Apparently Zoomers are screwed when it comes to getting jobs?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eX6GIDIk9sI

Basically this guy explains how zoomers can't find jobs and also how previous generations of workers/managers have a bias against them which only adds to their problems finding jobs

What are your thoughts on this?

9/10 zoomers I've had to work with have been incapable of doing basic tasks

including "showing up to work regularly as expected"

I'm in that position now and not a zoomer. Job searching sucks.

Zoomers are screwed when it comes to pretty much everything. Partly because they're dealing with the fallout of the decisions of and events stemming from multiple generations before them, and partly because they themselves kind of suck.

All the zoomers I intern with rock, actually.

They said all the same shit about millennials 15 years ago. Young people with no work experience need to gain work experience, it's hard to comprehend I know

Yes, after moving last year it was a real struggle to find an actual job outside the house compared to eight years ago. But not all zoomers I worked with are bad. I've had worse experiences with boomers who are just deceitful and backstabbing compared to zoomers who just don't give a shit.

I don't interact with zoomers so i'm kinda blessed

I constantly do.

DrunkCaveman posted...

They said all the same shit about millennials 15 years ago.

They were right.

Job Applications should not be asking for references for entry level positions. How is a 16 year old supposed to talk about their work experiences and have references? McDonalds wants employees wanting to be team leaders.

Clench281 posted...

9/10 zoomers I've had to work with have been incapable of doing basic tasks

including "showing up to work regularly as expected"

Ever met a boomer?

DrunkCaveman posted...

They said all the same shit about millennials 15 years ago. Young people with no work experience need to gain work experience, it's hard to comprehend I know

You can't gain work experience without being hired.

25-35 is the sweet spot for hiring in my experience. By 25 theyve burned through some BS jobs and now want something serious. People under 25 that Ive interviewed and employed tend to be garbage. Employees in their 40-50s tend to have temperament issues in my experience.

Gen Alpha/Gen Z aren't as bad as youtube portrays. you have to remember that when you consume that type of content that keep portraying one side as bad, you're still just witnessing cherry picked content.

TimeForAction posted...

25-35 is the sweet spot for hiring in my experience. By 25 theyve burned through some BS jobs and now want something serious. People under 25 that Ive interviewed and employed tend to be garbage. Employees in their 40-50s tend to have temperament issues in my experience.

This.
I'm 40 now and there just things I'm not willing to do anymore. My body takes an hour just to fully wakeup before I even begin to start my day. It's a reminder of how I need to keep pressing on with exercise and fitness if I plan to work late into my 50s full time.

Ever since I got my first job 13 years ago at 18 I have been jobless for like a week, it's never taken me more than a couple of days to find a new job, so no, I haven't ever had a hard time finding a job

Also it seems a good chunk of gen z is probably having a hard time finding jobs because they don't want to work. I've had multiple gen z coworkers and most of them just kinda wander off in the middle of the shift regularly. Though I have had some good gen z coworkers too so I'm not going to generalize them.

Kallainanna posted...

All the zoomers I intern with rock, actually.

Has not been my experience. We hire a lot through temp agencies. The younger guys are almost always terrible and the older guys always come in willing to actually show up and do the job without excuses. Always catch the younger guys on their phone or sneaking out to smoke weed in their car or disappearing for whatever and taking long lunch breaks

Honestly, it sounds like it's going to depend on the industry or the business, or it's just going to be random.

My experience at my current job is that the "Gen Z" employees are generally pretty nose-to-the-grindstone and get work done. I know a lot of Gen X and Boomers at my job that spend a lot of the day chit-chatting in office while lauding the necessity of human connection. I'm always trying to escape longwinded conversations with boomer coworkers that have nothing to do with work.

Haven't had a ton of experience with Zoomers at work, but the few I have had have not been fully positive. Like, show up to work on time, give notice if you are going to be out, and tell me if you are struggling with the work I am giving you so I can help you. Doesn't seem very hard, but for some reason they can't do that.

