I'm going to replay all the Zelda games in release order this year

Already giving an update for Echoes of Wisdom, not even a full day after finishing TotK! This is the only Zelda game I've never played, so naturally I'm excited to get started.

I've already finished the first dungeon. So far, my first impressions of this game are positive. It's a LOT different than previous entries in the series, especially given the full reliance on the echo ability for combat.

I'm impressed with the incredibly high number of objects that you use the echo ability with. It almost has me concerned that I'll forget what some of the objects do and that I'll encounter a situation way later in the game that requires me to use something I haven't even thought about since way earlier in the game (Spirit Tracks unfortunately had something like that, with a song that uncovered buried secrets).

Another thing that there seems to be a lot of are Heart Pieces. I've already found 4, and assembled a new heart from those. I imagine that means there aren't a lot of dungeons in this game (although I'd rather keep that a surprise, so no spoilers), kind of like Minish Cap.

The story seems very much in line with what I'd expect from a 2D Zelda. There was one element that shocked me though (spoilers): when the King of Hyrule falls into the rift and then comes out of the rift as an imposter, he calls for the execution of Zelda. This seemed unusually dark for such a bright, cheery looking Zelda game . The big mystery with the story right now is why only some people can see Tri, which seemingly it must only be people who have been in a rift before .

Something very minor that has impressed me is just how much subtle references there have been to older Zelda games, some of which are obscure. The following observations might be considered spoilers. I've encountered a Business Scrub, which I think haven't been in a Zelda game since Majora's Mask, or maybe Four Swords Adventures. A very obscure scorpion-like enemy from Zelda II: Adventure of Link called Aruroda have made their return, ending a 36 year absence. I'm also already able to tell that the central portion of this Hyrule's map is strongly inspired by the map from A Link to the Past, which became clear when I found the ruins of the Desert Palace dungeon.

It's still far too early to tell how good this game is, but I'm optimistic from what I've seen so far. I'll be taking in as much of this game as I can, so long as I continue to enjoy playing it.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/9/9435c4ef.jpg

faramir77 posted...

I'm impressed with the incredibly high number of objects that you use the echo ability with. It almost has me concerned that I'll forget what some of the objects do and that I'll encounter a situation way later in the game that requires me to use something I haven't even thought about since way earlier in the game (Spirit Tracks unfortunately had something like that, with a song that uncovered buried secrets).

That's actually really good to hear. I was concerned the ability would be a gimmick and there'd be a really small amount of objects and only a handful of useful ones, mostly being either very niche or "joke objects".

Gonna skip over your spoilery segments because I still need to play it, but I'd like to hear how well the mechanics turn out further into it.

Salrite posted...

That's actually really good to hear. I was concerned the ability would be a gimmick and there'd be a really small amount of objects and only a handful of useful ones, mostly being either very niche or "joke objects".

Gonna skip over your spoilery segments because I still need to play it, but I'd like to hear how well the mechanics turn out further into it.

Yeah, the problem with Echoes isn't a shortage; it's an excess. There are a lot of Echoes, most of which have some unique property (I've not experimented with the various pots enough to know whether they're interchangeable or not), so there are reasons to use (almost) all of them - though I ended both my 100% playthroughs with a bunch of echoes I'd never used, and a bunch more only used once, with maybe 10% in frequent use.

The interface for Echoes is the same "quick" menu as in BotW and TotK - hold a direction button and scroll through a one-dimensional list (which can be sorted in various ways, which, like the TotK arrow fusing, helps, but not quite enough) - fine up to around 15-20 items, but increasingly clunky after that.

I loved EoW - beat it about a month ago. Might go back to complete some more on the Switch 2.

I should really play EoW. I've had it for a while, but I've been progressing through other parts of my backlog instead.

100% of the issues in echos can be solved with a sword

Also, this is the perfect time to play EoW - they just updated/fixed the "long list of echos" issue.

ReturnOfFa posted...

Also, this is the perfect time to play EoW - they just updated/fixed the "long list of echos" issue.

The what?

ReturnOfFa posted...

Also, this is the perfect time to play EoW - they just updated/fixed the "long list of echos" issue.

Awesome, I bought it at launch because Costco was selling it for $40. Played it for about two hours and then life got in the way and I haven't gone back to it but that was one of my initial annoyances with it.

Looks like it's not a complete fix, but it's a significant improvement: from the official patch notes it sounds like once you have 30+ Echoes learned, you can pick which Echoes appear in the quick menu.

nice!

Replaying BotW and going for a true 100% run. It's so beautiful and runs amazingly well on Switch 2.

supergamer19 posted...

Replaying BotW and going for a true 100% run. It's so beautiful and runs amazingly well on Switch 2.

There's a false 100% run?

Revelation34 posted...

There's a false 100% run?

Most people don't bother collecting every Korok seed. I love the Korok puzzles, but 900 of them shits is way to much (1000 in TotK)!

Salrite posted...

Most people don't bother collecting every Korok seed. I love the Korok puzzles, but 900 of them shits is way to much (1000 in TotK)!

