Israel/Palestina War XIX - Now With Boat Tours!

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Current Events » Israel/Palestina War XIX - Now With Boat Tours!
Reports that new Hezbollah leader Hassan Khalil Yassin has been killed by the IDF
Ring the bells that still can ring/Forget your perfect offering/There is a crack in everything/That's how the light gets in."- RIP, Leonard Cohen
LightSnake posted...
Reports that new Hezbollah leader Hassan Khalil Yassin has been killed by the IDF
I haven't seen any evidence that he was the new leader of Hezbollah. He was the leader of the intelligence division only, and I am sure a new general leader hasn't been elected yet considering Nasrallah died just yesterday, so there is no "new leader of Hezbollah" to begin with.
WHO AM I?FFTHEWINNER. WHO ARE YOU?URTHELOSER
http://i.imgur.com/xgSex.png
Honestly, they're probably having a hell of a time just figuring out passwords on the group chat let alone new leadership
Ring the bells that still can ring/Forget your perfect offering/There is a crack in everything/That's how the light gets in."- RIP, Leonard Cohen
Just think how much good 8 billion extra dollars would do to help US citizens if we didn't give it to Israel
Zikten posted...
Just think how much good 8 billion extra dollars would do to help US citizens if we didn't give it to Israel
Or how much humanitarian aid for Gaza (and likely soon, Lebanon) it could fund.

Heck, could probably be a significant help for both causes if used wisely.
And they say that a Trumble will save us...
Zikten posted...
Just think how much good 8 billion extra dollars would do to help US citizens if we didn't give it to Israel
The problem is that these money would never be used to help US citizens if they were not sent to Israel.
GameFAQs isn't going to be merged in with GameSpot or any other site. We're not going to strip out the soul of the site. -CJayC
Foppe posted...
The problem is that these money would never be used to help US citizens if they were not sent to Israel.
We have a roughly trillion dollar deficit every year. It would certainly help with that.
Hospy posted...
We have a roughly trillion dollar deficit every year. It would certainly help with that.
It would indeed.
Which is why they would end up in the pockets of politicals or military instead.
GameFAQs isn't going to be merged in with GameSpot or any other site. We're not going to strip out the soul of the site. -CJayC
If Biden wanted to use the money for Hurricane Helene relief, he could figure out a way. Just a billion would make a difference now.
GoldenSun/Crossbone Isle diagrams/ 18 teams known https://photobucket.com/u/SwordOfWheat/a/9990a2ee-25f3-4242-ae79-7d2d4b882be4
Starks posted...
Sinwar is also incommunicado for the past few weeks.

My brain read that is Shines
Asus E-gaming z490 | 10700k | DDR4 32gb 3200mhz | Asus TUF 3080ti | 1000 watt | Corsair H100i 240 | G7 Odyssey 32" | Orion Spark | Proteus Core
https://www.axios.com/2024/09/28/iran-attack-israel-nasrallah-killing

Israel asked the U.S. to take steps to deter Iran from attacking Israel in response to the Israeli airstrike in Beirut that killed Hezbollah leader Hassan Nasrallah and a top Iranian general, two Israeli and U.S. officials tell Axios.

Why are we suddenly expected to clean up this mess? Every remaining proxy is about to flip out.
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yet again a one sided alliance
Ring the bells that still can ring/Forget your perfect offering/There is a crack in everything/That's how the light gets in."- RIP, Leonard Cohen
https://twitter.com/kthalps/status/1840240840045740405

https://twitter.com/Alonso_GD/status/1840126387971305541

I mean, what the hell is even going on here?
lolAmerica
Bluevoterguide.org
ClayGuida posted...
https://twitter.com/kthalps/status/1840240840045740405

https://twitter.com/Alonso_GD/status/1840126387971305541

I mean, what the hell is even going on here?