ReturnOfFa posted...

Honestly, it sounds like it's going to depend on the industry or the business, or it's just going to be random.

My experience at my current job is that the "Gen Z" employees are generally pretty nose-to-the-grindstone and get work done. I know a lot of Gen X and Boomers at my job that spend a lot of the day chit-chatting in office while lauding the necessity of human connection. I'm always trying to escape longwinded conversations with boomer coworkers that have nothing to do with work.

Probably depends on the job for sure. Mine have been more "nose to the phone." Which makes sense being that they're the generation that grew up addicted to phones, tablets, social media, etc

Younger generations are just less tolerant of abusive work places.

TimeForAction posted...

25-35 is the sweet spot for hiring in my experience. By 25 theyve burned through some BS jobs and now want something serious. People under 25 that Ive interviewed and employed tend to be garbage. Employees in their 40-50s tend to have temperament issues in my experience.

You're right. It's an age thing, not a generation thing.
I didn't realize how much 20 year olds suck until i reached my 30s and realized why i received so many good ethic compliments.

Everything else comes down to everybody sucks

Beveren_Rabbit posted...

Job Applications should not be asking for references for entry level positions. How is a 16 year old supposed to talk about their work experiences and have references? McDonalds wants employees wanting to be team leaders.

I left home 20 years ago and had issues back then finding work because I left school even with good grades even went to local small college but then had no work experience, I kept getting told I need references but I couldn't as I hadn't had a job before, ended up getting a job for minimum wage in a holiday park (not sure what Americans call it) I was working in the convenience store getting like 2 a hour, and the park was charging me 70 a week "rent" to stay in one of their caravans and messed up my taxes so I was lucky working 50 hours a week I had about 15 for food, luxuries etc, I got 45 on unemployment benefits to do nothing, I was shouted at regulary by the boss for being slow, not knowing what I was doing etc, they gave me no training and wondered why I was bad at my job.

After that was out of work for 2 years, then lasted about 2 weeks in a factory, reasonable wages for the time but it was too much for me so left, got another job a few months later but the company went under so was back on unemployment.

So basically by this point I had 1 if I was lucky reference.

I was told offhand by a few people that companies bin applications from unemployed people due to stereotypes.

The few jobs that may of taken me were things like McDonalds but I wouldn't of lasted there as I am autistic, one place when I was 17 turned me down for an advertised position but offered me the same job as an apprentice which meant rather than an actual wage I got 1 a hour as I was classed as learning, put it this way my rent which was very cheap was still 45 a week as it was bare minimum, run down etc.

Due to my autism and mental health I often started jobs and worked myself so hard I burned out and left around the 3-5 month mark after taking a few days off.

But even without my issues, I remember 15 years ago and even further back in my home town area which had about 3 thousand unemployed there was 0 full time jobs at the local jobcentre, and many "sales" people i.e Avon where you had to buy their products, and then sell them to others for a profit and you must do your own taxes, have your own car etc, not a proper job.

If you have no work experience, go through a temp agency and you will easily find work

my zoomer gf has only ever had one job in her life (went from being a student worker in a college to working for that college in the same office)
my zoomer brother is having hell finding anything permanent and is currently doing blue collar work despite having a tech degree
\_()_/

Im a millennial and my zoomer wife works harder than I do for a tiny fraction of the pay.

TimeForAction posted...

25-35 is the sweet spot for hiring in my experience. By 25 theyve burned through some BS jobs and now want something serious. People under 25 that Ive interviewed and employed tend to be garbage. Employees in their 40-50s tend to have temperament issues in my experience.

Pretty much. It's more of an age thing than a generational thing. Younger people getting jobs are often getting them just because they need to work somewhere and not because they have actual interest in the field, plus they're still learning how much slacking they can actually get away with and often end up pushing the envelope too far in that regard. "The youth of today have no work ethic" is a complaint as old as recorded history. Figuring out how to motivate yourself to do a good job is just part of growing up, and comes with experience (including being disciplined for doing a bad job, so this isn't to say "let kids be kids" when a younger worker is failing to do their job).

