenceIN/status/7720153887
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Peace___Frog
06/21/17 6:48:55 PM
#264:


The "Shady Bunch" reply has me chuckling


https://twitter.com/darth/status/877177655518404608
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Mr Lasastryke
06/21/17 6:49:19 PM
#265:


in b4 sephy posting "<3 pence"
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ChaosTonyV4
06/21/17 6:49:48 PM
#266:


Ignore the group name watch this video of Bernie doing what he does best about the hidden Senate healthcare bill:

https://www.facebook.com/DigitalLeft/videos/463887153972823/
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KamikazePotato
06/21/17 7:02:42 PM
#267:


ChaosTonyV4 posted...
Ignore the group name watch this video of Bernie doing what he does best about the hidden Senate healthcare bill:

https://www.facebook.com/DigitalLeft/videos/463887153972823/

10/10
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MrGreenonion
06/21/17 8:31:56 PM
#268:


Metal_DK posted...
I live in the 6th district. Its slightly bluer than say...in 2002 or something. But its still primarily red, and this "close loss is still encouraging" is questionable, or at least not worth much yet and would need another 10ish years before we check back on the shift.

I think the close loss thing is less about shifting that particular district and more about the national trend. If four 20+ point losses turned into 5-6 point losses, maybe a bunch of 10-or-less point losses can be turned into wins.

So it's not "check back in 2026 and see if GA06 is blue", it's "check back in 2018 and see how many purple districts nationwide are blue".
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LordoftheMorons
06/21/17 9:12:02 PM
#269:


MrGreenonion posted...
I think the close loss thing is less about shifting that particular district and more about the national trend. If four 20+ point losses turned into 5-6 point losses, maybe a bunch of 10-or-less point losses can be turned into wins.

So it's not "check back in 2026 and see if GA06 is blue", it's "check back in 2018 and see how many purple districts nationwide are blue".

This is right

It would be great if the Dems could get some R +20 districts (especially to put the fear of god into these Republicans), but they don't need to take back the House in 2018.
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red sox 777
06/21/17 10:55:23 PM
#270:


I think the best way of maximizing efficiency for Republicans is to win a lot of districts by very small margins and lose a few less by big margins. That way, you can get the same amount of power with a lower percentage of the popular vote and you can better distribute the spoils of victory.
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xp1337
06/21/17 11:01:26 PM
#271:


red sox 777 posted...
I think the best way of maximizing efficiency for Republicans is to win a lot of districts by very small margins and lose a few less by big margins. That way, you can get the same amount of power with a lower percentage of the popular vote and you can better distribute the spoils of victory.

Well, I mean that is literally the principle behind gerrymandering so this has been a thing that's been happening for a very long time.
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red sox 777
06/21/17 11:03:19 PM
#272:


I'm curious as to how low the GOP percentage of the national popular vote can go while still maintaining power. Abe Lincoln, our first Republican president, won the electoral college with 39% of the popular vote, which is probably a record that will never be broken, but it'd be pretty amazing if they could get close to that nowadays.
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UltiWasRight
06/21/17 11:14:06 PM
#273:


Trump lost the 6th district in Georgia. Handel winning the way she did despite getting outspent 7 to 1 and despite her ridiculous comment about not supporting a living wage is nuts. That is not Trump country at all. There is no way to spin that as some positive outcome for democrats. They went all-in in that district and got embarrassed.

The strategy is to just play things straight and not resort to their ridiculous brand of activism. They almost won in South Carolina when they paid no attention.
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LordoftheMorons
06/21/17 11:17:31 PM
#274:


7 to 1? It was more like 3 to 2: https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/06/20/us/politics/georgia-6th-most-expensive-house-election.html
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LordoftheMorons
06/21/17 11:18:45 PM
#275:


Also Trump won the district in November, albeit only by 1.5 points. Handel doing better isn't surprising given that these are rich, well educated Republicans who should like a traditional Republican like Handel a lot more than Trump.
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woodman
06/21/17 11:20:10 PM
#276:


UltiWasRight posted...
Trump lost the 6th district in Georgia.

Trump won.
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TheRock1525
06/21/17 11:22:55 PM
#277:


woodman posted...
UltiWasRight posted...
Trump lost the 6th district in Georgia.

Trump won.


Which is more appropriate: fake news or alternate facts?
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SupremeZero
06/21/17 11:23:23 PM
#278:


TheRock1525 posted...
woodman posted...
UltiWasRight posted...
Trump lost the 6th district in Georgia.

Trump won.


Which is more appropriate: fake news or alternate facts?

Alternate Facts.
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UltiWasRight
06/21/17 11:48:11 PM
#279:


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TheRock1525
06/22/17 1:17:55 AM
#280:


John Oliver is actually getting sued by the company that threatened to sue him if he ran that segment that I posted earlier.

I don't know exactly what they're suing about since everything he showed was either things they actually said or other people's testimony.
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Skyridge87
06/22/17 1:22:54 AM
#281:


I'll love to see how that develops
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woodman
06/22/17 1:26:54 AM
#282:


TheRock1525 posted...
John Oliver is actually getting sued by the company that threatened to sue him if he ran that segment that I posted earlier.

I don't know exactly what they're suing about since everything he showed was either things they actually said or other people's testimony.