More land grabbing of course.
Just call me Discount Dan.
Netanyahu: I will be remembered as the tzaddiq that was chosen by God to give back the Holy Land to his chosen people and to destroy its enemies!
GameFAQs isn't going to be merged in with GameSpot or any other site. We're not going to strip out the soul of the site. -CJayC
Foppe posted...
Bibi the tzaddiq
Fuck that on every imaginable level.
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https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/israel-launches-strikes-yemeni-houthi-targets-2024-09-29/

Israel launched strikes at Houthi targets in Yemen on Sunday after the Houthi militants fired missiles at Israel over the past two days, marking a fresh exchange in another front of the regional conflict.

The Israeli military said in a statement that dozens of aircraft, including fighter jets, attacked power plants and a sea port at the Ras Issa and Hodeidah ports.

They appear committed to continuing until they've wiped out the threats against them or until Iran interdicts.
darkace77450 posted...
https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/israel-launches-strikes-yemeni-houthi-targets-2024-09-29/

They appear committed to continuing until they've wiped out the threats against them or until Iran interdicts.

At this point, you'd think Iran might want to just because they are vastly losing ground in the proxy war. At least take time to rebuild.
Ring the bells that still can ring/Forget your perfect offering/There is a crack in everything/That's how the light gets in."- RIP, Leonard Cohen
darkace77450 posted...
They appear committed to continuing until they've wiped out the threats against them or until Iran interdicts.

In what world is this rational or sustainable, especially when your actions are creating threats to yourself?

This could all have remained isolated to Israel and Palestine, but Israel escalated regional conflict with pager and walkie-talkie detonation attacks.

(Can we call those indiscriminate terrorism, as they would meet the definition if conducted by a non-governmental body, or are we limited to merely classifying them as "attacks?")
What has books ever teached us? -- Captain Afrohead
Subject-verb agreement. -- t3h 0n3
DnDer posted...
In what world is this rational or sustainable, especially when your actions are creating threats to yourself?

This could all have remained isolated to Israel and Palestine, but Israel escalated regional conflict with pager and walkie-talkie detonation attacks.

(Can we call those indiscriminate terrorism, as they would meet the definition if conducted by a non-governmental body, or are we limited to merely classifying them as "attacks?")

In the case of Hezbollah, this wasn't isolated. Northern regions in Israel are literally depopulated because of refugees as Hezbollah was firing rockets before any incursion into Gaza.

The use of force is way out of proportion, but there came a point when Israel was directly responding to attacks. Nasrallah was a huge proponent of the "spider Web" theory which said Israel is weak as a spider web and that Israelis would just flee the country at the signs of danger.

If we're going to find a solution, we do need to stop pretending a lot of this isn't Iran trying to put these theories into practice. Hamas really thought October 7 was the beginning of the end of Israel and Hezbollah and the Houthis attempted to supplement that with absolutely catastrophic results.
Ring the bells that still can ring/Forget your perfect offering/There is a crack in everything/That's how the light gets in."- RIP, Leonard Cohen
LightSnake posted...
In the case of Hezbollah, this wasn't isolated. Northern regions in Israel are literally depopulated because of refugees as Hezbollah was firing rockets before any incursion into Gaza.

Are we treating Hezbollah as a part of the Lebanese government, because missiles back and forth are acts of actual war at that point, aren't they?

And if we treat them as just a terrorist organization, Israel is firing rockets into someone else's sovereign territory. Even if it's morally justified, the political ramifications in the region alone would be staggering.

Israel has a right to defend itself against any attacks. Even Hezbollah rockets from across the border. That's one of the responsibilities of the Iron Dome, yes? But...

LightSnake posted...
The use of force is way out of proportion

Very much so.

LightSnake posted...
but there came a point when Israel was directly responding to attacks.

Launching incursions into someone's sovereign airspace, striking infrastructure, and blindly detonating bombs doesn't feel like a "direct response" anymore.

A direct response would be firing on the launch sites of the missile attacks within minutes of shooting down the original missiles. Not... <gestures broadly> this.

A direct response to rocket attacks would not include opening a front to fight on and a theatre of war to launch operations into.