Of course, there's also the issue that entry-level jobs aren't enough to afford much of anything these days and better-paying jobs are few and far between, so you don't have the extrinsic motivator of "if I work hard I'll be able to buy *cool thing*," and the interconnectedness of the Internet has made younger generations less tolerant of poor working conditions because they know things can be better than an endless refrain of "pay your dues," but every generation has their own reasons from being disconnected from previous generations' idea of work ethic.

I've been struggling to find work the past two to three years and I don't know what I'm doing wrong or what assumptions people are making about me. Fifteen years of experience in Broadcast Television with a significant amount of it in a leadership position, and it means nothing. Barely anything available in my field that pays what I need and the few interviews I get end up ghosting me. I've had to branch outside of my field with whatever I think I can find and it's even worse trying to find something there. Am I overqualified? Have I been out of work for too long and am just screwed?

The past year I've been through three jobs, first was temporary anyways and ended in a month, the owner of the second was missing 10,000 dollars and started making up accusations towards me so I had to leave, and the third I just couldn't make sales quotas in the worst months of the year.

I've been told by all my managers that my work ethic is impeccable, but I really feel like there's a lot no one is telling me. I never used to have this hard of a time finding work, but now it's nearly impossible.

adjl posted...

Pretty much. It's more of an age thing than a generational thing. Younger people getting jobs are often getting them just because they need to work somewhere and not because they have actual interest in the field, plus they're still learning how much slacking they can actually get away with and often end up pushing the envelope too far in that regard. "The youth of today have no work ethic" is a complaint as old as recorded history. Figuring out how to motivate yourself to do a good job is just part of growing up, and comes with experience (including being disciplined for doing a bad job, so this isn't to say "let kids be kids" when a younger worker is failing to do their job).

Of course, there's also the issue that entry-level jobs aren't enough to afford much of anything these days and better-paying jobs are few and far between, so you don't have the extrinsic motivator of "if I work hard I'll be able to buy *cool thing*," and the interconnectedness of the Internet has made younger generations less tolerant of poor working conditions because they know things can be better than an endless refrain of "pay your dues," but every generation has their own reasons from being disconnected from previous generations' idea of work ethic.

Know the feeling,

Wages were terrible when I left home but at least there was the promise of experience meant higher wages, so a minimum wage I could rent a small room somewhere and still have a bit of a social life, get a better paid job and then I could treat myself and/or save for something better.

Here in the UK the minimum wage rises meant something that would of got you as much as 3x but more likely just 2x the minimum 20 years ago is now minimum wage, yet that small room I rented 20 years ago would go for the wage 20 years ago that would of been someone earning double the minimum wage, so essentially doubled in cost.

And yet the government wonders why we have so many people unemployed or claiming benefits as well as working as their wages are too low, the governments response? Lets cut benefits.

Zoomers being lazy at my job: using their phones while working.

Boomers being lazy: spend hours talking with every passing person about how lazy zoomers are to be checking their texts at work.

adjl posted...

"The youth of today have no work ethic" is a complaint as old as recorded history

Sure... but having an endless source of entertainment at your fingertips in the form of a smartphone is unprecedented up until the last decade or so. That's the difference between being lazy in... lets say... the 80s compared to now

Most Zoomers I've worked with have been fine. They'll probably complain about having to work, but they get the job done and they do it well. A lot even put me to shame.

OhhhJa posted...

Sure... but having an endless source of entertainment at your fingertips in the form of a smartphone is unprecedented up until the last decade or so. That's the difference between being lazy in... lets say... the 80s compared to now

Sure, nobody was glued to their phones in the 80's, but that doesn't mean they weren't just as eager to find ways to avoid doing work. The form changes, but the fundamental issue does not. In fact, I'd argue that it's because the form changes that this complaint is so timeless: the culture of every generation differs from that which came before them, and that means that when somebody from an older generation notices a younger colleague slacking off, they're behaving in ways that the older person knows they never did. That makes it easier to resent by making it harder for them to recognize that they slacked off comparably in their day.