I was going to do that but I took a break and then never played again. I think I had some DLC shrines left too.

Revelation34 posted...

There's a false 100% run?

I can't say I've kept up with BotW's run categories in particular, but it's not uncommon for games to have a couple of "close enough to 100%" categories in cases where genuinely reaching 100% is particularly tedious and/or pointless. In Kirby and the Forgotten Land, for example, maxing out all of the copy ability upgrades involves running the arena over and over again as the only infinite source of the resource needed to do so, and serves pretty much no purpose except to say that you've done so (the upgrade tiers that require more items than you get playing through the game normally just increase the damage they do). Rather than subjecting myself to a really long, tedious grind after thoroughly enjoying everything up to that point, I decided that was close enough to 100% for me. True 100%, though, would include that.

Basically, I'd treat it as the distinction between "I've done everything the game has to offer me" and "I've done everything the game will recognize me doing."

Revelation34 posted...

I was going to do that but I took a break and then never played again. I think I had some DLC shrines left too.

In theory, they are the perfect way to fill out the map and give something to do post-game that's fun to engage with. Pick it up for a couple hours and go exploring and find a few more hidden collectibles. It's just that I treated it as a "unattainable goal" and then eventually moved onto something else before actually completing it.

Now with the Zelda Notes app, it's really nifty to hunt down the Korok seeds.

I still have a separate map for all the dead guardians/broken down carts/bombable walls/treasure chests/etc, though. It's been 50 hours and I've only unlocked 3 areas on the map. Just got to Hateno Village.

Yeah, it definitely wouldn't be feasible without an interactive map. But it's still difficult to keep track of where you've been and what you've already found with the amount that there is. The "Hero's Path" sort of helps with this, but not completely.

Time for another update. I've just completed the third dungeon now.

The graphics for this game are really nice for the most part. Scenery often looks very lively and charming, they really leaned in on the whole plasticine look with this one. Some cutscenes have been sort of lame though, mainly due to the minimalist video-gamey animations of characters. The cutscene after the third dungeon in particular was cheesy.

I'm really enjoying the references to previous games that consistently occur in EoW. Some of these are VERY obscure, too. I mentioned it in the last update as well, but it's nearly non stop, and yet never overwhelming. Some new references I've noticed since the last update include bombfish from Twilight Princess, Guay from Ocarina of Time (which are honestly one of the best echoes to create, go figure), and most of all, a side boss encounter in the Eastern Temple (the same one from ALttP) which was Smog, a boss from the Crown Dungeon in Oracle of Ages (the same dungeon I complained had the worst music I've ever heard in a video game lmao). He had almost the exact same technique as he did back in Ages, honestly quite cool to see that boss make a return.

The bosses have been super creative so far. They generally make great use of not only your echoes but also your ability to briefly turn into "the swordsman" . The boss of the second dungeon took me way longer than I'd like to admit to beat, it felt more like a slow effort attempting to actually inflict damage rather than a fun boss fight. Maybe I was doing something wrong though, I don't know.

Not everything has been great. Creating echoes to fight enemies has gotten incredibly old. It can be innovative and creative at times, but when I'm trying to defeat a simple enemy, it's somewhat frustrating cycling through your echo choices just to select one that might have a fighting chance against the enemy. The swordsman ability is too short lived to be used outside of extreme circumstances like boss battles . There came a point where the echo system stopped feeling new and exciting and instead made it feel like I was being forced to play a Zelda game with my hands tied behind my back.

I have no clue how far into the game I am. I've done a bit of exploring around the world (since I was curious about it since I noticed before the last update that much of the overworld is a remade version of Hyrule from ALttP ), and I'd estimate I've uncovered about 70% of the overworld map. I'm going to be very busy over the next week or so but we'll see what kind of progress I can make.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/5/564567d4.jpg

As you allude to, the d-pad up ability is deliberately kept limited in order to focus the game on the use of Echoes. The game was, apparently, originally designed with a more conventional Link, but as the Echoes mechanic emerged, the decision was made to rework the core mechanics and switch playable character to Zelda so you have to use Echoes rather than running around whacking things with a sword as Link.

The design mostly limits d-up to the stilled worlds, but you can use it fairly freely there since there's a lot of refill there.

I'm curious which was your second dungeon? The game gives you some pretty open choices about which order to tackle the dungeons in each section of the game - you can go Zora - Gerudo - Castle Town or Gerudo - Zora - Castle Town and other examples later in the game

The Gerudo one was my second dungeon, and the Zora one was my third dungeon.

Since the last update, I've completed two more dungeons: Hyrule Castle (my fourth dungeon) and Eldin Volcano (my fifth dungeon). Additionally, I've done a fair amount of sidequesting, obtaining a few new equipment upgrades (including 3 new outfits ) as well as upgrading many of my swordsman abilities, incluiding my sword to level 3 . My work for the year is winding down this week, so I'll have a ton of time to finish this game very soon (although, I bet I'll be done the game, and thus finally this entire series playthrough, before July!). Unfortunately I've caught a bad cold so I'm not super motivated to do much aside from sleep right now.