So, back to, "How is Israel's behavior/disproportionate response towards Hezbollah's attacks rational or sustainable?"
What has books ever teached us? -- Captain Afrohead
Subject-verb agreement. -- t3h 0n3
DnDer posted...
Are we treating Hezbollah as a part of the Lebanese government, because missiles back and forth are acts of actual war at that point, aren't they?

That's questionable at this point, because Hezbollah is the de facto government in many places, even if it's officially a stateless actor.

And if we treat them as just a terrorist organization, Israel is firing rockets into someone else's sovereign territory. Even if it's morally justified, the political ramifications in the region alone would be staggering.


Yeah, the issue is that the Lebanese government has, effectively, very little real power to do anything and Hezbollah controls wide swaths of territory throughout. And it gets even muddier when they're Iranian proxies.

Israel has a right to defend itself against any attacks. Even Hezbollah rockets from across the border. That's one of the responsibilities of the Iron Dome, yes? But...

Very much so.

Yeah, we're agreeing here. I mean, leveling a city block even to get Nasrallah and the rest of the high command is bad, but some strikes are probably justified at this point even if the pager blast and the bunker buster weren't.
Launching incursions into someone's sovereign airspace, striking infrastructure, and blindly detonating bombs doesn't feel like a "direct response" anymore.

At this point, I think the logic is just "Lebanon doesn't have any real government and can't stop this, so we'll just dismantle Hezbollah ourselves."

A direct response would be firing on the launch sites of the missile attacks within minutes of shooting down the original missiles. Not... <gestures broadly> this.


The main issue is Hezbollah absolutely declared war by any measure. Israel doesn't seem inclined to just play tit for tat with that and are aiming to absolutely cripple the organization. It's murkier how that works when dealing with stateless actors.

It's absolutely not irrational. It's just disproportionate and overly brutal with little care for collateral.

Ring the bells that still can ring/Forget your perfect offering/There is a crack in everything/That's how the light gets in."- RIP, Leonard Cohen
Don't forget that Hezbollah was established after Israel invaded Lebanon in the 80s. Israel is creating problems and then using those problems to justify destruction and territorial expansion.
https://imgur.com/a/FU9H8 - https://i.imgur.com/ZkQRDsR.png - https://i.imgur.com/2x2gtgP.jpg
I think it's silly to pretend that Hezbollah is nothing more than an Iranian proxy and that Iran is some kind of mastermind behind all of this. Hezbollah is a complex and quite sophisticated political organisation which has grown over 40 years driven by a popular movement. They formed in response to the vicious invasion and atrocities committed by Israel in Lebanon in 1982, and also as a result of the political vacuum that Israel created in Lebanon, partly due to the elimination of the PLO, partly due to the failure of the Lebanese government, and also because of the weakness and ineffectiveness of the Lebanese military to provide any kind of resistance or deterrence to future Israeli aggression. The violence and insecurity that Israel propagates only fuels further resistance.

The axis of resistance is a defensive coalition employed as a textbook balancing strategy to offset US/Israeli aggression in the region.

Just a month ago the former Israeli General Yitzhak Brik was writing in Haaretz that, "Israel Will Collapse Within a Year if the War of Attrition Against Hamas and Hezbollah Continues". With economic and political instability looming, time is certainly not on Israel's side in this conflict.
~we are a part of the process, not instigators of its progress~
LightSnake posted...
It's absolutely not irrational. It's just disproportionate and overly brutal with little care for collateral.
I agree. What we're seeing is the end of human shields as a working defensive strategy.
conduit posted...
I think it's silly to pretend that Hezbollah is nothing more than an Iranian proxy and that Iran is some kind of mastermind behind all of this. Hezbollah is a complex and quite sophisticated political organisation which has grown over 40 years driven by a popular movement. They formed in response to the vicious invasion and atrocities committed by Israel in Lebanon in 1982, and also as a result of the political vacuum that Israel created in Lebanon, partly due to the elimination of the PLO, partly due to the failure of the Lebanese government, and also because of the weakness and ineffectiveness of the Lebanese military to provide any kind of resistance or deterrence to future Israeli aggression. The violence and insecurity that Israel propagates only fuels further resistance.