Phone addiction and whatnot are absolutely issues, and it wouldn't surprise me if there are some actual differences in productivity associated with that (though it's tricky to determine anything conclusively because this is an issue with a lot of confounding variables), but phones mostly just amount to offering another thing to do while being lazy, not an actual paradigm shift in laziness. Fiddling around on a phone for an hour a day is functionally no different from taking an hour's worth of smoke breaks in a day.

OhhhJa posted...

Sure... but having an endless source of entertainment at your fingertips in the form of a smartphone is unprecedented up until the last decade or so. That's the difference between being lazy in... lets say... the 80s compared to now

Have you ever heard of the funnies? Or talking? Half of an 80s job in a bank was smoking cigarettes and verbally abusing women.

Sure, but that only applies to smokers which is a relatively small percentage of the population at this point. Outside of smoking, sitting on the toilet for long periods of time (which is really kind of embarrassing if people see you doing this a lot), and staring at your phone, being lazy actually requires a bit of creativity/effort to the point that a lot of people will just work as the alternative even if they're slow about it.

I don't know how easy it would be to prove statistically, but I'd bet money that productivity in the workplace is way down compared to past decades. I feel like i even see that difference on a macro scale. I'll use something I'm particularly familiar with. Music is easier than ever to record yet bands/artists now take way longer to put out albums than they used to. Bands in the 60/70s were putting out sometimes more than an album a year. I think the fact that everyone's faces are buried in phones has a lot to do with this.

Without the distraction at someone fingertips, people were forced to just do actual productive things to pass the time. Hell, I'm guilty of this as are most people nowadays

ReturnOfFa posted...

Have you ever heard of the funnies? Or talking? Half of an 80s job in a bank was smoking cigarettes and verbally abusing women.

And yet I still don't think this compares even remotely to the amount of time people waste on their phones. Plus its actually possible to talk and work to some degree. Impossible to work while scrolling Instagram

OhhhJa posted...

And yet I still don't think this compares even remotely to the amount of time people waste on their phones. Plus its actually possible to talk and work to some degree . Impossible to work while scrolling Instagram

no

I can't speak to other industries, but it's been kind of an open secret with white collar jobs that people don't really work all that much. I've honestly found myself wishing at times I had more work to do so that it could stop me from looking at my phone during the lulls... then phone scrolling turns into a bad habit in a way that talking to coworkers wasn't. I think we also take for granted how much computers and the internet trivialize certain tasks that would've taken people a long time in the older days. We're probably more productive overall but the standards for what counts as productivity have changed.

OhhhJa posted...

Music is easier than ever to record yet bands/artists now take way longer to put out albums than they used to. Bands in the 60/70s were putting out sometimes more than an album a year. I think the fact that everyone's faces are buried in phones has a lot to do with this.

I think it's more because bands (if you aren't just using "bands" as a shorthand for any musical artist) and especially albums don't sell anymore

Edit: I don't know how I missed the "/artists" the first time, but still, I think the decline of albums is a big thing here

ReturnOfFa posted...

no

Yes, it varies greatly though. Some jobs are easier to do than others while chatting. And some people are better than others at multi-tasking. I've had guys who can talk up a storm and get their work done while I have seen others who operate on a lower frequency who seemingly can't juggle the two and stop working altogether once they open their mouth

bachewychomp posted...

I think it's more because bands (if you aren't just using "bands" as a shorthand for any musical artist) and especially albums don't sell anymore

That's a factor for sure. Artists make all their money touring so there's more incentive to constantly tour than to release music. But then again, artists always made most of their money touring, and there's still a huge incentive to constantly release new music, especially if you're constantly touring so people don't get fatigued from seeing you live

OhhhJa posted...