I'm not surprised. He basically yelled "Sue me, bitches!" at them, which makes me so, so happy. Does the company think that this is going to end well for them? Even if they win the case, they'll get fucking insane negative press.
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TheRock1525
06/22/17 1:28:17 AM
#283:


There's nothing they can stand on here. Most think it's laughable, they tried it with the NYT in May and it's likely to get dismissed.

The Lesson: Don't be a shit company and people won't make fun of you.
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Kinglicious
06/22/17 1:34:43 AM
#284:


Maybe he'll find something to counter sue them with and initiate discovery on their financials.
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LordoftheMorons
06/22/17 2:31:47 AM
#285:


Just saw the Philando Castile video

Jesus fuck, how was that guy acquitted?
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GuessMyAltName
06/22/17 2:46:30 AM
#286:


black people are inherently scary

at least Americans think that's a legit excuse
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LordoftheMorons
06/22/17 2:58:41 AM
#287:


I mean, I guess I could see a racist or two getting on the jury and getting a mistrial

But 12 people saw that and were at minimum willing to be argued to not guilty? I just don't get it.
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AheadOfTheCurve
06/22/17 3:05:34 AM
#288:


GuessMyAltName posted...
black people are inherently scary

at least Americans think that's a legit excuse

It's honestly not a black issue. It's a money issue.

Bill Cosby and OJ were both guilty as hell and got away with what they did. Al Capone was guilty as fuck and they ended up getting him on tax evasion, and even then it's only because he contracted syphilis, went insane, and stopped covering his financial tracks properly. Green is the only language our courtrooms speak, and it's sad.
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Eddv
06/22/17 3:34:53 AM
#289:


They used the "Im a skittish fucktard" defense

There was another verdict yesterday where black man was killed after a foot chase after he threw his gun away and got onto tthe ground

His defense "I thought he had a second gun and was playing possum"
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Wanglicious
06/22/17 4:06:14 AM
#290:


see, while i can agree that's a weak defense, it's not unreasonable. standard of reasonable doubt does work for that: the idea that there may be another weapon isn't illogical.

Castile's case i legit just don't see it. if the guy's stoned, him telling you that he has a gun doesn't mean he's going to reach for it and shoot you, he's not fast enough for that and is going to be dulled. should he have not moved at all after saying that? the defense is just the cop's fear, irrationality be damned.
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Eddv
06/22/17 4:22:34 AM
#291:


Right thats the entirety of the problem - the standard is whatever the cop says he was feeling is the truth.

Dashcam and bodycam and all of that seems to not matter and that just feels...wrong.
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Wanglicious
06/22/17 4:31:33 AM
#292:


well yeah, it's throwing out the doctrine of reasonable doubt for feelings. it doesn't care what the reasonable person would think, an unreasonable person having an irrational fear is being accepted as a proper defense.

i mean the upside i can see is that when this hits civil court Castile's side will easily win anything they want. but with that defense it does not seem a cop can be prosecuted at all in that area.
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GuessMyUserName
06/22/17 7:43:35 AM
#293:


Jesus Christ Sam B's piece on the Child Victim's Act, hopefully it's something both sides of the aisle can agree on here

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SNKPVAlp_jc

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GuessMyUserName
06/22/17 7:58:56 AM
#294:


http://news.gamescom.de/en/2017/06/chancellor-merkel-is-opening-gamescom-for-the-first-time/

what in the

neat
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Metal_DK
06/22/17 8:31:46 AM
#295:


MrGreenonion posted...

So it's not "check back in 2026 and see if GA06 is blue", it's "check back in 2018 and see how many purple districts nationwide are blue".


Possible, but the thing about that is 2018 should be a democrat slaughter. The problem is they are awful at having any message about shit, and shut up people who do apparently.

I also think Trump being such a unique instance in politics history causes a lot of people to maybe be a purple area for elections in his term. Like i mentioned earlier, there are a lot of people ive talked to who hate Trump, but dont really have a problem with Ryan or Pence or whatever. Is that also possible in other districts? If so its a short term plan which might not hold much water long term.
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charmander6000
06/22/17 10:13:10 AM
#296:


2018 may not be a big win for the Democrats. Republicans are almost guaranteed to hold the Senate and may even increase their lead and while we may know why the average American will just see a Republican win. Among the house they need to flip 24 seats which puts the tipping point at Utah 4 which had their Republican candidate win with 12.5%. This is assuming the Republicans don't flip any Democrat seats.

Based on Georgia 6 things look promising, but you have to remember the district did not have an incumbent advantage and due to it being a by-election it had a lower vote total relative to 2016 and non-incumbent parties tend to perform better in them.
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The Mana Sword
06/22/17 12:55:11 PM
#297:


https://twitter.com/mikenfrank/status/877579677640019968

this is unacceptable

driving on the green should be an impeachable offense
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LordoftheMorons
06/22/17 1:59:29 PM
#298:


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Not_an_Owl
06/22/17 2:20:07 PM
#299:


The Senate health care bill is out, and it's terrible (but I repeat myself):

http://www.npr.org/2017/06/22/533947844/senate-republicans-reveal-long-awaited-affordable-care-act-repeal-bill
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SupremeZero
06/22/17 2:23:46 PM
#300:


The Mana Sword posted...
https://twitter.com/mikenfrank/status/877579677640019968

this is unacceptable

driving on the green should be an impeachable offense

"sorry, you are not authorized"
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