The axis of resistance is a defensive coalition employed as a textbook balancing strategy to offset US/Israeli aggression in the region.

Just a month ago the former Israeli General Yitzhak Brik was writing in Haaretz that, "Israel Will Collapse Within a Year if the War of Attrition Against Hamas and Hezbollah Continues". With economic and political instability looming, time is certainly not on Israel's side in this conflict.

My dude, Hezbollah is responsible for killing vastly more innocent Muslims than they killed anyone else. They bombed a Jewish community center in Argentina just to target Jews, they gleefully starved a Syrian city and posted pictures of food on social media to mock their victims while committing horrible war crimes in favor of Assad and don't even try with "they went to fight ISIS" because they were in Syria before ISIS even formed. Nasrallah was gleeful about wanting Jews eliminated.

This only makes sense if you view the US as the source of all evil whereas anything against the US is "good." Even brutal religious fanatics with an absolutely tyrannical ideology.

You can be against killing hundreds to get one guy because that is well and truly a fucked tactic, but whitewashing Nasrallah and Hezbollah is sickening.

Also just "ah, but the defeat of Israel is coming! TIme is not on their side!" Yeah, Nasrallah was saying that every day for like 18 years. Now he's dead along with the vast majority of his chain of command. Hezbollah has been absolutely decapitated. They're not winning.

Hamas has been so operationally damaged they can't even pull off a retaliation for Israel blowing their last leader up in his hotel room. Iran is left posting twitter threats how the end is coming soon while they're running out of actual proxies.
Ring the bells that still can ring/Forget your perfect offering/There is a crack in everything/That's how the light gets in."- RIP, Leonard Cohen
LightSnake posted...
This only makes sense if you view the US as the source of all evil whereas anything against the US is "good."

...says the person who clearly thinks the ones committing genocide are the "good" guys.

It's not about goodies and baddies, this is a mickey mouse worldview, a childish dichotomy formed by toddlers.

And I don't know why you're accusing me of whitewashing anything. Whatever you think of Hezbollah, my point which you seem to have missed was that they are not simply a proxy of Iran, they were not built by Iran, and they are not controlled by Iran. They are no more a proxy of Iran than Israel is a proxy of the US.

Secondarily, to explain the coalition between Hezbollah and Iran as well as others I was making a point about how separate (weaker) elements coalesce as a balancing strategy to offset the imbalance created by greater powers.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balancing_(international_relations)

This is merely an observation of power dynamics rooted in international relations theory to explain how rival powers form. It has nothing to do with whitewashing anything, though I can understand why someone arguing from an entrenched ideological perspective might think that, you obviously seem invested on a personal level.

I'm saying Israel has played a far more influential role in the existence and development of Hezbollah than Iran ever has.
~we are a part of the process, not instigators of its progress~
conduit posted...
...says the person who clearly thinks the ones committing genocide are the "good" guys.

Wrong, try again
It's not about goodies and baddies, this is a mickey mouse worldview, a childish dichotomy formed by toddlers.

And I don't know why you're accusing me of whitewashing anything. Whatever you think of Hezbollah, my point which you seem to have missed was that they are not simply a proxy of Iran, they were not built by Iran, and they are not controlled by Iran. They are no more a proxy of Iran than Israel is a proxy of the US.

They're very much a proxy of Iran, I don't even know how this is debatable. They follow Iran's orders, the head of their religion is literally the Ayatollah. Regardless of how they formed, they subordinated to Iran quite quickly.

Secondarily, to explain the coalition between Hezbollah and Iran as well as others I was making a point about how separate (weaker) elements coalesce as a balancing strategy to offset the imbalance created by greater powers.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balancing_(international_relations)

This is merely an observation of power dynamics rooted in international relations theory to explain how rival powers form. It has nothing to do with whitewashing anything, though I can understand why someone arguing from an entrenched ideological perspective might think that, you obviously seem invested on a personal level.