Yes, it varies greatly though. Some jobs are easier to do than others while chatting. And some people are better than others at multi-tasking. I've had guys who can talk up a storm and get their work done while I have seen others who operate on a lower frequency who seemingly can't juggle the two and stop working altogether once they open their mouth

Or your job requires you to literally talk to people, so having a co-worker talk to you quite literally prevents this.

It took me a few years to get my foot in the door. Once I did, it became a lot easier

The job market in general is currently shitty. At least in tech, I've been looking and there aren't many entry-level openings, and the ones that do often ask for years of experience.

OhhhJa posted...

Sure, but that only applies to smokers which is a relatively small percentage of the population at this point.

At this point? Yes. Historically? It wasn't at all uncommon for people to smoke solely because they'd have more excuses to take breaks for it.

OhhhJa posted...

being lazy actually requires a bit of creativity/effort to the point that a lot of people will just work as the alternative even if they're slow about it.

Slowing down your work for the sake of killing time is no different from getting the same amount done in a day while spending some of it not working. Lazily working is also a form of laziness.

OhhhJa posted...

Music is easier than ever to record yet bands/artists now take way longer to put out albums than they used to. Bands in the 60/70s were putting out sometimes more than an album a year. I think the fact that everyone's faces are buried in phones has a lot to do with this.

I'd be more inclined to attribute that to how hard it is to make money off of music these days. In part because it's easier than ever to record (though note that being easier to record doesn't mean it's easier to compose: the tools used to translate ideas into music have improved, but the artist still needs to have those ideas in the first place), more people than ever are able to get their music out there, which means any given artist/group is competing with many more people for recognition (and therefore income).

Toss in the extent to which Spotify and similar services are dominating music consumption while doing very little to compensate artists, and it's pretty much a given that any musician that isn't already wildly successful isn't going to be able to make their primary living off of releasing new music. Toss in the increasing cost of living, and that means they spend more time focusing on other income sources, in many cases, which leaves less time for composition.

I don't doubt that easier availability of distractions is a factor, given that creating so often involves banging your head against some form of writer's block and it's tempting to let yourself be distracted instead of continuing to bang, but the reality of financing creative endeavours is probably the more salient issue.

bachewychomp posted...

I can't speak to other industries, but it's been kind of an open secret with white collar jobs that people don't really work all that much

Indeed. Especially with how much being decent with computers can increase productivity, a lot of white collar work is in a weird place where the jobs require enough specialized knowledge and surge capacity that you need a whole person dedicated to them, and produce enough value to justify a full-time salary, but there often isn't actually enough work to keep that person occupied full-time (especially if bureaucratic delays are a factor).

It's a big part of the debate around remote work: People like being able to work from home because (in addition to the myriad other benefits) they have the freedom to do something else with their work hours if they run out of work to do, but the optics of acknowledging that open secret aren't great (especially when the people approving things like salary budgets tend to be pretty distantly separated from the actual work being done). This is another point where there's a generational divide, where younger generations tend to be less concerned about keeping up that pretense, while older ones cling to it.

ParanoidObsessive posted...

They were right.

adjl posted...

Of course, there's also the issue that entry-level jobs aren't enough to afford much of anything these days

This can be part of the issue, but a lot of this is also people refusing to share housing with others, and housing is the number one place people can save money with a single choice.

Living alone as an adult has always been a luxury, not the default state.

For even more spare money, live/work somewhere you don't need to have a car to commute to work.

If working adults aren't living with each other as much (no idea if that's true or not) then it certainly has a lot to do with the fact they're living with their parents instead, which is still "sharing housing". Not to mention any statistics about studio/1 bedroom rents vs. incomes over time will show that living alone is definitely becoming at least more of a luxury.

Cities that are walkable/have good transit tend to cost a lot more to live in than anywhere else, but I do wonder if the lack of car ownership is enough to offset the housing costs

I think for sure living alone now qualifies as a luxury. Unless it's something like an extended stay. And I'd argue we may not be that far from that being a luxury

One bedroom apartments anywhere within like 2 hours of a major city or hour within a semi-major city are approaching 1500-2k a month