The fourth dungeon was the best one yet, and the boss, Ganon, was an excellent throwback, even if he's hinted just to be an echo . The path to the fifth dungeon was terrible, and the Goron chief who follows you around is the most irritating character in the series since Fi. I don't know why he needs to have the exact same dialogue over and over again, as if they're trying to throw in some character arc for a throwaway side character.

I'm still appreciative of the diverse enemies that appear in the game. I was able to predict that the boss of the fifth dungeon was Volvagia as soon as I dropped into the boss room and saw the lava holes on the ground. I also was just recently very surprised to see an enemy called "Goo Specter", which has only ever appeared in the Color Dungeon of Link's Awakening.

My feelings for the combat system are up and down. There are times when summoning an echo to attack and enemy feels rewarding, but a lot of the time it just feels tedious. I have to appreciate Nintendo trying something vastly different for a change, but the novelty of the whole thing has worn off quickly. I'd say about 85% of echos I've learned literally never get used. Mostly I've just been using the Sword Moblin, Guay, Old Bed (as a bridge), and Trampoline, with others getting occasional niche use.

The system of mending rifts is also getting stale. Every rift feels like the same thing. Something about the mood of the game feels off sometimes, like it's somewhere between a Paper Mario game and Skyward Sword. It's hard to describe how the game's theme feels.

I can tell I'm more than halfway through the game. I'll obviously wait until I finish the game to officially place it on my tier list, but my impressions so far are that it's a very mid tier Zelda, likely slightly below Minish Cap. I'm currently heading towards my sixth dungeon, which will be the one in the Faron Wetlands .

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/7/73f75752.jpg

It's finally all over. I've completed Echoes of Wisdom, and therefore the entire Zelda series in release order. This one took me around 20 hours, making it the shortest Zelda game in a very long time.

The sixth dungeon, Faron Temple , was decent. I really enjoyed the mechanics of its boss, Gohma . In a way, it felt like a more traditional Zelda boss since it required you to exploit a weakness using a specific echo, or at least any echo that produced electrical attacks .

The seventh dungeon, Lanayru Temple , was without any shred of doubt that absolute highlight of the entire game. The system of using the heating and cooling systems built into the dungeon to thaw/freeze entire rooms was very unique and a lot of fun . The boss required you to balance attacking and dodging which is a simple but perfect formula for a fun and engaging boss battle.

The ending of the game comes on a little too quickly. There's no final dungeon, just a few quick tasks before the final boss. The final boss itself was pretty good, although it definitely feels like your job as a player is mainly to dodge attacks while NPC Link does all the actual battling. Even my best echoes didn't do a quarter as much damage to the final boss as Link does.

Overall, EoW ends on a pretty high note. The story is pretty simplistic, but sometimes Zelda games need that. The biggest issue I had with the whole game was how repetitive the echo system got. I'm not really sure there is a way around this, but I'd be lying if I didn't say I started to feel disconnected and fatigued from having to constantly summon echos, especially with combat.

For the final time...here's my completed tier list for the entire Zelda series. Each successive entry has been based off my fresh impressions as I've completed the games one by one in release order. Some of these rankings are very close, and I'd be open to shuffling the order slightly (especially the middle tier ones), but I'm sticking with this.

1. BotW
2. OoT
3. TotK
4. MM
5. ALBW
6. ALttP
7. TP
8. WW
9. OoS
10. OoA
11. EoW
12. SS
13. PH
14. MC
15. LA
16. AoL
17. LoZ
18. FSA
19. ST

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/c/c62de508.jpg

To officially wrap up this topic, I want to say thank you to everyone who's been reading my updates and giving their feedback throughout this journey over the past 15 months.

This entire idea started as an ambitious thought one boring evening last March. I knew it would be a lengthy task, but this took far longer than I had ever imagined. Life is pretty busy, and the ups and downs of day to day living definitely put some wrenches in my plans to complete this in a reasonable time frame. Documenting this series playthrough has been also in many ways me documenting my life...so I apologize for this seemingly like BlogFAQs at times.

I'm very glad that I stuck through it. The Legend of Zelda has absolutely been the most important video game series in my life. Miyamoto has often said that Link serves as a representation of you, the player, hence why they have insisted on keeping him a silent protagonist. In many ways, the entire series is a link to my past.

I will someday do this again. It won't be any time in the near future, especially now that I know that this is an endeavour that takes well over a year, and will only be longer as this series grows. Perhaps I'll be able to do this again when I retire in 30 years. I can only imagine where this series will be at that time. I fully intend on saving everything in this topic to be archived for future reads.

Nintendo has their hands on a true diamond. The care they've put into almost every single entry in the series has been a reflection of the importance that they also see in this incredible franchise. I can't think of another media franchise that has been so consistently golden for nearly 40 years straight. The legacy it has left will be the real Legend of Zelda.

I'll end this topic with a visual tier list. The structured one I ended my last comment with doesn't tell the full story, many of the entries are a lot closer than they seem. Thank you again to everyone who has followed this over the past 15 months!

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/b/bf950b65.jpg

Every Mario game is next.