I'm saying Israel has played a far more influential role in the existence and development of Hezbollah than Iran ever has.

Using "The Axis of Resistance" was as much of a giveaway as the guy holding up the wrong three fingers in Inglourious Basterds, man. This dog ain't hunting.
Ring the bells that still can ring/Forget your perfect offering/There is a crack in everything/That's how the light gets in."- RIP, Leonard Cohen
conduit posted...

I honestly don't know how LightSnake hasn't been suspended yet.
And they say that a Trumble will save us...
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/3/3964dbc7.jpg

Truly, Hezbollah are not controlled by Iran at all.
Ring the bells that still can ring/Forget your perfect offering/There is a crack in everything/That's how the light gets in."- RIP, Leonard Cohen
Literally MEMRI. LOL
https://imgur.com/a/FU9H8 - https://i.imgur.com/ZkQRDsR.png - https://i.imgur.com/2x2gtgP.jpg
1337toothbrush posted...
Literally MEMRI. LOL

This isn't an uncommon video, you know. Nasrallah was a staunch Shiite militant who believed wholly in Iran's control.
Ring the bells that still can ring/Forget your perfect offering/There is a crack in everything/That's how the light gets in."- RIP, Leonard Cohen
Trumble posted...
I honestly don't know how LightSnake hasn't been suspended yet.

put the guy on ignore ages ago, theres nothing there worth interfacing with
I pray god will curse the writer, as the writer has cursed the world with this beautiful, stupendous creation, terrible in its simplicity, irresistible in truth
https://x.com/IsraelRadar_com/status/1840459951614902464

Estimations are Hezbollah's firepower has been severely crippled.
Ring the bells that still can ring/Forget your perfect offering/There is a crack in everything/That's how the light gets in."- RIP, Leonard Cohen
https://x.com/electionwiz/status/1840577622297722965?s=46

reminder that this guy is actively still president right now
I pray god will curse the writer, as the writer has cursed the world with this beautiful, stupendous creation, terrible in its simplicity, irresistible in truth
ultimate_reaver posted...
https://x.com/electionwiz/status/1840577622297722965?s=46

reminder that this guy is actively still president right now
Big oof right there.
And they say that a Trumble will save us...
Attack on apartment building in central Beirut, 3 dead from The Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine (PFLP).
At least 100 dead in multiple attacks.
GameFAQs isn't going to be merged in with GameSpot or any other site. We're not going to strip out the soul of the site. -CJayC
https://twitter.com/evanhill/status/1840761265053921754

A "limited" invasion of Lebanon may be imminent
Yes we're being condescending
Yes that means we're talking down to you
"""Limited"""
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https://x.com/ragipsoylu/status/1840671666940039461

Iran straight up saying "you're on your own, guys."
Ring the bells that still can ring/Forget your perfect offering/There is a crack in everything/That's how the light gets in."- RIP, Leonard Cohen
LightSnake posted...
https://x.com/ragipsoylu/status/1840671666940039461

Iran straight up saying "you're on your own, guys."

I'd like to believe that some of these proxies are now realizing that they were being treated like useful idiots by Iran in their proxy war against everybody else in the middle east.
"History Is Much Like An Endless Waltz. The Three Beats Of War, Peace And Revolution Continue On Forever." - Gundam Wing: Endless Waltz
LightSnake posted...
https://x.com/ragipsoylu/status/1840671666940039461

Iran straight up saying "you're on your own, guys."

No. Iran saying we do not want Israel to decide on its own that there will be a war
GoldenSun/Crossbone Isle diagrams/ 18 teams known https://photobucket.com/u/SwordOfWheat/a/9990a2ee-25f3-4242-ae79-7d2d4b882be4
LightSnake posted...
https://x.com/ragipsoylu/status/1840671666940039461

Iran straight up saying "you're on your own, guys."
Yeah, this is clear as it gets really.
WHO AM I?FFTHEWINNER. WHO ARE YOU?URTHELOSER
http://i.imgur.com/xgSex.png
LightSnake posted...
https://x.com/ragipsoylu/status/1840671666940039461

Iran straight up saying "you're on your own, guys."
Also throws Pezeshkian under the bus. It's a twofer.
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https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/jordanian-fm-arab-world-willing-to-guarantee-israels-security-if-palestinian-state-established/

In a recent press conference on the sidelines of the UN General Assembly, Jordanian Foreign Minister Ayman Safadi insisted that Arab and Muslim countries will guarantee Israels security if Jerusalem agrees to allow the establishment of a Palestinian state on the pre-1967 lines, while blasting Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahus refusal to do so.

The Israeli prime minister came here today and said that Israel is surrounded by those who want to destroy it, Safadi said at a Friday press conference shortly after Netanyahu finished his speech at the UN General Assembly.

Were here members of the Muslim-Arab committee, mandated by 57 Arab and Muslim countries and I can tell you very unequivocally, all of us are willing to guarantee the security of Israel in the context of Israel ending the occupation and allowing for the emergence of a Palestinian state, Safadi passionately argued.

Netanyahu is creating that danger because he simply does not want the two-state solution. If he does not want the two-state solution, can you ask Israeli officials what is their end-game other than just wars and wars and wars?

All of us in the Arab world here, want a peace in which Israel lives in peace and security, accepted, normalized with all Arab countries in the context of ending the occupation, withdrawing from Arab territory, allowing for the emergence of an independent, sovereign Palestinian state on the June 4, 1967 lies with East Jerusalem as its capital, Safadi continues.

The amount of damage that this Israeli government has done 30 years of efforts to convince people that peace is possible, this Israeli government killed it. The amount of dehumanization, hatred, bitterness, will take generations to navigate through, the Jordanian foreign minister says. We have no partner for peace in Israel, there is a partner for peace in the Arab world, and thats why the international community needs to move.

He obviously doesn't speak for Iran, and how much they can do to honor their guarantee is debatable, but the underlying point he's making isn't wrong. So long as Palestinians are subjected to apartheid conditions, resentment will persist. And so long as resentment persists, lasting peace will be impossible.
darkace77450 posted...
https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/jordanian-fm-arab-world-willing-to-guarantee-israels-security-if-palestinian-state-established/

He obviously doesn't speak for Iran, and how much they can do to honor their guarantee is debatable, but the underlying point he's making isn't wrong. So long as Palestinians are subjected to apartheid conditions, resentment will persist. And so long as resentment persists, lasting peace will be impossible.

The bitterest irony is a Palestinian state is the single most obvious way to secure a lasting peace and security, but it's the option that is most adamantly opposed by even mainstream parties in Israel who wish to keep the Palestinians as a permanent and stateless underclass.
Ring the bells that still can ring/Forget your perfect offering/There is a crack in everything/That's how the light gets in."- RIP, Leonard Cohen
LightSnake posted...
The bitterest irony is a Palestinian state is the single most obvious way to secure a lasting peace and security, but it's the option that is most adamantly opposed by even mainstream parties in Israel who wish to keep the Palestinians as a permanent and stateless underclass.
I don't think they want to keep them as a permanent underclass.

I'm pretty sure they want them to go away or cease existing somehow.
There are literally hundreds of thousands of Israelis protesting to end the war, which seems more relevant to what many desire than several dozen on boat tours
Ring the bells that still can ring/Forget your perfect offering/There is a crack in everything/That's how the light gets in."- RIP, Leonard Cohen
LightSnake posted...
There are literally hundreds of thousands of Israelis protesting to end the war, which seems more relevant to what many desire than several dozen on boat tours
Yes, there are, and it is very important to acknowledge this - because its a reminder that average Israeli (and/or Jewish) people are not responsible for this. However, these average people also arent the ones with the power to change anything.
And they say that a Trumble will save us...
Current Events » Israel/Palestina War XIX - Now With Boat Tours!
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